The Future of China

[Tuthina]

However, even if the Chinese state is absolutely tyrannical, it does not rule with fear. The Communist Party has managed to keep power in such a large country through a pact with the Chinese people. If the Chinese agreed to give up their rights and obey the government, then the government would provide them with economic prosperity. I may sound like a dumb pact, but keep in mind this began shortly after Mao’s death. That’s why Hong Kong has never wanted to join China, they already had both rights and prosperity.

However if any of the parts breaks the pact, then the other retaliates. If the people want rights, then the government attacks the protestors, but if the government does not provide economic prosperity... well then everyone would start really revolting against the CCP. And the only way that China could remain a one party system in this case would require a return to Maoism, which is absolutely incompatible with an efficient economy. However, now China would be full of educated middle class people instead of illiterate peasants , unlike in 1989, which would probably make it much harder for Xi Jinping or whoever rules at the moment to avoid major Tiannanmen-like protest much more usually and could eventually lead the communist system down

Basically, if China gets a recession, the government would probably get the boot

It's not just the economy.There are many other questions.The reason why the CCP can take power is that it has solved the survival problem of the nation.It has to solve all the problems it encounters.If he doesn't solve the problem, the government's ability will be questioned.The CCP must fulfill all political commitments on time.Because the Chinese only see the result.

If that is the only way China can survive as a nation, then maybe we should question whether China as a nation should survive to begin with. I for me am in favour of it not, even though the chance of it happening is unfortunately pretty unlikely.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

If that is the only way China can survive as a nation, then maybe we should question whether China as a nation should survive to begin with. I for me am in favour of it not, even though the chance of it happening is unfortunately pretty unlikely.

Can I question the racist suspicion of your remark?

[Albrenia]

If that is the only way China can survive as a nation, then maybe we should question whether China as a nation should survive to begin with. I for me am in favour of it not, even though the chance of it happening is unfortunately pretty unlikely.

Can I question the racist suspicion of your remark?

...how is it racist to say a nation slaughtering its own people doesn't deserve to stand?

[Infected Mushroom]

Can I question the racist suspicion of your remark?

...how is it racist to say a nation slaughtering its own people doesn't deserve to stand?

The part about China not deserving to continue as a nation does sound a little bit sinophobic

[Albrenia]

...how is it racist to say a nation slaughtering its own people doesn't deserve to stand?

The part about China not deserving to continue as a nation does sound a little bit sinophobic

I guess it could be read that way. I took it more to mean the nation as ruled by the CCP, rather than an attack on the people itself. Much like Nazi Germany didn't deserve to exist as a nation, but not because it was made up of Germans.

[Jedi Council]

The part about China not deserving to continue as a nation does sound a little bit sinophobic

I guess it could be read that way. I took it more to mean the nation as ruled by the CCP, rather than an attack on the people itself. Much like Nazi Germany didn't deserve to exist as a nation, but not because it was made up of Germans.

That is how I read it as well.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

The part about China not deserving to continue as a nation does sound a little bit sinophobic

I guess it could be read that way. I took it more to mean the nation as ruled by the CCP, rather than an attack on the people itself. Much like Nazi Germany didn't deserve to exist as a nation, but not because it was made up of Germans.

If you use that meaning,that's fine.

[Pilipinas and Malaya]

It's not just the economy.There are many other questions.The reason why the CCP can take power is that it has solved the survival problem of the nation.It has to solve all the problems it encounters.If he doesn't solve the problem, the government's ability will be questioned.The CCP must fulfill all political commitments on time.Because the Chinese only see the result.

CCP defended China from Japanese invasion

CCP modernized the Chinese economy, kept the country together, built China into a world power

The country could have collapsed under American pressure but it stayed strong, through the spirit of socialism with Chinese characteristics

And now America is China’s greatest trade partner

Pretty sure it was the Nationalists that did the heavy-lifting in World War Two. Had the Kuomintang ruled over China, it would have been bad too because they were rather dictatorial, but they would have modernised earlier because of the relationships they had with the West.

I'm honestly very confused about the way SIC writes. It wasn't exactly clear as to which side they were supporting in the past two pages.

[Mantesa]

I guess it could be read that way. I took it more to mean the nation as ruled by the CCP, rather than an attack on the people itself. Much like Nazi Germany didn't deserve to exist as a nation, but not because it was made up of Germans.

If you use that meaning,that's fine.

I must agree that no despotic regime should ever be allowed to stand. The sovereignty of nations comes from the people. If the people are not allowed to exercise their sovereignty because of some bureaucratic tyranny like China then it doesn’t matter how much good the ruler does, he shall always be an oppressor.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

CCP defended China from Japanese invasion

CCP modernized the Chinese economy, kept the country together, built China into a world power

The country could have collapsed under American pressure but it stayed strong, through the spirit of socialism with Chinese characteristics

And now America is China’s greatest trade partner

Pretty sure it was the Nationalists that did the heavy-lifting in World War Two. Had the Kuomintang ruled over China, it would have been bad too because they were rather dictatorial, but they would have modernised earlier because of the relationships they had with the West.

I'm honestly very confused about the way SIC writes. It wasn't exactly clear as to which side they were supporting in the past two pages.

I'm not satisfied with the Chinese government on some issues.I reject the chaos brought about by the western political system.Who do you ask me to support?I support the present CCP government. Because technical officials are more credible than politicians,that's good.If Xi had a stem degree like his predecessor, I will support him.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

If you use that meaning,that's fine.

I must agree that no despotic regime should ever be allowed to stand. The sovereignty of nations comes from the people. If the people are not allowed to exercise their sovereignty because of some bureaucratic tyranny like China then it doesn’t matter how much good the ruler does, he shall always be an oppressor.

So how do your people exercise their sovereignty?Has your request been accepted by the leaders? Have your problems been solved?It seems that you must have a very happy life and have no dissatisfaction with the government.

[Mantesa]

I must agree that no despotic regime should ever be allowed to stand. The sovereignty of nations comes from the people. If the people are not allowed to exercise their sovereignty because of some bureaucratic tyranny like China then it doesn’t matter how much good the ruler does, he shall always be an oppressor.

So how do your people exercise their sovereignty?Has your request been accepted by the leaders? Have your problems been solved?It seems that you must have a very happy life and have no dissatisfaction with the government.

I’m not saying that our current democracies are the best system of the world but I prefer our petty politicians instead of some dark bureaucrats with no legitimacy. I recommend you to take a look at “The Spirit of Law”, by Montesquieu. He proposes very interesting ideas.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

So how do your people exercise their sovereignty?Has your request been accepted by the leaders? Have your problems been solved?It seems that you must have a very happy life and have no dissatisfaction with the government.

I’m not saying that our current democracies are the best system of the world but I prefer our petty politicians instead of some dark bureaucrats with no legitimacy. I recommend you to take a look at “The Spirit of Law”, by Montesquieu. He proposes very interesting ideas.

I've read it roughly.But from his book, I can see his fear of the state machine everywhere.He put forward the theory of decentralization, which was obviously naive.His insistence that power would corrupt reminded me of his pessimism.
Can only emphasizing procedural justice solve the problem?In theory, people will choose the politicians they support most.In fact, people will choose the political clown who is the best at public relations

But after all, he believes that the rule principle of autocracy is fear.But in China, there is no reign of terror. That only exists in your fantasy brain.

[Phoenicaea]

well, so..a resume, ”only if chinese commoners gain their rights, tibet (and others) will gain autonomy”.

[Pilipinas and Malaya]

Pretty sure it was the Nationalists that did the heavy-lifting in World War Two. Had the Kuomintang ruled over China, it would have been bad too because they were rather dictatorial, but they would have modernised earlier because of the relationships they had with the West.

I'm honestly very confused about the way SIC writes. It wasn't exactly clear as to which side they were supporting in the past two pages.

I'm not satisfied with the Chinese government on some issues.I reject the chaos brought about by the western political system.Who do you ask me to support?I support the present CCP government. Because technical officials are more credible than politicians,that's good.If Xi had a stem degree like his predecessor, I will support him.

Certain Western models of government I do support, but I stand opposed entirely to what Xi's dictatorship in all but name.

[Jedi Council]

Pretty sure it was the Nationalists that did the heavy-lifting in World War Two. Had the Kuomintang ruled over China, it would have been bad too because they were rather dictatorial, but they would have modernised earlier because of the relationships they had with the West.

I'm honestly very confused about the way SIC writes. It wasn't exactly clear as to which side they were supporting in the past two pages.

I'm not satisfied with the Chinese government on some issues.I reject the chaos brought about by the western political system.Who do you ask me to support?I support the present CCP government. Because technical officials are more credible than politicians,that's good.If Xi had a stem degree like his predecessor, I will support him.

I mean, technical officials may be more effective than regular politicians, but that is why every advanced democracy had a pretty elaborate public service. One might say that the CCP is more efficient than a Democratic system, but ours is far more accountable.

Every system had trade offs, but I am much more willing to allow a few incompetent legislators provided I am allowed a say in my countries affairs, have a relatively transparent view of their actions, and can be relatively confident that they are not committing terrible crimes when I am not looking, an assurance one cannot have in China.

[Shanghai industrial complex]

I'm not satisfied with the Chinese government on some issues.I reject the chaos brought about by the western political system.Who do you ask me to support?I support the present CCP government. Because technical officials are more credible than politicians,that's good.If Xi had a stem degree like his predecessor, I will support him.

I mean, technical officials may be more effective than regular politicians, but that is why every advanced democracy had a pretty elaborate public service. One might say that the CCP is more efficient than a Democratic system, but ours is far more accountable.

Every system had trade offs, but I am much more willing to allow a few incompetent legislators provided I am allowed a say in my countries affairs, have a relatively transparent view of their actions, and can be relatively confident that they are not committing terrible crimes when I am not looking, an assurance one cannot have in China.

Isn't incompetence a crime in itself?Why can the incompetent be in power?

[Jedi Council]

I mean, technical officials may be more effective than regular politicians, but that is why every advanced democracy had a pretty elaborate public service. One might say that the CCP is more efficient than a Democratic system, but ours is far more accountable.

Every system had trade offs, but I am much more willing to allow a few incompetent legislators provided I am allowed a say in my countries affairs, have a relatively transparent view of their actions, and can be relatively confident that they are not committing terrible crimes when I am not looking, an assurance one cannot have in China.

Isn't incompetence a crime in itself?Why can the incompetent be in power?

If incompetence were a crime a vast majority of people would be in prison.

And besides, incompetence has often saved countries from the worst excesses of terrible leaders. Look at the current state of the US; if Trump's political agenda and style were coupled with efficiency and competence, he would be even more dangerous than he already is.

In any case, I would take an incompetent government over a dictatorial one any day of the week. At least, in my country, if a government is incompetent we can remove them from office.

[Diahon]

never underestimate the destructiveness of the malevolently incompetent, padawan, especially if you win enough people over

[Jedi Council]

never underestimate the destructiveness of the malevolently incompetent, padawan, especially if you win enough people over

Would'nt malevolent incompetence just be negligence?

[The Cascadian Democratic Republic]

Well I certainly hope there’s enough strife generated in the “Communist” Party of China that a reversal of the Dengist reforms are pushed for, and a Maoist (one that actually understands how food chains and food webs work) takes power.

[Diahon]

never underestimate the destructiveness of the malevolently incompetent, padawan, especially if you win enough people over

Would'nt malevolent incompetence just be negligence?

negligence implies passivity

now tell me: does trump strike you as a passive figure?

[Jedi Council]

Would'nt malevolent incompetence just be negligence?

negligence implies passivity

now tell me: does trump strike you as a passive figure?

No, but in order for one to be malevolent, one needs intent. I do not think he is intentionally incompetent. I just think he is incompetent.

To clarify, I believe he is malicious. I believe he is incompetent. But I do not believe a person can be maliciously incompetent.

[Diahon]

negligence implies passivity

now tell me: does trump strike you as a passive figure?

No, but in order for one to be malevolent, one needs intent. I do not think he is intentionally incompetent. I just think he is incompetent.

insofar as he installs lackeys and leaves important offices to go to seed if not abolish altogether? the intent is there, even if seldom for other than personal reasons -- money, power, and dick

[Arzt0zka]

...how is it racist to say a nation slaughtering its own people doesn't deserve to stand?

The part about China not deserving to continue as a nation does sound a little bit sinophobic

How does someone mentioning China slaughtering Tibetans and Uyghers make you immediately think of "sinophobia"? It's a proven fact that they have been oppressing and replacing minorities for 60+ years and crying "sinophobe" won't change that.