STEMinism & Women in Biology: The Female of the Species

[Valrifell]

Lmao, you've clearly never done STEM

Observation and induction is not abstract thought, it is a lower order of thinking.

Imagine believing that all a scientist does is observation and induction lmao.

[United Muscovite Nations]

Observation and induction is not abstract thought, it is a lower order of thinking.

That is not all there is to STEM fields, my man

Physics is a little better, but even mathematics is not abstract thought because it deals with concrete things.

[Valrifell]

That is not all there is to STEM fields, my man

Physics is a little better, but even mathematics is not abstract thought because it deals with concrete things.

That's blatantly untrue. There's an entire field of mathematical thought called "abstract algebra", for one.

More generally mathematics is as abstract as you get.

[United Muscovite Nations]

Physics is a little better, but even mathematics is not abstract thought because it deals with concrete things.

That's blatantly untrue. There's an entire field of mathematical thought called "abstract algebra", for one.

More generally mathematics is as abstract as you get.

Wrong, the realm of ideas and forms is.

[Valrifell]

That's blatantly untrue. There's an entire field of mathematical thought called "abstract algebra", for one.

More generally mathematics is as abstract as you get.

Wrong, the realm of ideas and forms is.

What is mathematics besides the most in depth exploration of a few set ideas?

[United Muscovite Nations]

Wrong, the realm of ideas and forms is.

What is mathematics besides the most in depth exploration of a few set ideas?

An exploration of that which can be measured.

[Valrifell]

What is mathematics besides the most in depth exploration of a few set ideas?

An exploration of that which can be measured.

You've not been exposed to very much of axiomatic mathematics, have you?

[United Muscovite Nations]

An exploration of that which can be measured.

You've not been exposed to very much of axiomatic mathematics, have you?

Fair point on Axiomatic mathematics, I'll admit that, since it derives from the application of philosophy.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

I don’t see an issue with encouraging women who’re interested in STEM to join the field.

[Stagnant Axon Terminal]

Is this another "feminists are bad because *opinion that has little to nothing to do with feminism*" thread? Please advise.

Not All Feminists. I just wish more Feminists (heck, more people) encouraging girls and young women to get into science would pay a little more attention to female biologists, especially given a female biologist (Rita R. Colwell) coined the term STEM in the first place

A bit late on the response, but we do pay attention to women in biology. But, take for example myself and the numerous women I went to school with in STEM - every one of us experienced overt sexism in the classroom. It's not necessarily about "we need exactly half of STEM majors/degree holder to be women" and more "We need an environment where women feel encouraged and welcomed the same as men".

[Gormwood]

Males will be the first to involve into transhuman machines naturally and become cyborgs first. They will surpass their female counterparts as they stay in an inferior, biological and fleshy world.

Cool, can't wait to get sunglasses built into my face.

Okay Adam Jensen.

[Ethel mermania]

I don’t see an issue with encouraging women who’re interested in STEM to join the field.

Boy #2's. Trip to the gallopogus (for his biology class) was 2 boys to 7 girls.

[Vassenor]

Besides, why don't the MRAs complain about examples of male overrepresentstion if they're trying to position themselves as the ones truly after equality?

[Cekoviu]

I don’t see an issue with encouraging women who’re interested in STEM to join the field.

Boy #2's. Trip to the gallopogus (for his biology class) was 2 boys to 7 girls.

Galápagos.

[Ethel mermania]

Boy #2's. Trip to the gallopogus (for his biology class) was 2 boys to 7 girls.

Galápagos.

Bless my heart, that is so kind of you, whatever would I do without your help?

[Cekoviu]

Galápagos.

Bless my heart, that is so kind of you, whatever would I do without your help?

Happy to be of service

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

I don’t see an issue with encouraging women who’re interested in STEM to join the field.

Boy #2's. Trip to the gallopogus (for his biology class) was 2 boys to 7 girls.

Btw, did he enjoy that trip? I hear the Galápagos are gorgeous if a little bare.

[Ethel mermania]

Boy #2's. Trip to the gallopogus (for his biology class) was 2 boys to 7 girls.

Btw, did he enjoy that trip? I hear the Galápagos are gorgeous if a little bare.

Yeah, swam with the turtles and sharks, dove on a reef, has a picture of himself with a stuffed charles Darwin. Glad he went, with the benefit of hindsight, I might not let him go, but I am glad he did.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Btw, did he enjoy that trip? I hear the Galápagos are gorgeous if a little bare.

Yeah, swam with the turtles and sharks, dove on a reef, has a picture of himself with a stuffed charles Darwin. Glad he went, with the benefit of hindsight, I might not let him go, but I am glad he did.

Coolios.

[Ethel mermania]

Yeah, swam with the turtles and sharks, dove on a reef, has a picture of himself with a stuffed charles Darwin. Glad he went, with the benefit of hindsight, I might not let him go, but I am glad he did.

Coolios.

All things considered, only a 14 day quarantine for him, we got lucky

[Ostroeuropa]

Besides, why don't the MRAs complain about examples of male overrepresentstion if they're trying to position themselves as the ones truly after equality?

We do, quite often. A notable example being high overrepresentation in industries like trucking which is the most deadly profession. It's also fundamental to our rejection of feminist framing of the STEM issue in that we're arguing many of the males who go into STEM go there because they don't receive encouragement in other fields where they may be happier and more fulfilled. They do it because they think it's what they're good at, rather than actually wanting to do it.

Tackling the actual source of the issue (Misandry in the education system) will achieve equality. Demanding more female privilege won't do that, and instead creates an even more misandrous and gynocentric education system, as well as worsening a demonstrable pro-female bias in STEM hiring practices that already exists.

It's like 90% of the subjects are heavily biased against men, and feminists act like it's proof of misogyny that the result of this is that they cluster around the other 10% of subjects, even when the evidence shows those 10% of subjects are biased against men too, just to a lesser extent than the other 90% of subjects.

If we allow feminists to get their way, 100% of subjects will be heavily biased against men. This will mean higher male unemployment and worsen the university gender gap that already skews in womens favor. It might mean less men in STEM so their jobs get done by women instead, but that isn't the same thing as equality and hasn't made society actually better off, because now instead we've got people who could be graduating college not going in the first place. The only reason it's pitched as misogyny is gynocentrism and an unwillingness to comprehend gender dynamics except in terms of how it can be framed as womens issues, largely because that's what patriarchy theory and feminist theory is built to do (And hence, why it's nonsense.).

Conversely, rejecting feminism and adopting the MRM approach of lessening misandry in other subjects means men will go into other subjects more, equalizing those fields and leaving room in STEM for women. It also means closing the university graduate gap.

The link I provided as well as other evidence shows this is the sensible approach. But it means rejecting feminist framings of these issues and accepting their ideology consistently leads to destructive false positives of misogyny that worsen inequality when the cause of a disparity is actually misandry, as with this issue, and it means accepting that the education system is systemically biased against males.

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

This is a non-issue to begin. If women don't wanna work in STEM, that's their perogative. If men don't wanna work in biology, that's their perogative. We need to stop telling men and women what carrers to choose and let them make up their damned minds. If women want to work in STEM, let them, if they don't want to, they shouldn't. If there are more female biologists than male biologists, good for them. If there are more male engineers than female engineers, good for them. As long as nobody is prevented from entering STEM because of their gender, then this become the biggest non-issue ever. I would say that this becomes the biggest first-world prpblem, but this too pety to qualify as such. Now, if men and/or women are preventing from enetering STEM, then it becomes a problem

I'm going to agree you on this.

I'm all for any race and gender geting into there chosen field so they can live happy productive lives.

[Stanmenistan]

This is a non-issue to begin. If women don't wanna work in STEM, that's their perogative. If men don't wanna work in biology, that's their perogative. We need to stop telling men and women what carrers to choose and let them make up their damned minds. If women want to work in STEM, let them, if they don't want to, they shouldn't. If there are more female biologists than male biologists, good for them. If there are more male engineers than female engineers, good for them. As long as nobody is prevented from entering STEM because of their gender, then this become the biggest non-issue ever. I would say that this becomes the biggest first-world prpblem, but this too pety to qualify as such. Now, if men and/or women are preventing from enetering STEM, then it becomes a problem

I'm going to agree you on this.

I'm all for any race and gender geting into there chosen field so they can live happy productive lives.

Thank you for your points you two. As a man with slight libertarian leanings (in the sense that I feel people should be free to do what they want without hurting others), I feel men and women should have equal opportunities and equal pay. But if they want to work in different careers, that's their choice, not one that should be made or forced upon them by other people.

I feel there is a way to encourage young girls and women into STEM without excluding the achievements of female biologists.
These articles show a good way to do it.

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Xkcd tells it like it is.

[SD_Film Artists]

It reminds me of when the girl scouts wanted to join the boy scouts rather than replicating what the boy scouts does. Or in other words:

"we shouldn't be stereotyped into old fashioned 'girly' activities, we can do adventurous stuff too!"

"Ok, then do adventuerous stuff. No one is stopping you.."

"No, we want to do stereotypical girly activities!"

[Ifreann]

It reminds me of when the girl scouts wanted to join the boy scouts rather than replicating what the boy scouts does. Or in other words:

"we shouldn't be stereotyped into old fashioned 'girly' activities, we can do adventurous stuff too!"

"Ok, then do adventuerous stuff. No one is stopping you.."

"No, we want to do stereotypical girly activities!"

It's so funny how you're conflating individual girls and a big organisation.