Duvniask wrote:Genivaria wrote:Exactly why is conscription not acceptable to you?
As Cisairse says: conscription is antithetical to personal liberty.
It is also
pointless. The social cohesion you guys expect from welfare states doesn't derive from the fucking draft. Jesus.
And completely unrestricted individualist personal liberty cannot coexist with things like social welfare. You give up some liberties to get benefits from the state. Expecting you can have both unrestricted individualist personal liberties AND collectivist policies at the same time is doublethink.
In order to ave both at the same time you need to have a compromise that sacrifices some personal liberties and is only partially collectivist. Real social democracy realizes this.
Even if many left coms and US “democratic socialists” seem to struggle with the idea that they are pushing two partially conflicting ideas and unwilling to compromise on both.
And the social cohesion in the Nordic States does not stem ENTIRELY from the draft, the draft absolutely plays a role in it. The problem is you refuse to admit it plays a part on ideological grounds.
Having an obligation to society (which can be fulfilled with alternative non military service for conscientious objectors) in form of a draft is one of those critical obligations, not the only one but an important one.
And no it is not pointless. It can help prevent the formation of ethnic ghettos if people are sent to desegregated units, break down other societal barriers, encourage a sense of common sacrifice, can absolutely improve military performance if done selectively to select recruits with needed skills (people assume draftees must be infantry put this is not the case, if the US reactivated the selective service it would likely to be to get health and IT personnel, which it has shortages of, not basic infantry).
You do not like it purely on ideological grounds, when pragmatically several places have used it quite successfully.
Although again I prefer simply making certain government benefits and the ability to vote contingent on the national service over threat of imprisonment.