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LWDT IX: Discussing the Left From All Engels

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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What kind of Leftist are you?

Centrist/Moderate/Third wayer.
17
12%
Social Liberal
10
7%
Social Democrat
22
16%
Green Progressive
7
5%
Democratic Socialist
25
18%
Marxist Communist
19
14%
Anarchist Communist
20
14%
Other (please state)
20
14%
 
Total votes : 140

User avatar
Las Islas de Metanoia
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Posts: 299
Founded: Jan 10, 2020
New York Times Democracy

Postby Las Islas de Metanoia » Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:09 am

So the other day I found out that my mother who was deeply religious had a hidden life, before the Church led People Power Revolution she apparently joined the Communist New People's Army and had guerrilla operations in the mountains.

I am conflicted she always told me to be a good Catholic but he subscribed to Communist ideology which was vehemently Atheist.

User avatar
Rojava Free State
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18831
Founded: Feb 06, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Rojava Free State » Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:11 am

Las Islas de Metanoia wrote:So the other day I found out that my mother who was deeply religious had a hidden life, before the Church led People Power Revolution she apparently joined the Communist New People's Army and had guerrilla operations in the mountains.

I am conflicted she always told me to be a good Catholic but he subscribed to Communist ideology which was vehemently Atheist.


Feeling's mutual. Knew a girl from your country who cheated on her boyfriend with a Romanian guy and then said to me "I'm a good christian, I love my husband." The art of being fake, being a hypocrite and living double lives must be something people in the Philippines learned from America, since we're experts at that kind of stuff.
political compass:

Economic Left/Right: -0.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.38
pro: marijuana, gun rights, private property

anti: fascism, communism, islamism, sexism, pan africanism, La raza, Warren Police Department (and most of the other police departments of metro Detroit except for Auburn Hills. They're aight), gun control, trump, obama, bush, clinton, reagan, carter, chipotle and snotty in crowd teens. Ugh I can't deal with them
Hurdergaryp wrote:Humanity keeps seeing itself as the crown of creation, but to this world we're a crown of thorns at best.


Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/invites/conta ... ent=82zr2h

User avatar
Las Islas de Metanoia
Envoy
 
Posts: 299
Founded: Jan 10, 2020
New York Times Democracy

Postby Las Islas de Metanoia » Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:26 am

Rojava Free State wrote:
Las Islas de Metanoia wrote:So the other day I found out that my mother who was deeply religious had a hidden life, before the Church led People Power Revolution she apparently joined the Communist New People's Army and had guerrilla operations in the mountains.

I am conflicted she always told me to be a good Catholic but he subscribed to Communist ideology which was vehemently Atheist.


Feeling's mutual. Knew a girl from your country who cheated on her boyfriend with a Romanian guy and then said to me "I'm a good christian, I love my husband." The art of being fake, being a hypocrite and living double lives must be something people in the Philippines learned from America, since we're experts at that kind of stuff.


Nah, more than anything Americans are deeply honest, I think being honest about your intentions and emotions is a sign of strength at least from a position of power since you can be more honest about yourself when can control everyone but you have to shut up about your intentions if you're a powerless slave. That's why I really admire honest labor class people, especially if they go against you despite their weakness.

Maybe my mom hid things from me because she had a "Metanoia" moment, when she was pregnant with my sister with dictator's soldiers who spared her life because she was raped instead, she then had an about turn; she said that, she has kids to take care now, she was very willing to throw away her life for the cause but now that she has another kid to take care, she had to work within the system.

That's why she kept drumming in me "humility! humility!" the meek and kind will inherit the earth. And she wanted to keep her communist episodes a secret for our own safety. Had I gone on with my genetic predisposition of our soldier and knightly lineage of always looking for honor in war, she would probably be a poor insurgent until now instead of a judge and a prospect of the Philippine Supreme Court.

User avatar
Las Islas de Metanoia
Envoy
 
Posts: 299
Founded: Jan 10, 2020
New York Times Democracy

Postby Las Islas de Metanoia » Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:28 am

The New California Republic wrote:
(Image)
LWDT IX: Discussing the Left From All Engels




Hi folks! Welcome to the 9th iteration of the Left Wing Discussion Thread. As always please follow the forum rules when posting here. Take a break if you start feeling angry, instead of that anger determining the content of your posts here.

Relevant subjects for discussion include:

  • The politics, philosophies, and ideologies of the political left.
  • Left-wing perspectives on economics and political economy.
  • News and history relevant to the political left.
  • Left-wing responses to current events.
  • Left-wing perspectives on social and economic problems.
  • Political, social, cultural, and economic problems and their solutions according to the political left.
  • Leftist intersectionality with movements aimed at alleviating the suffering of oppressed minority groups such as the LGBT+ community, oppressed racial minority groups, and more.
  • The problems facing particular left-wing movements or the political left in general, and how to resolve them.



Poll History:

”What kind of Leftist are you?”
  • Centrist/Moderate/Third wayer - 279 (13%)
  • Social Liberal - 259 (12%)
  • Social Democrat - 338 (16%)
  • Green Progressive - 188 (9%)
  • Democratic Socialist - 433 (20%)
  • Marxist Communist - 246 (12%)
  • Anarchist Communist - 202 (10%)
  • Other (please state) - 176 (8%)
Total Votes: 2121 (Recorded 28/11/2016)
”What type of leftist are you?”
  • Left-leaning Centrist - 50 (12%)
  • Social Liberal - 57 (14%)
  • Social Democrat - 62 (15%)
  • Democratic Socialist - 80 (19%)
  • Marxist Communist - 59 (14%)
  • Anarchist Communist - 41 (10%)
  • Collectivist Anarchist - 9 (2%)
  • Individualist Anarchist - 10 (2%)
  • Revolutionary Syndicalist - 22 (5%)
  • Other (Please State) - 28 (7%)
Total Votes: 418 (Recorded 26/12/2016)

”What type of leftist are you?”
  • Left-leaning Centrist - 57 (13%)
  • Left/Social Liberal - 51 (12%)
  • Social Democrat - 73 (17%)
  • Democratic Socialist - 78 (18%)
  • Libertarian Marxist - 22 (5%)
  • Other Marxist - 43 (10%)
  • Social Anarchist - 31 (7%)
  • Individualist Anarchist - 13 (3%)
  • Revolutionary Syndicalist - 21 (5%)
  • Other (Please State) - 47 (11%)
Total Votes: 436 (Recorded 05/02/2017)

”Favourite Left-Wing Thinker?”
  • John Rawls - 11 (7%)
  • John Stuart Mill - 12 (8%)
  • Karl Marx - 44 (29%)
  • Max Stirner - 11 (7%)
  • Simone de Beauvoir - 1 (1%)
  • Noam Chomsky - 13 (9%)
  • Peter Kropotkin - 30 (20%)
  • Pierre-Joseph Proudhon - 6 (4%)
  • Slavoj Žižek - 7 (5%)
  • Other (Please State) - 15 (10%)
Total Votes: 150 (Recorded 19/02/2017)

”Favourite Left-Wing Politician?”
  • Bernie Sanders - 25 (17%)
  • Clement Attlee - 9 (6%)
  • Eugene V. Debs - 19 (13%)
  • Franklin D. Roosevelt - 37 (25%)
  • François Mitterand - 1 (1%)
  • Nikita Krushchev - 4 (3%)
  • Nelson Mandela - 21 (14%)
  • Salvador Allende - 8 (5%)
  • Tony Benn - 4 (3%)
  • Other (Please State) - 23 (15%)
Total Votes: 151 (Recorded 14/03/2017)

”Favourite Left-Wing Social Movement/Revolution?”
  • French Revolution, 1789 (France) - 61 (14%)
  • Spring Of Nations, 1848 (Europe) - 34 (8%)
  • October Revolution, 1917 (Russia) - 60 (14%)
  • Spanish Revolution, 1936 (Spain) - 57 (14%)
  • Chinese Communist Revolution, 1946 (China) - 14 (3%)
  • Resistance To Apartheid, 1950 (South Africa) - 24 (6%)
  • Cuban Revolution, 1953 (Cuba) - 19 (5%)
  • Civil Rights Movement, 1954 (USA) - 123 (29%)
  • Occupy Movement, 2011 (International) - 10 (2%)
  • Other (Please State) - 19 (5%)
Total Votes: 421 (Recorded 29/7/2017)

”Preferred economic system?”
  • Welfare Capitalism 92 (23%)
  • Market Socialism 62 (16%)
  • Mutualism 10 (3%)
  • Syndicalism 40 (10%)
  • Communalism 13 (3%)
  • State Planning 36 (9%)
  • Decentralised Planning 27 (7%)
  • Higher Phase Communism 38 (10%)
  • Left-wing Market Anarchism 15 (4%)
  • Other 67 (17%)
Total Votes: 400 (Recorded 05/11/2017)
Left-leaning Centrist
105 13%
Left/Social Liberal
74 9%
Social Democrat
115 14%
Democratic Socialist
139 17%
Marxist Communist
139 17%
Social Anarchist
50 6%
Individualist Anarchist
38 5%
Revolutionary Syndicalist
39 5%
Communalist
27 3%
Other (Please Post)
71 9%
Total votes : 797 (6/3/18)
Was Trotsky Polyamorous?
Yes 141 58%
Yes 103 42%
Who are the greatest threat to the Revolution?

Class traitors 9 5%
Social Democratic Fascists 17 9%
Bourgeois Homosexuals 30 16%
Kulaks 7 4%
Trotskyite Conspirator Saboteurs 16 9%
Actual Capitalists and Fascists 103 57%
Total votes : 182
Poll 1: Bread poll! Which Bread Anarchism is the best? (65 votes total)
  • Bread Santa, of course! - 3 (5%)
  • Bread Santa but more red. - 3 (5%)
  • Seriously? THIS is a poll? - 4 (6%)
  • Yes. - 3 (5%)
  • The Conquest of Bread. - 3 (5%)
  • I knead to get out of this thread. - 5 (8%)
  • Can you not be OP anymore? - 5 (8%)
  • No. - 13 (20%)
  • Fully Automated Luxury Hella Queer Space Anarchy forever! - 11 (17%) ( ;~; )
  • Torra, are you okay? Are you inbread? Because these poll options suck. - 15 (23%)

Poll 2: Roughly where do you sit on the left-wing of the political spectrum?

  • Yes. - 6 (17%)
  • Center-left, authoritarian. - 1 (3%)
  • Center-left, libertarian. - 3 (9%)
  • Center-left, centrist. - 4 (11%)
  • Mid-left, authoritarian. - 1 (3%)
  • Mid-left, libertarian. - 4 (11%)
  • Mid-left, centrist. - 3 (9%)
  • Far-left, authoritarian. - 1 (3%)
  • Far-left, libertarian. - 10 (29%)
  • Far-left, centrist. - 2 (6%)

Poll 3: Title Time! Which Title Should We Have?

  • Keep it as it is. - 4 (11%)
  • Yes. - 6 (17%)
  • Bread Dead Redemption. - 18 (50%)
  • Makhno Mistake, The Left is The Best! - 4 (11%)
  • The Right Can't Fight! - 4 (11%)
Poll 1: What do you think is currently the most successful existing example of a leftist movement globally?

  • Rojava, Northern Syria (2,000,000 people, acting as a governing body since 2014 and autonomous since 2016; Semi-Direct Democratic Libertarian Socialism) - 57 (40%)
  • The Zapatista Autonomous Communities, Chiapas, Mexico (364,000 people, autonomous since 1994; Direct Democratic Libertarian Socialism) - 37 (26%)
  • The DSA, USA (60,000 members as of 2019, founded in 1982; Democratic Socialist/Social Democratic, depending on region or person) - 11 (8%)
  • The International Workers' Association (17 member groups across the world, founded in 1922; Anarcho-Syndicalism) - 10 (7%)
  • The Committee for a Workers' Internationale (41 member groups globally, founded in 1974; Trotskyist) - 7 (5%)
  • Movement for Socialism, Bolivia (88/130 Deputies and 25/36 Senators, has democratically held power since 2006; Socialism of the 21st Century) - 20 (14%)
Poll 2: Which Book on Leftist Ideology is Your Preferred Book?
  • Other (Please Explain) - 32 (25%)
  • The Communist Manifesto (Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels) - 23 (18%)
  • The Conquest of Bread (Peter Kropotkin) - 24 (19%)
  • Das Kapital (Karl Marx) - 21 (16%)
  • What is Property? (Pierre-Joseph Proudhon) - 2 (2%)
  • Guerilla Warfare (Che Guevara) - 8 (6%)
  • Mutual Aid (Peter Kropotkin) - 2 (2%)
  • Profit Over People (Noam Chomsky) - 4 (3%)
  • The Ego and Its Own (Max Stirner) - 8 (6%)
  • Debt: The First 5,000 Years (David Graeber) - 5 (4%)
Poll 1: Who is your favorite breadtuber?
  • ContraPoints - 44 (26%)
  • Hbomberguy - 21 (12%)
  • Shaun and Jen - 6 (3%)
  • Innuendo Studios - 8 (5%)
  • Philosophy Tube - 22 (13%)
  • Peter Coffin - 2 (1%)
  • Three Arrows - 12 (7%)
  • BadMouseProductions - 21 (12%)
  • Thought Slime - 5 (3%)
  • Other - 31 (18%)

Under which leaders (if any) was the Soviet Union socialist?
Lenin (1918-1924) 404 34%
Stalin (1924-1953) 219 19%
Khrushchev (1953-1964) 147 12%
Brezhnev (1964-1982) 122 10%
Gorbachev (1985-1991) 122 10%
Never 164 14%





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YouTube Channels


Lots of free leftist literature is available at:

Free leftist audiobooks are also available at:

Other useful resources:


Hey there Mr. Reporter who got me temp banned even when I explicitly said I won't report you for the insults you hurled at me first. I will never forget your ingrate and callous nature.

User avatar
Rojava Free State
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18831
Founded: Feb 06, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Rojava Free State » Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:53 am

Las Islas de Metanoia wrote:
Rojava Free State wrote:
Feeling's mutual. Knew a girl from your country who cheated on her boyfriend with a Romanian guy and then said to me "I'm a good christian, I love my husband." The art of being fake, being a hypocrite and living double lives must be something people in the Philippines learned from America, since we're experts at that kind of stuff.


Nah, more than anything Americans are deeply honest, I think being honest about your intentions and emotions is a sign of strength at least from a position of power since you can be more honest about yourself when can control everyone but you have to shut up about your intentions if you're a powerless slave. That's why I really admire honest labor class people, especially if they go against you despite their weakness.

Maybe my mom hid things from me because she had a "Metanoia" moment, when she was pregnant with my sister with dictator's soldiers who spared her life because she was raped instead, she then had an about turn; she said that, she has kids to take care now, she was very willing to throw away her life for the cause but now that she has another kid to take care, she had to work within the system.

That's why she kept drumming in me "humility! humility!" the meek and kind will inherit the earth. And she wanted to keep her communist episodes a secret for our own safety. Had I gone on with my genetic predisposition of our soldier and knightly lineage of always looking for honor in war, she would probably be a poor insurgent until now instead of a judge and a prospect of the Philippine Supreme Court.


My mom is basically a political normie, being a Biden supporter, and my dad is a borderline fascist so that's...uncomfortable. Nothing in their political past that's weird.

And I dont know if Americans are honest. I think we were very honest recently when we elected Trump, since we were finally admitting to the world:

•We don't value freedom.
•We don't value human life.
•We accept feelings over facts.
•We have alot of racists in our country.
•We love reality TV and all its obnoxious and vulgar behavior.

Trump is the president we definitely didn't need, but we absolutely deserved as a people.
Last edited by Rojava Free State on Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:54 am, edited 2 times in total.
political compass:

Economic Left/Right: -0.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.38
pro: marijuana, gun rights, private property

anti: fascism, communism, islamism, sexism, pan africanism, La raza, Warren Police Department (and most of the other police departments of metro Detroit except for Auburn Hills. They're aight), gun control, trump, obama, bush, clinton, reagan, carter, chipotle and snotty in crowd teens. Ugh I can't deal with them
Hurdergaryp wrote:Humanity keeps seeing itself as the crown of creation, but to this world we're a crown of thorns at best.


Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/invites/conta ... ent=82zr2h

User avatar
Cisairse
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8499
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cisairse » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:03 am

Albrenia wrote:So in ye olde Communism, who owns a business where the production is done by self-maintaining robots?


The robots
Now it's clear as a pillar of smoke
The details of the above post are subject to leftist infighting.

And broken Starbucks glass

Yeah, I support my troops
They wave black flags
They wear black masks

User avatar
Cisairse
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8499
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cisairse » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:04 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:The leftists and the right wingers just have very different, economic, political, social and cultural views, it does not mean the right wingers are bad and evil and the leftists are good. It does not mean the leftists are bad and evil and the right wingers are good. We have very different ways of thinking.


Yeah, well, from my point of view the Jedi are evil.
Now it's clear as a pillar of smoke
The details of the above post are subject to leftist infighting.

And broken Starbucks glass

Yeah, I support my troops
They wave black flags
They wear black masks

User avatar
Cekoviu
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16094
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cekoviu » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:06 am

Cisairse wrote:So in ye olde Communism, who owns a business where the production is done by self-maintaining robots?

The robots, i.e. the workers
Last edited by Cekoviu on Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
RWDT - REST IN POWER
Market socialist, David Hume fangirl, and massive Tuvaboo. Moderate SWERF & traditionalist SJW. Non-denominational Christian, influenced by Orthodoxy and certain Protestant currents.
/tʃɛ'koʊ.vi:.ju:/ (check-OH-vee-you)

User avatar
Cisairse
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8499
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cisairse » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:06 am

Rojava Free State wrote:
Las Islas de Metanoia wrote:
Nah, more than anything Americans are deeply honest, I think being honest about your intentions and emotions is a sign of strength at least from a position of power since you can be more honest about yourself when can control everyone but you have to shut up about your intentions if you're a powerless slave. That's why I really admire honest labor class people, especially if they go against you despite their weakness.

Maybe my mom hid things from me because she had a "Metanoia" moment, when she was pregnant with my sister with dictator's soldiers who spared her life because she was raped instead, she then had an about turn; she said that, she has kids to take care now, she was very willing to throw away her life for the cause but now that she has another kid to take care, she had to work within the system.

That's why she kept drumming in me "humility! humility!" the meek and kind will inherit the earth. And she wanted to keep her communist episodes a secret for our own safety. Had I gone on with my genetic predisposition of our soldier and knightly lineage of always looking for honor in war, she would probably be a poor insurgent until now instead of a judge and a prospect of the Philippine Supreme Court.


My mom is basically a political normie, being a Biden supporter, and my dad is a borderline fascist so that's...uncomfortable. Nothing in their political past that's weird.

And I dont know if Americans are honest. I think we were very honest recently when we elected Trump, since we were finally admitting to the world:

•We don't value freedom.
•We don't value human life.
•We accept feelings over facts.
•We have alot of racists in our country.
•We love reality TV and all its obnoxious and vulgar behavior.

Trump is the president we definitely didn't need, but we absolutely deserved as a people.


Hey, don't attribute the views of radical right-wing religious fundamentalists to all of America. Remember, a majority of American voters voted against Trump.
Now it's clear as a pillar of smoke
The details of the above post are subject to leftist infighting.

And broken Starbucks glass

Yeah, I support my troops
They wave black flags
They wear black masks

User avatar
Cekoviu
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16094
Founded: Oct 18, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cekoviu » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:07 am

poll please
RWDT - REST IN POWER
Market socialist, David Hume fangirl, and massive Tuvaboo. Moderate SWERF & traditionalist SJW. Non-denominational Christian, influenced by Orthodoxy and certain Protestant currents.
/tʃɛ'koʊ.vi:.ju:/ (check-OH-vee-you)

User avatar
Rojava Free State
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18831
Founded: Feb 06, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Rojava Free State » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:09 am

Cisairse wrote:
Rojava Free State wrote:
My mom is basically a political normie, being a Biden supporter, and my dad is a borderline fascist so that's...uncomfortable. Nothing in their political past that's weird.

And I dont know if Americans are honest. I think we were very honest recently when we elected Trump, since we were finally admitting to the world:

•We don't value freedom.
•We don't value human life.
•We accept feelings over facts.
•We have alot of racists in our country.
•We love reality TV and all its obnoxious and vulgar behavior.

Trump is the president we definitely didn't need, but we absolutely deserved as a people.


Hey, don't attribute the views of radical right-wing religious fundamentalists to all of America. Remember, a majority of American voters voted against Trump.


Yes, about 48% didnt vote for trump, compared to his 45%, but clearly we need to do a better job fighting these ideologies.

Speaking of that, sounds like my dad is ranting about martial law and loss of freedoms cause of COVID again.
political compass:

Economic Left/Right: -0.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.38
pro: marijuana, gun rights, private property

anti: fascism, communism, islamism, sexism, pan africanism, La raza, Warren Police Department (and most of the other police departments of metro Detroit except for Auburn Hills. They're aight), gun control, trump, obama, bush, clinton, reagan, carter, chipotle and snotty in crowd teens. Ugh I can't deal with them
Hurdergaryp wrote:Humanity keeps seeing itself as the crown of creation, but to this world we're a crown of thorns at best.


Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/invites/conta ... ent=82zr2h

User avatar
Cisairse
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8499
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cisairse » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:12 am

Rojava Free State wrote:
Cisairse wrote:
Hey, don't attribute the views of radical right-wing religious fundamentalists to all of America. Remember, a majority of American voters voted against Trump.


Yes, about 48% didnt vote for trump, compared to his 45%, but clearly we need to do a better job fighting these ideologies.

Speaking of that, sounds like my dad is ranting about martial law and loss of freedoms cause of COVID again.


That's not how numbers work. 53.9% of voters voted against Trump. That's an even higher number than voted against Romney in '12.
Now it's clear as a pillar of smoke
The details of the above post are subject to leftist infighting.

And broken Starbucks glass

Yeah, I support my troops
They wave black flags
They wear black masks

User avatar
Rojava Free State
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18831
Founded: Feb 06, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Rojava Free State » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:16 am

Cisairse wrote:
Rojava Free State wrote:
Yes, about 48% didnt vote for trump, compared to his 45%, but clearly we need to do a better job fighting these ideologies.

Speaking of that, sounds like my dad is ranting about martial law and loss of freedoms cause of COVID again.


That's not how numbers work. 53.9% of voters voted against Trump. That's an even higher number than voted against Romney in '12.


That's still way too many people who went for Trump. Clearly we are doing something wrong as a people if Trump wasn't single handedly defeated in the primary alone early on.
political compass:

Economic Left/Right: -0.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.38
pro: marijuana, gun rights, private property

anti: fascism, communism, islamism, sexism, pan africanism, La raza, Warren Police Department (and most of the other police departments of metro Detroit except for Auburn Hills. They're aight), gun control, trump, obama, bush, clinton, reagan, carter, chipotle and snotty in crowd teens. Ugh I can't deal with them
Hurdergaryp wrote:Humanity keeps seeing itself as the crown of creation, but to this world we're a crown of thorns at best.


Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/invites/conta ... ent=82zr2h

User avatar
LiberNovusAmericae
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6945
Founded: Mar 10, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:18 am

Las Islas de Metanoia wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:
(Image)
LWDT IX: Discussing the Left From All Engels




Hi folks! Welcome to the 9th iteration of the Left Wing Discussion Thread. As always please follow the forum rules when posting here. Take a break if you start feeling angry, instead of that anger determining the content of your posts here.

Relevant subjects for discussion include:

  • The politics, philosophies, and ideologies of the political left.
  • Left-wing perspectives on economics and political economy.
  • News and history relevant to the political left.
  • Left-wing responses to current events.
  • Left-wing perspectives on social and economic problems.
  • Political, social, cultural, and economic problems and their solutions according to the political left.
  • Leftist intersectionality with movements aimed at alleviating the suffering of oppressed minority groups such as the LGBT+ community, oppressed racial minority groups, and more.
  • The problems facing particular left-wing movements or the political left in general, and how to resolve them.



Poll History:

”What kind of Leftist are you?”
  • Centrist/Moderate/Third wayer - 279 (13%)
  • Social Liberal - 259 (12%)
  • Social Democrat - 338 (16%)
  • Green Progressive - 188 (9%)
  • Democratic Socialist - 433 (20%)
  • Marxist Communist - 246 (12%)
  • Anarchist Communist - 202 (10%)
  • Other (please state) - 176 (8%)
Total Votes: 2121 (Recorded 28/11/2016)
”What type of leftist are you?”
  • Left-leaning Centrist - 50 (12%)
  • Social Liberal - 57 (14%)
  • Social Democrat - 62 (15%)
  • Democratic Socialist - 80 (19%)
  • Marxist Communist - 59 (14%)
  • Anarchist Communist - 41 (10%)
  • Collectivist Anarchist - 9 (2%)
  • Individualist Anarchist - 10 (2%)
  • Revolutionary Syndicalist - 22 (5%)
  • Other (Please State) - 28 (7%)
Total Votes: 418 (Recorded 26/12/2016)

”What type of leftist are you?”
  • Left-leaning Centrist - 57 (13%)
  • Left/Social Liberal - 51 (12%)
  • Social Democrat - 73 (17%)
  • Democratic Socialist - 78 (18%)
  • Libertarian Marxist - 22 (5%)
  • Other Marxist - 43 (10%)
  • Social Anarchist - 31 (7%)
  • Individualist Anarchist - 13 (3%)
  • Revolutionary Syndicalist - 21 (5%)
  • Other (Please State) - 47 (11%)
Total Votes: 436 (Recorded 05/02/2017)

”Favourite Left-Wing Thinker?”
  • John Rawls - 11 (7%)
  • John Stuart Mill - 12 (8%)
  • Karl Marx - 44 (29%)
  • Max Stirner - 11 (7%)
  • Simone de Beauvoir - 1 (1%)
  • Noam Chomsky - 13 (9%)
  • Peter Kropotkin - 30 (20%)
  • Pierre-Joseph Proudhon - 6 (4%)
  • Slavoj Žižek - 7 (5%)
  • Other (Please State) - 15 (10%)
Total Votes: 150 (Recorded 19/02/2017)

”Favourite Left-Wing Politician?”
  • Bernie Sanders - 25 (17%)
  • Clement Attlee - 9 (6%)
  • Eugene V. Debs - 19 (13%)
  • Franklin D. Roosevelt - 37 (25%)
  • François Mitterand - 1 (1%)
  • Nikita Krushchev - 4 (3%)
  • Nelson Mandela - 21 (14%)
  • Salvador Allende - 8 (5%)
  • Tony Benn - 4 (3%)
  • Other (Please State) - 23 (15%)
Total Votes: 151 (Recorded 14/03/2017)

”Favourite Left-Wing Social Movement/Revolution?”
  • French Revolution, 1789 (France) - 61 (14%)
  • Spring Of Nations, 1848 (Europe) - 34 (8%)
  • October Revolution, 1917 (Russia) - 60 (14%)
  • Spanish Revolution, 1936 (Spain) - 57 (14%)
  • Chinese Communist Revolution, 1946 (China) - 14 (3%)
  • Resistance To Apartheid, 1950 (South Africa) - 24 (6%)
  • Cuban Revolution, 1953 (Cuba) - 19 (5%)
  • Civil Rights Movement, 1954 (USA) - 123 (29%)
  • Occupy Movement, 2011 (International) - 10 (2%)
  • Other (Please State) - 19 (5%)
Total Votes: 421 (Recorded 29/7/2017)

”Preferred economic system?”
  • Welfare Capitalism 92 (23%)
  • Market Socialism 62 (16%)
  • Mutualism 10 (3%)
  • Syndicalism 40 (10%)
  • Communalism 13 (3%)
  • State Planning 36 (9%)
  • Decentralised Planning 27 (7%)
  • Higher Phase Communism 38 (10%)
  • Left-wing Market Anarchism 15 (4%)
  • Other 67 (17%)
Total Votes: 400 (Recorded 05/11/2017)
Left-leaning Centrist
105 13%
Left/Social Liberal
74 9%
Social Democrat
115 14%
Democratic Socialist
139 17%
Marxist Communist
139 17%
Social Anarchist
50 6%
Individualist Anarchist
38 5%
Revolutionary Syndicalist
39 5%
Communalist
27 3%
Other (Please Post)
71 9%
Total votes : 797 (6/3/18)
Was Trotsky Polyamorous?
Yes 141 58%
Yes 103 42%
Who are the greatest threat to the Revolution?

Class traitors 9 5%
Social Democratic Fascists 17 9%
Bourgeois Homosexuals 30 16%
Kulaks 7 4%
Trotskyite Conspirator Saboteurs 16 9%
Actual Capitalists and Fascists 103 57%
Total votes : 182
Poll 1: Bread poll! Which Bread Anarchism is the best? (65 votes total)
  • Bread Santa, of course! - 3 (5%)
  • Bread Santa but more red. - 3 (5%)
  • Seriously? THIS is a poll? - 4 (6%)
  • Yes. - 3 (5%)
  • The Conquest of Bread. - 3 (5%)
  • I knead to get out of this thread. - 5 (8%)
  • Can you not be OP anymore? - 5 (8%)
  • No. - 13 (20%)
  • Fully Automated Luxury Hella Queer Space Anarchy forever! - 11 (17%) ( ;~; )
  • Torra, are you okay? Are you inbread? Because these poll options suck. - 15 (23%)

Poll 2: Roughly where do you sit on the left-wing of the political spectrum?

  • Yes. - 6 (17%)
  • Center-left, authoritarian. - 1 (3%)
  • Center-left, libertarian. - 3 (9%)
  • Center-left, centrist. - 4 (11%)
  • Mid-left, authoritarian. - 1 (3%)
  • Mid-left, libertarian. - 4 (11%)
  • Mid-left, centrist. - 3 (9%)
  • Far-left, authoritarian. - 1 (3%)
  • Far-left, libertarian. - 10 (29%)
  • Far-left, centrist. - 2 (6%)

Poll 3: Title Time! Which Title Should We Have?

  • Keep it as it is. - 4 (11%)
  • Yes. - 6 (17%)
  • Bread Dead Redemption. - 18 (50%)
  • Makhno Mistake, The Left is The Best! - 4 (11%)
  • The Right Can't Fight! - 4 (11%)
Poll 1: What do you think is currently the most successful existing example of a leftist movement globally?

  • Rojava, Northern Syria (2,000,000 people, acting as a governing body since 2014 and autonomous since 2016; Semi-Direct Democratic Libertarian Socialism) - 57 (40%)
  • The Zapatista Autonomous Communities, Chiapas, Mexico (364,000 people, autonomous since 1994; Direct Democratic Libertarian Socialism) - 37 (26%)
  • The DSA, USA (60,000 members as of 2019, founded in 1982; Democratic Socialist/Social Democratic, depending on region or person) - 11 (8%)
  • The International Workers' Association (17 member groups across the world, founded in 1922; Anarcho-Syndicalism) - 10 (7%)
  • The Committee for a Workers' Internationale (41 member groups globally, founded in 1974; Trotskyist) - 7 (5%)
  • Movement for Socialism, Bolivia (88/130 Deputies and 25/36 Senators, has democratically held power since 2006; Socialism of the 21st Century) - 20 (14%)
Poll 2: Which Book on Leftist Ideology is Your Preferred Book?
  • Other (Please Explain) - 32 (25%)
  • The Communist Manifesto (Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels) - 23 (18%)
  • The Conquest of Bread (Peter Kropotkin) - 24 (19%)
  • Das Kapital (Karl Marx) - 21 (16%)
  • What is Property? (Pierre-Joseph Proudhon) - 2 (2%)
  • Guerilla Warfare (Che Guevara) - 8 (6%)
  • Mutual Aid (Peter Kropotkin) - 2 (2%)
  • Profit Over People (Noam Chomsky) - 4 (3%)
  • The Ego and Its Own (Max Stirner) - 8 (6%)
  • Debt: The First 5,000 Years (David Graeber) - 5 (4%)
Poll 1: Who is your favorite breadtuber?
  • ContraPoints - 44 (26%)
  • Hbomberguy - 21 (12%)
  • Shaun and Jen - 6 (3%)
  • Innuendo Studios - 8 (5%)
  • Philosophy Tube - 22 (13%)
  • Peter Coffin - 2 (1%)
  • Three Arrows - 12 (7%)
  • BadMouseProductions - 21 (12%)
  • Thought Slime - 5 (3%)
  • Other - 31 (18%)

Under which leaders (if any) was the Soviet Union socialist?
Lenin (1918-1924) 404 34%
Stalin (1924-1953) 219 19%
Khrushchev (1953-1964) 147 12%
Brezhnev (1964-1982) 122 10%
Gorbachev (1985-1991) 122 10%
Never 164 14%





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Hey there Mr. Reporter who got me temp banned even when I explicitly said I won't report you for the insults you hurled at me first. I will never forget your ingrate and callous nature.

Right wingers should stop hesitating when thinking about reporting commies for rule violations. Stop taking the high ground.
Last edited by LiberNovusAmericae on Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
China Lied, People Died.
Anti-imperialism is really code for anti-west.
Not to be confused with Novus America! We are NOT the same player.

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
P2TM RP Mentor
 
Posts: 19219
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:28 am

Greater Miami Shores wrote:The leftists and the right wingers just have very different, economic, political, social and cultural views, it does not mean the right wingers are bad and evil and the leftists are good. It does not mean the leftists are bad and evil and the right wingers are good. We have very different ways of thinking.

A sentiment that only makes sense in an abstract vacuum, if we forget the contents of political ideologies.

Having a different views is not something you are born with, or something you cannot change. And it certainly is something that involves morals. Your morals should dictate your political views. I do not judge people just for having a different political opinion in the abstract. However, I will judge people for the moral code that leads them to have a certain political opinion. If you believe, for example, that people ought to die in other to protect the Dow Jones, that is a political opinion that stems from what I judge to be a bad moral code.

To view politics as totally devoid from the personal is a privilege only enjoyed by those who don’t stand to lose. When meeting someone who would take away the rights of me and my friends, who threatens the mental health of those I hold dear, I cannot just say ‘well, that’s politics’ and move on.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.

Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled


Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
P2TM RP Mentor
 
Posts: 19219
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:32 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:
Las Islas de Metanoia wrote:
Hey there Mr. Reporter who got me temp banned even when I explicitly said I won't report you for the insults you hurled at me first. I will never forget your ingrate and callous nature.

Right wingers should stop hesitating when thinking about reporting commies for rule violations. Stop taking the high ground.

You were taking the high ground?

Jesus, what’s the low ground?
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.

Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled


Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
LiberNovusAmericae
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Posts: 6945
Founded: Mar 10, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:42 am

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:Jesus, what’s the low ground?

Augusto Pinochet is the lowest ground.
Last edited by LiberNovusAmericae on Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
China Lied, People Died.
Anti-imperialism is really code for anti-west.
Not to be confused with Novus America! We are NOT the same player.

User avatar
The New California Republic
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27246
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:43 am

Cekoviu wrote:poll please

It's up. Was away from the computer for a bit.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

NS Hitman
White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

User avatar
Cisairse
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8499
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cisairse » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:45 am

I'm answering the poll with the following assumptions:
  • I can return to my present life at the precise moment I left upon the conclusion of the revolution
  • When you die in the Russian Revolution, you don't die in real life
Now it's clear as a pillar of smoke
The details of the above post are subject to leftist infighting.

And broken Starbucks glass

Yeah, I support my troops
They wave black flags
They wear black masks

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
P2TM RP Mentor
 
Posts: 19219
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:46 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:Jesus, what’s the low ground?

Augusto Pinochet is the lowest ground.

At least his victims were.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.

Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled


Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
LiberNovusAmericae
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6945
Founded: Mar 10, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:48 am

How many of you here view the Russian Revolution favorably?
China Lied, People Died.
Anti-imperialism is really code for anti-west.
Not to be confused with Novus America! We are NOT the same player.

User avatar
The New California Republic
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27246
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:50 am

Cisairse wrote:I'm answering the poll with the following assumptions:
  • I can return to my present life at the precise moment I left upon the conclusion of the revolution
  • When you die in the Russian Revolution, you don't die in real life

Yeah nobody there will be aware of your presence unless you want them to be, and you can't be harmed. But by the same token you are there to observe, your presence will not change anything (besides the joke option in the poll to replace John Reed with Hasselhoff).
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

NS Hitman
White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

User avatar
Cisairse
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8499
Founded: Mar 17, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Cisairse » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:58 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:How many of you here view the Russian Revolution favorably?


Revolution was pretty good. Stalin was not, but that was post-revolution so I'd say overall favorable.
Now it's clear as a pillar of smoke
The details of the above post are subject to leftist infighting.

And broken Starbucks glass

Yeah, I support my troops
They wave black flags
They wear black masks

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
P2TM RP Mentor
 
Posts: 19219
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:59 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:How many of you here view the Russian Revolution favorably?

I’m inclined to view the February Revolution favourably. But I’m a Menshevik rather than a Bolshevik. Red October was a bloody coup by antidemocratic forces and should be viewed as such.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.

Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled


Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
Kowani
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21773
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Wed Apr 01, 2020 9:06 am

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:How many of you here view the Russian Revolution favorably?

The Revolution itself, fine. Tsardom needed to die.
What followed, not so much.
Spanish Atheist.
If an area was ours for 500 years and yours for 50 years, it should belong to us – you are merely occupiers.
If an area was yours for 500 years and ours for 50 years, it should belong to us – borders must not be changed.
If an area belonged to us 500 years ago but never since then, it should belong to us – it is the cradle of our nation.
If a majority of our people live there, it must belong to us – they must enjoy the right of self-determination.
If a minority of our people live there, it must belong to us – they must be protected against your oppression.
All of the above rules apply to us, but not to you.
Our dream of greatness is historical necessity, yours is fascism.

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