NationStates

Alvecia wrote:

Lower Nubia wrote:
Is that contempt I sense?

I dunno, why don't you guess what I'm contemptuous of and I'll tell you how close you get.

Lower Nubia wrote:

Alvecia wrote:I dunno, why don't you guess what I'm contemptuous of and I'll tell you how close you get.

Why play games? Yes, no, or just a little?

Freakoland wrote:

Region of Dwipantara wrote:Here's my opinion:

1. The Czech republic is a nice and peaceful central European country with good healthcare, high standard of living, and an irreligiousity rate of 72%. Meanwhile, Afghanistan is a totalitarian fundamentalist sh*thole country with quack infrastructure and subsistence-level income. I'm not saying that all religion is bad for society per se, some quite the opposite in fact, but I do say that religion isn't really an important factor.

2. The problem with most religion is that, being a dictatorial commandment from the sky that we must obey or else, they can't evaluate the result of their existence and correct them (or at least efficiently). Humans need principles, sure, but we also need a way to evaluate if those principles makes the world a better place or instead drag ourselves to the 6th century.

I think that's interesting what you said in your second point., that religion being a "dictatorial commandment from the sky" or else, in that perhaps religion is just a reflection human nature's desire for some sort of higher authority. People dont really do well in chaos so most people naturally accept a dictorial commandment from the sky. Now that being said I wouldn't say that it is good. People who are able to train themselves out of needing that dictorial commandment in the sky and see the absolute chaos and arbitrariness of the universe and are still able to hold that and be ok with, I think that's where real life begins.

Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not inherently but religion in its various forms be it Christian, Hindu, Muslim, pagan etc etc does provide a sense of community and belonging that thus far at least purely secular things have failed to match.

Sadakoyama wrote:

Freakoland wrote:What I think would be interesting is to compare different societies which have tried to eradicate religion versus those which were basically theocratic.

Say Communist Russia vs. Imperial Russia.

Communist Russia rather quickly replaced worhip of god with worship of Stalin, though. It would be better to look at cultures evolving out of religion, such as Scandanavia.

Alvecia wrote:Personally I don't think so. That which religion provides can be provided through other means.

That said, even without it, people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Alvecia wrote:

Lower Nubia wrote:
Why play games? Yes, no, or just a little?

This really is me trying not to play a game. Why don't you just skip the foreplay and get right to the point you're trying to make.

Genivaria wrote:

Washington Resistance Army wrote:Not inherently but religion in its various forms be it Christian, Hindu, Muslim, pagan etc etc does provide a sense of community and belonging that thus far at least purely secular things have failed to match.

Are governments and corporations not by their nature secular?

Alvecia wrote:Personally I don't think so. That which religion provides can be provided through other means.

That said, even without it, people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Freakoland wrote:

Sadakoyama wrote:Communist Russia rather quickly replaced worhip of god with worship of Stalin, though. It would be better to look at cultures evolving out of religion, such as Scandanavia.

But what about Russia after Stalin, say under Khrushchev or Gorbachev? I think worship of Stalin was no different than any other megalomania seen in say Hitler's Germany or present-day North Korea. But are these cults of personality really "religious"? I don't think so because they don't qualify to be religious in the sense that they lack the spiritual aspect of religion. Now, if you see religion as not specifically spiritual then that would be interesting for another discussion, but in regards to worship of Stalin replacing worship of God I would challenge you on that supposition.

Region of Dwipantara wrote:

Freakoland wrote:
I think that's interesting what you said in your second point., that religion being a "dictatorial commandment from the sky" or else, in that perhaps religion is just a reflection human nature's desire for some sort of higher authority. People dont really do well in chaos so most people naturally accept a dictorial commandment from the sky. Now that being said I wouldn't say that it is good. People who are able to train themselves out of needing that dictorial commandment in the sky and see the absolute chaos and arbitrariness of the universe and are still able to hold that and be ok with, I think that's where real life begins.

(This is also the reason why I view the Soviet Union as a semi-religion: belief system from the sky [Kremlin] that cannot be challenged or evaluated and is indoctrinated to little children). I think it's more on the "religion is an effective tool to control the masses" thing. If you are a 11th century king ruling over a land of peasants where order is enforced through the sword, having Big Brother on your side greatly helps. An orderly state is much, much preferable to warring warlords. But as time progresses, those systems starts to get outdated and become irritating.

Europa Undivided wrote:Comparing religion with flat earthers is dumb. Reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally dumb.

Washington Resistance Army wrote:

Genivaria wrote:Are governments and corporations not by their nature secular?

I don't know about you anon but neither Congress nor Walmart give me a sense of community and belonging lol

Sadakoyama wrote:

Europa Undivided wrote:Comparing religion with flat earthers is dumb. Reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally dumb.

Not really,the cognative origins of such thinking may be similar.

https://theboar.org/2019/01/religion/

Europa Undivided wrote:

Alvecia wrote:Personally I don't think so. That which religion provides can be provided through other means.

That said, even without it, people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Reddit atheism detected.

Comparing religion with flat earthers is dumb. Reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally dumb.

Freakoland wrote:

Alvecia wrote:Personally I don't think so. That which religion provides can be provided through other means.

That said, even without it, people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

I'm interested by what you said, how people are "going to believe in some stupid shit." Perhaps religion and spirituality are anthropological explainable phenomena. That people are going to believe in something because they want to believe in something. Whatever this "something " is that is where religious wars come in for us to help clarify.

Lower Nubia wrote:

Alvecia wrote:This really is me trying not to play a game. Why don't you just skip the foreplay and get right to the point you're trying to make.

people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Is religion on that same level to you, and are you contemptuous towards that "bullshit".

Europa Undivided wrote:

Alvecia wrote:Personally I don't think so. That which religion provides can be provided through other means.

That said, even without it, people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Reddit atheism detected.

Comparing religion with flat earthers is dumb. Reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally dumb.

Washington Resistance Army wrote:

Genivaria wrote:Are governments and corporations not by their nature secular?

I don't know about you anon but neither Congress nor Walmart give me a sense of community and belonging lol

Sadakoyama wrote:

Europa Undivided wrote:Comparing religion with flat earthers is dumb. Reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally dumb.

Not really,the cognative origins of such thinking may be similar.

https://theboar.org/2019/01/religion/

If traditional religions don't fill that "hole", other things will.

Alvecia wrote:

Lower Nubia wrote:
people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Is religion on that same level to you, and are you contemptuous towards that "bullshit".

Yes.

Lower Nubia wrote:

Alvecia wrote:Yes.

Oh look, I was right:

"For now, we'll just have to do with one camp being hateful, and the other camp being hateful, but wrongly."

Alvecia wrote:

Lower Nubia wrote:
Oh look, I was right:

"For now, we'll just have to do with one camp being hateful, and the other camp being hateful, but wrongly."

k

Alvecia wrote:Personally I don't think so. That which religion provides can be provided through other means.

That said, even without it, people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Freakoland wrote:

Alvecia wrote:Personally I don't think so. That which religion provides can be provided through other means.

That said, even without it, people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

I'm interested by what you said, how people are "going to believe in some stupid shit." Perhaps religion and spirituality are anthropological explainable phenomena. That people are going to believe in something because they want to believe in something. Whatever this "something " is that is where religious wars come in for us to help clarify.

Alvecia wrote:

Freakoland wrote:
I'm interested by what you said, how people are "going to believe in some stupid shit." Perhaps religion and spirituality are anthropological explainable phenomena. That people are going to believe in something because they want to believe in something. Whatever this "something " is that is where religious wars come in for us to help clarify.

The cognitive flaws of the human brain are quite well known.

Lower Nubia wrote:
people are gonna believe in some stupid shit. Just look at the paranormal, alien consipracies, or pseudoscientific bullshit.

Is religion on that same level to you, and are you contemptuous towards that "bullshit".

Yes.

Europa Undivided wrote:Reddit atheism detected.

Comparing religion with flat earthers is dumb. Reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally dumb.

You're the one that brought up flat earthers.
I was thinking of "alternative" medicines.

Neanderthaland wrote:

Europa Undivided wrote:Reddit atheism detected.

Comparing religion with flat earthers is dumb. Reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally dumb.

You know it must be true because a guy on the internet said so. And he used a ton of "a"s.