Is religion a necessity for society?

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

I feel like it goes without saying but college campus clubs are not things that the overwhelming majority of the populace could ever access even if they wanted to.

Point is, there are other social clubs you can form. If college students, with their tendency toward liberal views. can coalesce around things other than religion, so too can the rest of us once religion is thrown away.

Social interaction is addictive because humans are inherently social and going without it does seriously fucky things to your brain.

Well, let's just say current circumstances are putting that theory to the test.

[Insaanistan]

“A warlord is a leader able to exercise military, economic, and political control over a subnational territory within a sovereign state due to their ability to mobilize loyal armed forces. These armed forces, usually considered militias, are loyal to the warlord rather than to the state regime.”
Timur was a warlord. Genghis Khan was a warlord. Julius Caesar was a warlord. Muhammad was just a military commander.

The Qur’ân never says whether he ever learned to read. We know that up until he became a prophet, he was illiterate. Some Hadith say that Gabriel taught him to read. Others say he never learned to read, and that Āli wrote everything for him.

"Warlord" is being used in a more generic sense, don't be a pedant because it just underminds your case.

Unless several hadith of the highest quality are wrong (which would cast huge doubts on your entire religion because oral tradition is massively important in Islam) he wasn't illiterate. Islamic tradition says he sent messengers with letters he himself wrote to various leaders in the regions surrounding Arabia. Admittedly this probably actually didn't happen but it does destroy the notion that he was illiterate.

Bad example, I'm pretty sure not worshiping Zeus isn't grounds for going into the Fields of Punishment (though I suppose WRA can give a more informed answer for this one?)

As Kowani said, it's not. Traditionally you have to do some pretty heinous shit to be punished in the afterlife and the basics of eusebia, despite commonly being translated simply as piety, really just comes down to "be a good person". Reincarnation also is a fairly common belief amongst Hellenists.

If that’s the case, then any emperor or king who has ever fought a war and gained land is a warlord.
That’s what you were going on about? His letters to the heads of states? Yeah, they were his words, but he didn’t write them! His letters, including those ones, were written by Āli, Zaid, or one of his scribes. That’s why he wanted Zaid, his adopted son, to learn Syriac. I can provide sources if you want.

[Czechostan]

The existence of groups like the American Humanist Association leads me to say no.

[Western Magoninkhe]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

[Albrenia]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

Because not being dead is better than the alternative in most cases.

[Purple Rats]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

So, if I am not religious, i have nothing to live for?

[Neanderthaland]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

This is an insult to both non-suicidal atheists, and bungee-jumping theists.

[Kuominwave]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

Whatever happened to "free will"? By that logic, people can't have their own desire for living?

[Saint Nicholas and the Hussars]

reminder: not everyone is you, and will not know what you are thinking or have the same thoughts in mind. Governments and Religious institutions are likewise

[Ultimate Destructive Fighting Nation]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

This is an insult to both non-suicidal atheists, and bungee-jumping theists.

Yeah, that is what people don’t get. I am the “ atheist “. still, I don’t do it now-plenty of time when reality becomes Uber messed up.

WARNING *** suicide is foolish. Don’t do it*** WARNING

[Dangine]

Cell phones have become more necessary for people than religion at this point.

[The Grims]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

So next to people who would go on a rape and murderspree if they ever lost faith we have people who would just kill themselves.

Scary place you got here mister Barry.

[The Grims]

Cell phones have become more necessary for people than religion at this point.

Google is a lot like God. Omniscient, omnipresent, listens to everything you say.

[Albrenia]

Cell phones have become more necessary for people than religion at this point.

Google is a lot like God. Omniscient, omnipresent, listens to everything you say.

...and is keeping everything you do on record in case it can use it against you.

[Othelos]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

Religion is unlikely to be your only reason for being alive. I'm sure you can think of other things you live for. Non-religious people have plenty, which is why we haven't jumped off a cliff.

[Washington Resistance Army]

If that’s the case, then any emperor or king who has ever fought a war and gained land is a warlord.

A great deal of pre-modern leaders could be accurately described as warlords, yes.

That’s what you were going on about? His letters to the heads of states? Yeah, they were his words, but he didn’t write them! His letters, including those ones, were written by Āli, Zaid, or one of his scribes. That’s why he wanted Zaid, his adopted son, to learn Syriac. I can provide sources if you want.

The hadith do not support the notion that others wrote them. Several directly say Muhammad, the messenger of Allah, wrote them himself. Which furthers to the notion that this whole thing is self contradictory and his presumed illiteracy was likely invented later to make his story more dramatic.

[Region of Dwipantara]

If that’s the case, then any emperor or king who has ever fought a war and gained land is a warlord.

A great deal of pre-modern leaders could be accurately described as warlords, yes.

Plus, we don't glorify those past conquerors as someone that is always correct and cannot be wrong, whose words should be eternally obeyed without question until the end of the literal spacetime. I mean, I respect Alexander's military prowess, but not that much.

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

Religion is unlikely to be your only reason for being alive. I'm sure you can think of other things you live for. Non-religious people have plenty, which is why we haven't jumped off a cliff.

Not to mention that for irreligious people, their life is literally everything that they will ever have so they better make it worth it. Many religious person believes in a decadently boring eternal afterlife, making it very easy for Yusuf Fadil to press that damned red button.

[The Grims]

A great deal of pre-modern leaders could be accurately described as warlords, yes.

Plus, we don't glorify those past conquerors as someone that is always correct and cannot be wrong, whose words should be eternally obeyed without question until the end of the literal spacetime. I mean, I respect Alexander's military prowess, but not that much.

Do you not respect his ego which made him rename almost every city he conquered after himself or his horse ?

Not to mention that for irreligious people, their life is literally everything that they will ever have so they better make it worth it. Many religious person believes in a decadently boring eternal afterlife, making it very easy for Yusuf Fadil to press that damned red button.

So religion is bad for society, since religious people are not living for its benefit but for the benefit of the afterlife ?

[Othelos]

Not to mention that for irreligious people, their life is literally everything that they will ever have so they better make it worth it. Many religious person believes in a decadently boring eternal afterlife, making it very easy for Yusuf Fadil to press that damned red button.

So religion is bad for society, since religious people are not living for its benefit but for the benefit of the afterlife ?

I believe so. If reality is devalued in favor of the afterlife, people may, for example, excuse disadvantage or oppression as "their lot in life" which they have to live with and will be rewarded in heaven, or wherever. If they treated this life as their most important, they would more readily see the unfairness of modern systems and demand something better.

[Sundiata]

The best possible world is one where we all follow Catholic Social Teaching (CST).

However, that's a tall order. I think that the Catholic Church is a necessity for society. The absence of the church leads to alienation, depression, meaninglessness, and individualism. The church offers meaning and stability to it's members. I don't think it can be beat. The Catholic Church was here 1000 years ago and it's going to be here 1000 years from now. Nations rise and fall, people live, people pass, but the church remains. What an honor it is to be a saint.

[Othelos]

.

[Othelos]

The best possible world is one where we all follow Catholic Social Teaching (CST).

However, that's a tall order. I think that the Catholic Church is a necessity for society. The absence of the church leads to alienation, depression, meaninglessness, and individualism. The church offers meaning and stability to it's members. I don't think it can be beat. The Catholic Church was here 1000 years ago and it's going to be here 1000 years from now. Nations rise and fall, people live, people pass, but the church remains. What an honor it is to be a saint. :)

The Catholic church is responsible for loads of atrocities. Two modern ones that come to mind right away include discouraging the use of contraception in countries stricken by HIV and the rampant pedophilia in the clergy. The latter alone is enough to denounce the Catholic Church as an institution, and in the US it should be under FBI surveillance. Being a religious institution shouldn't excuse it from its human rights abuses.

After being intertwined with repressive power structures around the world for centuries, the church continues to throw its support behind causes that aim to reduce the rights and dignity of humanity. The world would be better, and humans more equal, without it.

[Region of Dwipantara]

Yes, because it provides something for you to live for. Without something to live for, why wouldn't we just be jumping off a cliff when something bad happened?

So, if I am not religious, i have nothing to live for?

If we're being really technical and objective here, yes

[Albrenia]

So, if I am not religious, i have nothing to live for?

If we're being really technical and objective here, yes

I've got plenty to live for. Between my family, my goals, seeing what happens in the future and all the experiences it might bring, I'm good.

I've had some pretty nasty shit happen to me in my time, which I won't go into details online about, but I've never needed religion to keep me from cliff jumping.

[Ankenland]

As with most atheists, I don't doubt the possibility of higher powers, I just don't see any proof in general, or of any particular religion individually.

By definition, that makes you an agnostic, not an atheist. Atheists believe that they have disproven the thesis of a metaphysical higher power. This is a belief with no evidence, and that is why atheism is a cult - but without the culture. Worst of both worlds.

Point me back to these arguments and I will try to address them.

- People are inherently selfish (though sometimes altruistic, they are still very selfish) and so it is a benefit to society to train them to be more altruistic
- The supposition of inescapable metaphysical reward and punishment is the only logical argument for not being selfish, there is no other possible case in which not behaving in your own best interest could be in your own best interest, this would be a contradiction in terms.
- We are near-certainly in a simulation, and near-certainly subject to whatever system of metaphysical reward and punishment to which we, ourselves, would subject the population of simulations we control.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superrationality