Abortion Law Reform Passes in New Zealand

[The American Free States]

So do the unborn not have rights?

Even if it did, it would not have the right to use another person's body without their consent.

Its as if the unborn consented to being aborted, or if it consented to use another person’s body.

[The New California Republic]

It does not resolve an unwanted pregnancy.

If they don’t want a child, they can just put it up for adoption, terminating it is not the answer.

That doesn't solve the issue of the woman's body being enslaved to the fetus for 9 months in the meantime if there is no abortion allowed.

[The American Free States]

If they don’t want a child, they can just put it up for adoption, terminating it is not the answer.

That doesn't solve the issue of the woman's body being enslaved to the fetus for 9 months in the meantime if there is no abortion allowed.

Shouldn’t have broke abstinence then.

Edit: Shouldn’t have willingly broke abstinence.

[Godular]

In any event, emotive appeal noted, called out, and summarily dismissed.



That is your opinion. Some folks feel that improving quality of life is better than improving quantity.

Congratulations, you have reduced humans life to numbers! Now let’s go exterminate the poor and raise average quality of life!

Non-sequitur noted, called out, and dismissed.

As are tumors.

Tumors are not human.

Genetically, yes they are.

[Celritannia]

No, they don't. Someone who is alive has rights, the unborn do not.

Nitpick active:

Can we stop saying the fetus doesn't count as alive? It most assuredly is.

That just doesn't give it any special permissions that born people don't have.

Alright, they are not an independent life in terms of humanity.

[Cekoviu]

As are tumors.

Tumors are not human.

Yes they are. They have human(-ish) genomes.

[Godular]

Even if it did, it would not have the right to use another person's body without their consent.

Its as if the unborn consented to being aborted, or if it consented to use another person’s body.

The fetus' consent is not relevant.

[The New California Republic]

That doesn't solve the issue of the woman's body being enslaved to the fetus for 9 months in the meantime if there is no abortion allowed.

Shouldn’t have broke abstinence then.

Sorry bud, but this is the real world, not a convent as you'd wish to believe.

[The American Free States]

Nitpick active:

Can we stop saying the fetus doesn't count as alive? It most assuredly is.

That just doesn't give it any special permissions that born people don't have.

Alright, they are not an independent life in terms of humanity.

Yes, they are dependent, which makes abortion much worse because you are terminating a helpless human.

[Celritannia]

If you are a man, and you are saying this is wrong, well, you don't understand bodily sovereignty.

If you are a fetus, and you are saying this is right, well, you don’t understand bodily sovereignty.

Well, a fetus is not an independent body, so it doesn't have bodily sovereignty.

[The American Free States]

Its as if the unborn consented to being aborted, or if it consented to use another person’s body.

The fetus' consent is not relevant.

So it’s not a human with human rights?

[Celritannia]

Alright, they are not an independent life in terms of humanity.

Yes, they are dependent, which makes abortion much worse because you are terminating a helpless human.

Again, think of the circumstances of the woman in question. The woman in question, as someone who is an independent life, takes priority.

[Godular]

The fetus' consent is not relevant.

So it’s not a human with human rights?

A person need not have the consent of an assailant to execute deadly force against them in defense of self. Not requiring the consent of the fetus is not denying it of whatever rights it might have.

[Theokratiss]

Tumors are not human.

Yes they are. They have human(-ish) genomes.

A fetus has a unique set of human DNA and, of unimpeded, will grow into a "normal" human.

[The American Free States]

If you are a fetus, and you are saying this is right, well, you don’t understand bodily sovereignty.

Well, a fetus is not an independent body, so it doesn't have bodily sovereignty.

It’s still a human, a living one.

[Celritannia]

Well, a fetus is not an independent body, so it doesn't have bodily sovereignty.

It’s still a human, a living one.

Not living independently.

[The American Free States]

So it’s not a human with human rights?

A person need not have the consent of an assailant to execute deadly force against them in defense of self. Not requiring the consent of the fetus is not denying it of whatever rights it might have.

If the fetus poses a threat to the mothers life, then it’s acceptable, but termination just because you don’t want it is wrong.

[Theokratiss]

Yes, they are dependent, which makes abortion much worse because you are terminating a helpless human.

Again, think of the circumstances of the woman in question. The woman in question, as someone who is an independent life, takes priority.

Woman simply gets to avoid pain for another’s death? This isn’t a binary "someone, does better, someone does worse" here.

[Theokratiss]

It’s still a human, a living one.

Not living independently.

You heard it here first guys and gurls, children don’t have rights!

[Celritannia]

Again, think of the circumstances of the woman in question. The woman in question, as someone who is an independent life, takes priority.

Woman simply gets to avoid pain for another’s death? This isn’t a binary "someone, does better, someone does worse" here.

News just in, men think they still control women's bodies.

[The American Free States]

It’s still a human, a living one.

Not living independently.

Yes, which makes abortion much worse because, as I said above, it terminates a helpless person just because you don’t want them.

[Godular]

A person need not have the consent of an assailant to execute deadly force against them in defense of self. Not requiring the consent of the fetus is not denying it of whatever rights it might have.

If the fetus poses a threat to the mothers life, then it’s acceptable,

Which a pregnancy in general is, inherently.

[Celritannia]

Not living independently.

You heard it here first guys and gurls, children don’t have rights!

Children do have rights once they are born.
Until then, they are dependent of the women's body, meaning they have no independent rights.

[Theokratiss]

Woman simply gets to avoid pain for another’s death? This isn’t a binary "someone, does better, someone does worse" here.

News just in, men think they still control women's bodies.

An unborn child is not part of a woman’s body.

[The American Free States]

Woman simply gets to avoid pain for another’s death? This isn’t a binary "someone, does better, someone does worse" here.

News just in, men think they still control women's bodies.

I never said that, stop changing what I said.