NATION

PASSWORD

Abortion Law Reform Passes in New Zealand

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)
User avatar
Costa Fierro
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19652
Founded: Dec 09, 2013
Psychotic Dictatorship

Abortion Law Reform Passes in New Zealand

Postby Costa Fierro » Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:12 am

New Zealand has legalised abortion, removing the practice from the Crimes Act and liberalising access to abortion services.

The final vote on the bill passed 68 to 51, it will now head to the Governor-General for the royal assent before becoming law.

The new law liberalises abortion rules, treating the practice as a health matter rather than a criminal one.

People will now be able to access abortions from a health practitioner in the first 20 weeks of pregnancy.

After 20 weeks, people will still be able to accesss abortions, but only after proving to two health practitioners that an abortion is "clinically appropriate," with the regard to their physical and mental health and wellbeing.


Sauce.

Bit of a disclaimer: this liberalises existing laws that have been in place since the 1960's. Abortions could be performed in New Zealand under existing legislation provided they met certain criteria, although most were performed exploiting a loophole.

Unfortunately due to some eel-like slipperiness from one of the MP's, protesters can now gather outside clinics and other facilities offering abortions unimpeded, as Parliament inadvertently voted in favour of an addition to the legislation that removed the implementation of safe zones, and there was no real legislative way to reinstate them.

Furthermore, and thank whatever deity one worships for this, it would not have gone to a referendum as per what New Zealand First wanted, unlike both the marijuana and euthanasia law reforms which are due to be voted on through public referendum in this year's general election in September.

Personally it's a bit meh from me, but it's something different to the doom and gloom of the coronavirus and economic collapse.
"Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist." - George Carlin

User avatar
Drongonia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1149
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
Corporate Bordello

Postby Drongonia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:14 am

Awful, awful AWFUL! Disgusting, I'm ashamed to see this happening in my country.
Republic of Drongonia | The MT powerhouse of the Pacific. | NationStates Flag Bracket #1 - 2nd, 4th, AND 7th place!

News via FUX.dg: Labour, Greens back push to open borders amid COVID crisis | FUX PolitiPoll: NAT 53.4%/LAB 40.4%/PFR 4.6%/CON 1.1%/GRN 0.5% | Drongonia-China Pacific naval conflict comes to an end
Factbooks: Overview | Political Parties | Our Leader | Defence Force Info | OOC Info (+ does Drongonia represent my views?)

User avatar
Radiatia
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7964
Founded: Oct 25, 2011
Capitalizt

Postby Radiatia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:20 am

Drongonia wrote:Awful, awful AWFUL! Disgusting, I'm ashamed to see this happening in my country.


Same.

I've been quite public already with my views on the subject (in real life), so I'm not going to rehash the same debate on these forums but to make a long story short, there was no reason to change our existing laws: We had an excellent balance between the rights of the unborn child and the rights of women who find themselves in difficult circumstances.

Now we've thrown that away in a flurry of ideology, and just to add insult to injury they attempted (luckily unsuccessfully) to ban anyone from protesting it because New Zealand is rapidly becoming an authoritarian shithole.

Even if you're rabidly pro-choice, surely you should be able to see that banning protests (or confining them to certain areas) is a very, very dangerous thing to do.
Last edited by Radiatia on Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Vivolkha
Diplomat
 
Posts: 580
Founded: Oct 15, 2017
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vivolkha » Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:22 am

While I'm in favor of the general idea behind the law (it's a matter of basic human rights, really), it falls slightly short (the safe area problem, statuory test after 20 weeks). But for now since it's better than the previous law in place I would support it.
My views are constantly changing; check the spoiler below for the most updated ones. Currently, this is an exclusively OOC nation.
Pro: Parlamentarism, atheism, EU, EU and UN reform, open borders, capitalism (generally), strong state, welfare state, authoritarian drug policies, abortion, nuclear power, space exploration, science
Anti: Religion, totalitarianism (includes Communism/Fascism by definition), Maduro & Morales, Trump, alt-right, right to discriminate, SJW, drug decriminalization, conspiracy theories, unregulated capitalism, monarchism, anti-intellectualism

Check out my Dispatch guides!
How to build a realistic totalitarian state | How to start with any nation type (UPDATED)

User avatar
Albrenia
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12595
Founded: Aug 18, 2017
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Albrenia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 2:46 am

Abortion is one of those issues I have a lot of internal confusion over, but in the end I think it is the woman's body so it is her choice. I'm not going to force someone to go through a long, potentially dangerous, always stressful (in many different ways) and life-altering process against their will.

Having said that, abortion is the least desirable outcome from my perspective, with things like adoption and the like being much better alternatives.

User avatar
Terabithya
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 105
Founded: Feb 20, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Terabithya » Wed Mar 18, 2020 2:57 am

Unfortunately, New Zealand has a very evil government. I'm surprised that they didn't fully legalize unborn murder until today.

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 37479
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:00 am

Good, I hope New Zealand continues to be one of the best English speaking countries and that conservative and religious shackles continue to break world wide.
Last edited by New haven america on Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2020

That's all folks~

User avatar
Prozitia
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 103
Founded: Oct 28, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Prozitia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:03 am

All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?
POSSUMUS!

User avatar
Awhaiti Kaiatu
Secretary
 
Posts: 26
Founded: Mar 17, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Awhaiti Kaiatu » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:09 am

Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?


Most of those in opposition are guys as well - because they of course must have a say over a woman's body? (imo, if you're against abortion then don't get one)


Regardless, good on my country for passing this - this is the result of decades of social rights work advocacy right here

As for the safe-zones? That fell short due to the parliament meeting being at 11pm... many of the MP's were drousy and faing asleep at the wheel.. oops
Awhaiti Kaiatu
Sci-fi Island State - South Pacific Ocean
Main Factbook | Economics | Civics | Space Agency

A member of the Environmental Conservation Organisation

User avatar
Terabithya
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 105
Founded: Feb 20, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Terabithya » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:10 am

Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?


It's not like you could avoid sexual intercourse or let another couple adopt your child, is it? Sexual intercourse is for marriage anyway, when you usually want to have children. Outside of sacramental marriage, sex is usually a sin.

User avatar
Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 61063
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:10 am

Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?

You do realize that you can be pro-life while also supporting welfare to support single parents, reducing hunger, and expanding education right? It’s not an either or proposition
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

User avatar
Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 61063
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:12 am

Terabithya wrote:
Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?


It's not like you could avoid sexual intercourse or let another couple adopt your child, is it? Sexual intercourse is for marriage anyway, when you usually want to have children. Outside of sacramental marriage, sex is usually a sin.

Nobody gives a shit about what your church says about marriage and sex. Besides the RCC has been having a lot of issues in the after school department so they really shouldn’t be lecturing anyone about sexual sins until they remove that log from their eye.
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

User avatar
Awhaiti Kaiatu
Secretary
 
Posts: 26
Founded: Mar 17, 2019
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Awhaiti Kaiatu » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:15 am

Terabithya wrote:
Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?


It's not like you could avoid sexual intercourse or let another couple adopt your child, is it? Sexual intercourse is for marriage anyway, when you usually want to have children. Outside of sacramental marriage, sex is usually a sin.



Mistakes happen when people are having the fun of sex, and if they don't want the burden of an unwanted child then they should have the option to not ruin their life.

And saying "sex outside marriage is a sin" isn't very impactful in a country like NZ where just over a third of people are christian.
Last edited by Awhaiti Kaiatu on Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
Awhaiti Kaiatu
Sci-fi Island State - South Pacific Ocean
Main Factbook | Economics | Civics | Space Agency

A member of the Environmental Conservation Organisation

User avatar
Waldoven
Attaché
 
Posts: 89
Founded: Jan 07, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Waldoven » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:16 am

I'm quite conflicted on the topic of abortion. On one hand, it is the right for a woman to choose. But I don't like taking the life of an unborn child that if it was allowed to be born would grow up to be a living human. But in the end I' m pro-choice. But a little bit of convincing could turn me into pro-life. But a little bit of convincing could also turn me back into pro-choice.
United Federation of Waldoven
——————
"Mommy, why does the moon look like it's getting bigger?"
Map | National Anthem | Region | Puppets | Me

Ajenja Chronicle: A Waldovian family home's oxygen system breaks, causing 2 adults and 3 children to suffocate to death | Research sujests Jhalax will solidify in 1,200,000 years | 4 new nuclear power plants have been built to power Ajenja | Leaks show that the new ibanana 15 will be able to detect body temperature | Fusion reaction research going well, scientist says

Matroyska wrote:someone: hey i’m new he-
waldoven: EAT NS DISPATCH https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=444406
Devionsa wrote:Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

User avatar
Nakena
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11558
Founded: May 06, 2017
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Nakena » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:17 am

Terabithya wrote:
Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?


It's not like you could avoid sexual intercourse or let another couple adopt your child, is it? Sexual intercourse is for marriage anyway, when you usually want to have children. Outside of sacramental marriage, sex is usually a sin.


Yeah not everyone follows your religion. Hurr durr.

User avatar
Terabithya
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 105
Founded: Feb 20, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Terabithya » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:19 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Terabithya wrote:
It's not like you could avoid sexual intercourse or let another couple adopt your child, is it? Sexual intercourse is for marriage anyway, when you usually want to have children. Outside of sacramental marriage, sex is usually a sin.

Nobody gives a shit about what your church says about marriage and sex. Besides the RCC has been having a lot of issues in the after school department so they really shouldn’t be lecturing anyone about sexual sins until they remove that log from their eye.


If someone in the RCC is evil, does that give you the right to be evil? And it's not just what the RCC says, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself said: "But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman to lust after her has already committed adultery with her in his heart." (Matthew 5, 28) So even to look at a woman to lust after her is the sin of adultery. How much more sinful is extramarital sex then?
Last edited by Terabithya on Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 37479
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:21 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?

You do realize that you can be pro-life while also supporting welfare to support single parents, reducing hunger, and expanding education right? It’s not an either or proposition

I mean, you can be.

It's just that like 90-95% of them tend not to be and stop caring about the "Child's" wellbeing as soon as they pop out. It'd be nice if they focused on those kids after they're born as well.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2020

That's all folks~

User avatar
New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 37479
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:22 am

Terabithya wrote:
Prozitia wrote:All of you "pro-life" guys are sick in the head. You only want a larger ignorant, starving population. Because that's what makes you conservatards profit. Why is this even a debate?


It's not like you could avoid sexual intercourse or let another couple adopt your child, is it? Sexual intercourse is for marriage anyway, when you usually want to have children. Outside of sacramental marriage, sex is usually a sin.

Pregnancy as punishment, take a shot!

God, not even 20 posts in.
Human of the male variety
Will accept TGs
Char/Axis 2020

That's all folks~

User avatar
Greater Theowherveld
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 6
Founded: Mar 18, 2020
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Greater Theowherveld » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:23 am

Terabithya wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Nobody gives a shit about what your church says about marriage and sex. Besides the RCC has been having a lot of issues in the after school department so they really shouldn’t be lecturing anyone about sexual sins until they remove that log from their eye.


If someone in the RCC is evil, does that give you the right to be evil? And it's not just what the RCC says, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself said: "But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman to lust after her has already committed adultery with her in his heart." (Matthew 5, 28) So even to look at a woman to lust after her is the sin of adultery. How much more sinful is extramarital sex then?

You quote the bible as if it is a historical account. This alone shows you know so little that anyone listening to your thoughts are suffering brain damage.

User avatar
Terabithya
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 105
Founded: Feb 20, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Terabithya » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:24 am

New haven america wrote:
Terabithya wrote:
It's not like you could avoid sexual intercourse or let another couple adopt your child, is it? Sexual intercourse is for marriage anyway, when you usually want to have children. Outside of sacramental marriage, sex is usually a sin.

Pregnancy as punishment


Nowhere did I write that pregnancy is a punishment. It is actually a bliss in marriage to found a happy family.

User avatar
Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 61063
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:24 am

Terabithya wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Nobody gives a shit about what your church says about marriage and sex. Besides the RCC has been having a lot of issues in the after school department so they really shouldn’t be lecturing anyone about sexual sins until they remove that log from their eye.


If someone in the RCC is evil, does that give you the right to be evil? And it's not just what the RCC says, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself said: "But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman to lust after her has already committed adultery with her in his heart." (Matthew 5, 28) So even to look at a woman to lust after her is the sin of adultery. How much more sinful is extramarital sex then?

The Bible also talks about greater sins. And having sex isn’t all that great compared to diddling children and covering up said child abuse.
And why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye?
” (Matthew 7, 3)
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

User avatar
Drongonia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1149
Founded: Feb 11, 2019
Corporate Bordello

Postby Drongonia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:25 am

Terabithya wrote:Nowhere did I write that pregnancy is a punishment. It is actually a bliss in marriage to found a happy family.

Human life is a gift, and it pains me to think that the people who supported this Act the most (Green Party MPs) would go into bat for species of wild animals but not for the preservation of human life.
Republic of Drongonia | The MT powerhouse of the Pacific. | NationStates Flag Bracket #1 - 2nd, 4th, AND 7th place!

News via FUX.dg: Labour, Greens back push to open borders amid COVID crisis | FUX PolitiPoll: NAT 53.4%/LAB 40.4%/PFR 4.6%/CON 1.1%/GRN 0.5% | Drongonia-China Pacific naval conflict comes to an end
Factbooks: Overview | Political Parties | Our Leader | Defence Force Info | OOC Info (+ does Drongonia represent my views?)

User avatar
Samudera Darussalam
Senator
 
Posts: 3577
Founded: Aug 05, 2016
New York Times Democracy

Postby Samudera Darussalam » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:26 am

I.....don't really expect a NZ thread to turn into a religious debate tbh, but ah well.
Embassy Link - This is closed for a while.

Indonesian Muslim

User avatar
Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 61063
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:26 am

New haven america wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:You do realize that you can be pro-life while also supporting welfare to support single parents, reducing hunger, and expanding education right? It’s not an either or proposition

I mean, you can be.

It's just that like 90-95% of them tend not to be and stop caring about the "Child's" wellbeing as soon as they pop out. It'd be nice if they focused on those kids after they're born as well.

Those who refuse to care for those on the outside are just as guilty of the sins their churches preach about the abortionists.
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

User avatar
Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 61063
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:27 am

Samudera Darussalam wrote:I.....don't really expect a NZ thread to turn into a religious debate tbh, but ah well.

It’s abortion dude. It was bound to happen
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

Next

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: -SARS-, Aclion, Animmalia, Baby Chipmunk, Eahland, Equestrian States, Google [Bot], Greater Miami Shores, Holy Roman Empires2, Jamesburgh, Major-Tom, Mirli, Narvatus, New Alsunova, Nilokeras, Post War America, Riviere Renard, Shazbotdom, Stickmandia, The Black Forrest, Washington Resistance Army

Advertisement

Remove ads