Hunting: The most ethical source of animal protein?

[Kaltovar]

Over the past few years, my views of hunting (for food, not trophies) have evolved. I used to think it sounded fun, but that it was just a bunch of insecure jerkoffs running around in the woods LARPing as the god of death, and you'd have to be a little messed up to actually go and do it. I was forced to reconsider this position however, and now believe it to be the single most ethical source of animal protein. Although I understand that a purely plant based diet would be EVEN MORE ETHICAL, I am not someone who is willing to give up animal protein and many others are unwilling to as well. Let me explain my stance, and you can tell me if you agree or disagree.

1: Unlike humans, animals normally die in extremely horrible ways. They die of their infections caused by teeth rotting out, being mauled by other animals, or starvation. That's what dying of natural causes means for a wild animal, and by comparison less than a minute of pain when shot properly in the vitals is a very comfortable way to go.

2: I view factory farming as nothing short of atrocious. By it's nature, hunting for food means that the animal you're eating has lived a natural and cage free existence with much less suffering and abuse.

3: Wild animals don't get antibiotic injections, which contribute to the development of super bugs.

4: Wild animals are much healthier for you. Factory grown animals have way too much OMega-6 fat because of their homogeneous diet and lack of exercise. Wild animals have more Omega-3s, are leaner overall, and contain more nutrients.

5: You will have more respect for the source of your food if you have to kill and gut it yourself, and by the nature of the task being more difficult you are likely to eat less meat, which will bring less death to animals in general.

6: It's physically exhausting and improves your health, thus decreasing the burden on the medical system and decreasing the odds of major health problems which could make your family members upset.

7: It can build community, which is something I think society is sorely lacking these days. Not only will you make new friends, you will probably have excess meat that you can give away - Either to people you know on a personal level, or your local food pantry.

So what do you think of my reasoning? Am I totally right? Am I a delusional psychopath? Somewhere in between? I'm very interested to hear alternative viewpoints, so have at me!

[Cantelo]

When I lived out west (Nevada) I always pestered my dad and a family friend about wanting to go hunting, as they always talked about doing some trip to Idaho or Utah or something, this was back in like 2007 so when I was pretty young.

I still have an interest in going hunting someday, I've gone fishing and I found it super rewarding to catch my own meal, filet it, then cook it. I'd love the experience with a deer or wild boar (though I've heard they taste pretty grody)

[Page]

It is definitely preferable to hunt than buy from the meat industry.

[Kaltovar]

When I lived out west (Nevada) I always pestered my dad and a family friend about wanting to go hunting, as they always talked about doing some trip to Idaho or Utah or something, this was back in like 2007 so when I was pretty young.

I still have an interest in going hunting someday, I've gone fishing and I found it super rewarding to catch my own meal, filet it, then cook it. I'd love the experience with a deer or wild boar (though I've heard they taste pretty grody)

I'd be lying if I said that how fun it seemed didn't factor into my desire to get into it. Like I said, I used to judge people for it, but these days I feel like people get the desire to hunt from the way our ancestors evolved and there's nothing wrong with it as long as you're using the meat.

It is definitely preferable to hunt than buy from the meat industry.

This is pretty much the main crux of my argument. The more I learn about the meat industry the more it bothers me.

[South Ccanda]

I just want to say, from my personal opinion, that Humans are omnivorous creatures. there are certain vitamins and such things that come from meat that you can't gather from plants, and a lot of people seem not to know this. If you were to go on a vegan diet, you would need to take certain vitamin supplements as well, or else you'll just feel unhealthy and drained of energy. If you feel like eating meat is against your ethical opinion, good for you. I just hope you do your diet correctly and can live a happy life. As for us people who do eat meat, we should be well educated about where our food comes from. Every time I show someone what farm factories look like and the condition the animals there stay in, they are completely disgusted.

[Cantelo]

When I lived out west (Nevada) I always pestered my dad and a family friend about wanting to go hunting, as they always talked about doing some trip to Idaho or Utah or something, this was back in like 2007 so when I was pretty young.

I still have an interest in going hunting someday, I've gone fishing and I found it super rewarding to catch my own meal, filet it, then cook it. I'd love the experience with a deer or wild boar (though I've heard they taste pretty grody)

I'd be lying if I said that how fun it seemed didn't factor into my desire to get into it. Like I said, I used to judge people for it, but these days I feel like people get the desire to hunt from the way our ancestors evolved and there's nothing wrong with it as long as you're using the meat.

It is definitely preferable to hunt than buy from the meat industry.

This is pretty much the main crux of my argument. The more I learn about the meat industry the more it bothers me.

I really think that hunting could serve as a way to wean less people off of the meat industry, there's plenty of invasive species both on land and in the water that could be harvested in fishing/hunting expeditions. For example, wild boar are an incredibly destructive species in much of the US. In Florida, where I live, they're pretty numerous and the state encourages the hunting/trapping of them.

There's also Asian carp, Lionfish, alligator (though those are farmed for their meat already) and maybe even python if people have a stomach for it.

[Kaltovar]

I just want to say, from my personal opinion, that Humans are omnivorous creatures. there are certain vitamins and such things that come from meat that you can't gather from plants, and a lot of people seem not to know this. If you were to go on a vegan diet, you would need to take certain vitamin supplements as well, or else you'll just feel unhealthy and drained of energy. If you feel like eating meat is against your ethical opinion, good for you. I just hope you do your diet correctly and can live a happy life. As for us people who do eat meat, we should be well educated about where our food comes from. Every time I show someone what farm factories look like and the condition the animals there stay in, they are completely disgusted.

I do agree that we're omnivorous and that it's the natural choice, but it is possible to get all the required nutrients from a plant based diet. You just have to be ... Well, upper middle class at least and very knowledgeable about the nutrient profile you require. More knowledgeable than the vast majority of people. I do not think it's realistic for the vast majority of the middle to lower economic spectrum to be healthy and vegan at the same time.

Dietary supplements and diverse diets do make it possible to live off exclusively plants in a healthy way, but like I said it's usually a much more expensive option especially in America. Hindus manage it very well in India though, where the country is more geared toward animal free diets overall.

Personally the main reason I eat animal protein is because it's tasty.

I really think that hunting could serve as a way to wean less people off of the meat industry, there's plenty of invasive species both on land and in the water that could be harvested in fishing/hunting expeditions. For example, wild boar are an incredibly destructive species in much of the US. In Florida, where I live, they're pretty numerous and the state encourages the hunting/trapping of them.

There's also Asian carp, Lionfish, alligator (though those are farmed for their meat already) and maybe even python if people have a stomach for it.

That's a really good point! Some animals quite literally need to be shot for the sake of the environment, other animals not starving, and farms not being obliterated.

[Pax Nerdvana]

I do agree that fishing and similar pursuits are rewarding, even if nothing is caught. I love fishing, despite never catching anything. There's just something about being out on the water with friends and family. I have zero qualms about eating store-bought meat though. I want to go hunting sometime, and I wish I could fish more often.

[South Ccanda]

Personally the main reason I eat animal protein is because it's tasty.

Cichen Tendies taste good, can agree.

[Nakena]

Over the past few years, my views of hunting (for food, not trophies) have evolved. I used to think it sounded fun, but that it was just a bunch of insecure jerkoffs running around in the woods LARPing as the god of death, and you'd have to be a little messed up to actually go and do it. I was forced to reconsider this position however, and now believe it to be the single most ethical source of animal protein. Although I understand that a purely plant based diet would be EVEN MORE ETHICAL, I am not someone who is willing to give up animal protein and many others are unwilling to as well. Let me explain my stance, and you can tell me if you agree or disagree.

1: Unlike humans, animals normally die in extremely horrible ways. They die of their infections caused by teeth rotting out, being mauled by other animals, or starvation. That's what dying of natural causes means for a wild animal, and by comparison less than a minute of pain when shot properly in the vitals is a very comfortable way to go.

2: I view factory farming as nothing short of atrocious. By it's nature, hunting for food means that the animal you're eating has lived a natural and cage free existence with much less suffering and abuse.

3: Wild animals don't get antibiotic injections, which contribute to the development of super bugs.

4: Wild animals are much healthier for you. Factory grown animals have way too much OMega-6 fat because of their homogeneous diet and lack of exercise. Wild animals have more Omega-3s, are leaner overall, and contain more nutrients.

5: You will have more respect for the source of your food if you have to kill and gut it yourself, and by the nature of the task being more difficult you are likely to eat less meat, which will bring less death to animals in general.

6: It's physically exhausting and improves your health, thus decreasing the burden on the medical system and decreasing the odds of major health problems which could make your family members upset.

7: It can build community, which is something I think society is sorely lacking these days. Not only will you make new friends, you will probably have excess meat that you can give away - Either to people you know on a personal level, or your local food pantry.

So what do you think of my reasoning? Am I totally right? Am I a delusional psychopath? Somewhere in between? I'm very interested to hear alternative viewpoints, so have at me!

Theoretically you're right. Hunting is part of the proper human way of life.

Practically however you seldom get the chance for such unless you happen to live in a very rural area somewhere in the rocky mountains or in Canada etc.

[Kaltovar]

I do agree that fishing and similar pursuits are rewarding, even if nothing is caught. I love fishing, despite never catching anything. There's just something about being out on the water with friends and family. I have zero qualms about eating store-bought meat though. I want to go hunting sometime, and I wish I could fish more often.

I do it, but I'd prefer not to do it. I don't like the existence animals from the meat industry live.

Theoretically you're right. Hunting is part of the proper human way of life.

Practically however you seldom get the chance for such unless you happen to live in a very rural area somewhere in the rocky mountains or in Canada etc.

In my case, I do.

[Cantelo]

I do agree that fishing and similar pursuits are rewarding, even if nothing is caught. I love fishing, despite never catching anything. There's just something about being out on the water with friends and family. I have zero qualms about eating store-bought meat though. I want to go hunting sometime, and I wish I could fish more often.

To me, fishing gives me a similar sort of rush as gambling or prize machines but without having to spend any money every time I cast a rod. I also think its super relaxing being out in the water, I love the sea and being around it

[Cantelo]

Personally the main reason I eat animal protein is because it's tasty.

Cichen Tendies taste good, can agree.

Chechen tendies*

[Cekoviu]

More ethical, but also wildly implausible for many.

[Page]

Over the past few years, my views of hunting (for food, not trophies) have evolved. I used to think it sounded fun, but that it was just a bunch of insecure jerkoffs running around in the woods LARPing as the god of death, and you'd have to be a little messed up to actually go and do it. I was forced to reconsider this position however, and now believe it to be the single most ethical source of animal protein. Although I understand that a purely plant based diet would be EVEN MORE ETHICAL, I am not someone who is willing to give up animal protein and many others are unwilling to as well. Let me explain my stance, and you can tell me if you agree or disagree.

1: Unlike humans, animals normally die in extremely horrible ways. They die of their infections caused by teeth rotting out, being mauled by other animals, or starvation. That's what dying of natural causes means for a wild animal, and by comparison less than a minute of pain when shot properly in the vitals is a very comfortable way to go.

2: I view factory farming as nothing short of atrocious. By it's nature, hunting for food means that the animal you're eating has lived a natural and cage free existence with much less suffering and abuse.

3: Wild animals don't get antibiotic injections, which contribute to the development of super bugs.

4: Wild animals are much healthier for you. Factory grown animals have way too much OMega-6 fat because of their homogeneous diet and lack of exercise. Wild animals have more Omega-3s, are leaner overall, and contain more nutrients.

5: You will have more respect for the source of your food if you have to kill and gut it yourself, and by the nature of the task being more difficult you are likely to eat less meat, which will bring less death to animals in general.

6: It's physically exhausting and improves your health, thus decreasing the burden on the medical system and decreasing the odds of major health problems which could make your family members upset.

7: It can build community, which is something I think society is sorely lacking these days. Not only will you make new friends, you will probably have excess meat that you can give away - Either to people you know on a personal level, or your local food pantry.

So what do you think of my reasoning? Am I totally right? Am I a delusional psychopath? Somewhere in between? I'm very interested to hear alternative viewpoints, so have at me!

Theoretically you're right. Hunting is part of the proper human way of life.

Practically however you seldom get the chance for such unless you happen to live in a very rural area somewhere in the rocky mountains or in Canada etc.

Hunting might be much more sufficient if people consumed less meat.

I'm an omnivore myself but eating meat for breakfast, lunch, and dinner is excessive and people need to realize that. If they want to keep doing it then that's their choice but don't pretend meat every day is a basic need.

I was raised Catholic and Fridays during Lent everyone "sacrificed" meat (and went to get food from Long John Silver's because fish doesn't count) as a means of "fasting." The fact that people even consider one day without red meat to be a sacrifice is incredibly disturbing.

[Australian rePublic]

Over the past few years, my views of hunting (for food, not trophies) have evolved. I used to think it sounded fun, but that it was just a bunch of insecure jerkoffs running around in the woods LARPing as the god of death, and you'd have to be a little messed up to actually go and do it. I was forced to reconsider this position however, and now believe it to be the single most ethical source of animal protein. Although I understand that a purely plant based diet would be EVEN MORE ETHICAL, I am not someone who is willing to give up animal protein and many others are unwilling to as well. Let me explain my stance, and you can tell me if you agree or disagree.

It depends on which animal. Cows and sheep, for example, cannot live in the wild

1: Unlike humans, animals normally die in extremely horrible ways. They die of their infections caused by teeth rotting out, being mauled by other animals, or starvation. That's what dying of natural causes means for a wild animal, and by comparison less than a minute of pain when shot properly in the vitals is a very comfortable way to go.

True, but you can also avoid the whole situation by farming and domesticating animals and treating them with proper medicine. But yes, as there'll always be wild animals, hunting will reduce suffering

2: I view factory farming as nothing short of atrocious. By it's nature, hunting for food means that the animal you're eating has lived a natural and cage free existence with much less suffering and abuse.

Factory farming is absolutely disgusting, but you can also buy from farms

3: Wild animals don't get antibiotic injections, which contribute to the development of super bugs.

Good point

4: Wild animals are much healthier for you. Factory grown animals have way too much OMega-6 fat because of their homogeneous diet and lack of exercise. Wild animals have more Omega-3s, are leaner overall, and contain more nutrients.

Here we go again with the factory farming. Compare hunting to farms. Apples to apples. Do not compare hunting to factories, apples to oranges

5: You will have more respect for the source of your food if you have to kill and gut it yourself, and by the nature of the task being more difficult you are likely to eat less meat, which will bring less death to animals in general.

Nope. I have an interstate relative who (legally) hunts and relatives in Greece who are subsistance farmers. This has reduced their meat consumption by zero

6: It's physically exhausting and improves your health, thus decreasing the burden on the medical system and decreasing the odds of major health problems which could make your family members upset.

True, assuming you're physically fit enough to hunt. If you're frail or disabled, good luck

7: It can build community, which is something I think society is sorely lacking these days. Not only will you make new friends, you will probably have excess meat that you can give away - Either to people you know on a personal level, or your local food pantry.

Community, yea I suppose, as for excess meat, doubt it. By the time you divide the meat amongst your hunting group and/or take some for your family, whatever's left will probably be for your dog or something. Alternately, you'd probably get a lot more wastage

So what do you think of my reasoning? Am I totally right? Am I a delusional psychopath? Somewhere in between? I'm very interested to hear alternative viewpoints, so have at me!

I agree hunting has its merits, as does farming. Both have different benefits and people should be allowed to choose whichever method they want, or both.

[The New California Republic]

Hunting alone would not be able to keep up with the demand for meat. Ethical? Perhaps. Practical? No.

[Pax Nerdvana]

I do agree that fishing and similar pursuits are rewarding, even if nothing is caught. I love fishing, despite never catching anything. There's just something about being out on the water with friends and family. I have zero qualms about eating store-bought meat though. I want to go hunting sometime, and I wish I could fish more often.

To me, fishing gives me a similar sort of rush as gambling or prize machines but without having to spend any money every time I cast a rod. I also think its super relaxing being out in the water, I love the sea and being around it

I know what you mean. There's a feeling that I can't describe about being out on the water, out in nature. I've always wanted to go deep sea fishing, but I've never had the chance. My experience is mostly limited to lakes and rivers. I tried fly fishing last summer, and now I want to get myself a fly rod.

[Cantelo]

To me, fishing gives me a similar sort of rush as gambling or prize machines but without having to spend any money every time I cast a rod. I also think its super relaxing being out in the water, I love the sea and being around it

I know what you mean. There's a feeling that I can't describe about being out on the water, out in nature. I've always wanted to go deep sea fishing, but I've never had the chance. My experience is mostly limited to lakes and rivers. I tried fly fishing last summer, and now I want to get myself a fly rod.

Funny enough I've never been fishing in lakes or rivers, I've always either gone to a pier or fished in the open Gulf of Mexico. I'd say like 90% of the fish I catch are red snappers, sadly many of them end up being too small for me to legally keep so they end up thrown back

[Kaltovar]

Over the past few years, my views of hunting (for food, not trophies) have evolved. I used to think it sounded fun, but that it was just a bunch of insecure jerkoffs running around in the woods LARPing as the god of death, and you'd have to be a little messed up to actually go and do it. I was forced to reconsider this position however, and now believe it to be the single most ethical source of animal protein. Although I understand that a purely plant based diet would be EVEN MORE ETHICAL, I am not someone who is willing to give up animal protein and many others are unwilling to as well. Let me explain my stance, and you can tell me if you agree or disagree.

It depends on which animal. Cows and sheep, for example, cannot live in the wild

1: Unlike humans, animals normally die in extremely horrible ways. They die of their infections caused by teeth rotting out, being mauled by other animals, or starvation. That's what dying of natural causes means for a wild animal, and by comparison less than a minute of pain when shot properly in the vitals is a very comfortable way to go.

True, but you can also avoid the whole situation by farming and domesticating animals and treating them with proper medicine. But yes, as there'll always be wild animals, hunting will reduce suffering

2: I view factory farming as nothing short of atrocious. By it's nature, hunting for food means that the animal you're eating has lived a natural and cage free existence with much less suffering and abuse.

Factory farming is absolutely disgusting, but you can also buy from farms

3: Wild animals don't get antibiotic injections, which contribute to the development of super bugs.

Good point

4: Wild animals are much healthier for you. Factory grown animals have way too much OMega-6 fat because of their homogeneous diet and lack of exercise. Wild animals have more Omega-3s, are leaner overall, and contain more nutrients.

Here we go again with the factory farming. Compare hunting to farms. Apples to apples. Do not compare hunting to factories, apples to oranges

5: You will have more respect for the source of your food if you have to kill and gut it yourself, and by the nature of the task being more difficult you are likely to eat less meat, which will bring less death to animals in general.

Nope. I have an interstate relative who (legally) hunts and relatives in Greece who are subsistance farmers. This has reduced their meat consumption by zero

6: It's physically exhausting and improves your health, thus decreasing the burden on the medical system and decreasing the odds of major health problems which could make your family members upset.

True, assuming you're physically fit enough to hunt. If you're frail or disabled, good luck

7: It can build community, which is something I think society is sorely lacking these days. Not only will you make new friends, you will probably have excess meat that you can give away - Either to people you know on a personal level, or your local food pantry.

Community, yea I suppose, as for excess meat, doubt it. By the time you divide the meat amongst your hunting group and/or take some for your family, whatever's left will probably be for your dog or something. Alternately, you'd probably get a lot more wastage

So what do you think of my reasoning? Am I totally right? Am I a delusional psychopath? Somewhere in between? I'm very interested to hear alternative viewpoints, so have at me!

I agree hunting has its merits, as does farming. Both have different benefits and people should be allowed to choose whichever method they want, or both.

2: Good point!

4: You are wrong and I will do as I please.

5: Anecdotal

7: There's a lot of game meat in the food pantries here.

[Nakena]

Hunting might be much more sufficient if people consumed less meat.

I'm an omnivore myself but eating meat for breakfast, lunch, and dinner is excessive and people need to realize that. If they want to keep doing it then that's their choice but don't pretend meat every day is a basic need.

The interesting thing is that you don't really as much food or meat in general. Most of it is really just getting carbs. Once that is being cut you'd be surpristed how little you need.

I was raised Catholic and Fridays during Lent everyone "sacrificed" meat (and went to get food from Long John Silver's because fish doesn't count) as a means of "fasting." The fact that people even consider one day without red meat to be a sacrifice is incredibly disturbing.

Heh. I once did water fast for about 48-72 hours to get rid of carbs out of my system.

[Samudera Darussalam]

I just want to say, from my personal opinion, that Humans are omnivorous creatures. there are certain vitamins and such things that come from meat that you can't gather from plants, and a lot of people seem not to know this. If you were to go on a vegan diet, you would need to take certain vitamin supplements as well, or else you'll just feel unhealthy and drained of energy. If you feel like eating meat is against your ethical opinion, good for you. I just hope you do your diet correctly and can live a happy life. As for us people who do eat meat, we should be well educated about where our food comes from. Every time I show someone what farm factories look like and the condition the animals there stay in, they are completely disgusted.

I do agree that we're omnivorous and that it's the natural choice, but it is possible to get all the required nutrients from a plant based diet. You just have to be ... Well, upper middle class at least and very knowledgeable about the nutrient profile you require. More knowledgeable than the vast majority of people. I do not think it's realistic for the vast majority of the middle to lower economic spectrum to be healthy and vegan at the same time.

Dietary supplements and diverse diets do make it possible to live off exclusively plants in a healthy way, but like I said it's usually a much more expensive option especially in America. Hindus manage it very well in India though, where the country is more geared toward animal free diets overall.

Personally the main reason I eat animal protein is because it's tasty.

One can ask whether the Hindus, Jains, and Buddhists in India really get their nutrient requirement fulfilled with their diet though.
A plant-based diet is not expensive if you happens to live in areas where agriculture (no, I don't mean the animal farms) makes up for a significant sector of the economy. Vegetables and fruits are cheaper than meat in the place where I live. However, I do agree with your point that without being knowledgeable about what kind of vegan-based food we have to eat in place of meat to satisfy our need, it won't be really healthy.

On the topic of hunting, well.....whether it's ethical or not is a case per case basis thing I guess. As a somebody who used to live in a place where people hunt birds for....reasons unknowable, having to see fallen empty nests laying around, sometimes with the eggs still in, are not exactly fun after you heard the sounds of gun went off sometime ago.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Cheaper too. Bullets cost less than Ribeyes.

[Samadhi]

The only unethical part of the meat industry is government involvement and regulations.

[Neutraligon]

So long as it is done safely and the animal is not tortured/left with a slowly lethal wound, and the animal is used for more then just the enjoyment of the hunt (as in actually use the meat/other animal parts) I have no issue with hunting. Actually from what I understand hunters have a very strong interest in conservation since conservation means that they are able to enjoy the hunt and use the animal.