The creepy double standards of Female rape.

[Estanglia]

There's a reason statutory rape is a crime. You can't consent at that age.

That's why I already stated that it should be prosecutable at the discretion of the victim once he or she comes of age. Just because someone can't consent doesn't give the power to withhold consent to some stupid organization like a government.

So, say, I get raped at the age of 13.

Do I have to wait 5 years until I'm 18 before I can get them prosecuted? 5 years in which they can hide and/or flee, making catching and punishing them impossible?

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

But if they want it because they aren't picky, wouldn't they be less likely to regret it for the same reason?

Whether or not both parties want it, it's still illegal because a child cannot consent. Any adult attempting to have sex with a minor is inherently taking advantage of the fact that a child's consent is uninformed and coming from the immature opinion of an underaged person.

But the harm done in the first place is in the potential for regret, is it not? The other harms are in child support bills (which could be voided in a situation like this without having to treat it as being as heinous as the revers) or STDs. (Which, if she fails to inform him of, could be prosecuted separately.)

[Cantelo]

Whether or not both parties want it, it's still illegal because a child cannot consent. Any adult attempting to have sex with a minor is inherently taking advantage of the fact that a child's consent is uninformed and coming from the immature opinion of an underaged person.

But the harm done in the first place is in the potential for regret, is it not? The other harms are in child support bills (which could be voided in a situation like this without having to treat it as being as heinous as the revers) or STDs. (Which, if she fails to inform him of, could be prosecuted separately.)

Age of consent laws also protect vulnerable children who may be pressured into sex by a manipulative adult, and pressured into claiming that they wanted it.

The way that, you know, children inherently view adults as having some sort of authority over them. Which is why having sexual relations with someone beneath you in any hierarchy is so frowned upon; it leaves the door wide open for sexual abuse, molestation, rape, and any other form of emotional/physical abuse you can imagine.

For Christ's sake I can't believe I'm having to defend the idea that children shouldn't be able to consent to sex with grown-ass adults.

[Stellar Colonies]

I'm certain this is going to be an unpopular opinion, but I am of the position that any crime done to a woman, rape or not, is worse than a crime done to a man. Men have higher responsibilities towards women than women do towards men, and there's nothing wrong with that. The arguments which your friends put forward, however, were garbage. Just because someone is "hot" doesn't mean they have a license to rape.

Also, I'm of the opinion that statutory rape should only be prosecuted if the victim, once he or she comes of age, wants charges pressed. Otherwise, if, as an adult, someone is still quite happy that he or she had sex with someone when he or she was younger, than is there really any crime? Now, don't mistake me, adults having sex with minors is sick, but to be a crime, there must be a victim.

Bullsh*te.

Men and women have an equal responsibility to each other, and rape with a male victim is equally heinous as rape with a female victim.

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

But the harm done in the first place is in the potential for regret, is it not? The other harms are in child support bills (which could be voided in a situation like this without having to treat it as being as heinous as the revers) or STDs. (Which, if she fails to inform him of, could be prosecuted separately.)

Age of consent laws also protect vulnerable children who may be pressured into sex by a manipulative adult, and pressured into claiming that they wanted it.

The way that, you know, children inherently view adults as having some sort of authority over them. Which is why having sexual relations with someone beneath you in any hierarchy is so frowned upon; it leaves the door wide open for sexual abuse, molestation, rape, and any other form of emotional/physical abuse you can imagine.

For Christ's sake I can't believe I'm having to defend the idea that children shouldn't be able to consent to sex with grown-ass adults.

I never said it should be legal. I'm just saying the perpetrators had every reason to believe it's not AS wrong as the gender-reverse, and if they are wrong, there's a lot of blame to go around for making them think that way.

[Saiwania]

My interpretation is that the double standard is mainly because women can get pregnant while a man can't.

Thus, if a woman gets raped- there can be more negative consequences for her than if the same were to happen to a man, provided she's not yet too old and is attractive in terms of sexual marketplace value. There is a lot of stigma for any lady who got saddled with a rape baby or had one, or is seen as damaged goods.

A man can move on from a rape easier and more quickly relatively speaking. Only worry there is for a permanent STI. Only one or a few of which to my knowledge, is truly life threatening.

[Galloism]

My interpretation is that the double standard is mainly because women can get pregnant while a man can't.

Thus, if a woman gets raped- there can be more negative consequences for her than if the same were to happen to a man, provided she's not yet too old and is attractive in terms of sexual marketplace value. There is a lot of stigma for any lady who got saddled with a rape baby or had one, or is seen as damaged goods.

A man can move on from a rape easier and more quickly relatively speaking. Only worry there is for a permanent STI. Only one or a few of which to my knowledge, is truly life threatening.

Funny thing about that - that may have USED to be the case, but now it's reversed. While a woman who gets pregnant can typically get an abortion if so desired which, while it certainly isn't a day at the beach, has fewer life-long consequences than going through pregnancy and having a child and then having to care for that child for 20 years with all that that entails.

However, for a boy who is raped, this eventuality - 20 years of supporting his child (and his rapist) is a very real and legally binding consequence of being raped. This often means that they will never go to college, never get a great career, etc, because the system as currently designed actually punishes putative fathers (even rape victims) for seeking higher education, as that gives them higher income for child support purposes and requires them to pay more (scholarships, grants, tax credits, etc, all of that is deemed income and requires he pay his rapist more money for having received them).

It wasn't necessarily always this way, but when it comes to consequences, the average boy has more severe consequences of a nonconsenting pregnancy than a girl does. A girl has a way out.

A boy doesn't.

[Saiwania]

Funny thing about that - that may have USED to be the case, but now it's reversed. While a woman who gets pregnant can typically get an abortion if so desired which, while it certainly isn't a day at the beach, has fewer life-long consequences than going through pregnancy and having a child and then having to care for that child for 20 years with all that that entails.

However, for a boy who is raped, this eventuality - 20 years of supporting his child (and his rapist) is a very real and legally binding consequence of being raped. This often means that they will never go to college, never get a great career, etc, because the system as currently designed actually punishes putative fathers (even rape victims) for seeking higher education, as that gives them higher income for child support purposes and requires them to pay more (scholarships, grants, tax credits, etc, all of that is deemed income and requires he pay his rapist more money for having received them).

It wasn't necessarily always this way, but when it comes to consequences, the average boy has more severe consequences of a nonconsenting pregnancy than a girl does. A girl has a way out. A boy doesn't.

People should spare me this "not going to college means having no future" crap. I went to college and guess what? It didn't benefit me any. And I got a degree I perceived as valuable but wasn't. It was in STEM and wasn't some Liberal Arts crap. People can succeed from going to college but chances are- it has to be for the Financial, Medical, or Legal professions to make it more likely that you don't need something like a full apprenticeship or lots of work experience already to break into such an industry.

In any case, some places make access to abortion more difficult than other places or the population there has heavily anti-abortion politics. If a woman wants an abortion, they more or less have to arrange it as soon as possible. If they wait too long, its often too late.

If a man is being shaken down for paternity, he just needs a better lawyer than the woman suing him can afford. And if it doesn't go his way, he can always skip town or flee the country.

[Esternial]

I think that, among many people, rape has simply gotten associated with the worst instances of the act.

If an attractive adult has "consensual" sex with a minor, it gets treated like this. It's just wrong, and inevitably leads to a discussion on semantics on the term "rape", doesn't it?

[Galloism]

Funny thing about that - that may have USED to be the case, but now it's reversed. While a woman who gets pregnant can typically get an abortion if so desired which, while it certainly isn't a day at the beach, has fewer life-long consequences than going through pregnancy and having a child and then having to care for that child for 20 years with all that that entails.

However, for a boy who is raped, this eventuality - 20 years of supporting his child (and his rapist) is a very real and legally binding consequence of being raped. This often means that they will never go to college, never get a great career, etc, because the system as currently designed actually punishes putative fathers (even rape victims) for seeking higher education, as that gives them higher income for child support purposes and requires them to pay more (scholarships, grants, tax credits, etc, all of that is deemed income and requires he pay his rapist more money for having received them).

It wasn't necessarily always this way, but when it comes to consequences, the average boy has more severe consequences of a nonconsenting pregnancy than a girl does. A girl has a way out. A boy doesn't.

People should spare me this "not going to college means having no future" crap. I went to college and guess what? It didn't benefit me any. And I got a degree I perceived as valuable but wasn't. It was in STEM and wasn't some Liberal Arts crap. People can succeed from going to college but chances are- it has to be for the Financial, Medical, or Legal professions to make it more likely that you don't need something like a full apprenticeship or lots of work experience already to break into such an industry.

In any case, some places make access to abortion more difficult than other places or the population there has heavily anti-abortion politics. If a woman wants an abortion, they more or less have to arrange it as soon as possible. If they wait too long, its often too late.

If a man is being shaken down for paternity, he just needs a better lawyer than the woman suing him can afford. And if it doesn't go his way, he can always skip town or flee the country.

No, he doesn't - he is screwed in any case. The fact that he's a minor will be simultaneously used to state he can't care for a child so the rapist mother should, and disregarded in whether he's still responsible to pay her.

The case law on this is explicitly clear. He will spend the next 20 years (or more) of his life slaving away to pay his rapist for the results of her having raped him. There is no defense.

[Cekoviu]

Absolutely not. It's both misogynist and misandrist to think that's okay.
Though this really doesn't need to be a thread separate from the [Anti]feminist Discussion Thread.

[Neutraligon]

People should spare me this "not going to college means having no future" crap. I went to college and guess what? It didn't benefit me any. And I got a degree I perceived as valuable but wasn't. It was in STEM and wasn't some Liberal Arts crap. People can succeed from going to college but chances are- it has to be for the Financial, Medical, or Legal professions to make it more likely that you don't need something like a full apprenticeship or lots of work experience already to break into such an industry.

In any case, some places make access to abortion more difficult than other places or the population there has heavily anti-abortion politics. If a woman wants an abortion, they more or less have to arrange it as soon as possible. If they wait too long, its often too late.

If a man is being shaken down for paternity, he just needs a better lawyer than the woman suing him can afford. And if it doesn't go his way, he can always skip town or flee the country.

No, he doesn't - he is screwed in any case. The fact that he's a minor will be simultaneously used to state he can't care for a child so the rapist mother should, and disregarded in whether he's still responsible to pay her.

The case law on this is explicitly clear. He will spend the next 20 years (or more) of his life slaving away to pay his rapist for the results of her having raped him. There is no defense.

Is there case law where a male rapes an underage girl, she goes through with the pregnancy, and he keeps the child?

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Dude. You are essentially trying to make a case for the defense of pedophilia.

That’s a bad thing. That is, objectively, a very bad thing. This is not the hill you want to die on, my guy.

Pedophilia is very, very, wrong. But ultimately, there is nobody except the victim of a crime who ought to determine whether or not to prosecute said crime.

Murder. Grievous bodily injury resulting in a coma. Murder-rape.

This philosophy just doesn't work.

[Cekoviu]

This philosophy just doesn't work.

Literally ancapism.

[Galloism]

No, he doesn't - he is screwed in any case. The fact that he's a minor will be simultaneously used to state he can't care for a child so the rapist mother should, and disregarded in whether he's still responsible to pay her.

The case law on this is explicitly clear. He will spend the next 20 years (or more) of his life slaving away to pay his rapist for the results of her having raped him. There is no defense.

Is there case law where a male rapes an underage girl, she goes through with the pregnancy, and he keeps the child?

Not that I can think of, but typically that's because he's in jail.

[Neutraligon]

Is there case law where a male rapes an underage girl, she goes through with the pregnancy, and he keeps the child?

Not that I can think of, but typically that's because he's in jail.

Hmm, apparently there are attempts, (I saw no mention of underage) where convicted rapists have tried to file for joint custody of child. Laws dealing with this vary depending on state, where some have no protection for the victim to those that require a rape conviction(specifically rape, lesser charges do not count), to those that do not require a conviction but have a standard I do not entirely understand. It was actually only recently that these laws preventing a rapist (male in this case) from having joint child custody went into effect.

[Samadhi]

Jesus H Christ.

[Galloism]

Not that I can think of, but typically that's because he's in jail.

Hmm, apparently there are attempts, (I saw no mention of underage) where convicted rapists have tried to file for joint custody of child. Laws dealing with this vary depending on state, where some have no protection for the victim to those that require a rape conviction(specifically rape, lesser charges do not count), to those that do not require a conviction but have a standard I do not entirely understand. It was actually only recently that these laws preventing a rapist (male in this case) from having joint child custody went into effect.

However, keep in mind women generally get primary custody by default in most states for unmarried parents.

Whether she's a rapist or not.

[Liriena]

I'm surprised that the OP didn't start the thread based on Shoe0nHead's recent video on female teachers and statutory rape.

But yeah, there is a creepy double standard still when it comes women raping men, even young boys. It's creepy how people of all genders actively reinforce both the notion that women (usually cis women specifically) are inherently helpless and delicate actors incapable of sexual violence, and the notion that boys, even barely pubescent ones, can be, should be and are horny and willing at all times.

There's still a long way to go when it comes to teaching children, teenagers and a disturbing number of adults about informed consent as it pertains to all ages, genders and circumstances.

[Neutraligon]

Hmm, apparently there are attempts, (I saw no mention of underage) where convicted rapists have tried to file for joint custody of child. Laws dealing with this vary depending on state, where some have no protection for the victim to those that require a rape conviction(specifically rape, lesser charges do not count), to those that do not require a conviction but have a standard I do not entirely understand. It was actually only recently that these laws preventing a rapist (male in this case) from having joint child custody went into effect.

However, keep in mind women generally get primary custody by default in most states for unmarried parents.

Whether she's a rapist or not.

I am aware, and still looking into what happens. I am simply pointing out that the law dealing with rape and child custody was shitty until fairy recently. I believe that it was only in 2015 that the rape survivor custody act went into play where states where provided funds if a state had a law allowing a pregnant woman (specifically woman) to seek the termination of their rapists parental rights.... Gallo when was the court date that had the male victim have to pay custody?

You know, looking at that law, it seems fairly discriminatory against men. I wonder if there is a lawyer who would like to use it to cut of a female rapists right to custody (so the child could then be placed for adoption and the man not have to pay child custody). If the court refuses on the grounds that the law is specifically for women you got yourself a lawsuit.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Doing it like that risks endangering a lot more children. The government has a duty to protect its citizens from things like rape, not allow it for longer.

If it's consensual, it's not rape. How is that complicated?

There’s no true informed consent. Also, a teenaged boy or girl that is coaxed into sex by a teacher, is being coaxed into it by an adult in a position of power. Don’t you see the dynamic imbalance here?

[Gravlen]

No, he doesn't - he is screwed in any case. The fact that he's a minor will be simultaneously used to state he can't care for a child so the rapist mother should, and disregarded in whether he's still responsible to pay her.

The case law on this is explicitly clear. He will spend the next 20 years (or more) of his life slaving away to pay his rapist for the results of her having raped him. There is no defense.

Is there case law where a male rapes an underage girl, she goes through with the pregnancy, and he keeps the child?

Like this?

A convicted sex offender who raped a Michigan woman when she was only 12 years old has now been granted joint custody of his victim’s 8-year-old son, according to a report.

Christopher Mirasolo, 27, was awarded joint legal custody — and shared parenting time — with his now-21-year-old victim after DNA testing established the child’s paternity late last month, the Detroit News reported.

At least the rapist got sentenced to... oh...

Mirasolo ended up holding them captive for two days in a vacant house before he released the older sister in a park — and allegedly threatened to kill both girls if they ratted him out. He then raped the younger girl, according to the report.

He was arrested a month later when the pre-teen became pregnant. He was sentenced to one year in county jail but only ended up serving six-and-a-half months so he could care for his sick mother, Kiessling said.

It ended up being revoked, because he said he had no intention of seeking visitation or seeing the child.

Here's anothe fun one. Step Uncle got her pregnant at 15.

When she was 12, her mother’s 19-year-old half brother moved in with her family in Alabama. He raped her repeatedly, Jessica says, and she got pregnant and had a miscarriage within a few years. To this day, Jessica wonders why her doctor didn’t inform authorities as required by state law. “At the time I was just scared,” Jessica says. “But now I’m thinking, ‘Why was something more not done?’”

A family member pressured Jessica to marry her uncle. She got pregnant again at 15, 17, and 18. Her surviving sons are now 16 and 13 years old. Her second child, who would be 14 now, was severely disabled due to Krabbe disease, a nervous system disorder. He lived only two years. Jessica has his nickname, Pooh, tattooed on her right wrist.

Her uncle continued to abuse her, and after a particularly frightening attack, she finally fled. “I’ve got to get out of here or he’s going to kill me,” she remembers thinking. In 2009, while the divorce was pending, a judge granted her a protection order. Without family support, Jessica became homeless. The courts gave the father full custody.

That's Alabama for you.

[Liriena]

If it's consensual, it's not rape. How is that complicated?

There’s no true informed consent. Also, a teenaged boy or girl that is coaxed into sex by a teacher, is being coaxed into it by an adult in a position of power. Don’t you see the dynamic imbalance here?

Yeah, the latter should be a huge red flag for anyone, even if you believed that teenagers can give informed consent. Even in sexual relationships between adults, it's generally understood that an unequal power dynamic makes the whole thing potentially unhealthy.

Kinky power fantasies are fine when they're between two people in a safe, sane and consensual relationship, because in those situations the unequal power dynamic is contained inside the roleplaying.

[Duvniask]

Is this that male privilege they keep talking about because it sure seems like society ain't willing to protect men from getting raped

And next, I suppose, you're going to criticize anyone calling out racist practices these days, because a black person might, in some single respect, be better off than a white? It's just ignorance of the bigger picture; on some issues men are affected more (suicide is one of the go-to examples), but on the whole you'd have much greater difficulty arguing your case that males aren't privileged (payment, positions of power, etc.).

[Liriena]

Is this that male privilege they keep talking about because it sure seems like society ain't willing to protect men from getting raped

And next, I suppose, you're going to criticize anyone calling out racist practices these days, because a black person might, in some single respect, be better off than a white? It's just ignorance of the bigger picture; on some issues men are affected more (suicide is one of the go-to examples), but on the whole you'd have much greater difficulty arguing your case that males aren't privileged (payment, positions of power, etc.).

Also, in the particular case of men being raped by women, the lack of recognition that it's even possible for it to happen is something which to a large extent can be traced back to the traditional "benevolent" sort of sexism which underestimates women in general as being powerless beings with no agency and no capacity to physically dominate men in any way, up to and including sexual violence.

"Women are helpless, passive and delicate, whereas men are strong, active and horny, so how could a woman ever rape a man?"