Are Pit Bulls more dangerous than other breeds?

[Jebslund]

Despite making up just 5.8% of all dogs in America, pit bulls make up 65% of all dog attacks. And unlike the racial psuedoscience stuff these dogs are literally bred for combat. Clearly, if every owner was nice, they would be more or less ok, but that's impossible because dogs like this will always have a sort of appeal to unpleasant people.

That sounds like an argument that pitbulls are only conditionally more dangerous, rather than inherently so. Their appeal to the wrong sorts of owners doesn't make them more dangerous than other breeds. It makes them more attractive to unpleasant and/or lazy owners. What you have pointed out is a factor which skews the data, not proof that they are inherently less trainable than other breeds.

[Cantelo]

I think it's quite the fallacy, and straight racist, to compare the treatment pit bulls get to black people. I'm not saying you are, but I've seen this argument a handful of times and I can't help but feel it's ridiculous to hold a dog breed to the same level as humans. Dogs can't comprehend racism, humans absolutely can and are negatively affected by it on a level dogs will never be able to internalize because they simply can't.

The point of the comparison was to illustrate the idea that the eugenics UED was referring to most likely had little to do with selective breeding and much to do with the idea that some countries believe they are inherently dangerous and should be put down. Stick to that, rather than your manufactured racism and internalisation arguments and don't put words in my mouth.

I'm not saying you are, but I've seen this argument a handful of times

Is reading comprehension difficult? I made sure to point out I'm not accusing you of racism, I'm saying it's not uncommon to see people that stan for pit bulls using the race card on a dog.

[Jebslund]

The point of the comparison was to illustrate the idea that the eugenics UED was referring to most likely had little to do with selective breeding and much to do with the idea that some countries believe they are inherently dangerous and should be put down. Stick to that, rather than your manufactured racism and internalisation arguments and don't put words in my mouth.

I'm not saying you are, but I've seen this argument a handful of times

Is reading comprehension difficult? I made sure to point out I'm not accusing you of racism, I'm saying it's not uncommon to see people that stan for pit bulls using the race card on a dog.

Okay, but understand that the fact that you felt the need to write that comment at all says more than your one-sentence denial.

[Cantelo]

Is reading comprehension difficult? I made sure to point out I'm not accusing you of racism, I'm saying it's not uncommon to see people that stan for pit bulls using the race card on a dog.

Okay, but understand that the fact that you felt the need to write that comment at all says more than your one-sentence denial.

What are you insinuating, exactly? I was expecting someone to bring up race, as has been done in pit bull discussions before. You (indirectly) brought it up, and so I decided to comment on it before somebody tried making it into a main argument in defense of the dogs.

[South Ccanda]

Both I and my brother have been attacked by Pitbulls on separate occasions. I was a baby when one split my bottom lip open, and a few years ago, one bit my brother in the face and he had to have half of his face reconstructed. that being said, we both still love Pitbulls. I strongly believe that pitbull owners should not have their dogs around children. You can not deny that they are just a more aggressive breed, no matter how docile they seem to you. My neighbor's cat was recently eaten by a pit bull that got away from its owners. it's an unfortunate fact, but that is really just how it is.

Edit* I would like to rephrase. I do not mean to say they are the most aggressive breed. More accurately, playfulness and aggressiveness from Pitbulls seem somewhat similar (In my experience) and can have a much stronger, damaging bite than other breeds.

[Estado Novo Portugues]

If I had my way, pitbull ownership would be banned, and I'd strain them out of the canine gene pool as fast as possible. The less innocent toddlers mauled by someone's "precious pitty", the better.

Or just regulate the owners, and restrict ownership to experienced dog handlers with no small children in the home.

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

That awkward moment when I saw this thread the day after I finished watching Zootopia...

Anyway, they say it's just the owners, not the dogs, but if a breed disproportionately attracts dangerous owners, doesn't that suggest a higher degree of scrutiny is warranted for anyone looking to adopt a pitbull than anyone looking to adopt any other breed?

[Dogmeat]

Despite making up just 5.8% of all dogs in America, pit bulls make up 65% of all dog attacks. And unlike the racial psuedoscience stuff these dogs are literally bred for combat. Clearly, if every owner was nice, they would be more or less ok, but that's impossible because dogs like this will always have a sort of appeal to unpleasant people.

That sounds like an argument that pitbulls are only conditionally more dangerous, rather than inherently so. Their appeal to the wrong sorts of owners doesn't make them more dangerous than other breeds. It makes them more attractive to unpleasant and/or lazy owners. What you have pointed out is a factor which skews the data, not proof that they are inherently less trainable than other breeds.

A bad owner is always going to make the situation worse.

But all things being equal, a Pit Bull is more likely that other large breeds to react to a given stimulus with violence. This is just factually the case. They're also much more likely to pursue an attack, whereas other dogs will just give a warning bite.

I know there's the impulse to not blame the dog. "It's not their fault, it's the humans fault." And that's true. But it's not just the owners, in this case it's also the breeders. People bred and aggressive dog. And we could breed it out of them (and people have started to), but that's going to take a little time.


Buy a mutt. They're much more likely to be healthy, and free of personality issues.

[Page]

Remember when people who knew absolutely nothing about guns ignorantly talked about how super dangerous the AR-15 is despite the fact that it's really no different than any other typical rifle?

That's what this is. The pitbull is the AR-15 of dogs. People have the cause and effect backwards. It's not the rifle/dog that's the problem, it's bad people who like the rife/dog.

[South Ccanda]

Remember when people who knew absolutely nothing about guns ignorantly talked about how super dangerous the AR-15 is despite the fact that it's really no different than any other typical rifle?

That's what this is. The pitbull is the AR-15 of dogs. People have the cause and effect backwards. It's not the rifle/dog that's the problem, it's bad people who like the rife/dog.

Then that leads us to the argument of "How do we prevent bad people from owning ______?"

[Unstoppable Empire of Doom]

Despite making up just 5.8% of all dogs in America, pit bulls make up 65% of all dog attacks. And unlike the racial psuedoscience stuff these dogs are literally bred for combat. Clearly, if every owner was nice, they would be more or less ok, but that's impossible because dogs like this will always have a sort of appeal to unpleasant people.

Neither of your sources say what they mean by "pitbull". Again these statistics are wildly skewed and poorly interpreted due to the simple fact "pitbull" is not a breed but rather 5 or 6 breeds as well as any and all mutts that merely look like one.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.huffpost ... 112394/amp

[Page]

Remember when people who knew absolutely nothing about guns ignorantly talked about how super dangerous the AR-15 is despite the fact that it's really no different than any other typical rifle?

That's what this is. The pitbull is the AR-15 of dogs. People have the cause and effect backwards. It's not the rifle/dog that's the problem, it's bad people who like the rife/dog.

Then that leads us to the argument of "How do we prevent bad people from owning ______?"

Shelters doing better vetting for adoption would be a good start.

[Dogmeat]

Remember when people who knew absolutely nothing about guns ignorantly talked about how super dangerous the AR-15 is despite the fact that it's really no different than any other typical rifle?

That's what this is. The pitbull is the AR-15 of dogs. People have the cause and effect backwards. It's not the rifle/dog that's the problem, it's bad people who like the rife/dog.

...it's not though.

Pit Bulls really are more prone to aggression. It's not their fault, we bred the behavior into them, but they are.

This shouldn't surprise anyone. We've radically altered the behavior of all dogs through breeding. So much that they're behaviorally (if not biologically) an entirely different species from Asianic Wolves.

I get the impulse not to blame the dog. And you shouldn't. But it's not just the owners, either.

[Page]

Remember when people who knew absolutely nothing about guns ignorantly talked about how super dangerous the AR-15 is despite the fact that it's really no different than any other typical rifle?

That's what this is. The pitbull is the AR-15 of dogs. People have the cause and effect backwards. It's not the rifle/dog that's the problem, it's bad people who like the rife/dog.

...it's not though.

Pit Bulls really are more prone to aggression. It's not their fault, we bred the behavior into them, but they are.

This shouldn't surprise anyone. We've radically altered the behavior of all dogs through breeding. So much that they're behaviorally (if not biologically) an entirely different species from Asianic Wolves.

I get the impulse not to blame the dog. And you shouldn't. But it's not just the owners, either.

Even more aggressive breeds can be raised to be gentle. There are things you can do, like socialize them with other dogs and other humans when they're puppies. Train them to respond calmly to others.

I've interacted with many pitbulls in my life who couldn't kill anyone unless if they licked them to death.

[Elwher]

Despite making up just 5.8% of all dogs in America, pit bulls make up 65% of all dog attacks.

Despite making up 13% of the US population, Blacks make up 40% of the prison population. Are Blacks more crime prone than other races? No, there is a bias in the system. The same is true of pit bulls. When a pit bull bites someone, it is big news. When a chihuahua bites someone, it often does not get reported at all, and certainly gets less publicity if it is.

Personally, and I know this is anecdotal evidence only, I have spent a great deal of time among dogs of many different breeds, and have been bitten by two of them. One was a chihuahua and the other was a westie, none of the pits I have known have ever bitten me.

[Cantelo]

Despite making up just 5.8% of all dogs in America, pit bulls make up 65% of all dog attacks.

Despite making up 13% of the US population, Blacks make up 40% of the prison population.

There it is, black people brought up as an analogy in defense of pit bulls.

Human beings and all the injustices society commits against a certain subset of them != a breed of dog.

[Page]

Despite making up 13% of the US population, Blacks make up 40% of the prison population.

There it is, black people brought up as an analogy in defense of pit bulls.

Human beings and all the injustices society commits against a certain subset of them != a breed of dog.

We could instead bring up young white males being involved in most of the heavily publicized mass shootings if you prefer.

[Earth Orbit]

If I had my way, pitbull ownership would be banned, and I'd strain them out of the canine gene pool as fast as possible. The less innocent toddlers mauled by someone's "precious pitty", the better.

Or just regulate the owners, and restrict ownership to experienced dog handlers with no small children in the home.

Regulation is not some magic cure-all for problems like this. How are you going to enforce such regulation? What's stopping some hick from getting a license and then letting his pitbull roam free? What's stopping tragic accidents when a pitbull manages to escape a truly experienced handler through a broken fence? What's stopping tragic accidents when kids don't know better and go to pet the doggy, only to get their face shredded?

Another example: We regulate opiates to purely medical uses, yet tens of thousands die every year when they use them in ways contrary to their regulation.

[Bear Stearns]

It's not pit bulls, it's pit bull owners. Now what do pit bull owners all have in common? :^)

[Seangoli]

Despite making up just 5.8% of all dogs in America, pit bulls make up 65% of all dog attacks. And unlike the racial psuedoscience stuff these dogs are literally bred for combat. Clearly, if every owner was nice, they would be more or less ok, but that's impossible because dogs like this will always have a sort of appeal to unpleasant people.

That sounds like an argument that pitbulls are only conditionally more dangerous, rather than inherently so. Their appeal to the wrong sorts of owners doesn't make them more dangerous than other breeds. It makes them more attractive to unpleasant and/or lazy owners. What you have pointed out is a factor which skews the data, not proof that they are inherently less trainable than other breeds.

https://www.avma.org/resources-tools/li ... role-breed

You are on the nose. Controlled studies have found that pitbulls do not bite more often than other types of dogs

That said, there are some caveats here:

1. Pitbulls are incredibly energetic and incredibly strong. They need a lot of training and a lot of exercise or else they will antsy as hell.

2. They do have a stronger bite than other dogs. The problem here is that dogs bite. All dogs do. They play bite, they nip, they chase things. This isn't a problem if you actually bother to train and socialize your dog well, and teach them out of this behavior. If you don't, the problem is that pitbulls don't necessarily know that a person is softer and weaker than they are. They will act like a person is a dog unless you train them not to.

3. Even "good" owners of pits have a bad habit of not doing any sort of extensive obedience training. They are lackadaisical about it. I have seen some of the most aggressive dogs you could ever imagine from almost any breed thinkable gain a more even temperament with obedience training. It's not hard to train a dog, contrary to popular belief. It just takes patience. 30 minutes a day every day for a month will go a long way to evening a dog's temperament, but most pet owners don't put in that time.

4. Pits do have a slight tendency to be aggressive towards other dogs. This, again, isn't deterministic. Socialization and training are important to keep this behavior in check.

Pits, at the end of the day, are big highly energetic dumb oafs. They are quite a loveable breed but because of their traits require a lot more attention than smaller dogs.

[Cantelo]

It's not pit bulls, it's pit bull owners. Now what do pit bull owners all have in common? :^)

They tend to be trashy, possibly lower income, and live in the worse-off parts of town?

[Bear Stearns]

It's not pit bulls, it's pit bull owners. Now what do pit bull owners all have in common? :^)

They tend to be trashy, possibly lower income, and live in the worse-off parts of town?

Yes...and what do trashy, lower income people who live in the bad part of town tend to have in common :^)

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

I’d let a small child play with a pit bull shark, I played with a pit bull shark as a kid, I take my pit bull shark to the dog park ocean and she plays with kids and other dogs fish. If you are the kind of person who thinks dog fish breeds are the difference between life and death then you clearly shouldn’t be allowed to have dogs fish.

Still a good idea now?

Most of the time, a Pitbull doesn't want to hurt a child. But it's dangerous to take that for granted and generalize that as true for every individual dog. Animal behavior isn't a deterministic algorithm, so you can't guarantee that the next 10, 100, 1000 times, the dog will still be friendly. What's certain is the potential danger: 235 PSI of biting force, much harder than a Golden Retriever, Poodle or Collie. Nobody expects to crash when driving, but it's definitely possible, so I'd pick a car with a good crash rating just in case.

Fun fact about sharks:
They dont really want to eat humans as we taste horrible to them.

Too much bones and muscles not enough fat.

Shark attacks are also over reported as on average you are much more dangerous to a shark then they are to you.

Also your entire post is a is based on a false equivalence.
A pit bull is nothing like a shark.

[Cantelo]

They tend to be trashy, possibly lower income, and live in the worse-off parts of town?

Yes...and what do trashy, lower income people who live in the bad part of town tend to have in common :^)

They may be...more predisposed to owning pit bulls due to a perpetuated image cultivated of pits being badass fighting dogs bred to be more aggressive and see an internalized version of themselves reflected in that image?

They've also got poverty in common? Maybe a lack of education due to monetary and environmental constraints as well as self-destructive habits formed out of that lack of education or lack of positive role models?

[Earthbound Immortal Squad]

I'm going to agree with that Pit Bulls are more dangerous. Most of the cases of dog attacks on humans I have heard over the years have been from Pit Bulls or Pit Bull crossbreeds. Though I would argue that human factor contributes to this too in the way that these dogs may not be brought up to be disciplined properly and hence increases the likelihood of an attack.