Prostitution and presumed double standards

[Chernoslavia]

At bars, drinks are often offered with the implicit arrangement of having sex with the person who offered them a drink later on.

No. That isn't the case at all.

Lolwut? What kind of bar do you go to?

[The East Marches II]

Prostitution is the opposite of any realtionship. You don't pay a prostitute to go somewhere with you; you pay a prostitute to go away after you're done.

All the more reason to legalize it really :^)

[Rojava Free State]

No. That isn't the case at all.

Lolwut? What kind of bar do you go to?

Bartender: ight bud here's your drink

The patron: thanks *rubs arm* when I come back later, whaddya say we uh, make our way to the men's restroom

Bartender: I'm totally a bottom

The patron: well I'm totally a top, so I'm ready to really dominate you

Me: what the actual fuck!? Did I accidentally walk into the gay bar again instead of the Vertex nightclub? Josh let's go. We fucked up

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

Prostitution is the opposite of any realtionship. You don't pay a prostitute to go somewhere with you; you pay a prostitute to go away after you're done.

Does this follow from the definition of prostitution, though? Technically, sex doesn't entitle her to a relationship any more than a relationship entitles you to sex. Laws on stalking don't have a "but we had sex before" loophole even if the stalker is a woman.

EDIT: That reminded me to check the poll. The only option with zero votes thus far was "sex strikes." Is that because I added it later, or do people have any reason in mind that has less in common with prostitution than the others?

[Heloin]

Lolwut? What kind of bar do you go to?

Bartender: ight bud here's your drink

The patron: thanks *rubs arm* when I come back later, whaddya say we uh, make our way to the men's restroom

Bartender: I'm totally a bottom

The patron: well I'm totally a top, so I'm ready to really dominate you

Me: what the actual fuck!? Did I accidentally walk into the gay bar again instead of the Vertex nightclub? Josh let's go. We fucked up

Sounds like more fun then any bar I've ever been in.

[United Muscovite Nations]

Pornography is quite literally prostitution, but some of the other options are also morally wrong as well.

[Page]

I have no moral problem with sex work and think it should be legal, but I do have a big problem with pimping as that is extremely exploitative.

Here's what I think sex work looks like in an ideal world: Sex workers are collective owners of their own business, and only those who participate in sex work can make money from the enterprise. So if there's a brothel with 12 sex workers, all 12 of them are equal partners. No "Madams" involved. I think it's dangerous for someone to do independent sex work but that is their right to do so if they want, though a collective is definitely ideal.

I think coercive sex work should be stopped, but under no circumstances should the sex workers themselves ever be punished. To this day in America and other countries, human trafficking victims including minors have been jailed for prostitution. There was even a case in Georgia a few years ago of a 14-year-old girl being arrested for prostitution. That is fucking evil, to jail a rape victim instead of helping her.

[Elwher]

I have no moral problem with sex work and think it should be legal, but I do have a big problem with pimping as that is extremely exploitative.

Here's what I think sex work looks like in an ideal world: Sex workers are collective owners of their own business, and only those who participate in sex work can make money from the enterprise. So if there's a brothel with 12 sex workers, all 12 of them are equal partners. No "Madams" involved. I think it's dangerous for someone to do independent sex work but that is their right to do so if they want, though a collective is definitely ideal.

I think coercive sex work should be stopped, but under no circumstances should the sex workers themselves ever be punished. To this day in America and other countries, human trafficking victims including minors have been jailed for prostitution. There was even a case in Georgia a few years ago of a 14-year-old girl being arrested for prostitution. That is fucking evil, to jail a rape victim instead of helping her.

The problem with that, as I see it, is obtaining the start up capital. No one would be allowed to loan them money except another brothel, which is unlikely to want to finance future competition, as repayment would be someone not in the sex trade making money off of it.

[Deacarsia]

Prostitution is wrong, for all parties involved, no matter their level of wealth or power, as is pornography. It degrades men and women to the status of objects. It is evil and should not be tolerated.

[Nakena]

Pornography is quite literally prostitution, but some of the other options are also morally wrong as well.

Funfact: Actually a lot of performers earn their main revenue in the escort business. Pornography is basically ads, and by itself does not necessarily generates much income or revenue. Neither for the performers nor for the Studios themself anymore, except a few big players and streaming websites.

[Page]

Prostitution is wrong, for all parties involved, no matter their level of wealth or power, as is pornography. It degrades men and women to the status of objects. It is evil and should not be tolerated.

That's quite a generalization.

[Saiwania]

Prostitution pays well only in places where its illegal or less accessible. I've read that in places like Germany or Greece, that sex work pays low for a lot of clients served. This was even more true when Greece's economy was at rock bottom a few years back. People just aren't going to pay a whole lot for anything that has a lot of competition or is unskilled. The supply of women doing sex work was too high when the economy was bad.

Anything that has a low barrier to entry isn't something you'll live well off doing.

[Nakena]

Prostitution is wrong, for all parties involved, no matter their level of wealth or power, as is pornography. It degrades men and women to the status of objects. It is evil and should not be tolerated.

That's quite a generalization.

Well he comes from a christian perspective. So that a given.

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

Prostitution is wrong, for all parties involved, no matter their level of wealth or power, as is pornography. It degrades men and women to the status of objects. It is evil and should not be tolerated.

Any given industrial job does its best to degrade men and women to the status of objects: as replaceable and impersonal as any given bit of machinery, to the point where they are often replaced by machines once the technology becomes available (car factory robots and self-checkouts in grocery stores come to mind). Should we dismantle the entire economy, or is this sort of dehumanization only wrong when it's in the form of prostitution and perfectly acceptable elsewhere?

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

Prostitution pays well only in places where its illegal or less accessible. I've read that in places like Germany or Greece, that sex work pays low for a lot of clients served. This was even more true when Greece's economy was at rock bottom a few years back. People just aren't going to pay a whole lot for anything that has a lot of competition or is unskilled. The supply of women doing sex work was too high when the economy was bad.

Anything that has a low barrier to entry isn't something you'll live well off doing.

Then let them decide for themselves whether or not it's worth the money.

EDIT: So I've taken another look at the poll. Literally twice as many people thus far call sugar mama/sugar daddy arrangements prostitution as call pornography prostitution. To what do you attribute the legality of the former, then?

This brings me to another question now... how does prostitution, and or sugar mama/daddy dating play into child support law? I'd probably let a sugar mama have me if I knew for a fact I wouldn't have to pay back all that money and more in child support bills. Is it considered "double dipping" to go after a prostitute/client for child support bills or what?

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

Prostitution is wrong, for all parties involved, no matter their level of wealth or power, as is pornography. It degrades men and women to the status of objects. It is evil and should not be tolerated.

Any given industrial job does its best to degrade men and women to the status of objects: as replaceable and impersonal as any given bit of machinery, to the point where they are often replaced by machines once the technology becomes available (car factory robots and self-checkouts in grocery stores come to mind). Should we dismantle the entire economy, or is this sort of dehumanization only wrong when it's in the form of prostitution and perfectly acceptable elsewhere?

To be fair, automation creates abundance, and abundance should never be a bad thing in any economy. If it is, something's wrong with the way the economy is designed.

The irony is, prostitution might be the profession least replaceable by machines, as we have access to sex dolls and there is still demand for prostitution.

[Nakena]

Any given industrial job does its best to degrade men and women to the status of objects: as replaceable and impersonal as any given bit of machinery, to the point where they are often replaced by machines once the technology becomes available (car factory robots and self-checkouts in grocery stores come to mind). Should we dismantle the entire economy, or is this sort of dehumanization only wrong when it's in the form of prostitution and perfectly acceptable elsewhere?

To be fair, automation creates abundance, and abundance should never be a bad thing in any economy. If it is, something's wrong with the way the economy is designed.

The irony is, prostitution might be the profession least replaceable by machines, as we have access to sex dolls and there is still demand for prostitution.

They aren't fully functional Gynoids though. Current tech isnt sufficiently advanced and wont be for long time to come for that.

So human prostitution is going to stay,

[Cappuccina]

Prostitution is wrong, for all parties involved, no matter their level of wealth or power, as is pornography. It degrades men and women to the status of objects. It is evil and should not be tolerated.

That's quite a generalization.

No it isn't, lol. It's true in every way.

[Andsed]

Prostitution is wrong, for all parties involved, no matter their level of wealth or power, as is pornography. It degrades men and women to the status of objects. It is evil and should not be tolerated.

Not really. Yes prostitution does have the issue in that many sex workers find themselves degraded and forced into it. But inherently all it is is a service in which sex is exchanged for money. If this is taking place between two consenting adults there is nothing degrading or wrong about it.

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

That's quite a generalization.

No it isn't, lol. It's true in every way.

Do you mean "by definition?" If so, what follows from the definition?

Otherwise, on what basis do you imply it to apply at all?

[Arkhane]

Despite what you may presume, sex is only one aspect of marriage. Prostitution, however, is only ever about sex, nothing more. Implying that both are similar shows one's ignorance about what marriage is all about.

My opinion on prostitution is negative despite being someone with an active, casual sex life, let me tell you, sex is not as fantastic, well coordinated or spontaneously pleasurable as porn often depicts.

Sure, I've had lovers who are careful and sensible, but on a whole they are either so awkward and nervous (usually the younger ones) or way too rough and inconsiderate (older guys) . I don't want to reveal or gross people out but some guys get carried away with the pinching and the biting and the rough fingers.

Now imagine that being your job and you have a quota to fill and no matter how undesirable you find your client, its that or you won't get paid. It is one of the most demeaning and undignified as well as dehumanizing experience you can imagine. In prostitution, consent will always be overriden by incentive. Society shouldn't encourage people to surrender their consent just because they're desperate. A majority of prostitutes do it not because it's fun or they like it.

They're doing it because they have no choice.

[LimaUniformNovemberAlpha]

Despite what you may presume, sex is only one aspect of marriage.

Of course. I never said it was the entirety. But so long as one partner wants it more than the other, it is going to be exchanged for other things, consciously or unconsciously.

Now imagine that being your job and you have a quota to fill and no matter how undesirable you find your client

This assumption does not follow from the definition of prostitution. Any regulation could address individual employees' rights to pick and choose their clients.

Society shouldn't encourage people to surrender their consent just because they're desperate.

Find a way to make people less desperate, instead of throwing people in jail over an honest transaction.

They're doing it because they have no choice.

There's always a choice. The real reason is because it's better than the alternatives. Take it up with all the other employers who are supposedly so awful prostitution is the better option.

[Crockerland]

Corporate pornography is just prostitution that happens to be filmed, and I wouldn't mind if its production were made illegal.

[Nakena]

Corporate pornography is just prostitution that happens to be filmed, and I wouldn't mind if its production were made illegal.

Funfact: Many if not most porn performers make their main income from escorting.

Find a way to make people less desperate, instead of throwing people in jail over an honest transaction.

It's mostly just remnants of nazarene morality. The lower tier prostitutions, hookers are suffering from this the most. Less so high-class escorting.

There's always a choice. The real reason is because it's better than the alternatives. Take it up with all the other employers who are supposedly so awful prostitution is the better option.

Escorting can roll in quite a buck in.

[Purpelia]

Now imagine that being your job and you have a quota to fill and no matter how undesirable you find your client, its that or you won't get paid.

You mean exactly like literally every other job ever? I am a highly paid software engineer. I don't get to pick and choose my projects. What the boss says needs doing is what gets done. And if I deeply despise what I am working on tough luck. It's do that or get fired. (For the record I actually love my job. But that's not the point right now.) And it's the same with every other profession out there. The office clerk does not get to choose who comes to him for paperwork. The judge does not choose who comes in for trial. And the doctor does not get to choose who comes in seeking treatment. They have to treat all clients as equal and do their best or else they lose their job. So why should prostitution be any different?

The one and only reason why you feel the way you do is because for some odd reason you treat sex as being somehow different from any other human interaction out there. Where it really is not.

And before you jump to say "oh, but it's the poor people who do prostitution. They'll starve unless they have sex for money." guess what? If I lose my job tomorrow I won't have any more money to buy bread than any unemployed prostitute would. Job = money. No job = no money. And your profession of choice does not change this.