NationStates

Posted: **Tue Jul 28, 2020 10:14 am**

Bienenhalde wrote:
Auristania wrote:JW and LDS reject Nicene Creed, they ain't Christians, so they ain't Prods.

I don't know whether Restorationists and Non-Demoninationalists reject Nicene Creed, but if they do, they ain't Prods neither.

What about denominations that say they only follow the Bible and not creeds but happen agree with everything in the Nicene Creed anyway?

Then they're still technically following it.

Posted: **Tue Jul 28, 2020 11:14 am**

Bienenhalde wrote:
Auristania wrote:JW and LDS reject Nicene Creed, they ain't Christians, so they ain't Prods.

I don't know whether Restorationists and Non-Demoninationalists reject Nicene Creed, but if they do, they ain't Prods neither.

What about denominations that say they only follow the Bible and not creeds but happen agree with everything in the Nicene Creed anyway?

That sounds like following the Nicene Creed but with extra steps.

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:30 am**

Lower Nubia wrote:
Bienenhalde wrote:
What about denominations that say they only follow the Bible and not creeds but happen agree with everything in the Nicene Creed anyway?

That sounds like following the Nicene Creed but with extra steps.

Like unilaterally adding a word stating that the Spirit proceeds from the Son as well as the Father?

We can't be having that, can we.

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:34 am**

Salus Maior wrote:
Kedri wrote:
He could possibly mean he's a part of the Restoration movement (churches of Christ, Disciples of Christ, etc.) The Restorationists often do not regard themselves as Protestants and probably could be considered non-denominational, although idk how many would accept or ready that label.

I mean...Restorationists are also Protestant.

?protestants split from the catholics.

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:37 am**

Is it a sin to lie to my grandmother with dimentia? We have to lie to her all the time for her own good. For example, when she goes to day care, we have to lie to her and tell she's going to work. Because of her domentia, she thinks she's going to work, and she won't go if we tell her otherwise. Is that a sin?

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:32 am**

Australian rePublic wrote:Is it a sin to lie to my grandmother with dimentia? We have to lie to her all the time for her own good. For example, when she goes to day care, we have to lie to her and tell she's going to work. Because of her domentia, she thinks she's going to work, and she won't go if we tell her otherwise. Is that a sin?

I think a priest would be much better-placed to answer that for you than NSG.

But for the unofficial record, my non-binding Orthodox opinion is that this is easily covered by the principle of economia. You may be deviating from the ordinary rules over lying, but surely this is covered by the need to display a loving spirit of Christian charity towards your grandmother. I can't imagine that any Orthodox priest would view what you are doing as wrong.

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:36 am**

The Archregimancy wrote:
Australian rePublic wrote:Is it a sin to lie to my grandmother with dimentia? We have to lie to her all the time for her own good. For example, when she goes to day care, we have to lie to her and tell she's going to work. Because of her domentia, she thinks she's going to work, and she won't go if we tell her otherwise. Is that a sin?

I think a priest would be much better-placed to answer that for you than NSG.

But for the unofficial record, my non-binding Orthodox opinion is that this is easily covered by the principle of economia. You may be deviating from the ordinary rules over lying, but surely this is covered by the need to display a loving spirit of Christian charity towards your grandmother. I can't imagine that any Orthodox priest would view what you are doing as wrong.

cheers

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:18 am**

The Archregimancy wrote:
Australian rePublic wrote:Is it a sin to lie to my grandmother with dimentia? We have to lie to her all the time for her own good. For example, when she goes to day care, we have to lie to her and tell she's going to work. Because of her domentia, she thinks she's going to work, and she won't go if we tell her otherwise. Is that a sin?

I think a priest would be much better-placed to answer that for you than NSG.

But for the unofficial record, my non-binding Orthodox opinion is that this is easily covered by the principle of economia. You may be deviating from the ordinary rules over lying, but surely this is covered by the need to display a loving spirit of Christian charity towards your grandmother. I can't imagine that any Orthodox priest would view what you are doing as wrong.

You could say his methods are a little...

Unorthodox

I'll see myself out now

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:50 am**

Australian rePublic wrote:Is it a sin to lie to my grandmother with dimentia? We have to lie to her all the time for her own good. For example, when she goes to day care, we have to lie to her and tell she's going to work. Because of her domentia, she thinks she's going to work, and she won't go if we tell her otherwise. Is that a sin?

As Arch said, a priest probably would be best to answer this question. However, personally, I have lived with grandparents who suffered with dementia and Alzheimer's for many years. It's a vicious, fickle beast, as I'm sure you probably know. I don't think it's a sin. Your intention is to give her care, which is already a corporeal work of mercy, caring for the sick and infirm. You have to live on her level, and so it would not be a sin. There's little you can do about these sorts of delusions or lapses without medicine, which really only slows the progress of the dementia. In your case, you're doing all you can to keep her comfortable. :hug:

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 8:02 am**

Trollzyn the Infinite wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
Are there any valid Christian theologies which discount the need of the sacraments which also can also be found in the duty, life and mission of the Church for the last 2,000 years? Not 500? No.

You're the only one who brought up sacraments, dude. I didn't say anything about them.

Churches are just buildings. Physical, material constructs of no real consequence. Temporary and finite. God needs no temples on Earth.

Salus Maior wrote:
Nubia isn't a Catholic.

And also neither of us are being that harsh with you. It's a fair criticism.

I didn't say it wasn't. I half-joking by making a Skyrim reference to dab on the Catholic gate-keeping that occurs so often in this thread. Just a little light-hearted, humor is all.

Tars and Nubia have already addressed the part about God not needing but still desiring temples, at least in part, but I'd like to add my own little bit.

God did command for His followers to create specific dwellings for Him. He asked for the Ark of the Covenant to be made for His dwelling place, and yes, He could not be entirely contained by it. Anyone who was deemed unworthy and who tried to enter the Temple to see it died immediately. Yet the point was that God still wished to be among His people, to let them know that no matter what, He is with them.

Sure, there are cases in which Masses or services can be said without a church. St. John Paul II, when he was a younger priest, would take his students on kayaking trips, and when he wanted to say Mass (in communist-run Poland this was not exactly safe to do in public), he would take his kayak, turn it into an altar, and he would say Mass with his students as the congregation, somewhere deep in the wilderness. The Sacraments are what made that Mass valid, rather than the saying of a Mass in a building.

So the requirement for buildings is twofold. In normal circumstances, God asks them of His followers, both in the Bible and in Tradition. Yet the buildings become useless if they are not blessed by God's presence, if He is not within them. There is the vision where Ezekiel saw the glory of God leaving the temple of Jerusalem. It's meant to be symbolic, in a sense, but at the same time it does make a literal point. What is a home without its creator, and what must one do if God asks for us to build houses for Him even if He does not necessarily need them?

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:08 am**

The Archregimancy wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
That sounds like following the Nicene Creed but with extra steps.

Like unilaterally adding a word stating that the Spirit proceeds from the Son as well as the Father?

We can't be having that, can we.

Oh damn, you got those Catholics good.

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:58 pm**

Lower Nubia wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:
Like unilaterally adding a word stating that the Spirit proceeds from the Son as well as the Father?

We can't be having that, can we.

Oh damn, you got those Catholics good.

Funnily enough this doesn't feel like a gotcha to me because in my Orthodox Catholic dialog group on another forum, this is all we've been talking about lately and we've had some very productive discussions.

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:59 pm**

Tarsonis wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
Oh damn, you got those Catholics good.

Funnily enough this doesn't feel like a gotcha to me because in my Orthodox Catholic dialog group on another forum, this is all we've been talking about lately and we've had some very productive discussions.

4th Council of Constantinople in 869 or 879?

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:04 pm**

Lower Nubia wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:

Funnily enough this doesn't feel like a gotcha to me because in my Orthodox Catholic dialog group on another forum, this is all we've been talking about lately and we've had some very productive discussions.

4th Council of Constantinople in 869 or 879?

eh were more debating the council of Florence

Posted: **Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:06 pm**

Tarsonis wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
4th Council of Constantinople in 869 or 879?

eh were more debating the council of Florence

Interesting, I know very little of the Council of Florence, other than it was utter Hypocrisy to call for unity while Catholicism was split so neatly, on the whole, couldn't "pick a pope" so to speak.

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 2:21 am**

Lower Nubia wrote:
Tarsonis wrote:
eh were more debating the council of Florence

Interesting, I know very little of the Council of Florence, other than it was utter Hypocrisy to call for unity while Catholicism was split so neatly, on the whole, couldn't "pick a pope" so to speak.

It was about the conflict between the Conciliar movement and the principle of papal supremacy, who or what is leading in the RCC.

The Council, or the Pope?

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:49 am**

Rosmana wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
Interesting, I know very little of the Council of Florence, other than it was utter Hypocrisy to call for unity while Catholicism was split so neatly, on the whole, couldn't "pick a pope" so to speak.

It was about the conflict between the Conciliar movement and the principle of papal supremacy, who or what is leading in the RCC.

The Council, or the Pope?

Well... The Council(s), or one of the Pope(s). Which I think was the enate hypocrisy.

"Join us! Let's be unified - wooo no more fighting"

must immediately pick sides in an ecclesiastical civil war

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:06 am**

Lower Nubia wrote:
Rosmana wrote:It was about the conflict between the Conciliar movement and the principle of papal supremacy, who or what is leading in the RCC.

The Council, or the Pope?

Well... The Council(s), or one of the Pope(s). Which I think was the enate hypocrisy.

"Join us! Let's be unified - wooo no more fighting"

must immediately pick sides in an ecclesiastical civil war

Agreed, it was a disaster.

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:22 am**

Remember that we are but clay in the Lord's hands, the word of the Lord.

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:49 am**

Sundiata wrote:Remember that we are but clay in the Lord's hands, the word of the Lord.

Yes yes, we are worms.

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:18 am**

Lower Nubia wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:
Like unilaterally adding a word stating that the Spirit proceeds from the Son as well as the Father?

We can't be having that, can we.

Oh damn, you got those Catholics good.

For the record, it was intended as a light-hearted joke, not as a 'gotcha'.

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:36 am**

The Archregimancy wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
Oh damn, you got those Catholics good.

For the record, it was intended as a light-hearted joke, not as a 'gotcha'.

We know your real intentions.

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:32 pm**

Lower Nubia wrote:
The Archregimancy wrote:
For the record, it was intended as a light-hearted joke, not as a 'gotcha'.

We know your real intentions.

The Orthodox Conspiracy™ persists

Posted: **Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:36 pm**

Tarsonis wrote:
Lower Nubia wrote:
We know your real intentions.

The Orthodox Conspiracy™ persists

Posted: **Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:47 pm**

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I23aEVCtzHs

For anyone seeking to do Adoration, but who is unable to attend a church, St. Benedict’s in Melbourne, Australia is offering Perpetual Adoration live from YouTube. Now you can worship Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament from your own home.

If you’ve never done Adoration before, it’s very relaxing and really opens the heart to God. Just sit in silence, or talk to God about your day, or even write your prayers in a journal. Just spend some time with Jesus.

If this link stops, I’ll happily find another Perpetual Adoration link. God bless!

NationStates

Christian Discussion Thread XI: Anicetus’ Revenge