Christian Discussion Thread XI: Anicetus’ Revenge

[Australian rePublic]

There's a theory out there that states that Judaism, up until Second Temple Period (the time of Jesus), would worship multiple gods. What do you guys, as Christians, make of that theory?

Israel was Henotheistic, which makes sense because the prevailing belief at the time (pre-exile) was that gods ruled over the land, upon entering Egypt, you would be under the Egyptian gods, Upon entering Canaan you would be under the Canaanite gods, upon entering Israel you would be under the God of Abraham.

And how does that align with our very blatantly strict monotheism, if God's chosen people themselves acknowledged the existence of various gods before Jesus?

[Lower Nubia]

Israel was Henotheistic, which makes sense because the prevailing belief at the time (pre-exile) was that gods ruled over the land, upon entering Egypt, you would be under the Egyptian gods, Upon entering Canaan you would be under the Canaanite gods, upon entering Israel you would be under the God of Abraham.

And how does that align with our very blatantly strict monotheism, if God's chosen people themselves acknowledged the existence of various gods before Jesus?

This belief was scrubbed out, just because it was a prevailing belief for a certain period of time for God's chosen people does not mean it has any bearing on the truth born out in Christ. No more than if for a period of time the Israelites believed in deism, or atheism, or acknowledged the Greek pantheon.

[Tarsonis]

Far as I’m aware:

Hebrews before the settling of the Holy Land
Israelites after the founding of the Kingdom of Israel
Israelites and Jews after the split into Israel and Judea
Just Jews after Israel fell.

Nope. Samaritans still exist. They're few and far between, and most live in Israel, but they still exist

Samaritans aren’t really Jewish proper though. They’re a separate group, hence not in the list.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

And you agree with this, do you?

Depends. Do I agree that the author had to walk back some of Paul’s statements because the idea of women and men being completely equal threatened the public order of the day and opened Christians up to oppressive attacks? Yes.

Do I agree that the priesthood was ordained for men and not women? Yes.

Do I agree it’s because a mythic character ate a mythic object? Not really no.

Well I guess that's fair.

[Australian rePublic]

And how does that align with our very blatantly strict monotheism, if God's chosen people themselves acknowledged the existence of various gods before Jesus?

This belief was scrubbed out, just because it was a prevailing belief for a certain period of time for God's chosen people does not mean it has any bearing on the truth born out in Christ. No more than if for a period of time the Israelites believed in deism, or atheism, or acknowledged the Greek pantheon.

But aren't theses mentioned in the Old Testament? (I don't know, I haven't heard of other gods being spoken about as being worshiped as opposed to shunned, but I've heard they're in there. Are you saying that what the Hebrews believed was wrong? If so, why would Moses and all the prophets after him allow such false beliefs (whether or not written in the Bible)?

[Lower Nubia]

This belief was scrubbed out, just because it was a prevailing belief for a certain period of time for God's chosen people does not mean it has any bearing on the truth born out in Christ. No more than if for a period of time the Israelites believed in deism, or atheism, or acknowledged the Greek pantheon.

But aren't theses mentioned in the Old Testament? (I don't know, I haven't heard of other gods being spoken about as being worshiped as opposed to shunned, but I've heard they're in there. Are you saying that what the Hebrews believed was wrong? If so, why would Moses and all the prophets after him allow such false beliefs (whether or not written in the Bible)?

Just because it's in the Old Testament doesn't mean it's endorsed by the Old Testament, David has Bathsheba's husband killed. Israelites believe in other god's beside the God of Abraham. Both are not endorsed as true or valid things to do.

[Eglaecia]

So, women actually are permitted to teach and have authority over a man? If so, what's wrong with ordaining women?

I'm not Catholic. Women can teach men, it's very obvious they can in Catholic and Reformed circles because they can be lecturers at Universities, teachers at Schools, they can be managers, lieutenants, etc without any issue.

We know they can teach the Gospel too from the New Testament account, as for one period of time the Church contained just one member: Mary Magdalene.

The reason women can't be ordained? They simply never have been.

Teach is a bad word. αὐθεντεῖν means to exercise authority. It isn't about "teaching" such as teaching in a class, it's about the priesthood.

[Diopolis]

So, I can already predict what a lot of people will probably say, but what are your thoughts on Christian identity? The ideology, not the state of being

One of the most lunatic heresies I’ve heard of.

[New Visayan Islands]

So, I can already predict what a lot of people will probably say, but what are your thoughts on Christian identity? The ideology, not the state of being

One of the most lunatic heresies I’ve heard of.

This. Full Stop. Beyond that, and I risk the Wrath of Mod.

[Salus Maior]

Nope. Samaritans still exist. They're few and far between, and most live in Israel, but they still exist

Samaritans aren’t really Jewish proper though. They’re a separate group, hence not in the list.

Well, then we get in the messiness of what constitutes Jewish identity though.

You could probably argue that Samaritans are ethnic Jews, just as secularists are ethnic Jews.

[Tarsonis]

Samaritans aren’t really Jewish proper though. They’re a separate group, hence not in the list.

Well, then we get in the messiness of what constitutes Jewish identity though.

You could probably argue that Samaritans are ethnic Jews, just as secularists are ethnic Jews.

Menassa is probably the better authority here. *blows conch shell*

[Hanafuridake]

[Salus Maior]

(Image)

Nice.

Charlemagne did nothing wrong.

[Lower Nubia]

I'm not Catholic. Women can teach men, it's very obvious they can in Catholic and Reformed circles because they can be lecturers at Universities, teachers at Schools, they can be managers, lieutenants, etc without any issue.

We know they can teach the Gospel too from the New Testament account, as for one period of time the Church contained just one member: Mary Magdalene.

The reason women can't be ordained? They simply never have been.

Teach is a bad word. αὐθεντεῖν means to exercise authority. It isn't about "teaching" such as teaching in a class, it's about the priesthood.

It's also a very rare word. It could mean both teach or have authority.

[Tarsonis]

Teach is a bad word. αὐθεντεῖν means to exercise authority. It isn't about "teaching" such as teaching in a class, it's about the priesthood.

It's also a very rare word. It could mean both teach or have authority.

διδάσκω means teach.
αὐθεντεῖν means to govern. It’s the root word of Authority.

[Lower Nubia]

It's also a very rare word. It could mean both teach or have authority.

διδάσκω means teach.
αὐθεντεῖν means to govern. It’s the root word of Authority.

Thank you for the correction.

In the context of the sentence, would the word "to teach" not be limited in scope by "exercise authority"?

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

So, I can already predict what a lot of people will probably say, but what are your thoughts on Christian identity? The ideology, not the state of being

One of the most lunatic heresies I’ve heard of.

That... actually seems like a fairly good point, and I didn't think it of that way. Claiming to follow a religion while ignoring its accepted theology is pretty much the definition of heresy, after all.

[Tarsonis]

διδάσκω means teach.
αὐθεντεῖν means to govern. It’s the root word of Authority.

Thank you for the correction.

In the context of the sentence, would the word "to teach" not be limited in scope by "exercise authority"?

We’re speculating a bit here, but it would seem that St. Paul sees the roles as intertwined, which would make sense given the pastoral concept the church is based off of. The shepherd controls the flock but also teaches the flock.

[Angleter]

There's a theory out there that states that Judaism, up until Second Temple Period (the time of Jesus), would worship multiple gods. What do you guys, as Christians, make of that theory?

The Old Testament is extremely upfront about the fact that the worship of false deities was a persistent problem in pre-exile Israel.

[Diopolis]

One of the most lunatic heresies I’ve heard of.

That... actually seems like a fairly good point, and I didn't think it of that way. Claiming to follow a religion while ignoring its accepted theology is pretty much the definition of heresy, after all.

I mean, whether you believe the Christians should accept evolution, should believe in creation, or something in between, their doctrine on creation is extremely heretical in an attempt to justify their views on race.
And that's before getting into their... views.

[Lower Nubia]

So I’m reading the ecumenical document between the Episcopal Church and the United Methodist Church, the report is very interesting concerning the alignment of practice between the two Churches. What are the Anglican/Methodist thoughts on the matter, especially for the acceptance of the historic episcopate for Methodists to commune with Anglicans?

[Salus Maior]

So I’m reading the ecumenical document between the Episcopal Church and the United Methodist Church, the report is very interesting concerning the alignment of practice between the two Churches. What are the Anglican/Methodist thoughts on the matter, especially for the acceptance of the historic episcopate for Methodists to commune with Anglicans?

Well, Methodists used to be Anglicans, and they're really not that different in the modern day, so why not?

[Joohan]

So, I can already predict what a lot of people will probably say, but what are your thoughts on Christian identity? The ideology, not the state of being

One of the most lunatic heresies I’ve heard of.

^this

Salvation is for all men

[Tarsonis]

One of the most lunatic heresies I’ve heard of.

^this

Salvation is for all men

And women

[Australian rePublic]

There's a theory out there that states that Judaism, up until Second Temple Period (the time of Jesus), would worship multiple gods. What do you guys, as Christians, make of that theory?

The Old Testament is extremely upfront about the fact that the worship of false deities was a persistent problem in pre-exile Israel.

Makes sense. Thanks