MAGAThread XVIII: The Authority Is Total

[San Montalbano]

which is why it shouldn't be trusted because it's not a legal process but a purley political one, there is no objective truth except for literal political positions people are taking.

They could all vote that Trump is a space alien and not need any real proof to impeach him for it, they just need a majority. They don't NEED any real proof.

this should trouble everyone that a president can intentionally be removed this way, guilty or innocent, republican or democrat etc etc

The problem with a “legal” solution is the fact many think you can’t file charges against a sitting president.

The impeachment process is fine. Only two presidents have been impeached. Clinton and Andrew Johnson. Only two have faced it. Nixon and Trump.

it's not a fine process beacuse it has no objective truth being used to imply guilt of anything. It is PURLEY political in nature.

Is it legal? Perhaps
Is it based in actually providing Justice? No, not all considering, once again, it's a POLITICAL HEARING, that's some shit you could see in the soviet union from the sounds of it.

I know it might make you happy since you don't like Trump, but this situation raises some SERIOUS questions about our system, namley that you can perform a De Facto coup with no evidence.

which is what this is, a political manuver used to oust the president.

[Greater Miami Shores]

which is why it shouldn't be trusted because it's not a legal process but a purley political one, there is no objective truth except for literal political positions people are taking.

They could all vote that Trump is a space alien and not need any real proof to impeach him for it, they just need a majority. They don't NEED any real proof.

this should trouble everyone that a president can intentionally be removed this way, guilty or innocent, republican or democrat etc etc

The problem with a “legal” solution is the fact many think you can’t file charges against a sitting president.

The impeachment process is fine. Only two presidents have been impeached. Clinton and Andrew Johnson. Only two have faced it. Nixon and Trump.

Again for the 11 billionth time I agree 100 % with San Montalbano as a fellow Republican or Trump supporter. See why we cant never agree with the Democrats and anti Trumpers on this issue?

[Empyia]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

[Nakena]

Here's the code if you need it:

Code: Select all

Yes, and he should be removed from office and prosecuted.
Yes, and he should be removed from office but not prosecuted.
Yes, and he should be impeached but not removed from office.
Neutral/Unsure/Meh
No, he shouldn't be impeached, let the 2020 Election decide his fate.
No, he shouldn't be impeached as his actions don't warrant impeachment.
No, he shouldn't be impeached as the impeachment inquiry is politically motivated.

Alternatively, you could use the same poll abcnews had on.

I am curious how many more vote either variant will get or if it will max out at some number.

Thanks. I made it so that people can change their votes.

You're welcome.

Everybody say it with me

P R E S I D E N T
P E N C E

Yeah it's all fun and games until he tries to pull some bullshit to repeal gay marriage.

Well, at least he'll be easier to impeach. Nobody likes him except Evangelicals.

I am telling that people since a while. Also Pence does, unlike Trump, know to run an US government administration smoothly.

And needless to say his policy record regarding LGBT+ matters is a rather shocking one.

[Greater Miami Shores]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

Again I agree 100 % with San Montalbano's posts and Empyia's post, we share the same views on Trump's impeachment by the Democrats reasons.

[San Montalbano]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

Again I agree 100 % with San Montalbano's posts and Empyia's post, we share the same views on Trump's impeachment by the Democrats reasons.

Your a nice person it seems, but please, I don't need you constantly saying you agree, we know.

[Kowani]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

This is an investigation. You don’t cross-examine anybody during the investigation of anything. The trial comes later.

Also, the Republican Party is allowed to sit in during hearings. They’re on the fucking committee.

[Tekania]

For the 10 billionth time. Impeachment is a political process. Saying ‘it’s being done for political reasons” is simple minded.

The impeachment inquiry only get’s more traction because trump is too stupid to work it. Attacking credible people only hurts his image and his cause. For example; a draft dodger has no right to impugn a solder who has been in combat and was awarded a purple heart.

which is why it shouldn't be trusted because it's not a legal process but a purley political one, there is no objective truth except for literal political positions people are taking.

They could all vote that Trump is a space alien and not need any real proof to impeach him for it, they just need a majority. They don't NEED any real proof.

this should trouble everyone that a president can intentionally be removed this way, guilty or innocent, republican or democrat etc etc

I'm not sure why this should be troubling. And it takes more than a simply majority... one needs a supermajority in the senate for a guilty verdict. The house proceeding only needs a simple majority... but that is just to decide to bring impeachment to trial in the senate and to set managers. Not a finding of guilt ( that is the Senate's job).

We have a president, not a king.

[San Montalbano]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

This is an investigation. You don’t cross-examine anybody during the investigation of anything. The trial comes later.

Also, the Republican Party is allowed to sit in during hearings. They’re on the fucking committee.

None of that matters because at the end of the day, this "hearing" is a political one, not a legal one, which means it requires no real debate of facts, it's quite literally a show because the "prosecution" as it were, dosn't really need evidence to proove anything. They could literally hold up a red ballon and say "Trump is evil and has to go cause this baloon is red" and that would still qualify as a reason for them to impeach.

What part of this is not terrifying to so called "lovers of freedom"?

[San Montalbano]

which is why it shouldn't be trusted because it's not a legal process but a purley political one, there is no objective truth except for literal political positions people are taking.

They could all vote that Trump is a space alien and not need any real proof to impeach him for it, they just need a majority. They don't NEED any real proof.

this should trouble everyone that a president can intentionally be removed this way, guilty or innocent, republican or democrat etc etc

I'm not sure why this should be troubling. And it takes more than a simply majority... one needs a supermajority in the senate for a guilty verdict. The house proceeding only needs a simple majority... but that is just to decide to bring impeachment to trial in the senate and to set managers. Not a finding of guilt ( that is the Senate's job).

We have a president, not a king.

Yeah, the senate will clear him sure, along party lines.

that's not the root of the problem here though, it's the political and not factual nature of the hearings that's the problem.

[Tekania]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

The house proceedings are not a trial. They are more akin to a Grand Jury if you want to draw a parallel to criminal proceedings. The trial is what happens in the senate if the house decides impeachment.

[San Montalbano]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

The house proceedings are not a trial. They are more akin to a Grand Jury if you want to draw a parallel to criminal proceedings. The trial is what happens in the senate if the house decides impeachment.

It dosn't matter, to get to a trial simply requires political party majority

again, this should worry so called "lovers of freedom"

[The Black Forrest]

This is an investigation. You don’t cross-examine anybody during the investigation of anything. The trial comes later.

Also, the Republican Party is allowed to sit in during hearings. They’re on the fucking committee.

None of that matters because at the end of the day, this "hearing" is a political one, not a legal one, which means it requires no real debate of facts, it's quite literally a show because the "prosecution" as it were, dosn't really need evidence to proove anything. They could literally hold up a red ballon and say "Trump is evil and has to go cause this baloon is red" and that would still qualify as a reason for them to impeach.

What part of this is not terrifying to so called "lovers of freedom"?

It doesn’t matter if it’s politically driven. What matters is the claims and the evidence presented. They can’t simply cry trump is a douche and remove him.

[Nakena]

nvm

[San Montalbano]

None of that matters because at the end of the day, this "hearing" is a political one, not a legal one, which means it requires no real debate of facts, it's quite literally a show because the "prosecution" as it were, dosn't really need evidence to proove anything. They could literally hold up a red ballon and say "Trump is evil and has to go cause this baloon is red" and that would still qualify as a reason for them to impeach.

What part of this is not terrifying to so called "lovers of freedom"?

It doesn’t matter if it’s politically driven. What matters is the claims and the evidence presented. They can’t simply cry trump is a douche and remove him.

Yes they actually can, they can just vote on party lines. If they all agreed he needed to be impeached no matter what they could just vote down party lines.

you can't talk about claims and evidence if your jury already has their minds made up before they even entered the building, so what are you talking about?

[The Black Forrest]

I'm not sure why this should be troubling. And it takes more than a simply majority... one needs a supermajority in the senate for a guilty verdict. The house proceeding only needs a simple majority... but that is just to decide to bring impeachment to trial in the senate and to set managers. Not a finding of guilt ( that is the Senate's job).

We have a president, not a king.

Yeah, the senate will clear him sure, along party lines.

that's not the root of the problem here though, it's the political and not factual nature of the hearings that's the problem.

Oh it’s expected. It could be shown Trump was as guilty as fuck and McConnell will block its advancement

[Kowani]

This is an investigation. You don’t cross-examine anybody during the investigation of anything. The trial comes later.

Also, the Republican Party is allowed to sit in during hearings. They’re on the fucking committee.

None of that matters because at the end of the day, this "hearing" is a political one, not a legal one, which means it requires no real debate of facts, it's quite literally a show because the "prosecution" as it were, dosn't really need evidence to proove anything. They could literally hold up a red ballon and say "Trump is evil and has to go cause this baloon is red" and that would still qualify as a reason for them to impeach.

What part of this is not terrifying to so called "lovers of freedom"?

Yeah, that’s plausible. It’s not like they need to convince Republicans, or, you know, voters, who would probably prefer it if impeachment was based on…you know, facts.

[The Black Forrest]

It doesn’t matter if it’s politically driven. What matters is the claims and the evidence presented. They can’t simply cry trump is a douche and remove him.

Yes they actually can, they can just vote on party lines. If they all agreed he needed to be impeached no matter what they could just vote down party lines.

you can't talk about claims and evidence if your jury already has their minds made up before they even entered the building, so what are you talking about?

*shrugs* Again the evidence. No deep state here.

[San Montalbano]

Yeah, the senate will clear him sure, along party lines.

that's not the root of the problem here though, it's the political and not factual nature of the hearings that's the problem.

Oh it’s expected. It could be shown Trump was as guilty as fuck and McConnell will block its advancement

how can it show him guilty as fuck if it's not a criminal trial?

that's like saying your a murderer and my band of freinds outnumber yours so your going to get charged, maybe not convicted, but purley because i have more people to send you to trial.

[Tekania]

I'm not sure why this should be troubling. And it takes more than a simply majority... one needs a supermajority in the senate for a guilty verdict. The house proceeding only needs a simple majority... but that is just to decide to bring impeachment to trial in the senate and to set managers. Not a finding of guilt ( that is the Senate's job).

We have a president, not a king.

Yeah, the senate will clear him sure, along party lines.

that's not the root of the problem here though, it's the political and not factual nature of the hearings that's the problem.

Well the phrase "high crimes and misdemeanors" as applied to the impeachment proceeding in fact encompasses the political. The phrase was used in a broad sense in English common law which forms the basis of our system here and as the phrase was used by the Founders. In fact it is ultimately the House itself which determines what constitutes a "high crime and misdemeanor" worthy of charging the president with before the Senate.

[San Montalbano]

Yes they actually can, they can just vote on party lines. If they all agreed he needed to be impeached no matter what they could just vote down party lines.

you can't talk about claims and evidence if your jury already has their minds made up before they even entered the building, so what are you talking about?

*shrugs* Again the evidence. No deep state here.

there dosn't need to be a deep state....they just need a majority who want him removed....that's literally ALL it takes to advance impeachment to the senate.

[Greater Miami Shores]

This "impeachment" is unconstitutional. The 5th and 14th amendments to the constitution guarantee due process. The democrats have violated this and by extension the constitution by failing to permit defence (Trump) from cross examining witnesses and being permitted to sit in during the "whistle blower" interviews.

The democrats never even voted to begin impeachment proceedings in the house.

This is an investigation. You don’t cross-examine anybody during the investigation of anything. The trial comes later.

Also, the Republican Party is allowed to sit in during hearings. They’re on the fucking committee.

So Democrat Adam Schiff gets to make all the comments he wants, scenarios he wants, to twist President Trumps words against him and calls Republicans not recognized when they want to ask certain questions and comments, he thinks the Republicans will ask that he does not like, granted other times he has allowed them to ask questions as we have all seen on the news and videos. I am following the investigation hearings on these sources alone for now, I have my private reasons.

Watch the Poltico leftist source video of Democrat Adam Schiff, see his angry face I think he makes, their is a bonus video of Ambassador or ex Ambassador Marie Yovanovitch, stating President Trump has not done any wrong or criminal to her knowledge:

Source Politico with a video:
Not Recognized (Democrat Adam) Schiff Clashes with Republicans:
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019 ... -activity/

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/11/1 ... id=impch_m
Watch Democrat Adam Schiff say to Republican xxxxxxxx the gentleman is not recognized. To the Republican Lady is not recognized.

I Rest My Points again.

[San Montalbano]

Yeah, the senate will clear him sure, along party lines.

that's not the root of the problem here though, it's the political and not factual nature of the hearings that's the problem.

Well the phrase "high crimes and misdemeanors" as applied to the impeachment proceeding in fact encompasses the political. The phrase was used in a broad sense in English common law which forms the basis of our system here and as the phrase was used by the Founders. In fact it is ultimately the House itself which determines what constitutes a "high crime and misdemeanor" worthy of charging the president with before the Senate.

EXACTLY MY POINT: The house decides if something is a crime, which is fucking ridiculous when you just need a majority to literally say whatever you want.

They could say "Trumps hitler reincarnated" and as long as the dem agree, it's a go.

[Tekania]

Yeah, the senate will clear him sure, along party lines.

that's not the root of the problem here though, it's the political and not factual nature of the hearings that's the problem.

Oh it’s expected. It could be shown Trump was as guilty as fuck and McConnell will block its advancement

Guilt is determined by the Senate, not the House.

how can it show him guilty as fuck if it's not a criminal trial?

that's like saying your a murderer and my band of freinds outnumber yours so your going to get charged, maybe not convicted, but purley because i have more people to send you to trial.

Trial determination at impeachment is guilty or not-guilty. Even though it's not a criminal trial the process borrows terms used in criminal proceedings.

[The Black Forrest]

*shrugs* Again the evidence. No deep state here.

there dosn't need to be a deep state....they just need a majority who want him removed....that's literally ALL it takes to advance impeachment to the senate.

Then why didn’t the republicans remove obama? It’s not that simple as you want to believe.

They can’t simply call Trump hitler and remove him.