Latin America General : Corona Carnaval

[Isles of Metanoia]

La Perla de Felipe should 'nt be alone now. More apostolic pearls of Revelation's New Jerusalem should also form like San Andres' or San Pavlo's, a transformation or reformation or creation of new nations should put this in effect.

And this current crisis in the middle east is opportunity too.

[Major-Tom]

Oh noes! Clearly, everyone knows that only true dictators would form an international committee to investigate election fraud! And, of course, only true dictators would seek to maintain their iron-fisted authoritarian rule via winning the majority of a vote in a free and fair election!

Please ignore the growing mountain of dead bodies being created in Bolivia by the new regime that went ahead and overthrew a democratically-elected government in a military coup, and let us continue to instead treat Morales as just as bad as the new regime instead.

It's only because the new regime will serve in American interests first and foremost, *cough*, erm, erm, because they respect democracy and uhhhhh the rule of law, or something.

[Novus America]

Oh noes! Clearly, everyone knows that only true dictators would form an international committee to investigate election fraud! And, of course, only true dictators would seek to maintain their iron-fisted authoritarian rule via winning the majority of a vote in a free and fair election!

Please ignore the growing mountain of dead bodies being created in Bolivia by the new regime that went ahead and overthrew a democratically-elected government in a military coup, and let us continue to instead treat Morales as just as bad as the new regime instead.

It's only because the new regime will serve in American interests first and foremost, *cough*, erm, erm, because they respect democracy and uhhhhh the rule of law, or something.

I mean TBH it does create a conundrum. The new government has used excessive police violence and lacks democratic legitimacy, but it has been a blow to dictators Putin and Xi.

Global politics is a dirty, nasty cutthroat game full of ironies.

Remember we allied with Stalin in WWII, made friends with Mao in the 70s.

Unfortunately sometimes you are put in a situation of a bad and ugly thing being beneficial on a bigger, longer scale.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

Fuck Bolsonaro, fuck Macri, fuck Colombia's Leader, fuck Ecuador's leader, fuck Chile's leader, impeach them all.

Why do you want to impeach Marquez and Moreno? The economic growth is unprecedented and poverty rates have fallen like crazy. Colombia-Venezuela border cities are starting to look like North and South Korea now

http://unperiodico.unal.edu.co/pages/de ... the-world/
Yeahh, no. And Moreno's austerity measures (Before they were repealed) have massively damaged his approval rating and will ultimately prove to be extremely detrimental to Ecuador's economy and human development, as we saw in Argentina, Bolivia, Greece, Iceland, Spain, Italy, Ireland, and Portugal.

[Greater Miami Shores]

Oh noes! Clearly, everyone knows that only true dictators would form an international committee to investigate election fraud! And, of course, only true dictators would seek to maintain their iron-fisted authoritarian rule via winning the majority of a vote in a free and fair election!

Please ignore the growing mountain of dead bodies being created in Bolivia by the new regime that went ahead and overthrew a democratically-elected government in a military coup, and let us continue to instead treat Morales as just as bad as the new regime instead.

A far right military dictatorship murdering people is no big deal compared to a leftist possibly having done something bad maybe.

"compared to a leftist possibly having done something bad maybe.' Maybe lol, good one Ifreann. But seriously these your views points and I just strongly disagree.

[Blueflarst]

Morales was an antispanish president criminalizing our presence in America in the past and the real history.
I am glad he has been deposed. He did not won in an honest election

[Isles of Metanoia]

We Filipinos owe a debt of gratitude to the Marquez family of Colombia.

Because the first Miss International Stella Marquez married a Filipino by the name of George Leon Araneta.

I great honor for.us.

Help me discern. My duties are conflicting in the contrary I desire the greatest good but I don't want to.be an ingrate too.

Colombia has given us a priceless treasure but we have other responsibilities too.

[Torrocca]

It's only because the new regime will serve in American interests first and foremost, *cough*, erm, erm, because they respect democracy and uhhhhh the rule of law, or something.

I mean TBH it does create a conundrum. The new government has used excessive police violence and lacks democratic legitimacy, but it has been a blow to dictators Putin and Xi.

Global politics is a dirty, nasty cutthroat game full of ironies.

Remember we allied with Stalin in WWII, made friends with Mao in the 70s.

Unfortunately sometimes you are put in a situation of a bad and ugly thing being beneficial on a bigger, longer scale.

I see you've decided to shift your argument away from, "lol but Morales is bad too," to, "acscktually the military regime in Bolivia is doing a good thing by slaughtering droves of innocent people." Amazing.

[Ifreann]

I mean TBH it does create a conundrum. The new government has used excessive police violence and lacks democratic legitimacy, but it has been a blow to dictators Putin and Xi.

Global politics is a dirty, nasty cutthroat game full of ironies.

Remember we allied with Stalin in WWII, made friends with Mao in the 70s.

Unfortunately sometimes you are put in a situation of a bad and ugly thing being beneficial on a bigger, longer scale.

I see you've decided to shift your argument away from, "lol but Morales is bad too," to, "acscktually the military regime in Bolivia is doing a good thing by slaughtering droves of innocent people." Amazing.

Maintaining the neoliberal capitalist world order doesn't come free, you know.

[Torrocca]

I see you've decided to shift your argument away from, "lol but Morales is bad too," to, "acscktually the military regime in Bolivia is doing a good thing by slaughtering droves of innocent people." Amazing.

Maintaining the neoliberal capitalist world order doesn't come free, you know.

Of course. The lengths at which people will go to justify such things never cease to amaze, though.

[Ifreann]

Maintaining the neoliberal capitalist world order doesn't come free, you know.

Of course. The lengths at which people will go to justify such things never cease to amaze, though.

What are the lives of a few foreigners compared to the stock price of Tesla?

[Isles of Metanoia]

Of course. The lengths at which people will go to justify such things never cease to amaze, though.

What are the lives of a few foreigners compared to the stock price of Tesla?

Teleologically speaking, conscious human beings are of different and might I say higher value to some things.

[Torrocca]

Of course. The lengths at which people will go to justify such things never cease to amaze, though.

What are the lives of a few foreigners compared to the stock price of Tesla?

Nothing, obviously. Gotta crack a few dozen brown people's skulls to make sure that the lithium in Bolivia stays nice and cheap for 'Murica's benefit, after all. /s

[Vassenor]

Morales was an antispanish president criminalizing our presence in America in the past and the real history.
I am glad he has been deposed. He did not won in an honest election

What?

[Novus America]

I mean TBH it does create a conundrum. The new government has used excessive police violence and lacks democratic legitimacy, but it has been a blow to dictators Putin and Xi.

Global politics is a dirty, nasty cutthroat game full of ironies.

Remember we allied with Stalin in WWII, made friends with Mao in the 70s.

Unfortunately sometimes you are put in a situation of a bad and ugly thing being beneficial on a bigger, longer scale.

I see you've decided to shift your argument away from, "lol but Morales is bad too," to, "acscktually the military regime in Bolivia is doing a good thing by slaughtering droves of innocent people." Amazing.

Umm clearly you did not read. Do you think our allying with Stalin was saying the Katyn massacre was good? Just because one person does one good thing does not mean they are good, or their other actions are good. Or that that good action offsets or is greater their bad actions.

And unfortunately if you try to be 100% good and only side with the 100% good in global politics you will completely and utterly fail.

I never said the police violence in Bolivia was good, on the contrary I made it quite clear I think it completely wrong.

You yourself have said us fighting the Nazis with Stalin was good, but you still think Stalin was bad and did bad things right? So you agree with the principal I am stating, even if we might apply it differently in other cases.
You agree Stalin benefited us at one point in time on one thing, despite being bad and doing bad things.

[Mbaracaya]

Fourth term as president? First terms promising to govern in favour of Bolivia's indigenous people, who had suffered centuries of discrimination. However, Once in power, he threw his weight behind a new constitution and giving his back to his own people.
The best thing he could do for his country is "resign"

Due the massive influx of South America related topics over the past days and weeks I have blatantly and hilariously decided to create SAG - South America General.

Thus i am continueing the awful and terrible tradition of megathreads, altough I do not expect this one to survive beyond a few weeks. You may prove me wrong however. Since thread ownership isn't a thing on NSG this is just me getting the ball rolling.

It covers all South American related topics. Central america and Caribbbean can be optionally added. You can discuss here the lastest developments in such different countries such as Argentina, Chile, Bolivia or Brazil.

The Hot Topics of the days are the political crisis in Bolivia and Brazil. In Bolivia long-time President Evo Morales has resigned upon threats of a coups against his government and in Brazil President Bolsonaro is confronted with severe allegations regarding the murder of Marielle Franco in 2018.

Morales sauce: https://www.dw.com/en/bolivia-morales-w ... a-51180165

Bolsonaro Sauce: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... r-suspects

[Isles of Metanoia]

What are the lives of a few foreigners compared to the stock price of Tesla?

Nothing, obviously. Gotta crack a few dozen brown people's skulls to make sure that the lithium in Bolivia stays nice and cheap for 'Murica's benefit, after all. /s

Poor Brown people. Aren't they already survivors of disease that nearly wiped them out but spare whites?

[Novus America]

I see you've decided to shift your argument away from, "lol but Morales is bad too," to, "acscktually the military regime in Bolivia is doing a good thing by slaughtering droves of innocent people." Amazing.

Maintaining the neoliberal capitalist world order doesn't come free, you know.

Nothing comes free. Although I am absolutely not a neoliberal.

The point is simply that sometimes bad people doing bad things may also do something good or beneficial. That does not make them good, or the bad thing not bad.

The world is not black and white. It is very dark gray.

[LiberNovusAmericae]

It is very dark gray.

That is unfortunate, but very true.

[Ifreann]

It is very dark gray.

That is unfortunate, but very true.

But please gentlemen, tell us more about how the wanton killing of innocent people by their own government can actually be good in a way.

[Isles of Metanoia]

In Augustinian spirituality, he said the God permits evil or temptation or tests to occur so that people who freely choose to love him despite of evil earn merit that otherwise would not have arisen if they were not exposed to evil, that does not make evil good at all at least only that the good that arose or while purified by being tested by evil is more precious than original innocence. However, original innocence lost, cannot be retaken and there's also the chance that in the process of testing or temptation, some people fall to genuine evil and they are lost, it's a matter of the reverse engineered evil or good arising from interacting with the evil cooperating with the originally innocent part to make sure that the struggle against evil continues but this is just my own understanding.

[Novus America]

That is unfortunate, but very true.

But please gentlemen, tell us more about how the wanton killing of innocent people by their own government can actually be good in a way.

Okay, that point went over your head like an SR-71.

Straw man. Nobody said it was good.
Again does saying Stalin benefited our side in WWII say the Katyn massacre was good?
Of course not.

But you seem to have missed the point completely. We said the world is very dark gray and you jumped in screaming it was black and white. That if someone does one thing good that means we must think they are good and everything they do is good.

[Ifreann]

But please gentlemen, tell us more about how the wanton killing of innocent people by their own government can actually be good in a way.

Okay, that point went over your head like an SR-71.

Straw man. Nobody said it was good.
Again does saying Stalin benefited our side in WWI say the Katyn massacre was good?
Of course not.

But you seem to have missed the point completely. We said the world is very dark gray and you jumped in screaming it was black and white. That if someone does one thing good that means we must think they are good and everything they do is good.

When you say that things are not black and white, but shades of grey, what that means is that things are neither solely good nor solely bad, but are in fact both good and bad. You mix black(bad) and white(good) to get grey. So you absolutely are saying that these killings are good. You must be saying that, since you are saying that they are both good and bad, and a thing cannot be both good and bad without being good.

If this is not what you meant then you are expressing yourself very badly, and I would suggest that you drop these metaphors of black and white and just speak plainly.

[Kubra]

It's only because the new regime will serve in American interests first and foremost, *cough*, erm, erm, because they respect democracy and uhhhhh the rule of law, or something.

I mean TBH it does create a conundrum. The new government has used excessive police violence and lacks democratic legitimacy, but it has been a blow to dictators Putin and Xi.

Global politics is a dirty, nasty cutthroat game full of ironies.

Remember we allied with Stalin in WWII, made friends with Mao in the 70s.

Unfortunately sometimes you are put in a situation of a bad and ugly thing being beneficial on a bigger, longer scale.

how on earth is this "beneficial on a bigger, longer scale"?

[Northern Davincia]

Oh noes! Clearly, everyone knows that only true dictators would form an international committee to investigate election fraud! And, of course, only true dictators would seek to maintain their iron-fisted authoritarian rule via winning the majority of a vote in a free and fair election!

Please ignore the growing mountain of dead bodies being created in Bolivia by the new regime that went ahead and overthrew a democratically-elected government in a military coup, and let us continue to instead treat Morales as just as bad as the new regime instead.

A far right military dictatorship murdering people is no big deal compared to a leftist possibly having done something bad maybe.

Assuming Morales was actually rigging the election and removing limitations to his own power, that would make him a dictator.

Oh noes! Clearly, everyone knows that only true dictators would form an international committee to investigate election fraud! And, of course, only true dictators would seek to maintain their iron-fisted authoritarian rule via winning the majority of a vote in a free and fair election!

Please ignore the growing mountain of dead bodies being created in Bolivia by the new regime that went ahead and overthrew a democratically-elected government in a military coup, and let us continue to instead treat Morales as just as bad as the new regime instead.

It's only because the new regime will serve in American interests first and foremost, *cough*, erm, erm, because they respect democracy and uhhhhh the rule of law, or something.

American puppet regimes are always an upside.