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UK Politics Thread XI: Boris' Big Bombastic Brexit Bash

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Who do you support to become the next Labour Party Leader?

Clive Lewis (DROPPED OUT)
2
2%
Keir Starmer (Shadow Brexit Secretary, MP for Holborn and St Pancras)
48
41%
Lisa Nandy (MP for Wigan)
11
9%
Jess Phillips (DROPPED OUT)
17
15%
Emily Thornberry (Shadow First Secretary of State, MP for Islington South and Finsbury)
7
6%
Yvette Cooper (DROPPED OUT)
1
1%
Dan Jarvis (DROPPED OUT)
1
1%
Ian Lavery (DROPPED OUT)
1
1%
Rebecca Long Bailey (Shadow Business Secretary, MP for Salford and Eccles)
17
15%
Other (Please state who in a reply)
11
9%
 
Total votes : 116

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SD_Film Artists
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Postby SD_Film Artists » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:15 am

Hirota wrote:
SD_Film Artists wrote:I wonder if Labour will join the Lib Dems in an anti-Brexit alliance. It worked in a recent by-election so Corbyn should consider it if he's serious about stopping a Tory Brexit.
He might as well hand in his Bennite members card then.

This is the problem Corbs has - he's a Bennite Eurosceptic who is only in power because of the firmly pro-EU momentum. The two are diametrically opposed.


True, but I'd still expect momentum to be against an alliance out of pure tribalism, along with the oldschool Wherekin Men's Club types who might not even know who the Lib Dems are.
Last edited by SD_Film Artists on Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:22 am

Definitely Not Trumptonium wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Gerrymandering refers to the manipulation of boundaries of an electoral constituency


Potato potato, still the same thing.

Ifreann wrote:
The same way citizens are able to. You allow them. UK election law allows citizens of specified countries to vote in your elections. The Brexit referendum wasn't limited to British citizens either.


Doesn't alter my point at all, Labour is trying to expand their vote in their advantage, but probably to the detriment of their northern pro-leave voters who see their attempts to "make foreigners vote" as an abomination and a clear break of Labour's brexit & migration promises, so even more likely to vote bxp/tory than before.

I dunno, are you sure that the northern Labour voter hates foreigners?

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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:22 am

Richard Braine has resigned as leader of UKIP following his suspension for allegedly stealing data from party members. UKIP has had five leaders since Nigel Farage stepped down in 2016, six if you include Nigel Farage's term as interim leader.
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:24 am

Philjia wrote:Richard Braine has resigned as leader of UKIP following his suspension for allegedly stealing data from party members. UKIP has had five leaders since Nigel Farage stepped down in 2016, six if you include Nigel Farage's term as interim leader.

UKIP's slide continues unabated. :lol2:
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

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White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
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The Huskar Social Union
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Postby The Huskar Social Union » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:24 am

Philjia wrote:Richard Braine has resigned as leader of UKIP following his suspension for allegedly stealing data from party members. UKIP has had five leaders since Nigel Farage stepped down in 2016, six if you include Nigel Farage's term as interim leader.

Should just disband the party at this rate, their dad aint coming back.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:25 am

The Huskar Social Union wrote:
Philjia wrote:Richard Braine has resigned as leader of UKIP following his suspension for allegedly stealing data from party members. UKIP has had five leaders since Nigel Farage stepped down in 2016, six if you include Nigel Farage's term as interim leader.

Should just disband the party at this rate, their dad aint coming back.

Apparently he's in DC for a Trump fundraiser.

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Philjia
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Postby Philjia » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:26 am

The Huskar Social Union wrote:
Philjia wrote:Richard Braine has resigned as leader of UKIP following his suspension for allegedly stealing data from party members. UKIP has had five leaders since Nigel Farage stepped down in 2016, six if you include Nigel Farage's term as interim leader.

Should just disband the party at this rate, their dad aint coming back.

They no longer exist as a meaningful force in politics, it was pretty obvious they were over after the 2017 election.
JG Ballard wrote:I want to rub the human race in its own vomit, and force it to look in the mirror.

⚧ Trans rights. ⚧
Pragmatic ethical utopian socialist, IE I'm for whatever kind of socialism is the most moral and practical. Pro LGBT rights and gay marriage, pro gay adoption, generally internationalist, ambivalent on the EU, atheist, pro free speech and expression, pro legalisation of prostitution and soft drugs, and pro choice. Anti authoritarian, anti Marxist. White cishet male.

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:28 am

Ifreann wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Should just disband the party at this rate, their dad aint coming back.

Apparently he's in DC for a Trump fundraiser.

His Twitter feed doesn't make mention of it, but the last tweet was 18 hours ago, so that'd make sense.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:29 am

Philjia wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Should just disband the party at this rate, their dad aint coming back.

They no longer exist as a meaningful force in politics, it was pretty obvious they were over after the 2017 election.

I mean, I know some parties have come back from the brink in the past, but I don't think that'll happen this time.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:47 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Apparently he's in DC for a Trump fundraiser.

His Twitter feed doesn't make mention of it, but the last tweet was 18 hours ago, so that'd make sense.

I can't imagine he'd want to advertise that he's out of the country backing a foreign leader when a general election is afoot, but I have seen it said that he was spotted in a DC bar near where the Trump fundraiser was being held.

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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:50 am

Ifreann wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:His Twitter feed doesn't make mention of it, but the last tweet was 18 hours ago, so that'd make sense.

I can't imagine he'd want to advertise that he's out of the country backing a foreign leader when a general election is afoot, but I have seen it said that he was spotted in a DC bar near where the Trump fundraiser was being held.

Makes sense, if in doubt look in the bars to find Farage.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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Salandriagado
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Postby Salandriagado » Wed Oct 30, 2019 8:33 am

Definitely Not Trumptonium wrote:
The Huskar Social Union wrote:Gerrymandering refers to the manipulation of boundaries of an electoral constituency


Potato potato, still the same thing.

Ifreann wrote:
The same way citizens are able to. You allow them. UK election law allows citizens of specified countries to vote in your elections. The Brexit referendum wasn't limited to British citizens either.


Doesn't alter my point at all, Labour is trying to expand their vote in their advantage, but probably to the detriment of their northern pro-leave voters who see their attempts to "make foreigners vote" as an abomination and a clear break of Labour's brexit & migration promises, so even more likely to vote bxp/tory than before.


Sure, and giving women the vote was also done for explicitly party-political reasons. That doesn't make it, in any way, a bad thing.
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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Wed Oct 30, 2019 8:47 am

Yes but that gets in the way of the #notracistbut.
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Dumb Ideologies
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Postby Dumb Ideologies » Wed Oct 30, 2019 8:55 am

Vassenor wrote:Yes but that gets in the way of the #notracistbut.


imagine thinking this sort of cringey debate-averse slur-slinging is remotely helpful to your side of the argument
Last edited by Dumb Ideologies on Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:01 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Dooom35796821595
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Postby Dooom35796821595 » Wed Oct 30, 2019 8:57 am

Vassenor wrote:Yes but that gets in the way of the #notracistbut.



https://www.gov.uk/elections-in-the-uk

General Election

General Elections (elections to the UK Parliament) usually take place every 5 years.

To vote in a General Election you must:

be registered to vote
be 18 or over on the day of the election (‘polling day’)
be a British, Irish or qualifying Commonwealth citizen
be resident at an address in the UK (or a British citizen living abroad who has been registered to vote in the UK in the last 15 years)
not be legally excluded from voting



Because anyone who disagrees with you is racist, right?
Or did Europe suddenly become part of the commonwealth?
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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:03 am

>Britain Deserves Better


...way to score an own goal, Conservative marketing.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:03 am

Dooom35796821595 wrote:
Vassenor wrote:Yes but that gets in the way of the #notracistbut.



https://www.gov.uk/elections-in-the-uk

General Election

General Elections (elections to the UK Parliament) usually take place every 5 years.

To vote in a General Election you must:

be registered to vote
be 18 or over on the day of the election (‘polling day’)
be a British, Irish or qualifying Commonwealth citizen
be resident at an address in the UK (or a British citizen living abroad who has been registered to vote in the UK in the last 15 years)
not be legally excluded from voting



Because anyone who disagrees with you is racist, right?
Or did Europe suddenly become part of the commonwealth?

I have no idea what point you're trying to make by posting the rules of who can vote.

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Cerinda
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Postby Cerinda » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:17 am

Not like anyone cares

Honestly UKIP should just dissolve and join with the Brexit party, they've literally become nothing at this point.

EDIT: Didn't see it was already posted, damnit.
Last edited by Cerinda on Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Vassenor » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:20 am

Dooom35796821595 wrote:
Vassenor wrote:Yes but that gets in the way of the #notracistbut.



https://www.gov.uk/elections-in-the-uk

General Election

General Elections (elections to the UK Parliament) usually take place every 5 years.

To vote in a General Election you must:

be registered to vote
be 18 or over on the day of the election (‘polling day’)
be a British, Irish or qualifying Commonwealth citizen
be resident at an address in the UK (or a British citizen living abroad who has been registered to vote in the UK in the last 15 years)
not be legally excluded from voting



Because anyone who disagrees with you is racist, right?
Or did Europe suddenly become part of the commonwealth?


So what does that have to do with people demanding that the franchise not be extended (to match that used in Local elections already, natch) because then the foreigns will vote?
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Vassenor
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Postby Vassenor » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:31 am

So now even the Scottish Unionist papers are admitting that Independence is likely.

As well as predicting that the SNP will sweep all the Scottish seats.
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Definitely Not Trumptonium
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Postby Definitely Not Trumptonium » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:53 am

Ifreann wrote:
Definitely Not Trumptonium wrote:
Potato potato, still the same thing.



Doesn't alter my point at all, Labour is trying to expand their vote in their advantage, but probably to the detriment of their northern pro-leave voters who see their attempts to "make foreigners vote" as an abomination and a clear break of Labour's brexit & migration promises, so even more likely to vote bxp/tory than before.

I dunno, are you sure that the northern Labour voter hates foreigners?


A northern pro-leave Labour voter would probably see Labour promises on migration and Brexit as totally empty and foregone given their actions in trying to amend the bill to allow non-citizens and children to vote. So to answer your point in a tangent, yes.

Salandriagado wrote:
Definitely Not Trumptonium wrote:
Potato potato, still the same thing.



Doesn't alter my point at all, Labour is trying to expand their vote in their advantage, but probably to the detriment of their northern pro-leave voters who see their attempts to "make foreigners vote" as an abomination and a clear break of Labour's brexit & migration promises, so even more likely to vote bxp/tory than before.


Sure, and giving women the vote was also done for explicitly party-political reasons. That doesn't make it, in any way, a bad thing.


I didn't ask for your opinion, nor did I state mine. I'm simply saying, northern pro-leave Labour voters have just watched another Labour own-goal.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:57 am

Definitely Not Trumptonium wrote:
Ifreann wrote:I dunno, are you sure that the northern Labour voter hates foreigners?


A northern pro-leave Labour voter would probably see Labour promises on migration and Brexit as totally empty and foregone given their actions in trying to amend the bill to allow non-citizens and children to vote. So to answer your point in a tangent, yes.

Why? What promises did Labour make that could be consider broken by allowing EU nationals and people aged 16 or 17 to vote?

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Definitely Not Trumptonium
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Postby Definitely Not Trumptonium » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:07 am

Ifreann wrote:
Definitely Not Trumptonium wrote:
A northern pro-leave Labour voter would probably see Labour promises on migration and Brexit as totally empty and foregone given their actions in trying to amend the bill to allow non-citizens and children to vote. So to answer your point in a tangent, yes.

Why? What promises did Labour make that could be consider broken by allowing EU nationals and people aged 16 or 17 to vote?


Plenty -- i.e. prohibiting migrants from seeking access to the benefits system (until 5 years of residence? I forgot), ending freedom of movement including refusing it in a Brexit deal, work with trade unions to end illegal immigration. Promises made since the 2017 manifesto include things like Abbott saying they will only allow migrants into the country if the have applied and been accepted for a job before migrating, excluding family reunions and refugees.

These promises which are in effect "let's decrease immigration" will be pretty empty to anyone who cares about them, having seen the actions Labour have taken.

It is tantamount to promising to end inequality and raise wages for the poorest in a manifesto then sneaking in tax cuts for the 1% on a Tuesday night when no one's watching. In itself the action is not contradictory to the statements and promises, but the intent to break them is pretty obvious for anyone who isn't gullible.
Last edited by Definitely Not Trumptonium on Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Dooom35796821595
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Founded: Sep 11, 2011
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Dooom35796821595 » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:15 am

Vassenor wrote:
Dooom35796821595 wrote:

https://www.gov.uk/elections-in-the-uk

General Election

General Elections (elections to the UK Parliament) usually take place every 5 years.

To vote in a General Election you must:

be registered to vote
be 18 or over on the day of the election (‘polling day’)
be a British, Irish or qualifying Commonwealth citizen
be resident at an address in the UK (or a British citizen living abroad who has been registered to vote in the UK in the last 15 years)
not be legally excluded from voting



Because anyone who disagrees with you is racist, right?
Or did Europe suddenly become part of the commonwealth?


So what does that have to do with people demanding that the franchise not be extended (to match that used in Local elections already, natch) because then the foreigns will vote?


Because they’re only considering it because they think they’ll vote for them. Short term thinking instead of a general principle that these people should be allowed to vote.
And it’s not people demanding the franchise not be extended, it’s the SNP/Lib Dems wanting more people to vote for them so they can promptly ignore what people want and do what they want.
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Postby Greed and Death » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:15 am

Vassenor wrote:So now even the Scottish Unionist papers are admitting that Independence is likely.

As well as predicting that the SNP will sweep all the Scottish seats.


Someone tell the Scots the EU wont admit them for many years. The French and Spanish will block them out of fear of encouraging their own separatist movements.
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