Turkish military offensive in Syria/Rojava

[Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum]

The Glorious Turkish Army Is Combating Terrorism.

[Khataiy]

And that puzzles me. Assad is a dictator like Erdogan, how can he possibly allow another State to enter so batlanty and violate its sovereignty? Jeez, Turkey is literally invading you, US doesn't care and you don't raise a single word against it?

Supposedly Erdogan just wants to conquer a "strip" in northern Syria as buffer zone but chances are he will go for all the cake and grab the wholesome of it down to the Euphrates.

He won't advance beyond the zone, the war and its history have shown this, when Afrin was taken he didn't advance into Tel Rifaat or Menagh, and during Euphrates Shield little to no efforts were made to take Manbij. There are also rumours Assad and the IRGC are preparing to enter Raqqa and more parts of Deir ez-Zor, and Erdogan wouldn't stop that either. Erdogan's foot in Syria is limited by America and Russia.

[Kaystein]

So it begins..

[Lost Memories]

The Kurds need their own nation.
Shame though that any externally enforced solution is going to create only more problems and tensions, we don't need a second Israel in that zone.
Which doesn't spell good for the Kurds, as it'll be hard for them to stand ground against bigger and more powerful nations, like Turkey.

Hope the Kurds will resist long enough to get their national status recognized.

[Khataiy]

The Kurds need their own nation.
Shame though that any externally enforced solution is going to create only more problems and tensions, we don't need a second Israel in that zone.
Which doesn't spell good for the Kurds, as it'll be hard for them to stand ground against bigger and more powerful nations, like Turkey.

Hope the Kurds will resist long enough to get their national status recognized.

Rojava isn't a sepratist movement they have made it very clear they have no intention of seperating from Syria.

[Gagium]

Meh. Could care less. Just glad American troops are coming home.

We are on the wrong side of the conflict

The point of withdrawing is so that we aren't in the conflict

[Duhon]

looks like every facet of american society is now specialized on selling out some facet of democracy -- concept and people alike -- upriver for a favor from some authoritarian or other

american government? look guys, we really need the goods on biden believe me! and while you're at it, why not every other democrat too?

american corporations? look guys, we really need the goods on the yuan or some shit believe me! keep those privileged eyeballs rolling towards us!

american people? look guys, we're just being inconsistent about this, but hey, at least you're not migrating here! have fun getting genocided! oh and fuck all y'all, believe us!

[The Huskar Social Union]

Kurds get fucked over once again and im sure we will be hearing all about a bunch of war crimes in the next few months with the Turks fucking slaughtering them.

[New Bremerton]

What an idiot move by Trump to order troops to just up and leave the de facto independent Kurdish Rojava state without warning to the mercy of the Turks, ISIS and Assad's forces. This coming from a president who also nearly betrayed the people of Afghanistan to the savage and medieval whims of the Taliban. Given his boorishness and propensity to lie, I prefer to judge him by his actions, not his words, and this was a really dumb thing to do, and is nothing short of a betrayal. Now Turkey seeks to flood northern Rojava with Arab refugees in order to undermine the Syrian Kurds' right to self-determination and completely destroy whatever semblance of a Kurdish state has managed to come into being. This is nothing less than ethnic cleansing, and I fear a genocide may follow shortly. The Kurds deserve better than this. They have already begun their reconquest of territory lost by the Ottoman Empire at the end of WWI.

America should be arming the Syrian Kurdish Rojava state, not feeding it to the wolves, just as Russia has been arming the Assad regime and backing it with airstrikes. The Kurdish people will be even worse off than they were prior to 2011. I stand with the Kurds for the exact same reason I stand with Israel, Tibet, East Turkestan, Catalonia, Taiwan and Hong Kong. This is about self-determination for an embattled ethnic minority in their indigenous homeland. America's betrayal will not be forgotten.

At least Tulsi Gabbard's not that irresponsible. She is a close friend and ally of the Kurdish people, and she recognizes that defending a Kurdish state and defeating ISIS =/= overthrowing Assad and encouraging regime change wars. America should be encouraging a ceasefire along the Euphrates River between Assad and the YPG in a deal brokered between Russia and the United States, the real players behind the chessboard, and both countries can then proceed to apply pressure on Turkey to withdraw its forces from Syria to the benefit of both the Assad regime and the Kurds.

This move has done more to dent my opinion of Donald Trump than his numerous tweets about The Squad and the countless accusations leveled against him by the Democrats and the MSM. All of that domestic controversy pales in comparison to the countless lives that would be lost as a direct consequence of his betrayal. I'm actually genuinely disgusted with him. And if he can betray the Kurds, he can betray Hong Kong, all at the drop of a hat.

As for the racist, Islamofascist, genocidal state of Turkey, they should be expelled from NATO (which in turn should serve to further placate Russia, as Turkey is sandwiched between Syria to the south and Ukraine and Russian-occupied Crimea across the Black Sea to the north), diplomatic ties should be severed and economic sanctions should be imposed. Together with Iran and Saudi Arabia, they should be isolated and contained. To achieve this objective, detente with Russia needs to happen first. Turkey can be stopped if the United States and Russia are prepared to work together. While Russia is similarly bombing civilians in HTS (Hayat Tahrir al-Sham)-controlled Idlib province, we can still prevent Turkey from doing likewise in northern Syria and snuffing out the last remaining bastion of freedom and democracy in the form of the Kurdish Rojava state. A limited, token U.S. military presence in Rojava should be sufficient to deter Turkish aggression.

[Duhon]

Kurds get fucked over once again and im sure we will be hearing all about a bunch of war crimes in the next few months with the Turks fucking slaughtering them.

"Everything's got a price... for the Million-Dollar Men. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA --"

[Agarntrop]

Syria getting divided between two dictators, Assad and Erdo, as I predicted

[Dogmeat]

Anyone else getting 70's flashbacks? What with an impeachable president dooming an ally with a withdrawal?

I think this means Jimmy Carter might be our next president...

[Lost Memories]

The Kurds need their own nation.
Shame though that any externally enforced solution is going to create only more problems and tensions, we don't need a second Israel in that zone.
Which doesn't spell good for the Kurds, as it'll be hard for them to stand ground against bigger and more powerful nations, like Turkey.

Hope the Kurds will resist long enough to get their national status recognized.

Rojava isn't a sepratist movement they have made it very clear they have no intention of seperating from Syria.

Doesn't Rojava wish for all of Syria to eventually become a federation similar to how Rojava is structured?
So while it isn't tecnical separatism, it's still something which goes counter the syrian national government.

There is also to take in mind that the Kurdish population isn't only in Syria, see Kurdistan.
As an enough distinct ethnic group, with their own culture, language etc, it's odd for them to be split over many different nations.

[Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana]

What an idiot move by Trump to order troops to just up and leave the de facto independent Kurdish Rojava state without warning to the mercy of the Turks, ISIS and Assad's forces. This coming from a president who also nearly betrayed the people of Afghanistan to the savage and medieval whims of the Taliban. Given his boorishness and propensity to lie, I prefer to judge him by his actions, not his words, and this was a really dumb thing to do, and is nothing short of a betrayal. Now Turkey seeks to flood northern Rojava with Arab refugees in order to undermine the Syrian Kurds' right to self-determination and completely destroy whatever semblance of a Kurdish state has managed to come into being. This is nothing less than ethnic cleansing, and I fear a genocide may follow shortly. The Kurds deserve better than this. They have already begun their reconquest of territory lost by the Ottoman Empire at the end of WWI.

America should be arming the Syrian Kurdish Rojava state, not feeding it to the wolves, just as Russia has been arming the Assad regime and backing it with airstrikes. The Kurdish people will be even worse off than they were prior to 2011. I stand with the Kurds for the exact same reason I stand with Israel, Tibet, East Turkestan, Catalonia, Taiwan and Hong Kong. This is about self-determination for an embattled ethnic minority in their indigenous homeland. America's betrayal will not be forgotten.

At least Tulsi Gabbard's not that irresponsible. She is a close friend and ally of the Kurdish people, and she recognizes that defending a Kurdish state and defeating ISIS =/= overthrowing Assad and encouraging regime change wars. America should be encouraging a ceasefire along the Euphrates River between Assad and the YPG in a deal brokered between Russia and the United States, the real players behind the chessboard, and both countries can then proceed to apply pressure on Turkey to withdraw its forces from Syria to the benefit of both the Assad regime and the Kurds.

This move has done more to dent my opinion of Donald Trump than his numerous tweets about The Squad and the countless accusations leveled against him by the Democrats and the MSM. All of that domestic controversy pales in comparison to the countless lives that would be lost as a direct consequence of his betrayal. I'm actually genuinely disgusted with him. And if he can betray the Kurds, he can betray Hong Kong, all at the drop of a hat.

As for the racist, Islamofascist, genocidal state of Turkey, they should be expelled from NATO (which in turn should serve to further placate Russia, as Turkey is sandwiched between Syria to the south and Ukraine and Russian-occupied Crimea across the Black Sea to the north), diplomatic ties should be severed and economic sanctions should be imposed. Together with Iran and Saudi Arabia, they should be isolated and contained. To achieve this objective, detente with Russia needs to happen first. Turkey can be stopped if the United States and Russia are prepared to work together. While Russia is similarly bombing civilians in HTS (Hayat Tahrir al-Sham)-controlled Idlib province, we can still prevent Turkey from doing likewise in northern Syria and snuffing out the last remaining bastion of freedom and democracy in the form of the Kurdish Rojava state. A limited, token U.S. military presence in Rojava should be sufficient to deter Turkish aggression.

Rojava is far from a good state. Rojava persecutes Arabs within itself, the whole point of Ba’ath is secularism

[Agarntrop]

The Glorious Turkish Army Is Combating Terrorism.

(Image)

What a cretinous analogy. Helping ISIS and destroying the only hope of true democracy in Syria and the end of tyranny is not 'combatting terrorism'. It is quite the opposite, it is terrorism. Erdogan is a terrorist and neo-ottomanism is a fundamentally terroristic ideology.

[Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana]

Turkey has full rights to do this, as Rojava continues its persecution of Arabs. I’m hoping Assad comes out on top at the end of all this, he’s definitely least of all the evils in this conflict

Sure, the Rojava government has a bad track record in regards to killing of opponents, many of whom are Arab, but to take that and suddenly leap to the conclusion that "Assad is the most moral here" is asinine. Turkey is descending into an authoritarian hellscape, sure, and the Rojava government may not be the trendsetter of human rights that many would like to believe, granted, but Assad is a megalomaniacal tyrant who frequently slaughters his own people.

Assad is literally the last hope of secularism in the region

[Duhon]

Anyone else getting 70's flashbacks? What with an impeachable president dooming an ally with a withdrawal?

I think this means Jimmy Carter might be our next president...

1970s? lol there wouldn't be a respite to this trumpery even if trump goes
you americans will be known for selling democracy upriver at every authoritarian's fucking munich
only you're not even neville fucking chamberlains, wanting peace at any price and failing to get it

[Kyria]

Well, this is a most saddening and utterly despicable development. Unfortunately, I can only offer my best wishes to the Kurds in their fight for freedom. I do believe Turkey has the right to nationhood, but Erdogan is making that really difficult to justify. Hopefully the Kemalists oust him before it’s too late.

[Swasal]

I feel there might be some borderline genocidal shit going down in Syria soon enough after the Turkish beat the Kurdish troops with sheer numbers and technology. My heart bleeds for the long-suffering Kurds but sadly there is no reasoning with dictators such as Mr. Erdogan, especially after the World Police became the World Licensing Authority too. I find it unimaginable that Nato and the US basically endorsed Turkish invasion of a sovereign country due to "legitimate security concerns". As if Turkey hasn't been holding Apo in what is basically solitary confinement for 17 years on mostly trumped-up charges of terrorism (not the kind defined under international law, the kind that says if you oppose us you're a terrorist). Well, this is the world we live in.

[Negarakita]

This is a good thing, the YPG have been involved in supporting PKK terrorist attacks in Turkey for too long. Love that the child soldiers cum opium smugglers of the PKK have become poster children for democracy in the middle east, but it will be great to see the AnComs shut up about their socialist paradise where gay children get to be pressed into military service too. I just hope that the campaign will be carried out in a moral manner and without the targetting of civilians that the PKK are fond of.

[Thermodolia]

And that puzzles me. Assad is a dictator like Erdogan, how can he possibly allow another State to cross your borders and violate your sovereignty so batlanty? Jeez, Turkey is literally invading you, US doesn't care and you don't raise a single word against it?

The territory in question is already far outside Syrian government control.

This map is from march, but the front lines haven't move significantly since then. The attacks now are happening in the north-eastern part of the map.

Here's a live-updated map of the situation.

Here’s a more updated map from October

[Hakinda Herseyi Duymak istiyorum]

The Glorious Turkish Army Is Combating Terrorism.

(Image)

What a cretinous analogy. Helping ISIS and destroying the only hope of true democracy in Syria and the end of tyranny is not 'combatting terrorism'. It is quite the opposite, it is terrorism. Erdogan is a terrorist and neo-ottomanism is a fundamentally terroristic ideology.

Nobody wants neo-ottomanism, all we want is peace and security of the region.Assad and Turkey should sit at the table for peace

I will not answer racist rhetoric

[Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana]

This is a good thing, the YPG have been involved in supporting PKK terrorist attacks in Turkey for too long. Love that the child soldiers cum opium smugglers of the PKK have become poster children for democracy in the middle east, but it will be great to see the AnComs shut up about their socialist paradise where gay children get to be pressed into military service too. I just hope that the campaign will be carried out in a moral manner and without the targetting of civilians that the PKK are fond of.

I disagree with a lot of what you said, but you are right about one thing, Rojava is far from being a good state. It’s continued support of terrorism, persecution of Arabs, and horrible human rights record often goes ignored by the far left which holds it up as the poster child of successful communism (this really says more about the far-left than Rojava imo)

[Wallenburg]

This is a good thing, the YPG have been involved in supporting PKK terrorist attacks in Turkey for too long. Love that the child soldiers cum opium smugglers of the PKK have become poster children for democracy in the middle east, but it will be great to see the AnComs shut up about their socialist paradise where gay children get to be pressed into military service too. I just hope that the campaign will be carried out in a moral manner and without the targetting of civilians that the PKK are fond of.

I disagree with a lot of what you said, but you are right about one thing, Rojava is far from being a good state. It’s continued support of terrorism, persecution of Arabs, and horrible human rights record often goes ignored by the far left which holds it up as the poster child of successful communism (this really says more about the far-left than Rojava imo)

So many claims, but no sauce to go with it.

[Heloin]

What a cretinous analogy. Helping ISIS and destroying the only hope of true democracy in Syria and the end of tyranny is not 'combatting terrorism'. It is quite the opposite, it is terrorism. Erdogan is a terrorist and neo-ottomanism is a fundamentally terroristic ideology.

Nobody wants neo-ottomanism, all we want is peace and security of the region.Assad and Turkey should sit at the table for peace

Most of the people living in that Rojava territory of this imaginary Turkmeneli are Kurds and want nothing to do with Turkey. The same thing is true on the other side of the border actually.