California loses right to set emissions standards.

[Antityranicals]

It was a parliamentary, royal, and admiralty crime to support the United States of America seceding from the United Kingdom.

That case was not true for Dixie and is not true for California and Texas. The right to secede and self-determination is, and should be, absolute, assuming the consent of the people involved.

Except when California decides to set higher emissions standards than the rest of the US. Then it's time for the Fed to step in and squash it.

Hey, if the feds have to step in and squash something, it should at least be something which is morally wrong, like emissions standards...

[Nantoraka]

Difference is the USSR was held together by tape and glue, and things happened when Gorbachev took a hose to clean up the place.

And the United States is not?!?

I honestly get the vibe that Trump is our Gorbachev.

Did you just compare the United States, which has been stable for 150 years, to the disintegrating, unstable mess that was the Soviet Union?

[Ayytaly]

*deep inhaling*

Do you smell what the GOP is cooking?

Bullshit? Is that it?

Perhaps...

I propose bottleneck roads in GOP-dominated towns. Gotta share the Rockefeller love.

[Antityranicals]

I've got no problem with the Union being eternal, but why should California be part of it?

Just eject LA and San Fran into the pacific and you have a decent state with decent sights.

We're waiting, San Andreas Fault...

[Telconi]

"""United""" is that what you call this?

What's california going to do if it leaves an is no longer getting military and federal investment? Things are still better than they were in the 70s.

Why should I care?

[Thermodolia]

Because the Union is Eternal and we fought a war to keep it that way. Plus I’m a die hard nationalist

Anyway that’s enough of that

I've got no problem with the Union being eternal, but why should California be part of it?

Did you not read the first part of your sentence?

Anyway California is not bad or evil for trying to get to zero emissions. Honestly the Feds should be supporting electric vehicles and renewable energy massively.

[Antityranicals]

What's california going to do if it leaves an is no longer getting military and federal investment? Things are still better than they were in the 70s.

Why should I care?

If statism's the way to go, California should be just fine...

[Grand Britannia]

What's california going to do if it leaves an is no longer getting military and federal investment? Things are still better than they were in the 70s.

Why should I care?

That was supposed to be an argument that California should consider if it ever wants to break off.

[Nantoraka]

Just eject LA and San Fran into the pacific and you have a decent state with decent sights.

We're waiting, San Andreas Fault...

maybe when the fault cracks, all the bum piss and shit will fall into the crack and never be seen again

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

The company never had a right to mess with the earth for profit.

We are Creation's master, superior to all life that exists and ever will exist. We have Dominion over the planet. The earth God's footstoll AND ours. It exists to be exploited, harvested, and commanded by and for man and man alone.

We are in turn obligated by God to do this responsibly, so I obviously recycle, refuse to litter, not waste, don't pollute, etc. etc. etc., but I do not consider the earth or anything in it to be my equal..

Also, I reiterate: I do not support Trump's move to deny California its states' rights.

A particularly virulent and lethal strain of a pathogen the likes of Yersinia Pestis would be enough to bring humanity onto its knees, especially as bioterrorism gets more and more sophisticated and advanced in the next few decades. Just one single successful plan by a biochemistry-literate crackpot to release such a plague onto the world, and the "holy human dominion" will come crashing down,

[Thermodolia]

We are Creation's master, superior to all life that exists and ever will exist. We have Dominion over the planet. The earth God's footstoll AND ours. It exists to be exploited, harvested, and commanded by and for man and man alone.

We are in turn obligated by God to do this responsibly, so I obviously recycle, refuse to litter, not waste, don't pollute, etc. etc. etc., but I do not consider the earth or anything in it to be my equal..

Also, I reiterate: I do not support Trump's move to deny California its states' rights.

A particularly virulent and lethal strain of a pathogen the likes of Yersinia Pestis would be enough to bring humanity onto its knees, especially as bioterrorism gets more and more sophisticated and advanced in the next few decades. Just one single successful plan by a biochemistry-literate crackpot to release such a plague onto the world, and the "holy human dominion" will come crashing down,

Hell all it would take is a bit of Marburg Virus and everything comes crashing down

[Antityranicals]

I've got no problem with the Union being eternal, but why should California be part of it?

Did you not read the first part of your sentence?

Anyway California is not bad or evil for trying to get to zero emissions. Honestly the Feds should be supporting electric vehicles and renewable energy massively.

Something can still be eternal, even if one removes a cancer from it.

Why should the feds support it? If people want electric cars and renewable energy, they can buy them, thus making the industry profitable. Otherwise, why should we steal from Americans to make an unprofitable industry profitable? That, not emissions, is what I call wasteful.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

Except when California decides to set higher emissions standards than the rest of the US. Then it's time for the Fed to step in and squash it.

Hey, if the feds have to step in and squash something, it should at least be something which is morally wrong, like emissions standards...

There is nothing immoral about restricting emissions of a pollutant, unless you love the fossil fuel industry, that is.

[TURTLESHROOM II]

you do realize our country was founded by secessionists right?

Yes. But that doesn’t mean I need to support breaking my own nation up.

The South Will Rise Again(TM)(R)(YEEHAW).

Also, I believe heavily on self determination.

I don’t.

If Americans don't wanna be one nation anymore,we shouldn't force them to live as one when we can have an amicable divorce

I disagree.

I'm sure the USA will invade Texas and California if their people consent to leave. Right?

It was a parliamentary, royal, and admiralty crime to support the United States of America seceding from the United Kingdom.

And?

Your logic, if you apply it straight and not hypocritically, would extend the America's founding as well. I like spelling "color" and saying "lab-ruh-tory", thank you very much. Also, tea is meant to be cold.

That case was not true for Dixie and is not true for California and Texas. The right to secede and self-determination is, and should be, absolute, assuming the consent of the people involved.

SCOTUS disagrees with you. You can’t leave the US. Self determination is dumb.

Self-determination is the cornerstone of liberty- including the rights of the individual -and Abraham Lincoln is the worst President precisely because he thought about federalislm the way you do. In fact, Abraham Lincoln phased out federalism and FDR killed it.

The USA is, outside of certain issues like its elections, a de facto unitary state.

Now let’s get back on track. Trump is an idiot and can’t do what he thinks he can

Correct. California has states' rights and that includes emmission standards.

Remember, though, that California is levraging itself in order to force car companies to cater to it, shafting every other state regulation in the Union and driving the cost of automobiles up.

Does California's right to swing its regulatory fist end at Texas' clay?

[Antityranicals]

We are Creation's master, superior to all life that exists and ever will exist. We have Dominion over the planet. The earth God's footstoll AND ours. It exists to be exploited, harvested, and commanded by and for man and man alone.

We are in turn obligated by God to do this responsibly, so I obviously recycle, refuse to litter, not waste, don't pollute, etc. etc. etc., but I do not consider the earth or anything in it to be my equal..

Also, I reiterate: I do not support Trump's move to deny California its states' rights.

A particularly virulent and lethal strain of a pathogen the likes of Yersinia Pestis would be enough to bring humanity onto its knees, especially as bioterrorism gets more and more sophisticated and advanced in the next few decades. Just one single successful plan by a biochemistry-literate crackpot to release such a plague onto the world, and the "holy human dominion" will come crashing down,

The bright side is it might bring about the abolition of the state, allowing survivors to institute a new order of freedom and prosperity. Or, more likely, they'll just establish new states. But one can hope...

[The Greater Ohio Valley]

Except when California decides to set higher emissions standards than the rest of the US. Then it's time for the Fed to step in and squash it.

Hey, if the feds have to step in and squash something, it should at least be something which is morally wrong, like emissions standards...

If we’re applying morals to emission standards then they would be morally good as they exist as a step to ensure the health and well being of the environment which in turn is a step to ensure the health and well being of humans as humans benefit from the environment.

[Nantoraka]

We are Creation's master, superior to all life that exists and ever will exist. We have Dominion over the planet. The earth God's footstoll AND ours. It exists to be exploited, harvested, and commanded by and for man and man alone.

We are in turn obligated by God to do this responsibly, so I obviously recycle, refuse to litter, not waste, don't pollute, etc. etc. etc., but I do not consider the earth or anything in it to be my equal..

Also, I reiterate: I do not support Trump's move to deny California its states' rights.

A particularly virulent and lethal strain of a pathogen the likes of Yersinia Pestis would be enough to bring humanity onto its knees, especially as bioterrorism gets more and more sophisticated and advanced in the next few decades. Just one single successful plan by a biochemistry-literate crackpot to release such a plague onto the world, and the "holy human dominion" will come crashing down,

I dunno about that one mate
Advances in gene studies and medicine is much more advanced than it was in the 1300s. Plague Inc likes to talk about how realistic it is, but it really isn't.

[Neutraligon]

Yes. But that doesn’t mean I need to support breaking my own nation up.

The South Will Rise Again(TM)(R)(YEEHAW).

I don’t.

I disagree.

I'm sure the USA will invade Texas and California if their people consent to leave. Right?

And?

Your logic, if you apply it straight and not hypocritically, would extend the America's founding as well. I like spelling "color" and saying "lab-ruh-tory", thank you very much. Also, tea is meant to be cold.

SCOTUS disagrees with you. You can’t leave the US. Self determination is dumb.

Self-determination is the cornerstone of liberty- including the rights of the individual -and Abraham Lincoln is the worst President precisely because he thought about federalislm the way you do. In fact, Abraham Lincoln phased out federalism and FDR killed it.

The USA is, outside of certain issues like its elections, a de facto unitary state.

Now let’s get back on track. Trump is an idiot and can’t do what he thinks he can

Correct. California has states' rights and that includes emmission standards.

Remember, though, that California is levraging itself in order to force car companies to cater to it, shafting every other state regulation in the Union and driving the cost of automobiles up.

Does California's right to swing its regulatory fist end at Texas' clay?

I will point out again that car companies release two cars where 1 is sold in California (and the other states that use California's regulations) and meets their regulations, and the other is sold in states that do not use those regulations but instead use the federal ones.

I will also point out that your hated of California, or California secession is not the topic of discussion. Is it really that hard to stay on topic?

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

The company never had a right to mess with the earth for profit.

We are Creation's master, superior to all life that exists and ever will exist. We have Dominion over the planet. The earth God's footstoll AND ours. It exists to be exploited, harvested, and commanded by and for man and man alone.

We are in turn obligated by God to do this responsibly, so I obviously recycle, refuse to litter, not waste, don't pollute, etc. etc. etc., but I do not consider the earth or anything in it to be my equal..

Also, I reiterate: I do not support Trump's move to deny California its states' rights.

Not just God but ourselves too. Setting rivers on fire only hurts ourselves and the earth.

Also I agree, denying California its states' rights is ridiculous.

[Antityranicals]

Yes. But that doesn’t mean I need to support breaking my own nation up.

The South Will Rise Again(TM)(R)(YEEHAW).

I don’t.

I disagree.

I'm sure the USA will invade Texas and California if their people consent to leave. Right?

And?

Your logic, if you apply it straight and not hypocritically, would extend the America's founding as well. I like spelling "color" and saying "lab-ruh-tory", thank you very much. Also, tea is meant to be cold.

SCOTUS disagrees with you. You can’t leave the US. Self determination is dumb.

Self-determination is the cornerstone of liberty- including the rights of the individual -and Abraham Lincoln is the worst President precisely because he thought about federalislm the way you do. In fact, Abraham Lincoln phased out federalism and FDR killed it.

The USA is, outside of certain issues like its elections, a de facto unitary state.

Now let’s get back on track. Trump is an idiot and can’t do what he thinks he can

Correct. California has states' rights and that includes emmission standards.

Remember, though, that California is levraging itself in order to force car companies to cater to it, shafting every other state regulation in the Union and driving the cost of automobiles up.

Does California's right to swing its regulatory fist end at Texas' clay?

I like state's rights more than federal rights, but I like individual rights more than either, so if the feds want to fight state's rights on behalf of individual rights, I'm all for it.

[Nantoraka]

Yes. But that doesn’t mean I need to support breaking my own nation up.

The South Will Rise Again(TM)(R)(YEEHAW).

I don’t.

I disagree.

I'm sure the USA will invade Texas and California if their people consent to leave. Right?

And?

Your logic, if you apply it straight and not hypocritically, would extend the America's founding as well. I like spelling "color" and saying "lab-ruh-tory", thank you very much. Also, tea is meant to be cold.

SCOTUS disagrees with you. You can’t leave the US. Self determination is dumb.

Self-determination is the cornerstone of liberty- including the rights of the individual -and Abraham Lincoln is the worst President precisely because he thought about federalislm the way you do. In fact, Abraham Lincoln phased out federalism and FDR killed it.

The USA is, outside of certain issues like its elections, a de facto unitary state.

Now let’s get back on track. Trump is an idiot and can’t do what he thinks he can

Correct. California has states' rights and that includes emmission standards.

Remember, though, that California is levraging itself in order to force car companies to cater to it, shafting every other state regulation in the Union and driving the cost of automobiles up.

Does California's right to swing its regulatory fist end at Texas' clay?

I mean, wouldn't anyone find a catfight between California and Texas funny?

[The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp]

Did you not read the first part of your sentence?

Anyway California is not bad or evil for trying to get to zero emissions. Honestly the Feds should be supporting electric vehicles and renewable energy massively.

Something can still be eternal, even if one removes a cancer from it.

Why should the feds support it? If people want electric cars and renewable energy, they can buy them, thus making the industry profitable. Otherwise, why should we steal from Americans to make an unprofitable industry profitable? That, not emissions, is what I call wasteful.

Because if we don't we will fuck up the planet and ourselves.

Also lol more "CaLIfOrnIa BaD" NPC ness.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

A particularly virulent and lethal strain of a pathogen the likes of Yersinia Pestis would be enough to bring humanity onto its knees, especially as bioterrorism gets more and more sophisticated and advanced in the next few decades. Just one single successful plan by a biochemistry-literate crackpot to release such a plague onto the world, and the "holy human dominion" will come crashing down,

The bright side is it might bring about the abolition of the state, allowing survivors to institute a new order of freedom and prosperity. Or, more likely, they'll just establish new states. But one can hope...

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is the Ancap strain of Posadism.

[Neutraligon]

The bright side is it might bring about the abolition of the state, allowing survivors to institute a new order of freedom and prosperity. Or, more likely, they'll just establish new states. But one can hope...

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is the Ancap strain of Posadism.

It is also not the topic of this thread.

[TURTLESHROOM II]

There is nothing immoral about restricting emissions of a pollutant, unless you love the fossil fuel industry, that is.

It's not immoral, but it is not the business of the state. Renewable energy will one day succeed. Not might. WILL. The market will always push for better fuel, power, and energy. Government subsidies of green energy only stagnate innovation by incentivizing the status quo by making it profitable enough to not need.

Also, it is the government that suppresses the Open Fuel Standard, which would force all car companies from enforcing the fossil fuel's monopoly on energy intake. If you want to break fossil fuel's domination, get the government out of the way. Overregulation and government-enforced monopolies (etc.) are the true preservers of fossil fuel.

Government ruins everything it touches. Except killing people and oppressing them. It's always good at that. Almost every problem in America today was either started by, enforced by, enhanced by, or otherwise touched, directly or indirectly, by the government.