Gun Control 2022 (IV) - Gun Rights, Control, & Government

[Neanderthaland]

It's much more typical and more effective to trap them.

EDIT: If you already have the gun, and there are coyotes, and you don't have the time or inclination to go to town and get a trap. It will absolutely work. And it's a totally reasonable use for the rifle. It's just that coyotes aren't the first thing that come to mind when I think of reasons to have one.

Fair enough. Point is AR-15s have legitimate farming and hunting uses.

Absolutely.

[Plzen]

Doesn’t matter how common it is. If even ONE person successfully defends their home it is a GOOD THING.

This is, of course, a blatantly ridiculous stance.

[Ammostan]

Doesn’t matter how common it is. If even ONE person successfully defends their home it is a GOOD THING.

This is, of course, a blatantly ridiculous stance.

Ah, I'm glad to see you want a homeowner dead and the intruders at large.

[The Alma Mater]

I realize you probably have some antecdote-but how common is that?

Doesn't matter how common it is. If even ONE person successfully defends their home it is a GOOD THING.

Well, depends. If one person succesfully defends their home, while 1000 "accidentally" kill the mailman, their wife, kids, dog etc one can wonder if the net result is not a big fat negative.

[The Chuck]

They always neglect the fact that there IS a "legitimate use" for an "assault" rifle with high capacity magazines. HOME. DEFENSE. AGAINST. MULTIPLE. INTRUDERS. Ah, but that "never happens". Riiiight?

I realize you probably have some antecdote-but how common is that?

The McCloskey family. Nuff' said Kowani.

[Ammostan]

What makes using an AR so much more inherently dangerous than using a handgun to protect your house? Why would you be any less responsible with an AR than you would be with your handgun?

Explain to me why I should be limited to a certain number of rounds per mag to protect my house. Why on God's green earth would you NOT want me to have an advantage over my attackers unless you are pro-criminal?

[The Chuck]

What makes using an AR so much more inherently dangerous than using a handgun to protect your house? Why would you be any less responsible with an AR than you would be with your handgun?

Explain to me why I should be limited to a certain number of rounds per mag to protect my house. Why on God's green earth would you NOT want me to have an advantage over my attackers unless you are pro-criminal?

Using a 4.5 inch H&K pistol, I can hit center of mass accurately up to 13 meters in ideal conditions taking my sweet ass old time between shots. With a 16 inch AR-15, I can bang away at a 100 meter 1"x1" steel plate like no tomorrow under stressful conditions. I'll take the AR-15 before buying a pistol, thank you very much.

[Neanderthaland]

What makes using an AR so much more inherently dangerous than using a handgun to protect your house? Why would you be any less responsible with an AR than you would be with your handgun?

Explain to me why I should be limited to a certain number of rounds per mag to protect my house. Why on God's green earth would you NOT want me to have an advantage over my attackers unless you are pro-criminal?

Using a 4.5 inch H&K pistol, I can hit center of mass accurately up to 13 meters in ideal conditions taking my sweet ass old time between shots. With a 16 inch AR-15, I can bang away at a 100 meter 1"x1" steel plate like no tomorrow under stressful conditions. I'll take the AR-15 before buying a pistol, thank you very much.

For home defense I'd take a short shotgun, like a Mossberg, over both.

It's a great combination of maneuverable, accurate at close range, unlikely to penetrate into neighboring houses, great stopping power, and "people pay attention when you point one at them."

[Grinning Dragon]

Using a 4.5 inch H&K pistol, I can hit center of mass accurately up to 13 meters in ideal conditions taking my sweet ass old time between shots. With a 16 inch AR-15, I can bang away at a 100 meter 1"x1" steel plate like no tomorrow under stressful conditions. I'll take the AR-15 before buying a pistol, thank you very much.

For home defense I'd take a short shotgun, like a Mossberg, over both.

It's a great combination of maneuverable, accurate at close range, unlikely to penetrate into neighboring houses, great stopping power, and "people pay attention when you point one at them."

For me, I'll use whatever is at hand, whether that would be a shotty, handgun or rifle, although my go to weapon would be my M4 clone, but I ain't picky, Hell if need be I could brain a parasite with the ol lady's high heel stilettos.

[Novus America]

Using a 4.5 inch H&K pistol, I can hit center of mass accurately up to 13 meters in ideal conditions taking my sweet ass old time between shots. With a 16 inch AR-15, I can bang away at a 100 meter 1"x1" steel plate like no tomorrow under stressful conditions. I'll take the AR-15 before buying a pistol, thank you very much.

For home defense I'd take a short shotgun, like a Mossberg, over both.

It's a great combination of maneuverable, accurate at close range, unlikely to penetrate into neighboring houses, great stopping power, and "people pay attention when you point one at them."

I am thinking of getting a Kel-Tec KSG. Although their reputation was spotty in the past, Kel-Tec is putting out som pretty interesting products now.

[The Chuck]

Using a 4.5 inch H&K pistol, I can hit center of mass accurately up to 13 meters in ideal conditions taking my sweet ass old time between shots. With a 16 inch AR-15, I can bang away at a 100 meter 1"x1" steel plate like no tomorrow under stressful conditions. I'll take the AR-15 before buying a pistol, thank you very much.

For home defense I'd take a short shotgun, like a Mossberg, over both.

It's a great combination of maneuverable, accurate at close range, unlikely to penetrate into neighboring houses, great stopping power, and "people pay attention when you point one at them."

5.56 AR-15, 16 inch barrel with frangible ammunition, no worries of hitting a neighbor's house

[Neanderthaland]

For home defense I'd take a short shotgun, like a Mossberg, over both.

It's a great combination of maneuverable, accurate at close range, unlikely to penetrate into neighboring houses, great stopping power, and "people pay attention when you point one at them."

5.56 AR-15, 16 inch barrel with frangible ammunition, no worries of hitting a neighbor's house

Yeah, that's more of a handgun problem. Particularly for those folks who think you're not a real man unless you're using something which breaks your wrist when you fire it.

Which, I realize, is ironic coming from a guy who just advocated for a shotgun with a pistol grip.

[Gun Manufacturers]

Not all are so easily scared. Individuals are usually cowards but in groups they may attack. Hence why you want a semi automatic .556/223 for them.
Given the huge coyote problems guns are needed to control them.

And homo sapiens are the most dangerous megafauna there is, so that is pretty much everywhere But much of North America has potentially dangerous megafauna of other, native types.

But anyways no state can be completely trusted, so the idea of what would happen if the state could be completely trusted is completely moot.

You should absolutely have a right to an AR-15 style rifle, but I'm not sure if you need one to deal with coyotes.

I have a lot of experience dealing with them. They are going to run after the first shot. Even if you miss. It doesn't even have to be a real gun. You could scatter them with a starter pistol.

Really? A starter pistol, you say?

[Neanderthaland]

You should absolutely have a right to an AR-15 style rifle, but I'm not sure if you need one to deal with coyotes.

I have a lot of experience dealing with them. They are going to run after the first shot. Even if you miss. It doesn't even have to be a real gun. You could scatter them with a starter pistol.

Really? A starter pistol, you say?

Shockingly wild animals are startled by loud sharp noises.

[Gun Manufacturers]

Really? A starter pistol, you say?

Shockingly wild animals are startled by loud sharp noises.

viewtopic.php?p=37457401#p37457401

[Neanderthaland]

Shockingly wild animals are startled by loud sharp noises.

viewtopic.php?p=37457401#p37457401

[Kowani]

I realize you probably have some antecdote-but how common is that?

The McCloskey family. Nuff' said Kowani.

...I asked for commonality, not one-off incidents.

[Kernen]

What makes using an AR so much more inherently dangerous than using a handgun to protect your house? Why would you be any less responsible with an AR than you would be with your handgun?

Explain to me why I should be limited to a certain number of rounds per mag to protect my house. Why on God's green earth would you NOT want me to have an advantage over my attackers unless you are pro-criminal?

Using a 4.5 inch H&K pistol, I can hit center of mass accurately up to 13 meters in ideal conditions taking my sweet ass old time between shots. With a 16 inch AR-15, I can bang away at a 100 meter 1"x1" steel plate like no tomorrow under stressful conditions. I'll take the AR-15 before buying a pistol, thank you very much.

This is why gun grabbers have an issue with "assault rifles' fwiw.

This is, of course, a blatantly ridiculous stance.

Ah, I'm glad to see you want a homeowner dead and the intruders at large.

I'm rabidly pro gun and even I think this is a shit argument.

[The Emerald Legion]

Doesn’t matter how common it is. If even ONE person successfully defends their home it is a GOOD THING.

This is, of course, a blatantly ridiculous stance.

Not really.

[Aclion]

They always neglect the fact that there IS a "legitimate use" for an "assault" rifle with high capacity magazines. HOME. DEFENSE. AGAINST. MULTIPLE. INTRUDERS. Ah, but that "never happens". Riiiight?

I realize you probably have some antecdote-but how common is that?

It's difficult to get statistic since it's not tracked consistently, but it's common enough that there is a word for it; Home invaders.
Unrelated, the french have a word, chauffeurs, which specifically refers to home invaders who would torture homeowners by holding their feet to the fireplace toget them to reveal hidden valuable.

[Kernen]

This is, of course, a blatantly ridiculous stance.

Not really.

Itnis, and you probably don't want to go down that rhetorical road. Taking Extreme Measures to save even one life plays right into the gun grabber bit.

[Plzen]

I didn’t think that it would be a terribly controversial position to assert that the number of people a problem affects is a key factor in the importance of that problem and thus the quantity of resources - including our attention, because the human ability to care is finite - that can be justifiably spent on solving it.

But apparently, it is.

[Kernen]

I didn’t think that it would be a terribly controversial position to assert that the number of people a problem affects is a key factor in the importance of that problem and thus the quantity of resources - including our attention, because the human ability to care is finite - that can be justifiably spent on solving it.

But apparently, it is.

The strongest argument against gun control remains the fact that guns are a net positive, but that requires accepting that the presence of guns in society necessarily generates negative effects. The argument's strength is in how the benefits outweigh the harms. When you get to radical absolutes, you end up fighting against your own best argument's underlying facts, and it just helps the grabbers.

[Grinning Dragon]

For home defense I'd take a short shotgun, like a Mossberg, over both.

It's a great combination of maneuverable, accurate at close range, unlikely to penetrate into neighboring houses, great stopping power, and "people pay attention when you point one at them."

5.56 AR-15, 16 inch barrel with frangible ammunition, no worries of hitting a neighbor's house

Unlikely the 5.56 round is going to leave the house in the case of missing your target, due to the very nature the bullet tumbles hard after contact of the first barrier.
Shotgun and pistol rounds have better success in over penetration vs .223/5.56
Why “High Powered” 5.56 NATO/.223 AR-15 Ammo is Safer For Home Defense (FBI overpenetration testing)

[Elevanos]

My first thought when the most people chose everything was:

"Breaking news, a nuclear attack was launched form an upscale apartment in New York City, causing the deaths of 15,000 people and counting."