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Gun Control 2022 (IV) - Gun Rights, Control, & Government

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Your thoughts on pistol braces? (See top of OP for information)

Ban modern sporting rifles
114
15%
Pistol braces should be outlawed and current restrictions on SBRs remain in place
86
11%
Pistol braces should be outlawed but current restrictions on SBRs should be removed
30
4%
Pistol braces should be allowed and current restrictions on SBRs should remain
102
13%
Pistol braces should be allowed but current restrictions on SBRs should be removed
454
58%
 
Total votes : 786

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Plzen
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Postby Plzen » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:15 am

Pax Nerdvana wrote:I hope that doesn't happen.

In my opinion, if the Democrats put up another vaguely inoffensive social liberal with an elite image, they might as well hand Trump the 2020 elections because they're not winning it.

But then again, history shows how frequently leaders choose to stay leaders of a sinking ship instead of letting someone else save it.
Last edited by Plzen on Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The Two Jerseys
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Two Jerseys » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:17 am

West Leas Oros 2 wrote:
Kernen wrote:Why do you people hate vegetables? Gimme romaine, spinach, red onion, tomatoes, carrots, and an oil and vinegar dressing. Hold all the extra carbs and *gag* ranch dressing.

Who the hell likes ranch dressing?

Real Americans.
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Diopolis
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Postby Diopolis » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:57 am

Plzen wrote:
Pax Nerdvana wrote:I hope that doesn't happen.

In my opinion, if the Democrats put up another vaguely inoffensive social liberal with an elite image, they might as well hand Trump the 2020 elections because they're not winning it.

But then again, history shows how frequently leaders choose to stay leaders of a sinking ship instead of letting someone else save it.

They’ll put up a scandal haunted, senile moderate and try to reassure their base by running to the left on social issues.
Which is about the dumbest thing they could do, but hey, they’re democrats.
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West Leas Oros 2
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Postby West Leas Oros 2 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:02 am

Diopolis wrote:
Plzen wrote:In my opinion, if the Democrats put up another vaguely inoffensive social liberal with an elite image, they might as well hand Trump the 2020 elections because they're not winning it.

But then again, history shows how frequently leaders choose to stay leaders of a sinking ship instead of letting someone else save it.

They’ll put up a scandal haunted, senile moderate and try to reassure their base by running to the left on social issues.
Which is about the dumbest thing they could do, but hey, they’re democrats.

Democrats are good at setting up stooges.
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Kernen
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Postby Kernen » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:21 am

The Two Jerseys wrote:
West Leas Oros 2 wrote:Who the hell likes ranch dressing?

Real Americans.

We should use our 2nd Amendment rights to rid the nation of Ranch and the Ranchophiles. Ranch dressing is an assault on our right to be free of bad food!
From the throne of Khan Juk i'Behemoti, Juk Who-Is-The-Strength-of-the-Behemoth, Supreme Khan of the Ogres of Kernen. May the Khan ever drink the blood of his enemies!

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Pax Nerdvana
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Capitalizt

Postby Pax Nerdvana » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:21 am

The Two Jerseys wrote:
West Leas Oros 2 wrote:Who the hell likes ranch dressing?

Real Americans.

I love ranch myself.
The Internet killed gun control.
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West Leas Oros 2
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Postby West Leas Oros 2 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:22 am

Kernen wrote:
The Two Jerseys wrote:Real Americans.

We should use our 2nd Amendment rights to rid the nation of Ranch and the Ranchophiles. Ranch dressing is an assault on our right to be free of bad food!

Hell yeah we're going to take your Ranch Dressing.
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The Two Jerseys
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Two Jerseys » Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:28 am

West Leas Oros 2 wrote:
Kernen wrote:We should use our 2nd Amendment rights to rid the nation of Ranch and the Ranchophiles. Ranch dressing is an assault on our right to be free of bad food!

Hell yeah we're going to take your Ranch Dressing.

Ranchophobes do not get to tell me how to eat my food. And if they try, I will meet them at the door with a gun. That is insane!
"The Duke of Texas" is too formal for regular use. Just call me "Your Grace".
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Kernen
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Kernen » Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:40 am

The Two Jerseys wrote:
West Leas Oros 2 wrote:Hell yeah we're going to take your Ranch Dressing.

Ranchophobes do not get to tell me how to eat my food. And if they try, I will meet them at the door with a gun. That is insane!

The Constitution never mentioned ranch dressing, and there is no way the Founders could have conceived of such an advanced version of their food. You do not have a right to a quasi-dairy product who's only purpose is to make you feel big and satisfied with your salad.
Last edited by Kernen on Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
From the throne of Khan Juk i'Behemoti, Juk Who-Is-The-Strength-of-the-Behemoth, Supreme Khan of the Ogres of Kernen. May the Khan ever drink the blood of his enemies!

Lawful Evil

Get abortions, do drugs, own guns, but never misstate legal procedure.

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The Two Jerseys
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Posts: 19610
Founded: Jun 07, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby The Two Jerseys » Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:09 pm

Kernen wrote:
The Two Jerseys wrote:Ranchophobes do not get to tell me how to eat my food. And if they try, I will meet them at the door with a gun. That is insane!

The Constitution never mentioned ranch dressing, and there is no way the Founders could have conceived of such an advanced version of their food. You do not have a right to a quasi-dairy product who's only purpose is to make you feel big and satisfied with your salad.

The Constitution says "the right of the people", not "the right of the government". We should be able to eat the same rations that the military does!
"The Duke of Texas" is too formal for regular use. Just call me "Your Grace".
"If I would like to watch goodness, sanity, God and logic being fucked I would watch Japanese porn." -Nightkill the Emperor
"This thread makes me wish I was a moron so that I wouldn't have to comprehend how stupid the topic is." -The Empire of Pretantia
Head of State: HM King Louis
Head of Government: The Rt. Hon. James O'Dell MP, Prime Minister
Ambassador to the World Assembly: HE Sir John Ross "J.R." Ewing II, Bt.
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Kernen
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Postby Kernen » Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:15 pm

The Two Jerseys wrote:
Kernen wrote:The Constitution never mentioned ranch dressing, and there is no way the Founders could have conceived of such an advanced version of their food. You do not have a right to a quasi-dairy product who's only purpose is to make you feel big and satisfied with your salad.

The Constitution says "the right of the people", not "the right of the government". We should be able to eat the same rations that the military does!


Image
From the throne of Khan Juk i'Behemoti, Juk Who-Is-The-Strength-of-the-Behemoth, Supreme Khan of the Ogres of Kernen. May the Khan ever drink the blood of his enemies!

Lawful Evil

Get abortions, do drugs, own guns, but never misstate legal procedure.

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Grinning Dragon
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Posts: 10387
Founded: May 16, 2011
Anarchy

Postby Grinning Dragon » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:19 pm


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Plzen
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Founded: Mar 19, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Plzen » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:23 pm

Grinning Dragon wrote:-snip-

...National Socialist Germany definitely didn't use the Communist red-and-yellow scheme.

Not to mention, using totalitarian regimes as an argument against gun control is an intriguing argument to make, because many of those totalitarian regimes demonstrate just how ineffective being armed is at actually putting an end to totalitarianism. After all, Stalin's 1937 Great Purge fell extremely heavily on the Red Army, with nearly its entire leadership quietly led away to be shot or interned... if something could've saved all those people and stop Stalin's purges, "more guns" certainly wouldn't be it.
Last edited by Plzen on Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Telconi
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Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:25 pm

Plzen wrote:
Grinning Dragon wrote:-snip-

...National Socialist Germany definitely didn't use the Communist red-and-yellow scheme.

Not to mention, using totalitarian regimes as an argument against gun control is an intriguing argument to make, because many of those totalitarian regimes demonstrate just how ineffective being armed is at actually putting an end to totalitarianism. After all, Stalin's 1937 Great Purge fell extremely heavily on the Red Army, with nearly its entire leadership quietly led away to be shot or interned... if something could've saved all those people and stop Stalin's purges, "more guns" certainly wouldn't be it.


It's not necessary for a right to prevent tyranny for the attacking of that right to be tyranny.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Plzen
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Ex-Nation

Postby Plzen » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:27 pm

Telconi wrote:It's not necessary for a right to prevent tyranny for the attacking of that right to be tyranny.

Fair enough. That raises the question, then, of what even is the point of that poster. "Look, these people we don't like did X, we shouldn't do X" is basically a textbook example of how ad hominem works.

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Ors Might
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Capitalist Paradise

Postby Ors Might » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:35 pm

Plzen wrote:
Telconi wrote:It's not necessary for a right to prevent tyranny for the attacking of that right to be tyranny.

Fair enough. That raises the question, then, of what even is the point of that poster. "Look, these people we don't like did X, we shouldn't do X" is basically a textbook example of how ad hominem works.

More so it’s “hey these people are bad because they did x and y. Lets not do x and y.”
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Grinning Dragon
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Founded: May 16, 2011
Anarchy

Postby Grinning Dragon » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:39 pm

Plzen wrote:
Telconi wrote:It's not necessary for a right to prevent tyranny for the attacking of that right to be tyranny.

Fair enough. That raises the question, then, of what even is the point of that poster. "Look, these people we don't like did X, we shouldn't do X" is basically a textbook example of how ad hominem works.

Any different than what anti gun cunts label pro gun folks?
Fact is red flag laws are shit, have always been shit and will continue to be shit, and those pols who support said unconstitutional ideas/laws are shit as well and are really no different than those piece of shit dictators those symbols on that poster represent.

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Telconi
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Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:46 pm

Plzen wrote:
Telconi wrote:It's not necessary for a right to prevent tyranny for the attacking of that right to be tyranny.

Fair enough. That raises the question, then, of what even is the point of that poster. "Look, these people we don't like did X, we shouldn't do X" is basically a textbook example of how ad hominem works.


It's a poster, not a debate argument.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Hurtful Thoughts
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Capitalist Paradise

Postby Hurtful Thoughts » Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:52 pm

West Leas Oros 2 wrote:
Kernen wrote:Why do you people hate vegetables? Gimme romaine, spinach, red onion, tomatoes, carrots, and an oil and vinegar dressing. Hold all the extra carbs and *gag* ranch dressing.

Who the hell likes ranch dressing?

Me. Add mustard and makes a nifty pretzel-dip.
Last edited by Hurtful Thoughts on Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kernen
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Kernen » Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:33 pm

Hurtful Thoughts wrote:
West Leas Oros 2 wrote:Who the hell likes ranch dressing?

Me. Add mustard and makes a nifty pretzel-dip.

Just stick with the mustard.
From the throne of Khan Juk i'Behemoti, Juk Who-Is-The-Strength-of-the-Behemoth, Supreme Khan of the Ogres of Kernen. May the Khan ever drink the blood of his enemies!

Lawful Evil

Get abortions, do drugs, own guns, but never misstate legal procedure.

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Deacarsia
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Posts: 1344
Founded: May 12, 2019
Right-wing Utopia

Gun Control - Lock, Stock, and Talk

Postby Deacarsia » Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:37 pm

Kernen wrote:
Hurtful Thoughts wrote:Me. Add mustard and makes a nifty pretzel-dip.

Just stick with the mustard.

Yuck! No way!
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Deacarsia
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Founded: May 12, 2019
Right-wing Utopia

Gun Control - Lock, Stock, and Talk

Postby Deacarsia » Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:38 pm

Grinning Dragon wrote:
Plzen wrote:Fair enough. That raises the question, then, of what even is the point of that poster. "Look, these people we don't like did X, we shouldn't do X" is basically a textbook example of how ad hominem works.

Any different than what anti gun @$#!s label pro gun folks?
Fact is red flag laws are shit, have always been shit and will continue to be shit, and those pols who support said unconstitutional ideas/laws are shit as well and are really no different than those piece of shit dictators those symbols on that poster represent.

I agree.
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West Leas Oros 2
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Ex-Nation

Postby West Leas Oros 2 » Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:19 am

Grinning Dragon wrote:Quite fitting of those pols who support red flag laws.

New Hampshire Democrats compared to Nazis at House committee vote on firearms bill

Gotta love the daily dose of McCarthyist Red-Baiting, now with a side of Godwin's Law.
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How many South Americans need to be killed by the CIA before you realize socialism is bad?
I like to think I've come a long way since the days of the First WLO.
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Asle Leopolka
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Posts: 840
Founded: Oct 18, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Asle Leopolka » Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:39 am

Buckle up, buckaroos: https://thehill.com/regulation/court-ba ... wsuit-from

The Supreme Court has refused to listen to the appeal of gunmaker Remington in the 2014 lawsuit brought forward by a survivor and families of victims of the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School mass shooting in Newtown, Conn.

The refusal of the appeal means that the lawsuit — which alleges that Remington should have never sold to the public a weapon as dangerous as the AR-15 style rifle used in the shooting — can move forward to trial.

Remington, the nation's oldest gunmaker, was appealing the 4-3 decision passed down by the Connecticut Supreme Court in March, citing the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act, a 2005 law that protects gunmakers from liability claims when criminal acts are carried out with their weapons.

Remington's Bushmaster XM-15 was used by 20-year-old Adam Lanza to murder 20 first graders and six educators at the elementary school.

Until now, the law had proven to be an airtight defense for gun manufacturers, causing lawsuits to be thrown out in similar situations, such as the Aurora, Colo., movie theater shooting in 2012.


BRB, gonna sue Chipotle because my brother became overweight from eating there every day.
Last edited by Asle Leopolka on Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
W̵̲͔͇͒̌̉̆̇͛̋ͅa̸̢̼̺̅̉̊͝l̶̟͈̳̗͒͜l̷̫͝ ̶̱̱̘͖̙̬͖̈́̏̕͘ō̴̼̭̥͔̮̟͒̒͒ͅn̴̖̦͎̯͕̈́̿͘͠ ̸̞̼͉͙́͐̏͝ẗ̴̮͕̰̫̖͉̩̍͆̂͛͝h̵̖̋̉̾̎͆e̸̞̩̳̲͙͎͑ ̴̩̈̽̈́͑S̵̯̮̟͈͎̭͠t̸͍̗̹̬͉̙̓͆̔̿r̸̡̤̺̱̹͈̦͑̈́̅ẹ̶̮͔̳̆͆̄̏̔e̴̢̺͚̠̟͕̋̄̂̓̽͘t̴̢̡̩͙̫̼̚,̸̩̖͌̈́͐̇ ̷̨͐͆P̵̳̦͗r̶̹̪̯͕̬̰̍̓͆o̷̠̱͙̠͔̗̫̽f̶̱͙͇̼̬̮̻̊͌̋į̸̯̩̖͇̍͋̓̾́̏̽ͅt̴͇̬͍̗̺̀̈́̈́͗͊ ̴̧̯̼̩͑̓̒͗i̷̪̲̜̮̼̲̎͑͊̂̕n̶͍̂ ̴͓̻̤̬͎̫̹̎͌̈́́̕͝t̸̺͚͍̕h̷͖͎̙͍̬̫̰̍̀̃̿̓e̷̛̩̔̑̌̾͊ ̵̤̖͎͔͖̂͘͝S̴̳͖̩̪͕̒͒̌͌͝h̷̝͇̱̝̻̓̓͂͑̒ȅ̶̛̞̱̮̏͐͜ḕ̷͙͉̄͜ť̸̫̩̟s̴̲̲̏̑̏̇͆͂͘͜

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Kernen
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7713
Founded: Mar 02, 2011
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Kernen » Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:51 am

Asle Leopolka wrote:Buckle up, buckaroos: https://thehill.com/regulation/court-ba ... wsuit-from

The Supreme Court has refused to listen to the appeal of gunmaker Remington in the 2014 lawsuit brought forward by a survivor and families of victims of the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School mass shooting in Newtown, Conn.

The refusal of the appeal means that the lawsuit — which alleges that Remington should have never sold to the public a weapon as dangerous as the AR-15 style rifle used in the shooting — can move forward to trial.

Remington, the nation's oldest gunmaker, was appealing the 4-3 decision passed down by the Connecticut Supreme Court in March, citing the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act, a 2005 law that protects gunmakers from liability claims when criminal acts are carried out with their weapons.

Remington's Bushmaster XM-15 was used by 20-year-old Adam Lanza to murder 20 first graders and six educators at the elementary school.

Until now, the law had proven to be an airtight defense for gun manufacturers, causing lawsuits to be thrown out in similar situations, such as the Aurora, Colo., movie theater shooting in 2012.


BRB, gonna sue Chipotle because my brother became overweight from eating there every day.


You didnt read the briefs, didya. They're suing based on consumer advertising, not liability for wrongful death. Even assuming the manufacturers lose, all they have to do is change their advertising approach. It's likely that the Lawful Commerce Act doesn't actually protect against consumer protection claims based in advertising issues.

This could be expensive for Remington, but it probably wont tank them. And if it does, itll be because they did it to them like the tobacco companies did with the internal memos.
From the throne of Khan Juk i'Behemoti, Juk Who-Is-The-Strength-of-the-Behemoth, Supreme Khan of the Ogres of Kernen. May the Khan ever drink the blood of his enemies!

Lawful Evil

Get abortions, do drugs, own guns, but never misstate legal procedure.

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