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2019-2020 US Election Megathread III: Biden VS Biden

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Who do you think had the best performance at tonight’s debate?

Bernie
65
62%
Buttigieg
12
11%
Warren
11
10%
Biden
5
5%
Steyer
4
4%
Klobuchar
8
8%
 
Total votes : 105

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Cannot think of a name
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Postby Cannot think of a name » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:07 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
He didn't say they were communists though, he said they were extremists. And the feasibility of a policy doesn't really effect how extreme it is.

If policy is feasible and doesn't harm human rights or cause huge chaos inherently as a policy, it's not extreme. :roll:

Now you did it...
"...I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season." -MLK Jr.

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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:07 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
He didn't say they were communists though, he said they were extremists. And the feasibility of a policy doesn't really effect how extreme it is.

If policy is feasible and doesn't harm human rights or cause huge chaos inherently as a policy, it's not extreme. :roll:


Nice opinion.
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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:10 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Nice opinion.

Fine, what is extreme then? :eyebrow:


Whatever someone thinks it is.
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Necroghastia
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Postby Necroghastia » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:11 pm

Telconi wrote:
Eternal Lotharia wrote:Fine, what is extreme then? :eyebrow:


Whatever someone thinks it is.


sounds extreme to me tbqh
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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:13 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Whatever someone thinks it is.

Then you've basically destroyed the credibility of the GOP's arguments.


And everyone else's.
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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:14 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
And everyone else's.

Not when you focus on what works. Actual policy, not pathetic rhetoric.


Lots of things "work"
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"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Dresderstan
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Postby Dresderstan » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:17 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Lots of things "work"

Ok, what works and improves people's lives, most people's, and Democrats's policies generally do that.
While Republicans...Look at their track record since Reagan.

How about actually explain your policies.
23 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Fuck neo-liberalism

Biden and Trump are traitors to America.
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and is actively stripping away your constitutional rights.
Remake the Free World, wipe the slate clean, a nation born and baptized in blood and fire shall be reborn again.

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Telconi
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Founded: Oct 08, 2016
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:17 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Lots of things "work"

Ok, what works and improves people's lives, most people's, and Democrats's policies generally do that.
While Republicans...Look at their track record since Reagan.


Well if "Improves people's lives" is a requirement, you just uh... "destroyed the credibility of the Democrat's arguments". Did I get that right?
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PRO:
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-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
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-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:22 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Well if "Improves people's lives" is a requirement, you just uh... "destroyed the credibility of the Democrat's arguments". Did I get that right?

No, look at the economic policies, compared to Dems, the Republicans fail utterly and the rich get richer. I mean, look at the numbers, and the historical economic concepts beyond the Wealth of Nations, and compare it to the rest of the world economically and you'll see why no other country is on the GOP's side economically.


Is increased wealth the only measure of quality of life?
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PRO:
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ANTI:
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-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
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-Foreign Entanglements
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"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:24 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Is increased wealth the only measure of quality of life?

By the global standards, Republicans fail to increase quality of life, Democrats succeed, generally.


Nobody gives a shit about your "global standards" they're not relevant.
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PRO:
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ANTI:
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-Foreign Entanglements
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"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Necroghastia
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Postby Necroghastia » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:26 pm

Telconi wrote:
Eternal Lotharia wrote:By the global standards, Republicans fail to increase quality of life, Democrats succeed, generally.


Nobody gives a shit about your "global standards" they're not relevant.


Y'know, sticking your head in the sand and pretending that other nations don't have it better than you do and that you're the #1 all time best is exactly the same thing North Korea does iirc.
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Dresderstan
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Postby Dresderstan » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:30 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Nobody gives a shit about your "global standards" they're not relevant.

Yes they are because that's how humanity judges quality of life, your "nuh-uhhhh" isn't an argument it's just pathetic childish sticking out your tongue and covering your ears and yelling "nah-nah-nah I caan't hear you! There is no war in Ba-Sing-Se!"

As if you speak for all of humanity.

Pot, meet kettle.
23 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Fuck neo-liberalism

Biden and Trump are traitors to America.
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and is actively stripping away your constitutional rights.
Remake the Free World, wipe the slate clean, a nation born and baptized in blood and fire shall be reborn again.

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Telconi
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Founded: Oct 08, 2016
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:31 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:As if you speak for all of humanity.

Pot, meet kettle.

Necroghastia wrote:
Y'know, sticking your head in the sand and pretending that other nations don't have it better than you do and that you're the #1 all time best is exactly the same thing North Korea does iirc.


Your inability to grasp the concept of an opinion isn't my problem.
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Dresderstan
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Postby Dresderstan » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:33 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:As if you speak for all of humanity.

Pot, meet kettle.

Necroghastia wrote:
Y'know, sticking your head in the sand and pretending that other nations don't have it better than you do and that you're the #1 all time best is exactly the same thing North Korea does iirc.

Come up with your own argument instead of relying on the backs of someone else, or admit your hypocrisy.
23 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Fuck neo-liberalism

Biden and Trump are traitors to America.
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and is actively stripping away your constitutional rights.
Remake the Free World, wipe the slate clean, a nation born and baptized in blood and fire shall be reborn again.

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Dresderstan
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Founded: Jan 18, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Dresderstan » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:33 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Your inability to grasp the concept of an opinion isn't my problem.

...But scholars have detailed a equation for quality of life, so you're not denying opinions you're denying facts. Jesus Christ, stop being so dense.

Receipts, show them.
23 year old, PA male. Love sports like baseball, hockey and American football, enjoy video games and TV. Music chart nerd, can't live without it. I'm gay. Fuck neo-liberalism

Biden and Trump are traitors to America.
Imagine being shocked about the fact of greed, corruption, and abuse of power in government.
The media is a propaganda tool fueling the two parties hyperpartisanship and killing the country, it's time to end the "freedom of the press"
Violence against the government is and should be accepted by the people, especially when said government wants to and is actively stripping away your constitutional rights.
Remake the Free World, wipe the slate clean, a nation born and baptized in blood and fire shall be reborn again.

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Telconi
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Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:35 pm

Eternal Lotharia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Your inability to grasp the concept of an opinion isn't my problem.

...But scholars have detailed a equation for quality of life, so you're not denying opinions you're denying facts. Jesus Christ, stop being so dense.


The irony of this post is palpable.
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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:46 pm

Dresderstan wrote:
Eternal Lotharia wrote:

Come up with your own argument instead of relying on the backs of someone else, or admit your hypocrisy.


"If someone disagrees with me they're literally North Korea!" pretty much is the extent of Lotharia's argument too.
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ANTI:
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-Government Overreach
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-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
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"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Necroghastia
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Postby Necroghastia » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:47 pm

Telconi wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:Come up with your own argument instead of relying on the backs of someone else, or admit your hypocrisy.


"If someone disagrees with me they're literally North Korea!" pretty much is the extent of Lotharia's argument too.


imagine getting that out of what i said lmao
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Gormwood
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Postby Gormwood » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:50 pm

Oh, people think they can debate with a bad faith shitposter now?
Bloodthirsty savages who call for violence against the Right while simultaneously being unarmed defenseless sissies who will get slaughtered by the gun-toting Right in a civil war.
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Ngelmish
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Postby Ngelmish » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:53 pm

Telconi wrote:
Dresderstan wrote:Come up with your own argument instead of relying on the backs of someone else, or admit your hypocrisy.


"If someone disagrees with me they're literally North Korea!" pretty much is the extent of Lotharia's argument too.


Wait, does this mean...

Telconi wrote:
Eternal Lotharia wrote:Fine, what is extreme then? :eyebrow:


Whatever someone thinks it is.


Telconi wrote:
Eternal Lotharia wrote:I'm using the world's standards as a basis myself.
No, it shows that most Republicans are extremists, in a sense, at least compared to the rest of the world, in the views, far-right compared to most.

So calling Democrats radical-left is factually incorrect.


They're radicals compared to me. That is factually correct. Rather they're radicals compared to any other person, or group of people, is entirely irrelevant.


... that if someone disagrees with you, then they're "extreme?" You really shouldn't project so transparently.

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Telconi
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Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:54 pm

Necroghastia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
"If someone disagrees with me they're literally North Korea!" pretty much is the extent of Lotharia's argument too.


imagine getting that out of what i said lmao


Imagine being unable to grasp that people posses opinions different from your own.
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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:55 pm

Ngelmish wrote:
Telconi wrote:
"If someone disagrees with me they're literally North Korea!" pretty much is the extent of Lotharia's argument too.


Wait, does this mean...

Telconi wrote:
Whatever someone thinks it is.


Telconi wrote:
They're radicals compared to me. That is factually correct. Rather they're radicals compared to any other person, or group of people, is entirely irrelevant.


... that if someone disagrees with you, then they're "extreme?" You really shouldn't project so transparently.


Extremism isn't the same as lying.
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ANTI:
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-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Necroghastia
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Founded: May 11, 2019
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Necroghastia » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:58 pm

Telconi wrote:
Ngelmish wrote:
Wait, does this mean...





... that if someone disagrees with you, then they're "extreme?" You really shouldn't project so transparently.


Extremism isn't the same as lying.


Of course it is. Extremism is whatever one believes it to be after all :)
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Telconi
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Postby Telconi » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:00 pm

Necroghastia wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Extremism isn't the same as lying.


Of course it is. Extremism is whatever one believes it to be after all :)


You truly don't think people can disagree with you legitimately?
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PRO:
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-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

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Aclion
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Postby Aclion » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:25 pm

Telconi wrote:
Eternal Lotharia wrote:No, look at the economic policies, compared to Dems, the Republicans fail utterly and the rich get richer. I mean, look at the numbers, and the historical economic concepts beyond the Wealth of Nations, and compare it to the rest of the world economically and you'll see why no other country is on the GOP's side economically.


Is increased wealth the only measure of quality of life?

It's strongly associated with wealth, yes, since most of the things that improve quality of life cost money. However cost of living is also a factor, which is something Eternal Lotharia overlooks(being very generous here and pretending he actually looked at the numbers) While it's true democrat controlled areas tend to have higher income they also tend to have higher a high cost of living for a given quality of life, with the effect that people in republican areas tend to be richer in terms of purchasing power even though they have less money. https://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstal ... ba10051d60

Additionally when comparing Republican and Democrat policies it's important to compare them not as a snapshot, but to also look at trends. Both economic and political. It's true, again, that blue states, like California, Connecticut, tend to have stronger economies then red states, like like Texas or Idaho. But when you look at the economic outlook it show quit a different picture, Connecticut and California are in decline while Texas and Idaho are in upsurge. Why? Because the parties switched control of these states some time ago an have been slowly changing policies to suit them. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opin ... ok-in-2018
Last edited by Aclion on Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
A popular Government, without popular information, or the means of acquiring it, is but a Prologue to a Farce or a Tragedy; or, perhaps both. - James Madison.

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