Google v. Almost Everyone

[Pacomia]

Well, sure, but just because you're the one making deals with Cthulhu doesn't make you the good guy.

Don't you think that if these services were owned by smaller companies they'd be even easier for the government to push around?

Push around how? Make them pay minimum wages? Give their workers rights? Avert a second monopoly? What is the government doing?

[Pacomia]

That’s not necessarily true. Resources can be allocated across child companies, I think devs would probably take what they can get and join wherever, and I’m willing to sacrifice a bit of financial security for dismantling a monopoly.

If companies don't have financial security they're inclined to take less risks.

What counts as a “risk”?

[Galloism]

Well, sure, but just because you're the one making deals with Cthulhu doesn't make you the good guy.

Don't you think that if these services were owned by smaller companies they'd be even easier for the government to push around?

Um, probably not, or at least it would be likely some of them would push back. And at least one would push back publicly most likely, which would result in public knowledge of the push around.

When you have a single monolithic company, there's a single point of failure that allows these things to occur without pushback. WIth multiple companies, and different management teams, you'll get different decisions being made.

Besides that, there's a bit of a circle thing, but the fact that a company is so big it's in violation of antitrust law actually makes it vulnerable to government push around. "That's a nice company you got there. Would be too bad if... someone split it in into 10 pieces." Or, if there are no anti-trust laws - "That's a nice search engine you got there. Would be a shame if there was a $0.05 per search use tax on it."

[Kernen]

I don't think that is the argument.

I meant bad as in 'have problems.' Why should we care about the size of google?

Because large companies can, and often do, push around consumers when there is no effective competition. Competition is why capitalism works.

[Galloism]

That’s not necessarily true. Resources can be allocated across child companies, I think devs would probably take what they can get and join wherever, and I’m willing to sacrifice a bit of financial security for dismantling a monopoly.

If companies don't have financial security they're inclined to take less risks.

Um, economically, this is a good thing.

[Nova Cyberia]

Well, sure, but just because you're the one making deals with Cthulhu doesn't make you the good guy.

Don't you think that if these services were owned by smaller companies they'd be even easier for the government to push around?

Is that so wrong?

I mean, when they aren't being pushed around they're busy monopolizing the markets and collecting data on millions of Americans to feed to the NSA.

[Cekoviu]

Google, Amazon, Apple and other tech companies are in serious violation of anitrust laws, have huge monopolies, and need to be broken up, plain and simple.

Yet I type this on an Apple phone using the Google Chrome search browser on a site whose internet is likely run by Amazon.

Guess I’m a hypocrite then.

EDIT: why is california not doing an antitrust investigation
did bapple and goggle bribe the state government

You can at least fix the Chrome part. Firefox has a perfectly good mobile browser available; use that instead.

I'm typing this in Firefox on Windows 7. I'm not saying Microsoft is 100% innocent either. Of course California wouldn't do anything; Google is based there and they probably get lots of money out of the Google people.

I will concede, however, that Google Maps is probably the best out there when it comes to maps; only OpenStreetMap comes close. The alternative is just plain inaccurate for my area.

I like Microsoft better, if they still made Windows phones I would have one of those. Can’t say I like Androids all that much, though. My laptop runs on Windows.

Do you have a reason to run Windows over Linux?

Big Tech/Silicon Valley are largely based in Cali, so it would make sense that they'd want to protect one of their big industries, even when most big tech companies are incredibly shady.

At any rate, seeing pretty much the entire nation begin an investigation is good. I'd loose no sleep to see companies like Google or Facebook broken up.

Partition Google between Bing, AskJeeves and DuckDuckGo.

Make Google the internet Poland.

>AskJeeves
lol ok grandpa

So which services that google offers are actually bad?

Chrome OS. Enough said.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

If companies don't have financial security they're inclined to take less risks.

Um, economically, this is a good thing.

I'm not really interested in the economy, I care about the product being more innovative.

[Galloism]

Um, economically, this is a good thing.

I'm not really interested in the economy, I care about the product being more innovative.

Then we should probably break up google. With different companies going in different directions, you'll get different products that are innovative in different ways, thereby increasing variety.

The problem with monopolies is they tend to stagnate.

Well, that's not the only one, but that's one of them.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Don't you think that if these services were owned by smaller companies they'd be even easier for the government to push around?

Is that so wrong?

I mean, when they aren't being pushed around they're busy monopolizing the markets and collecting data on millions of Americans to feed to the NSA.

The government only cares about respecting privacy when it's someone else doing the snooping.

[Kernen]

Um, economically, this is a good thing.

I'm not really interested in the economy, I care about the product being more innovative.

There's no reason to innovate if you've no competition.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I'm not really interested in the economy, I care about the product being more innovative.

Then we should probably break up google. With different companies going in different directions, you'll get different products that are innovative in different ways, thereby increasing variety.

The problem with monopolies is they tend to stagnate.

Well, that's not the only one, but that's one of them.

And so why is google continually releasing new products in different areas? They're not stagnating.

[Nova Cyberia]

Is that so wrong?

I mean, when they aren't being pushed around they're busy monopolizing the markets and collecting data on millions of Americans to feed to the NSA.

The government only cares about respecting privacy when it's someone else doing the snooping.

I guess it'd be preferable for them to not care at all and let anyone snoop?

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I'm not really interested in the economy, I care about the product being more innovative.

There's no reason to innovate if you've no competition.

Google does have competition, aside from possibly in youtube. Other search engines, browsers, mapping services, shopping directories exist.

[Drongonia]

Capitalism, not corporatism! Yes, break up Alphabet into individual companies, that way it might make it easier for international governments to ensure tax compliance too.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

The government only cares about respecting privacy when it's someone else doing the snooping.

I guess it'd be preferable for them to not care at all and let anyone snoop?

I have a lot less concern about companies having my data than the government having it.

[Cekoviu]

Um, economically, this is a good thing.

I'm not really interested in the economy, I care about the product being more innovative.

Are you posting this using Opera Neon running on a custom LFS build or are you full of nonsense?

[Kernen]

There's no reason to innovate if you've no competition.

Google does have competition, aside from possibly in youtube. Other search engines, browsers, mapping services, shopping directories exist.

But not on multiple levels. Not all monopolies are horizontal. Owning a sufficient share of different markets can be sufficient.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I'm not really interested in the economy, I care about the product being more innovative.

Are you posting this using Opera Neon running on a custom LFS build or are you full of nonsense?

No, I'm using chrome. It's a fast and customiseable browser that crucially doesn't allow sound to autoplay most of the time.

[Nova Cyberia]

I guess it'd be preferable for them to not care at all and let anyone snoop?

I have a lot less concern about companies having my data than the government having it.

Google is feeding data directly to the NSA so there you go.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I have a lot less concern about companies having my data than the government having it.

Google is feeding data directly to the NSA so there you go.

So the right path for the states to take would be one that aims to restrict their ability to do that, but they're too cowardly to come out against the security apparatus.

[Galloism]

Then we should probably break up google. With different companies going in different directions, you'll get different products that are innovative in different ways, thereby increasing variety.

The problem with monopolies is they tend to stagnate.

Well, that's not the only one, but that's one of them.

And so why is google continually releasing new products in different areas? They're not stagnating.

How has their search functionality, the core business, improved in the last 5 years?

No cheating.

[Cekoviu]

Are you posting this using Opera Neon running on a custom LFS build or are you full of nonsense?

No, I'm using chrome. It's a fast and customiseable browser that crucially doesn't allow sound to autoplay most of the time.

If you like innovation, Chrome is trash lol. Opera Neon is the weirdest and most innovative browser to date. Thus, you don't actually like innovation that much.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

And so why is google continually releasing new products in different areas? They're not stagnating.

How has their search functionality, the core business, improved in the last 5 years?

No cheating.

Does it need to? It kind of does what it says on the tin.

[Galloism]

How has their search functionality, the core business, improved in the last 5 years?

No cheating.

Does it need to? It kind of does what it says on the tin.

So it's stagnated?