Is consumerism ruining us?

[Petrolheadia]

To a narrow subset of people.


And I disagree with them.


At this rate you may call for abolition of law enforcement due to the negative impact on criminals' lives.

I downplay it because it is insignificant when compared to the other side of the coin.

It is a simple historical fact that the US saw its greatest economic improvements and wage growth under Hamiltonian economics, and that real wage growth has stagnated since outsourcing.

It simply has been a disaster here, not just for a small segment of the population. And thus we must fight it, regardless of your contrarian view that cares nothing for the welfare of our people.

Source on the "historical fact"?

And why should I care about a subset of a subset of the global population?

[Novus America]

It is a simple historical fact that the US saw its greatest economic improvements and wage growth under Hamiltonian economics, and that real wage growth has stagnated since outsourcing.

It simply has been a disaster here, not just for a small segment of the population. And thus we must fight it, regardless of your contrarian view that cares nothing for the welfare of our people.

Source on the "historical fact"?

And why should I care about a subset of a subset of the global population?

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2 ... r-decades/
US real incomes peaked in the early 70s.

And maybe you do not care about us but we do care, and why should we care about your obviously (at least for us) harmful ideology? Why should we not reject it for our own self benefit?

[Stylan]

Fuck yes. And it will continue to so long as the capitalist system is upheld. Capitalism destroys true culture.

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/750f/5 ... 5437cb.pdf

Great read. I would recommend anyone who agrees with that consumerism is bad read Adorno and other Frankfurt School members. Despite what neofascists would have you believe, Marxists hate the destruction of true culture as much as anyone else. They just don't predicate the notion of culture on the idea that all good culture is white, or that Western culture is superior, etc.

[US-SSR]

Not exactly. Late-stage capitalism is ruining us. Consumerism is the symptom, not the disease.

[Trollgaard]

I'm sure you've all seen it before. One of your friends got some new shoes that are supposedly the hottest on the market. Maybe your grandpa buys a new car each year and each year the cars get flashier. Perhaps your parents bought a house in the exurbs and now think they're rich like the great Gatsby cause it's 4000 square feet and has a walk out basement that faces a lake. Maybe you yourself are a victim of the comsumerism.

Starting with the end of world war II and an economic boom in the 1950s, corporations have increasingly peddled new and often redundant products to the average american, claiming that you can't live without it and everyone's buying it. People blow money on new clothes and gadgets annually in an attempt to be "with it" and show that they're not out of the loop. Americans love their goods and services

But has consumerism hurt us? Many seniors failed to save up for retirement and now rely on the government dole to survive. Poor people waste money that could go toward food on air jordans and the newest iphone. Mom and dad went and bought a lakefront home but now they can't afford the mortgage and the house got foreclosed on. To me, it seems that consumerism often runs people ragged and ruins a society and culture

I do not partake it consumer trends. My clothing is plain and working class oriented (a maroon bomber jacket, work boots and a couple pairs of sneakers, maybe ten different average looking t shirts and a couple sweaters and five pairs of jeans, most of which have holes in them). I don't own a car because I lived in a city with terrible traffic for two years. My music selection is as far from the mainstream as a future is from me and I don't run to the nearest FYE to buy the newest lil pump album "to look cool." To put it simply, I forsake basing my entire existence off having the newest and best products from the market. So what is your opinion Nsers? Do you think consumer craze is ruining our culture and country or is the consumer economy a good thing that helps our nation?

Excessive consumerism, yes.

Going out and buying new things from time to time is fine.

I do take issue with your not saving for retirement statement- how the hell is one supposed to do that? If someone is under 50 at the moment they should plan on working till they die unless they have a nice nest egg. Anything else is setting yourself up for a rude awakening down the line.

[Novus America]

I'm a bit saddened this hasn't gotten any responses yet but yes it absolutely has, its killed us as a culture. If there was any one singular thing we should destroy in the modern world it would be consumerism, a great many issues facing us can in some way be linked to it.

However consumerism finances capitalism.

Yet capitalism in the form the GOP wants disempowers workers.

In my view, consumerism needs to remain, but needs to be used in moderation. I am a product of consumerism, my interests, my political beliefs, etc.

I was born into this new era. I appreciate some of it's aspects, but despise others.

We need a Populist reform of economics and society as a whole, not just in laws, culture, or views but of how we act, educate, and view philosophy.

Consumerism was fine when it was mostly buying domestic goods, but once we adopted race to the bottom outsourcing it failed us.

[The Emerald Legion]

If it's too expensive to use labour in a particular country, it's unreasonable to expect companies to continue doing it.

Which is why free movement of people is such an essential part of capitalism. Labour moves to where there are jobs and when they do the push down the cost of labour until it reaches a point where it stops drawing in people. It forms a self regulating system.

Not really. Moving is still expensive, meaning there will be people who are simply incapable of moving.

[Latin Islands]

Jesus Christ, can you suck your own dick any harder?

Your definition of your identity in opposition to "consumerism" means that you're absolutely partaking in a trend and frankly are perhaps even more defined by it than those who unconsciously participate in it lol

Who buys albums these days? Everyone's on streaming services now.

Sometimes I do, secondhand CDs specifically. Is there a problem?

[Liriena]

Yes, but consumerism ought to be understood as being an element of a greater system. Y'all know which one. When your economic system needs constant growth, this encourages things like consumerism as a way to (theoretically) guarantee this constant growth.

Asides from the environmental consequences of consumerism, there are also terrible socioeconomic and cultural consequences to it. When those who wield the means to produce consumer goods in the culture industry work within the logic that they need to sell as much as humanly possible for as long as humanly possible one way or the other, that adds an often unfortunate factor in creative decision-making. And also, it generally screws the workers who make consumer goods over.

[Kombinita Socialisma Demokratio]

Even as a libertarian, I agree that consumerism is horrible. It contributes to society's lack of a transcendent purpose, ruins the environment, subsidizes poor living conditions abroad, and makes the populace less conscious of the issues that face our species. Capitalism and the free market are a force for good and change, but vapid and mindless consumerism are one of the major vices of the west.

It makes people less self reliant as well. A person who blows all their money is someone who will wanna be on the government dole when they reach retirement. This is why the boomer generation is really straining our system. They were vapid consumers and wasted lots of money that they should have saved

And now some Gen-Xers I know are saying that the decline of consumerism is ruining the economy...

Encouraging spending is wrong, regardless of any positive or negative economic impact that it may cause.

[Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana]

Yes, but consumerism ought to be understood as being an element of a greater system. Y'all know which one. When your economic system needs constant growth, this encourages things like consumerism as a way to (theoretically) guarantee this constant growth.

I’ll say it for you, capitalism

Asides from the environmental consequences of consumerism, there are also terrible socioeconomic and cultural consequences to it. When those who wield the means to produce consumer goods in the culture industry work within the logic that they need to sell as much as humanly possible for as long as humanly possible one way or the other, that adds an often unfortunate factor in creative decision-making. And also, it generally screws the workers who make consumer goods over.

Consumerism screws the target more than the worker. Factories don’t tend to employ human workers much anymore, How It’s Made makes it obvious

[GLDF]

It's not bad unless you act like an idiot about it.

[Rojava Free State]

I'm sure you've all seen it before. One of your friends got some new shoes that are supposedly the hottest on the market. Maybe your grandpa buys a new car each year and each year the cars get flashier. Perhaps your parents bought a house in the exurbs and now think they're rich like the great Gatsby cause it's 4000 square feet and has a walk out basement that faces a lake. Maybe you yourself are a victim of the comsumerism.

Starting with the end of world war II and an economic boom in the 1950s, corporations have increasingly peddled new and often redundant products to the average american, claiming that you can't live without it and everyone's buying it. People blow money on new clothes and gadgets annually in an attempt to be "with it" and show that they're not out of the loop. Americans love their goods and services

But has consumerism hurt us? Many seniors failed to save up for retirement and now rely on the government dole to survive. Poor people waste money that could go toward food on air jordans and the newest iphone. Mom and dad went and bought a lakefront home but now they can't afford the mortgage and the house got foreclosed on. To me, it seems that consumerism often runs people ragged and ruins a society and culture

I do not partake it consumer trends. My clothing is plain and working class oriented (a maroon bomber jacket, work boots and a couple pairs of sneakers, maybe ten different average looking t shirts and a couple sweaters and five pairs of jeans, most of which have holes in them). I don't own a car because I lived in a city with terrible traffic for two years. My music selection is as far from the mainstream as a future is from me and I don't run to the nearest FYE to buy the newest lil pump album "to look cool." To put it simply, I forsake basing my entire existence off having the newest and best products from the market. So what is your opinion Nsers? Do you think consumer craze is ruining our culture and country or is the consumer economy a good thing that helps our nation?

Excessive consumerism, yes.

Going out and buying new things from time to time is fine.

I do take issue with your not saving for retirement statement- how the hell is one supposed to do that? If someone is under 50 at the moment they should plan on working till they die unless they have a nice nest egg. Anything else is setting yourself up for a rude awakening down the line.

The boomers had decades to save for retirement and had more opportunities than we do and yet they didn't and now rely on the government to help them. I take a major issue with paying my money toward people who weren't careful and knowing I will not get anywhere near the same aid

[Rojava Free State]

I do not partake it consumer trends. My clothing is plain and working class oriented (a maroon bomber jacket, work boots and a couple pairs of sneakers, maybe ten different average looking t shirts and a couple sweaters and five pairs of jeans, most of which have holes in them). I don't own a car because I lived in a city with terrible traffic for two years. My music selection is as far from the mainstream as a future is from me and I don't run to the nearest FYE to buy the newest lil pump album "to look cool." To put it simply, I forsake basing my entire existence off having the newest and best products from the market.

Jesus Christ, can you suck your own dick any harder?

Your definition of your identity in opposition to "consumerism" means that you're absolutely partaking in a trend and frankly are perhaps even more defined by it than those who unconsciously participate in it lol

Well aren't you butthurt? Jesus Christ did you fall out of bed this morning or something ?

And what trend am I partaking in? I do not associate with some broad anti cnsumerist novwment. I simply live within my means. Most people are pro consumerism and feed into it so clearly this so called trend doesn't exist. Take your garbage elsewhere, you literally just came here to insult and nothing else

[Petrolheadia]

Source on the "historical fact"?

And why should I care about a subset of a subset of the global population?

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2 ... r-decades/
US real incomes peaked in the early 70s.

And maybe you do not care about us but we do care, and why should we care about your obviously (at least for us) harmful ideology? Why should we not reject it for our own self benefit?

Maybe US government shouldn't be paying lip service to factory workers and neglecting immigrants, but do it the other way around.

At least they'd be helping people actually willing to put in the work to make their life better.

[Page]

I've made an effort to detach from consumerism, though of course I am still taking part in it because it's inescapable, but I've tried to make small changes. For example, I used to be really into vaping culture, I would spend stupid amounts of money on ''craft'' and ''vintage'' e-liquids and equipment because I enjoyed vaping as a hobby. I switched to making my own liquid from scratch at home (saving 3/4 of the money I spent before) and stick with basic devices now.

I buy very cheap and practical clothes. I have a dozen plain t-shirts of various colors and generic shorts and jeans. The few expensive pieces of clothing I own were given to me from my father-in-law because we're the same height and build but he has a big old man belly now so they don't fit. In my teens and early 20's I loved to wear designer clothes, especially skater themed stuff (in my defense, I actually do skate), but nowadays I prefer plain and subtle clothes. On a normal day I'm just wearing a solid color t-shirt and some unremarkable shorts or jeans. I was inspired a bit by George Carlin who once answered a question about wearing plain black clothes for all of his shows by saying he didn't want to be an advertisement.

These little changes don't do much to change the world, but it makes me feel better to not define myself by brand names.

[Novo Vaticanus]

Reject consumerism, return to distributism

[Jack Thomas Lang]

Reject consumerism, return to distributism

Distributist gang assemble.

[Phoenicaea]

^i ve read consumerism being symptom here, still i believe you have to see it as disease.

[Novus America]

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2 ... r-decades/
US real incomes peaked in the early 70s.

And maybe you do not care about us but we do care, and why should we care about your obviously (at least for us) harmful ideology? Why should we not reject it for our own self benefit?

Maybe US government shouldn't be paying lip service to factory workers and neglecting immigrants, but do it the other way around.

At least they'd be helping people actually willing to put in the work to make their life better.

What? First of all this is just a diversion from my point.
Second of all immigrants and factory workers are not mutually exclusive. Immigrants can and do work in factories! Stagnant real wages and millions of jobs lost hurt immigrants too.

Also other way around?!
That would be giving lip service to immigrants and neglecting factory workers...
That would help no one...
And again does not even make any sense, of the 5 million Americans who lost their jobs from outsourcing many thousands were immigrants.

[Neko-koku]

Reject consumerism, return to distributism

Distributist gang assemble.

Everything is downstream from religion and lack thereof.

Distributism is really essentially a moderate form of socialism.

[Petrolheadia]

Maybe US government shouldn't be paying lip service to factory workers and neglecting immigrants, but do it the other way around.

At least they'd be helping people actually willing to put in the work to make their life better.

What? First of all this is just a diversion from my point.
Second of all immigrants and factory workers are not mutually exclusive. Immigrants can and do work in factories! Stagnant real wages and millions of jobs lost hurt immigrants too.

Also other way around?!
That would be giving lip service to immigrants and neglecting factory workers...
That would help no one...
And again does not even make any sense, of the 5 million Americans who lost their jobs from outsourcing many thousands were immigrants.

Still, my bottom line is that people should be prepared to change their jobs or even leave the country, not keep complaining.

[Rojava Free State]

What? First of all this is just a diversion from my point.
Second of all immigrants and factory workers are not mutually exclusive. Immigrants can and do work in factories! Stagnant real wages and millions of jobs lost hurt immigrants too.

Also other way around?!
That would be giving lip service to immigrants and neglecting factory workers...
That would help no one...
And again does not even make any sense, of the 5 million Americans who lost their jobs from outsourcing many thousands were immigrants.

Still, my bottom line is that people should be prepared to change their jobs or even leave the country, not keep complaining.

Or maybe jobs should pay their workers a fair wage and grant them normal humane working conditions.

[Neko-koku]

Still, my bottom line is that people should be prepared to change their jobs or even leave the country, not keep complaining.

Or maybe jobs should pay their workers a fair wage and grant them normal humane working conditions.

PRC exists. Due to the existence of PRC pretty much anything that can be outsourced to PRC will be outsourced to PRC. Vietnam essentially functions as a smaller, pro-West PRC. Then how can you ever have wages and working conditions above levels of China and Vietnam?

Sanctioning the PRC simply causes PRC goods to sneak into America through Vietnam, Cambodia and other countries. Pretty much the entire Old World except for Britain, Iceland, Cape Verde etc need to be completely blockaded if you want to prevent PRC-style production from affecting America.

[Neko-koku]

Without defeating the CCP there can never be freedom for humanity.