The Thread Formerly Known As Communism Will Save The World

[Ifreann]

So what the fuck does "the extent to which they perpetuate their world view" mean?

The way they dress it up as some noble cause or for the "greater good". In a historical sense - oh, I dunno - murdering people and causing mass famines?

To perpetuate is to make something to continue perpetually, indefinitely. Perpetuating a world view entails spreading that view. Telling other people about it, writing books about it, making websites about it.

[Esheaun Stroakuss]

The way they dress it up as some noble cause or for the "greater good". In a historical sense - oh, I dunno - murdering people and causing mass famines?

To perpetuate is to make something to continue perpetually, indefinitely. Perpetuating a world view entails spreading that view. Telling other people about it, writing books about it, making websites about it.

Which they do, with the exact methods you have listed as examples. The use of the internet, whether it's creating threads on websites like these are websites dedicated to the cause - Marxists.org. There are also leaflets, fliers, occasional rallies (not necessarily from communists but generally). In academia, without trying to sound like one of them "eww cultural Marxists" types, there is a sympathy to the ideology purely because of intent.

[Ifreann]

To perpetuate is to make something to continue perpetually, indefinitely. Perpetuating a world view entails spreading that view. Telling other people about it, writing books about it, making websites about it.

Which they do, with the exact methods you have listed as examples. The use of the internet, whether it's creating threads on websites like these are websites dedicated to the cause - Marxists.org. There are also leaflets, fliers, occasional rallies (not necessarily from communists but generally). In academia, without trying to sound like one of them "eww cultural Marxists" types, there is a sympathy to the ideology purely because of intent.

So you hate communism because people talk about communism and write books about communism and make websites about communism.

Like. You understand that people do that about literally everything, right?

[Esheaun Stroakuss]

Which they do, with the exact methods you have listed as examples. The use of the internet, whether it's creating threads on websites like these are websites dedicated to the cause - Marxists.org. There are also leaflets, fliers, occasional rallies (not necessarily from communists but generally). In academia, without trying to sound like one of them "eww cultural Marxists" types, there is a sympathy to the ideology purely because of intent.

So you hate communism because people talk about communism and write books about communism and make websites about communism.

Like. You understand that people do that about literally everything, right?

I don't hate communism because of people talking about it. I don't even hate it. I just has an intense dislike of it because of the way it's framed in discussions as this noble cause or that it has good intentions and all that crap, especially when it's seen as better than fascism or Nazism which were their own evil.

[Diamond Snow]

A nation that wants to regulate the economy will also try to regulate citizens' lifestyles.
Human rights and Diversity of lifestyle and value cannot be separated from economic freedom.

[GlobalControl]

So you hate communism because people talk about communism and write books about communism and make websites about communism.

Like. You understand that people do that about literally everything, right?

I don't hate communism because of people talking about it. I don't even hate it. I just has an intense dislike of it because of the way it's framed in discussions as this noble cause or that it has good intentions and all that crap, especially when it's seen as better than fascism or Nazism which were their own evil.

You'd think one might hate it because every attempt at it in its history has led to mass famine, genocide, economic collapse and suffering. But I guess that's a valid point too.

[Ifreann]

So you hate communism because people talk about communism and write books about communism and make websites about communism.

Like. You understand that people do that about literally everything, right?

I don't hate communism because of people talking about it. I don't even hate it. I just has an intense dislike of it because of the way it's framed in discussions as this noble cause or that it has good intentions and all that crap, especially when it's seen as better than fascism or Nazism which were their own evil.

Is there any cause that isn't framed as being noble and having good intentions?

[Russkiya Svyachena]

See?????? Even the Russians want the USSR back.

The only people who want the USSR back are boomers who can’t face the fact that their ideas are outdated. The same demographic that was wants to bring back segregation in the Deep South of America

[Yuyencia]

My friend are uneducate。 Many status unsatisfactory are consequence personality ability（but I am admit hiaerarchy sorting current are not full perfection）。Are proletarian morality to simple demand good and not enact courage ability obtain。

[Kingdoms of germany]

The communist will destroy everything

[Ethel mermania]

Communism is going to get me a mate?

[Ifreann]

Communism is going to get me a mate?

Is capitalism what got you your current one?

[Ethel mermania]

Communism is going to get me a mate?

Is capitalism what got you your current one?

My suaveness, and stunning good looks did that.

I was responding to the OP, and the way it mishmashed equality and misogyny, that's what I got out of it.

[Ifreann]

Is capitalism what got you your current one?

My suaveness, and stunning good looks did that.

I was responding to the OP, and the way it mishmashed equality and misogyny, that's what I got out of it.

Well, you know what they say. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

[Ethel mermania]

My suaveness, and stunning good looks did that.

I was responding to the OP, and the way it mishmashed equality and misogyny, that's what I got out of it.

Well, you know what they say. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

That seemed to be the implication, yes. Tbh I have never seen communism applied in quite that way.

[Nakena]

You basically confirmed what is behind that link I just posted.

It's nothing to do with envy. It's that billionaires are vastly more rich than most people realise. Our brains aren't wired to really grok numbers that large, so we think of "billion" as just "the one after million". Even if you know that a billion is a thousand million, that's still just numbers too big to comprehend. The best way to understand is through analogy.

I like the analogy of a staircase, where every step is a net worth of $100,000. Half the United States can't even get up the first step. The people on the 5th step are richer than 80% of Americans. The people on the 11th step are richer than 90% of Americans. "Billionaire" starts at the 10,000th step, and each billion is another 10,000 steps up. The working, middle, and upper classes are all on the first few feet of the staircase, but Jeff Bezos is the equivalent of 133 miles away.

Or consider a 10x10x10 cube of marbles. That's 1000 marbles, about the size of a large computer. A 10x10x10 cube of those cubes is a million marbles, around the size of an average room. A 10x10x10 cube of those cubes is a billion marbles, about the size of a mansion. Jeff Bezos has over 113 mansions of marbles.

If you were given $10 a year every year since the dinosaurs went extinct, you would only have one half of one billion dollars.

One thousand seconds is about 17 minutes. One million seconds is about 12 days. One billion seconds is about 32 years. If you were making one dollar a second, every second, it would take more than 3,500 years to have as much money as Jeff Bezos does now.

And all that money, all those miles of stairway, those mansions of marbles, those millennia at $1/s, that doesn't come from nowhere. And Jeff Bezos sure as shit isn't earning it with whatever the hell he does from nine to five. Even if you like the basic idea of capitalism, of entrepreneurs establishing businesses and competing in a free market, of workers selling their labour to those businesses, how can it be remotely fair that Jeff Bezos' wealth is so far beyond what even other CEOs makes. He's not doing more work, or better work, he's not innovating anything. But he's reaping incomprehensible profits.

Oh boy.

Yes I get it. Jeff Bezos is rich. Like really really rich. He could easily buy me off. No doubt involved.

So he's making a lot of money. Like really much. And that comes down to scaling, like once you get past a certain point the scaling starts to increase. And below that, well you crash down to plain zero.

And yes things are unfair sometimes. Life as a whole tends to be unfair. It has been unfair to me. So what I can do about it? Trying to improve things, to survive, to manage and to get stronger from the things that haven't killed me yet.

Nothing much you can do about it, but to take it anyways. Nasty ain't it?

As I wrote before, I don't really care about Jeff as long as I get my cuts. :^)

[Hirota]

Is capitalism what got you your current one?

My suaveness, and stunning good looks did that.

You can't have that. It must be equally distributed amongst the proletariat.

[Ethel mermania]

My suaveness, and stunning good looks did that.

You can't have that. It must be equally distributed amongst the proletariat.

Charm class starts at noon

[Ifreann]

It's nothing to do with envy. It's that billionaires are vastly more rich than most people realise. Our brains aren't wired to really grok numbers that large, so we think of "billion" as just "the one after million". Even if you know that a billion is a thousand million, that's still just numbers too big to comprehend. The best way to understand is through analogy.

I like the analogy of a staircase, where every step is a net worth of $100,000. Half the United States can't even get up the first step. The people on the 5th step are richer than 80% of Americans. The people on the 11th step are richer than 90% of Americans. "Billionaire" starts at the 10,000th step, and each billion is another 10,000 steps up. The working, middle, and upper classes are all on the first few feet of the staircase, but Jeff Bezos is the equivalent of 133 miles away.

Or consider a 10x10x10 cube of marbles. That's 1000 marbles, about the size of a large computer. A 10x10x10 cube of those cubes is a million marbles, around the size of an average room. A 10x10x10 cube of those cubes is a billion marbles, about the size of a mansion. Jeff Bezos has over 113 mansions of marbles.

If you were given $10 a year every year since the dinosaurs went extinct, you would only have one half of one billion dollars.

One thousand seconds is about 17 minutes. One million seconds is about 12 days. One billion seconds is about 32 years. If you were making one dollar a second, every second, it would take more than 3,500 years to have as much money as Jeff Bezos does now.

And all that money, all those miles of stairway, those mansions of marbles, those millennia at $1/s, that doesn't come from nowhere. And Jeff Bezos sure as shit isn't earning it with whatever the hell he does from nine to five. Even if you like the basic idea of capitalism, of entrepreneurs establishing businesses and competing in a free market, of workers selling their labour to those businesses, how can it be remotely fair that Jeff Bezos' wealth is so far beyond what even other CEOs makes. He's not doing more work, or better work, he's not innovating anything. But he's reaping incomprehensible profits.

Oh boy.

Yes I get it. Jeff Bezos is rich. Like really really rich. He could easily buy me off. No doubt involved.

So he's making a lot of money. Like really much. And that comes down to scaling, like once you get past a certain point the scaling starts to increase. And below that, well you crash down to plain zero.

And yes things are unfair sometimes. Life as a whole tends to be unfair. It has been unfair to me. So what I can do about it?

Make it fair, obviously.

Trying to improve things, to survive, to manage and to get stronger from the things that haven't killed me yet.

Nothing much you can do about it, but to take it anyways. Nasty ain't it?

Yes. Which is why we should change it.

As I wrote before, I don't really care about Jeff as long as I get my cuts. :^)

But that's just the thing, he's that rich because he's getting the money from other people's work.

[Nakena]

Oh boy.

Yes I get it. Jeff Bezos is rich. Like really really rich. He could easily buy me off. No doubt involved.

So he's making a lot of money. Like really much. And that comes down to scaling, like once you get past a certain point the scaling starts to increase. And below that, well you crash down to plain zero.

And yes things are unfair sometimes. Life as a whole tends to be unfair. It has been unfair to me. So what I can do about it?

Make it fair, obviously.

Trying to improve things, to survive, to manage and to get stronger from the things that haven't killed me yet.

Nothing much you can do about it, but to take it anyways. Nasty ain't it?

Yes. Which is why we should change it.

As I wrote before, I don't really care about Jeff as long as I get my cuts. :^)

But that's just the thing, he's that rich because he's getting the money from other people's work.

The universe is uncaring, unfear and inherently chaotic by design. I learned this the hard way.

The only way to improve things is to increase our rate of resilence, surviability and mastering of its conditions. Which is mostly done by technological advances and social engineering. (for example Social Democracy)

The big error in marxist worldview is the whole envyness and a fundamental broken perception of how the world, man and everything works. Its flawed and reductionist as Purgatio has explained.

And yes, I am also profiting off others people work. So you are by all likehood. Which I am sure you do.

And if you weren't I would find a way to make you complicit. ^^

[Ifreann]

Make it fair, obviously.

Yes. Which is why we should change it.


But that's just the thing, he's that rich because he's getting the money from other people's work.

The universe is uncaring, unfear and inherently chaotic by design. I learned this the hard way.

The universe was not designed, and the current state of human society is not written into the fabric of reality. We don't need the universe to care in order to make a more fair society.

The only way to improve things is to increase our rate of resilence, surviability and mastering of its conditions. Which is mostly done by technological advances and social engineering. (for example Social Democracy)

Capitalists have been knowingly poisoning the world for decades to make a profit.

The big error in marxist worldview is the whole envyness

Envy doesn't enter into it.

and a fundamental broken perception of how the world, man and everything works. Its flawed and reductionist as Purgatio has explained.

I care as much about Purgatio's assertions about Marxism as I care about his insane lies about fascists accidentally attacking people with hammers in the course of defending themselves from thrown rocks. If Purgatio posts about the sky being blue, I'd look out a window to check.

And yes, I am also profiting off others people work. So you are by all likehood. Which I am sure you do.

I don't know(or care, for the record) about you, but I make my money from selling my labour, not from owning the means of production. But I do live under capitalism and have to participate in capitalism if I want to continue living.

And if you weren't I would find a way to make you complicit. ^^

Do you think that this is some kind of clever gotcha?

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Has it saved any of the countries where it’s been instituted?

[Lanorth]

Maybe not this world, try another maybe?

[Strahcoin]

I fail to see how communism will save the world. On the contrary, I think it will cause its downfall.

Capitalism has brought many, many people out of poverty. It has led to wonderful innovation such as the telegraph, airplane, personal computer, iPhone, and NationStates. Communism, on the other hand, has led to starvation and persecution wherever it is attempted (see Jamestown, USSR, China, North Korea, Cuba, and Venezuela).

Not to mention it is completely immoral to forcibly confiscate (aka steal) all of the justly-earned property of the hard working entrepreneurs and upper/middle class.

In most cases, it isn't justly-earned. Most of it is passed down or built by the proletarian. It is, technically, theirs and always has been.

Cuba is yet another example of a fundamentally unequal and hypocritical communist government.

Cuba is a much smaller island with a smaller economy that the others. Give it a chance.

1. In a free-market capitalist society, the worker willingly signs the contract with the employer and is payed a mutually agreed upon wage predetermined by the signed contract. In return, the worker works for the employer. So, it is technically the employer buying the worker's production - seems fair.
2. It's been decades, and Cuba still uses horse-ridden carts instead of cars for transportation. If the system worked, it would've been apparent by now.

[Nakena]

The universe was not designed, and the current state of human society is not written into the fabric of reality. We don't need the universe to care in order to make a more fair society.

Marxism is the worst way to do that though. As we have plenty learned and known by now.

Capitalists have been knowingly poisoning the world for decades to make a profit.

Marxists have knowingly poisoned generations of Students minds, also the environmental record of the USSR and Red China isn't exactly a shining example either.

I care as much about Purgatio's assertions about Marxism as I care about his insane lies about fascists accidentally attacking people with hammers in the course of defending themselves from thrown rocks. If Purgatio posts about the sky being blue, I'd look out a window to check.

Frankly I do not agree often with him, but ya know even a broken clock... eitherway, Marxism is a brainwash ideology designed to indoctrinate people. I on the other hand deprogram and free people.

I don't know(or care, for the record) about you, but I make my money from selling my labour, not from owning the means of production. But I do live under capitalism and have to participate in capitalism if I want to continue living.

Then you might be a wage slave. My sincerest regrets.

Do you think that this is some kind of clever gotcha?

Yes.