NationStates

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 5:24 am**

Madonna Queendom wrote:I find the notion silly.

You can't just expect us all as a species to "partake of a questionable beverage" and cease to exist. It sorta feels unnatural and forced!

Which is why we should just start dropping nukes on every single human being, it's humane, fast, and awesome!

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 5:35 am**

Ayissor wrote:
Madonna Queendom wrote:I find the notion silly.

You can't just expect us all as a species to "partake of a questionable beverage" and cease to exist. It sorta feels unnatural and forced!

Which is why we should just start dropping nukes on every single human being, it's humane, fast, and awesome!

Mushroom Wars...and then a new world/domain/realm/etc. will appear where science and magic complement each other! Sounds like a plan!

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 5:40 am**

Yeah sure, why not. It'll be a welcome stimulus to the rope industry in these hard times.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 8:41 am**

Esheaun Stroakuss wrote:
Herador wrote:Don't care about the rest of the OP, but this is interesting. Do you just expect the whole of humanity to go "eh" and overdose and laughing gas? Do we all walk into the sea? Do we industrialize the slaughter? If we do industrialize, do the people who ran the slaughter get to live, or do we just expect them to say "Nah, we'll do it too once you all are done LARP'ing Jonestown, Scouts Honor."

I have more questions, and all of them revolve around how dumb this line of text is.

Forgive the polemic tone. It was mostly out of jest and frustration. I suppose what I mean is that, if there is an apocalyptic event on the horizon, shall we try and fight it with futile hope or just let the walls close in? What would be kinder/best for us?

CO2 reduction wont stop climate change anymore. However we can survive this. And emerge even stronger.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:17 am**

Nakena wrote:
Esheaun Stroakuss wrote:
Forgive the polemic tone. It was mostly out of jest and frustration. I suppose what I mean is that, if there is an apocalyptic event on the horizon, shall we try and fight it with futile hope or just let the walls close in? What would be kinder/best for us?

CO2 reduction wont stop climate change anymore. However we can survive this. And emerge even stronger.

Good one.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:38 am**

Madonna Queendom wrote:
Ayissor wrote:Which is why we should just start dropping nukes on every single human being, it's humane, fast, and awesome!

Mushroom Wars...and then a new world/domain/realm/etc. will appear where science and magic complement each other! Sounds like a plan!

Only if I get to be the magical Avatar of Atomic destruction.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 10:27 am**

The Emerald Legion wrote:
Madonna Queendom wrote:Mushroom Wars...and then a new world/domain/realm/etc. will appear where science and magic complement each other! Sounds like a plan!

Only if I get to be the magical Avatar of Atomic destruction.

Qualifications? We can't give the job to anyone.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 12:10 pm**

Ayissor wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:
Only if I get to be the magical Avatar of Atomic destruction.

Qualifications? We can't give the job to anyone.

I once walked into a nuclear reactor building. That was the most comfortable snuggly warmth I have ever felt. Like someone was microwaving my skeleton.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 12:32 pm**

The Strangers Club wrote:
Neo Puppetopia wrote:(Image)

Blue pill please.

via Imgflip Meme Generator

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 12:53 pm**

I will get the infinity gauntlet

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:11 pm**

Saying that humanity should continue fighting against it's base instincts in the name of progress is like saying that a cancer patient should push on and fight their cancer despite clearly losing the fight. It's utter nonsense, since humans are incapable of being above what their base instincts tell them what to do.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:14 pm**

The rise of the modern far-right and alt-right is borne in part out of giving up on the notion of women and minorities engaging in good faith, thanks to the idpol left.

A large part of the population would say "We already have.".

It's a conclusion that realpolitik is all there is, and attempts to pretend otherwise are either con artistry or gaslighting.

Once you give up on the notion of justice and believe in pure realpolitik, you're basically taking the side of the Vampires and Scramblers in "Blindsight". It is not a coincidence that "Female solipcism" and "Do women even have an internal experience or are they more like insects?" are questions taken seriously on the fringes of the reactionary movement.

Imagine you’re a scrambler. Imagine you have intellect but no insight, agendas but no awareness. Your circuitry hums with strategies for survival and persistence; flexible, intelligent, even technological — but no other circuitry monitors it. You can think of anything, yet are conscious of nothing. You can't imagine such a being can you? The term being doesn't even seem to apply, in some fundamental way you can't quite put your finger on.

Try.

Imagine that you encounter a signal. It is structured, and dense with information. It meets all the criteria of an intelligent transmission. Evolution and experience offer a variety of paths to follow, branch-points in the flowcharts that handle such input. Sometimes these signals come from conspecifics who have useful information to share, whose lives you'll defend according to the rules of kin selection. Sometimes they come from competitors or predators or other inimical entities that must be avoided or destroyed; in those cases, the information may prove of significant tactical value. Some signals may even arise from entities which, while not kin, can still serve as allies or symbionts in mutually beneficial pursuits. You can derive appropriate responses for any of these eventualities, and many others.

You decode the signals, and stumble:

I had a great time. I really enjoyed him. Even if he cost twice as much as any other hooker in the dome-

To fully appreciate Kesey's Quartet-

They hate us for our freedom-

Pay attention now-

Understand.

There are no meaningful translations for these terms. They are needlessly recursive. They contain no usable intelligence, yet they are structured intelligently; there is no chance they could have arisen by chance.

The only explanation is that something has coded nonsense in a way that poses as a useful message; only after wasting time and effort does the deception become apparent. The signal functions to consume the resources of a recipient for zero payoff and reduced fitness. The signal is a virus.

Viruses do not arise from kin, symbionts, or other allies.

The signal is an attack.

And it's coming from right about there.

(It's named after the blindsight phenomanae, where people react as though they have sight, but are not consciously aware of it. The suggestion is that philosophical zombies are real and merely pretend to be conscious as mechanism for obtaining resources and so on, but beyond that, perceive expression of conscious thought as a kind of assault.).

The reason this has happened is the left up and decided realpolitik was a reasonable prism through which to view demographic relations and make demands through.

The ideology they have constructed perceives whites and males expressing displeasure at the way they are treated as an attack that must be retaliated against.

Peace with such people is not possible. Communication is actively regarded as an assault, only total submission or total victory is possible.

Hence, the rise of the far-right and "Violence is the only way.".

Alternatively, pointing out the dynamic they have fostered and encouraging people to marginalize and deplatform them is also acceptable and may limit their ability to interact with others and poison society. Quarantine them and prevent them from telling people their ideas are normal and justifiable by abusing positions of authority to trick people into thinking their scrambleresque behavior is normal. This is the "moderate" position.

But the whole "Give up on humanity" thing?

That's now pretty normal mate, in a manner of speaking. Giving up on "Humane" and "Justice" is the motivation for the modern far-right after concluding that women and minorities are literally not capable of engaging with those concepts except in realpolitik terms ("Privilege+Power!") has already happened.

They think people like me are chumps for stubbornly trying to communicate mens grievances and not just accepting that;

A. They literally are not capable of comprehending and think we're harming them for trying to explain our experience
B. They are capable, but actively malicious and gaslighting.

Some on the new reactionary movement don't care either way about the internal experience, but note the external behavior is functionally identical either way. This is the consequence of left wing idpol. People are literally wondering if you even have an internal experience. (This also gives rise to the "NPC" meme.).

That's because, functionally, gynocentric bias and impulsively using a feminist framework based on realpolitik is indistinguishable from having no actual principles and only using words as a tool of manipulation to gain an advantage in a pure survival of the fittest fashion. The allusion to principles which are not consistently held makes sense if you view it this way, as manipulation. (Personally, I think it's bias and an ideology and worldview that actively prevents self-reflection, so so long as they insist on using left wing idpol to evaluate whether left wing idpol is justified, they aren't capable of changing. Because they have only one book on their bookshelf and refuse to read others, they cannot see why they are behaving badly. The book says the behavior is fine after all.).

Neo-reactionaries and the far-right and so on are concluding this, more so every day. It's a pretty sad state of affairs.

This is full on black pill level shit ofcourse. Redpillers don't go quite this far, but they basically dance around a similar conclusion;

That peace and equality and justice are not possible because of the inherent nature of the people doing this to them.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:20 pm**

fighting;giving up? these terms are equally meaningless. worship my be nearly so as well.
as a species we have the option of bringing about our own extinction.
we also have the option of not doing so.

the choice between them is not one decided by "fighting", "giving up", or "worshipping".
it is decided by our course of action; our choice of priorities and perspectives.

i've heard all my life this phrase "i give up", usually meaning they have no logical content to contribute to some or another debate.

to which my question, asked or unasked, is always, give up what?
give up thinking, give up logic, give up opening your own eyes?

when it means giving up ideological or other fanatacism, to be replaced by logic, consideration, honesty and imagination, this would be a very good thing,
though it is almost never what is actually being proposed. give up hating consideration, by all means, only the hatred of consideration makes tyranny possible.
give up hating logic, certainly, you can't avoid causing harm, however lovely your intentions without it, nor would it make sense to give up imagination, nor the joy in life that depends on it. honesty, i suppose, we could survive ignorance, but is it logical to hate even that?

give up lying to yourself, by all means.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:22 pm**

Nolo gap wrote:fighting;giving up? these terms are equally meaningless. worship my be nearly so as well.
as a species we have the option of bringing about our own extinction.
we also have the option of not doing so.

the choice between them is not one decided by "fighting", "giving up", or "worshipping".
it is decided by our course of action; our choice of priorities and perspectives.

i've heard all my life this phrase "i give up", usually meaning they have no logical content to contribute to some or another debate.

to which my question, asked or unasked, is always, give up what?
give up thinking, give up logic, give up opening your own eyes?

WTF? I'm sorry, I don't really understand what you are saying.
*edit* are you trying to so that only what people do matter, instead of what they say?, or that people are going to do what they want to do?

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:30 pm**

Bogan Laker wrote:
Nolo gap wrote:fighting;giving up? these terms are equally meaningless. worship my be nearly so as well.
as a species we have the option of bringing about our own extinction.
we also have the option of not doing so.

the choice between them is not one decided by "fighting", "giving up", or "worshipping".
it is decided by our course of action; our choice of priorities and perspectives.

i've heard all my life this phrase "i give up", usually meaning they have no logical content to contribute to some or another debate.

to which my question, asked or unasked, is always, give up what?
give up thinking, give up logic, give up opening your own eyes?

WTF? I'm sorry, I don't really understand what you are saying.

then can you explain wtf this thread is saying, by give up as a species? give up WHAT as a species?
any and all attempts to avoid causing our own extinction?

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:35 pm**

Nolo gap wrote:
Bogan Laker wrote:
WTF? I'm sorry, I don't really understand what you are saying.

then can you explain wtf this thread is saying, by give up as a species? give up WHAT as a species?
any and all attempts to avoid causing our own extinction?

I am mostly confused by the whole "fighting;giving up? these terms are equally meaningless. worship my be nearly so as well." And the "give up WHAT as a species? " seems to be existance, whether it is better off for humans to exist or not. I would rather have humanity grow, evolve, and be more harmonious instead of just, dying out.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:41 pm**

Bogan Laker wrote:
Nolo gap wrote:then can you explain wtf this thread is saying, by give up as a species? give up WHAT as a species?
any and all attempts to avoid causing our own extinction?

I am mostly confused by the whole "fighting;giving up? these terms are equally meaningless. worship my be nearly so as well." And the "give up WHAT as a species? " seems to be existance, whether it is better off for humans to exist or not. I would rather have humanity grow, evolve, and be more harmonious instead of just, dying out.

We must survive, evolve and advance to embrace our future destiny and fulfill ever greater amounts of our potential.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:43 pm**

Nakena wrote:
Bogan Laker wrote:
I am mostly confused by the whole "fighting;giving up? these terms are equally meaningless. worship my be nearly so as well." And the "give up WHAT as a species? " seems to be existance, whether it is better off for humans to exist or not. I would rather have humanity grow, evolve, and be more harmonious instead of just, dying out.

We must survive, evolve and advance to embrace our future destiny and fulfill ever greater amounts of our potential.

As long as it feels good

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:53 pm**

i don't know about "destiny". i think destiny is bullshit.

but if we're not here, we're not here.

besides its not 'giving up' anything, to stop actively destroying the conditions our existence depends upon.

hells bells, if we'd just stop destroying ourselves for short sighted gain we'd be improving our odds.

we're actually working at destroying ourselves. it wouldn't really take rocket science to just stop most of how we're doing so.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:55 pm**

Pretty much every bad thing humans have done can also be found in various animal species as well. We're just better at all of it.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 3:47 pm**

Imperium of Dragonia wrote:Saying that humanity should continue fighting against it's base instincts in the name of progress is like saying that a cancer patient should push on and fight their cancer despite clearly losing the fight. It's utter nonsense, since humans are incapable of being above what their base instincts tell them what to do.

I mean. You can win against Cancer. Besides, we've been hijacking our base instincts in the name of the greater good for literally centuries.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 6:13 pm**

Antityranicals wrote:
Nakena wrote:
I am still awaiting your reply to my post from earlier.

Sure, I'll respond to that, sorry I missed it earlier. Under the Catholic ethos, the ultimate purpose of life is deification. God is love, and Satan, being in opposition to God, is entirely against this. God wants what is best for humanity; Satan wants the exact opposite. God gave us free will so that we may truly "be like him," should we choose to, but this means we still have the option of choosing otherwise. This is the central reason why I am a Libertarian, because if God gives people free will, who am I, or what is the government, to restrict it? The point is, if we choose to be like God, we shall become like God. This is our ultimate potential, this is why we were made, and this is the exact opposite of what Satan wants.

God also created rules, regulations and punishment so as to not abuse our free will, lest we disregard His Commandments and act like murderous primal savages, which is exactly what Satan wants.

If anything, Satan is the epitome of Libertarianism, as it technically forbids God to have any say over our own actions.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 6:38 pm**

Madriax wrote:Pretty much every bad thing humans have done can also be found in various animal species as well. We're just better at all of it.

Avenge the trees fallen by beavers...
Predators kill their prey too slowly to be humane...

Yep. We're actually a LOT better at this stuff.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 6:42 pm**

Nogodia wrote:
Madriax wrote:Pretty much every bad thing humans have done can also be found in various animal species as well. We're just better at all of it.

Avenge the trees fallen by beavers...
Predators kill their prey too slowly to be humane...

Yep. We're actually a LOT better at this stuff.

Trees are replanted by seeds shat out from birds. Nature finds a way to balance itself out, as long as it maintains its endemic species. Or at least it did until Europeans started to present themselves to other lands, bringing rats and roaches along the trip.

Posted: **Thu Aug 29, 2019 7:59 pm**

Ayytaly wrote:
Nogodia wrote:Avenge the trees fallen by beavers...
Predators kill their prey too slowly to be humane...

Yep. We're actually a LOT better at this stuff.

Trees are replanted by seeds shat out from birds. Nature finds a way to balance itself out, as long as it maintains its endemic species. Or at least it did until Europeans started to present themselves to other lands, bringing rats and roaches along the trip.

Hey now. Give Polynesians their credit too.

NationStates

What should we do?