NationStates

Rojava Free State wrote:

Thermodolia wrote:Which is honestly quite reasonable.

You could also go down the Italian route and give kids wine to drink at dinner.

We need to lower the age of consumption of alcohol so that children can be better supervised if they drink too much. That way they can know their limits in a safe environment

We probably won't though because here in america, we like to do things in the most ineffective way possible

When did America become the USSR?

Vivolkha wrote:

Rojava Free State wrote:
We probably won't though because here in america, we like to do things in the most ineffective way possible

When did America become the USSR?

It isn't but it sure is starting to become like it. I suggest we become less like the USSR and have a government that stays out our business. The roads look like a meteor shower took them out. People are getting shot, stabbed and bludgeoned in my area. The local high school can't buy enough textbooks for every student. These are the issues government ought to focus on, not what someone does with their body

Rojava Free State wrote:Consider this stupid logic right here. You gotta be 21 to drink but 18 to join the military. That's right, the government has decided that it is dangerous for you to consume alcohol before 21, but A-ok to potentially end up on a battlefield getting fired upon by ISIS. You can't drink a beverage before 21 but you can give your life for america. What kind of logic is that?

You want to argue against U.S. law with logic? C'mon, you should know better.

What's even more beyond my understanding, is that they think it's a good idea to let 16-year-olds (or even 15- or 14-year-olds, depending on the state) drive a car, considering the ridiculous threshold of 21 to even have a beer. This means, that you're already a driver with advanced experience at the age of 21, but have no idea about the effect alcohol will have on you (provided you've stuck to the law) - including its impact on your driving. I can't imagine, that this is, in any form, helpful to reduce the accident rate. I find the way Germany does it (at the time you're allowed to drive on your own, you'll already have been allowed to drink beer and wine for two years, thus do know the effect of alcohol and can somewhat calculate the risk) way more logical.
(And yes, drivers around 20 are still the age group with the highest risk of accidents in here, but there are a few other factors playing into it, rather than just alcohol.)

Rojava Free State wrote:

Vivolkha wrote:When did America become the USSR?

It isn't but it sure is starting to become like it. I suggest we become less like the USSR and have a government that stays out our business. The roads look like a meteor shower took them out. People are getting shot, stabbed and bludgeoned in my area. The local high school can't buy enough textbooks for every student. These are the issues government ought to focus on, not what someone does with their body

The minimum drinking age in the US has been set at 21 since the passage of the 21st Amendment, which repealed the 18th Amendment and ended prohibition. That was 1933, and it was the states that set that limit. In the 70s some states lowered the age to 18, because the 26th Amendment had lowered the voting age to 18, then in the 80s a federal law was passed to encourage states to set the limit to 21 by cutting federal highway spending in anywhere that had a limit lower than that.

You've largely had this limit for 86 years, which, incidentally, is longer than the Soviet Union existed. If this is a sign that you're becoming like the USSR, you're becoming like the USSR extremely slowly.

Ifreann wrote:

Rojava Free State wrote:
It isn't but it sure is starting to become like it. I suggest we become less like the USSR and have a government that stays out our business. The roads look like a meteor shower took them out. People are getting shot, stabbed and bludgeoned in my area. The local high school can't buy enough textbooks for every student. These are the issues government ought to focus on, not what someone does with their body

The minimum drinking age in the US has been set at 21 since the passage of the 21st Amendment, which repealed the 18th Amendment and ended prohibition. That was 1933, and it was the states that set that limit. In the 70s some states lowered the age to 18, because the 26th Amendment had lowered the voting age to 18, then in the 80s a federal law was passed to encourage states to set the limit to 21 by cutting federal highway spending in anywhere that had a limit lower than that.

You've largely had this limit for 86 years, which, incidentally, is longer than the Soviet Union existed. If this is a sign that you're becoming like the USSR, you're becoming like the USSR extremely slowly.

So all we need to do is repeal said laws

Ifreann wrote:

Rojava Free State wrote:
It isn't but it sure is starting to become like it. I suggest we become less like the USSR and have a government that stays out our business. The roads look like a meteor shower took them out. People are getting shot, stabbed and bludgeoned in my area. The local high school can't buy enough textbooks for every student. These are the issues government ought to focus on, not what someone does with their body

The minimum drinking age in the US has been set at 21 since the passage of the 21st Amendment, which repealed the 18th Amendment and ended prohibition. That was 1933, and it was the states that set that limit. In the 70s some states lowered the age to 18, because the 26th Amendment had lowered the voting age to 18, then in the 80s a federal law was passed to encourage states to set the limit to 21 by cutting federal highway spending in anywhere that had a limit lower than that.

You've largely had this limit for 86 years, which, incidentally, is longer than the Soviet Union existed. If this is a sign that you're becoming like the USSR, you're becoming like the USSR extremely slowly.

Okay first off most of "us becoming like the USSR" has nothing to do with the drinking age at all. Second, my point was that I want government to be less involved in our lives, and that includes the drinking age.

Rojava Free State wrote:

Vivolkha wrote:When did America become the USSR?

It isn't but it sure is starting to become like it. I suggest we become less like the USSR and have a government that stays out our business. The roads look like a meteor shower took them out. People are getting shot, stabbed and bludgeoned in my area. The local high school can't buy enough textbooks for every student. These are the issues government ought to focus on, not what someone does with their body

It was meant as a joke on Soviet infamous inefficiency. America is nothing like that.

Yes, America has serious problems, but it's not like policymakers are focusing in drinking laws instead of those as far as I know. OP wasn't reacting to news.

Thermodolia wrote:

Indo-Malaysia wrote:In the UK, it is :

• 16 if it’s a half pint with a meal
• 18 to get boozed at a pub
• 25 to buy at most shops

Which is honestly quite reasonable.

You could also go down the Italian route and give kids wine to drink at dinner.

We need to lower the age of consumption of alcohol so that children can be better supervised if they drink too much. That way they can know their limits in a safe environment

Keep in mind that last figure isn't accurate. It's actually 18.

The New California Republic wrote:

Thermodolia wrote:Which is honestly quite reasonable.

You could also go down the Italian route and give kids wine to drink at dinner.

We need to lower the age of consumption of alcohol so that children can be better supervised if they drink too much. That way they can know their limits in a safe environment

Keep in mind that last figure isn't accurate. It's actually 18.

Here in the U.S., it is 21, which is pretty stupid.

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

The New California Republic wrote:Keep in mind that last figure isn't accurate. It's actually 18.

Here in the U.S., it is 21, which is pretty stupid.

Except in Puerto Rico.

Personally, I think 18 is a good enough age to be able to drink.

I mean, the main thing to do with youth drinking is to discuss with them the pros and cons of it. We should discuss ways to help the alcohol to not affect one's body so much, like drinking alcohol while having a meal or just having one or two drinks.

We could also help encourage drinkers to not drive by insisting them to take an rider's app (like Uber) or Public Transportation back to their place and just leave their car by the place they were at. Although, it would be important for the place to keep the car make, color, and license plate, along with the driver's name and phone number, so they could call to have them pick up their car.

Ifreann wrote:

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Here in the U.S., it is 21, which is pretty stupid.

Except in Puerto Rico.

Which is irrelevant because I live far away from that territory, and the overwhelming majority of Americans such as myself live in the mainland.

In my opinion, Alcohol (similar to other possibly-addictive consumables) should be available to everyone at 15-16. At that point, they have the ability to think critically and decide if they want or don't want to drink it. That said, any attempt to limit consumption of alcohol beyond that (a ridiculous drinking age limitation like that of the US or -heavens forbid- prohibition (religious or otherwise) should be fought, with weapons and physically if necessary.

....genuinely, how is this a debate?

We don't allow kids to permanently-damage their bodies without the capacity to consent. I have no problems with adults making an informed choice to drink or smoke with all the negative health consequences, because they are adults capable of autonomously consenting to damaging their own bodies, if they individually believe it is worth it. But kids don't have mental capacity, its why we have child labour laws, child pornography laws, laws against child marriage and statutory rape. It's the same thing here, a kid can't consent to destroying his own body, when he's an adult he can make an informed choice whether to do so or not, but until then, no.

For consuming large amounts, there should definitely be a minimum age. A little bit of wine at church or a wedding or whatnot is fine, but not a whole can of beer. I'm not sure what the exact minimum age ought to be for larger amount, but likely somewhere between 15 and 20.

North German Realm wrote:In my opinion, Alcohol (similar to other possibly-addictive consumables) should be available to everyone at 15-16. At that point, they have the ability to think critically and decide if they want or don't want to drink it. That said, any attempt to limit consumption of alcohol beyond that (a ridiculous drinking age limitation like that of the US or -heavens forbid- prohibition (religious or otherwise) should be fought, with weapons and physically if necessary.

I love this idea right here. An armed uprising in the name of getting dummy drunk. our battle cry could be "Protect the pub!"

Cekoviu wrote:For consuming large amounts, there should definitely be a minimum age. A little bit of wine at church or a wedding or whatnot is fine, but not a whole can of beer. I'm not sure what the exact minimum age ought to be for larger amount, but likely somewhere between 15 and 20.

Many European nations have their drinking age between 16 and 18, with italy's technically being 18 but officially being 0 because Italians don't like to enforce laws.

No seriously, I had this girl from italy tell me that her and her friends would go out drinking at the bar and they were like 15 or 16, and there were even cops there and no one cared that these kids were out drinking

Rojava Free State wrote:

North German Realm wrote:In my opinion, Alcohol (similar to other possibly-addictive consumables) should be available to everyone at 15-16. At that point, they have the ability to think critically and decide if they want or don't want to drink it. That said, any attempt to limit consumption of alcohol beyond that (a ridiculous drinking age limitation like that of the US or -heavens forbid- prohibition (religious or otherwise) should be fought, with weapons and physically if necessary.

I love this idea right here. An armed uprising in the name of getting dummy drunk. our battle cry could be "Protect the pub!"

Honestly? If a state bans alcohol and people don't rise up against it, those people deserve to live under that shithole of a state.

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

The New California Republic wrote:Keep in mind that last figure isn't accurate. It's actually 18.

Here in the U.S., it is 21, which is pretty stupid.

I can bet that many, possibly most, Americans between the ages of 18 and 21 have already had alcohol on several occasions.

Ifreann wrote:

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Here in the U.S., it is 21, which is pretty stupid.

Except in Puerto Rico.

And Louisiana.

The New California Republic wrote:

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:Here in the U.S., it is 21, which is pretty stupid.

I can bet that many, possibly most, Americans between the ages of 18 and 21 have already had alcohol on several occasions.

Plenty of states have exceptions allowing people under 21 to legally drink alcohol.

And also lots and lots of teenagers probably just break the law.

How about "children aren't allowed to buy it, or drink in bars without being supervised by adults, but parents should be allowed to give kids wine with supper"?

LimaUniformNovemberAlpha wrote:How about "children aren't allowed to buy it, or drink in bars without being supervised by adults, but parents should be allowed to give kids wine with supper"?

....because we don't allow kids to harm themselves just because their parents consent. That's ridiculous. That's like "let's allow kids to participate in child pornography, but only if a parent consents". What? That's not the point. If a kid is not mentally-competent to consent to something permanent being done to his body, then he can't consent, period. Parental consent doesn't change that.

Ifreann wrote:

The New California Republic wrote:I can bet that many, possibly most, Americans between the ages of 18 and 21 have already had alcohol on several occasions.

Plenty of states have exceptions allowing people under 21 to legally drink alcohol.

And also lots and lots of teenagers probably just break the law.

That last sentence is literally my whole life in 12 words. The first time I drank liquor was at 12 and the first time I smoked weed was at 11, and I can safely say I don't regret it

I would support lowering the age to 18, mostly for the sake of consistancy. If I am old enough to take out a mortgage loan, or enlist in the army, or buy a car, I ought to be old enough to buy a bottle of beer.

IMO an adult is an adult if they're an adult, and disparate age limits for various adult activities is absurd.