Palestinian police vow crackdown on LGBT events

[Novus America]

Hey, we actually agree on something...

Why Hamas Won

Most importantly, perhaps, Hamas acquired much of its political credit from its charity and social service networks. It built kindergartens and schools (that offer free meals for children), education centers for women, and youth and sports clubs. Its medical clinics provide subsidized treatment to the sick and the organization extends financial and technical assistance to those whose homes had been demolished as well as to refugees living in sub-standard conditions.

In other words, Hamas was elected not only because it is considered an alternative to the corrupt Palestinian Authority, but also because Israel created the conditions that made it an indispensable social movement.

Umm a Counterpunch opinion piece.
Not an actual assessment of data.

And again if that is the case why vote for a party that destroyed all that? Infrastructure in Gaza was much better before Hamas took over.

Surely they were fully aware that it meant eternal war. If not they were naive at best.

[Neko-koku]

Maybe if Fatah actually aided the Gazans instead of sucking off Israel and enriching themselves they wouldn't have voted Hamas into office.

Oh Fatah's no better. Actually I would argue that by kowtowing to the Israelis they're actually worse. Don't get me wrong, Hamas is awful but at least they didn't surrender to an avowed enemy of the Palestinian people and a regional menace.

Israel is objectively good, like it or not. That's also easy to verify. Which country in the Middle East is the most scientifically productive one per capita?

[Cekoviu]

Oh Fatah's no better. Actually I would argue that by kowtowing to the Israelis they're actually worse. Don't get me wrong, Hamas is awful but at least they didn't surrender to an avowed enemy of the Palestinian people and a regional menace.

Israel is objectively good, like it or not. That's also easy to verify. Which country in the Middle East is the most scientifically productive one per capita?

How do you even intend on quantifying that?

[Neko-koku]

Israel is objectively good, like it or not. That's also easy to verify. Which country in the Middle East is the most scientifically productive one per capita?

How do you even intend on quantifying that?

Sure!

Here we go!

https://www.natureindex.com

Now calculate FC 2018 / Population

Hehe UAE actually has moar people than Israel with about 2.7% of the scientific output Israel has for example.

[Samudera Darussalam]

Oh Fatah's no better. Actually I would argue that by kowtowing to the Israelis they're actually worse. Don't get me wrong, Hamas is awful but at least they didn't surrender to an avowed enemy of the Palestinian people and a regional menace.

Israel is objectively good, like it or not. That's also easy to verify. Which country in the Middle East is the most scientifically productive one per capita?

Tbh I don't really know which side is good, Israel with its illegal settlements (and historical invasion of Lebanon) and Palestine with its problems. The conflict has been going on for too long.

[Aureumterra]

Oh Fatah's no better. Actually I would argue that by kowtowing to the Israelis they're actually worse. Don't get me wrong, Hamas is awful but at least they didn't surrender to an avowed enemy of the Palestinian people and a regional menace.

Israel is objectively good, like it or not. That's also easy to verify. Which country in the Middle East is the most scientifically productive one per capita?

Well, I mean the competition is pretty bad, every scientific discovery is shot down with “ALLAH SHALL NOT PERMIT THIS HERESY” or something around those lines in the region

Man has the Arab world changed since the good ‘ol caliphate days

[Neko-koku]

Israel is objectively good, like it or not. That's also easy to verify. Which country in the Middle East is the most scientifically productive one per capita?

Well, I mean the competition is pretty bad, every scientific discovery is shot down with “ALLAH SHALL NOT PERMIT THIS HERESY” or something around those lines in the region

Man has the Arab world changed since the good ‘ol caliphate days

I think the Arab world was pretty good when the Mu'tazilites were dominant. So it's actually more complex than that. More like the Middle East is suffering from a dark age. That's not a terminal decline.

[Neko-koku]

Israel is objectively good, like it or not. That's also easy to verify. Which country in the Middle East is the most scientifically productive one per capita?

Tbh I don't really know which side is good, Israel with its illegal settlements (and historical invasion of Lebanon) and Palestine with its problems. The conflict has been going on for too long.

Nah. I mean from utilitarian POV. Israel is a lot better for human progress than Palestine.

[Samudera Darussalam]

Tbh I don't really know which side is good, Israel with its illegal settlements (and historical invasion of Lebanon) and Palestine with its problems. The conflict has been going on for too long.

Nah. I mean from utilitarian POV. Israel is a lot better for human progress than Palestine.

Probably, but in regards of 'regional peace' who knows. Both sides have their own roles in the conflict.

[Neko-koku]

Nah. I mean from utilitarian POV. Israel is a lot better for human progress than Palestine.

Probably, but in regards of 'regional peace' who knows. Both sides have their own roles in the conflict.

Right.

[Yisrae1]

Why am I not surprised at all about this? It has always been a well know fact that if a Palestinian State was formed it would be very patriarchal in nature. It is because of the Islamism which plagues both the West Bank and Gaza. I've actually heard from Palestinians first hand that "homosexuality is another way Israelis oppress us and try to threaten our way of life". As if Israelis are giving them a disease it really sickened me. It is similar to Russia's "the West imported homosexuality here".

If only.. I'd invite any LBGT* Palestinian to come make their home in Tel Aviv/Yafa.

[Ayissor]

I love how fellow socialists view Israel as an aggressive imperialist hellchild, which, to a degree is correct, as an Israeli I am not going to deny the discrimination against Arabs and Muslims in general, as a Russian I've seen discrimination against the slavic population too, but one thing they tend to miss and straight up ignore is that Israel when compared to Palestine is a socialist utopia, they don't arrest or stop LGBT events, that's for one.

[Gormwood]

I love how fellow socialists view Israel as an aggressive imperialist hellchild, which, to a degree is correct, as an Israeli I am not going to deny the discrimination against Arabs and Muslims in general, as a Russian I've seen discrimination against the slavic population too, but one thing they tend to miss and straight up ignore is that Israel when compared to Palestine is a socialist utopia, they don't arrest or stop LGBT events, that's for one.

They just let an ultra-Orthodox go up to the Jerusalem Pride Parade and stab people. At two parades.

Jerusalem Gay Pride stabbing: ultra-orthodox Yishai Schlissel jailed for life

But it's easy to ignore when trying to maintain the narrative that only Muslims assault and kill LGBTs in the whole world.

[Ayissor]

I love how fellow socialists view Israel as an aggressive imperialist hellchild, which, to a degree is correct, as an Israeli I am not going to deny the discrimination against Arabs and Muslims in general, as a Russian I've seen discrimination against the slavic population too, but one thing they tend to miss and straight up ignore is that Israel when compared to Palestine is a socialist utopia, they don't arrest or stop LGBT events, that's for one.

They just let an ultra-Orthodox go up to the Jerusalem Pride Parade and stab people. At two parades.

Jerusalem Gay Pride stabbing: ultra-orthodox Yishai Schlissel jailed for life

But it's easy to ignore when trying to maintain the narrative that only Muslims assault and kill LGBTs in the whole world.

I'm not saying Israel is perfect, religion in my opinion is a cancer as a whole, but they at the very least allow people to hold it, there is no government mandated crackdown on the LGBT community, it's religious people who think god gave them the right to murder someone.
It's the same reason Itzhak Rabin was murdered, hell, it's the reason there is a bloody war in the first place.
Not to mention, the article mentions he was jailed for life, he did something illegal pure and simple.

[Gormwood]

They just let an ultra-Orthodox go up to the Jerusalem Pride Parade and stab people. At two parades.

Jerusalem Gay Pride stabbing: ultra-orthodox Yishai Schlissel jailed for life

But it's easy to ignore when trying to maintain the narrative that only Muslims assault and kill LGBTs in the whole world.

I'm not saying Israel is perfect, religion in my opinion is a cancer as a whole, but they at the very least allow people to hold it, there is no government mandated crackdown on the LGBT community, it's religious people who think god gave them the right to murder someone.
It's the same reason Itzhak Rabin was murdered, hell, it's the reason there is a bloody war in the first place.
Not to mention, the article mentions he was jailed for life, he did something illegal pure and simple.

Rabin was executed as a traitor to Israel for daring to treat the Palestinians as actual human beings.

[Ayissor]

I'm not saying Israel is perfect, religion in my opinion is a cancer as a whole, but they at the very least allow people to hold it, there is no government mandated crackdown on the LGBT community, it's religious people who think god gave them the right to murder someone.
It's the same reason Itzhak Rabin was murdered, hell, it's the reason there is a bloody war in the first place.
Not to mention, the article mentions he was jailed for life, he did something illegal pure and simple.

Rabin was executed as a traitor to Israel for daring to treat the Palestinians as actual human beings.

That was no execution, that was murder, most Israelis agree on that, he was murdered by a man who saw the Palestinians as beneath him out of religious reasons, the entire conflict is just a religious mess, cut that out, give it a decade, there won't be fighting anymore.

Edit: I'd like to point out that most Israelis, at least those that I know and myself included, see orthodox Jews (Who are called "Dosim") as something far worse than Muslims, I can list the reasons as to why.

[Gormwood]

Rabin was executed as a traitor to Israel for daring to treat the Palestinians as actual human beings.

That was no execution, that was murder, most Israelis agree on that, he was murdered by a man who saw the Palestinians as beneath him out of religious reasons, the entire conflict is just a religious mess, cut that out, give it a decade, there won't be fighting anymore.

There are Israelis making regular pilgrimages to Baruch Goldstein's grave. I bet there are Israelis making regular pilgrimages to wherever Yigal Amir is being held. I would not be surprised if there are Israelis openly asking "Why can't we be more like Myanmar?"

[Ayissor]

That was no execution, that was murder, most Israelis agree on that, he was murdered by a man who saw the Palestinians as beneath him out of religious reasons, the entire conflict is just a religious mess, cut that out, give it a decade, there won't be fighting anymore.

There are Israelis making regular pilgrimages to Baruch Goldstein's grave. I bet there are Israelis making regular pilgrimages to wherever Yigal Amir is being held. I would not be surprised if there are Israelis openly asking "Why can't we be more like Myanmar?"

Love to see your sources, including a number of how many people actually do that, ditto, and I can say with confidence there aren't, for one, he is in a high security prison being watched 24/7, for two, he is branded in Israeli schools, of which I attend, as a bloodthirsty traitor who stood in the way of peace, and who snuffed out our only ever hope of achieving an end to the war, not exactly "Praise material", if you ask me. Oh there are for sure, but you have to understand that the otherside isn't any better, so to blame one while the other has the same amount of insane people is cherrypicking in my opinion.

[Gormwood]

There are Israelis making regular pilgrimages to Baruch Goldstein's grave. I bet there are Israelis making regular pilgrimages to wherever Yigal Amir is being held. I would not be surprised if there are Israelis openly asking "Why can't we be more like Myanmar?"

Love to see your sources, including a number of how many people actually do that, ditto, and I can say with confidence there aren't, for one, he is in a high security prison being watched 24/7, for two, he is branded in Israeli schools, of which I attend, as a bloodthirsty traitor who stood in the way of peace, and who snuffed out our only ever hope of achieving an end to the war, not exactly "Praise material", if you ask me. Oh there are for sure, but you have to understand that the otherside isn't any better, so to blame one while the other has the same amount of insane people is cherrypicking in my opinion.

If the Palestinians had any real power besides killing a handful of Israelis if Hamas has a lucky day while getting slaughtered regularly when not being ethnically cleansed then I'd find it bothersome. As it is, they are mostly impotent rage while Israel has real power to manifest their resentments and hatred.

Gunman’s Grave Now a Shrine for Extremists

[Ayissor]

Love to see your sources, including a number of how many people actually do that, ditto, and I can say with confidence there aren't, for one, he is in a high security prison being watched 24/7, for two, he is branded in Israeli schools, of which I attend, as a bloodthirsty traitor who stood in the way of peace, and who snuffed out our only ever hope of achieving an end to the war, not exactly "Praise material", if you ask me. Oh there are for sure, but you have to understand that the otherside isn't any better, so to blame one while the other has the same amount of insane people is cherrypicking in my opinion.

If the Palestinians had any real power besides killing a handful of Israelis if Hamas has a lucky day while getting slaughtered regularly when not being ethnically cleansed then I'd find it bothersome. As it is, they are mostly impotent rage while Israel has real power to manifest their resentments and hatred.

That's not power? Is that normal? Hypocrisy much? Hamas is a terrorist organization that has no moral issues with targeting civilians, I'm sorry, but giving the other side justification to crack down on you by citing "security concerns", is not a good political strategy, they are idiots. Sure, but if the sides were flipped would something change? Shouldn't you criticize both sides for their bullshit and not the one who is the regional power? Also, please answer all my other questions, you seem particularly dodgy and cherrypicky.

Edit: You new source doesn't provide a number as to how many people visit the thing, it even states that extremists do that. Y'know, the minority who are called extremists for a reason?

[Genivaria]

If the Palestinians had any real power besides killing a handful of Israelis if Hamas has a lucky day while getting slaughtered regularly when not being ethnically cleansed then I'd find it bothersome. As it is, they are mostly impotent rage while Israel has real power to manifest their resentments and hatred.

That's not power? Is that normal? Hypocrisy much? Hamas is a terrorist organization that has no moral issues with targeting civilians, I'm sorry, but giving the other side justification to crack down on you by citing "security concerns", is not a good political strategy, they are idiots. Sure, but if the sides were flipped would something change? Shouldn't you criticize both sides for their bullshit and not the one who is the regional power? Also, please answer all my other questions, you seem particularly dodgy and cherrypicky.

Edit: You new source doesn't provide a number as to how many people visit the thing, it even states that extremists do that. Y'know, the minority who are called extremists for a reason?

Being extremists does not automatically make you a numerical minority, that's an extremely simplistic view of it.
Or do you think the Soviet Union was a tiny country?

[Ayissor]

Being extremists does not automatically make you a numerical minority, that's an extremely simplistic view of it.
Or do you think the Soviet Union was a tiny country?

Yeah, I should have worded it better, by extremists I meant that, people who are on the extreme spectrum, not the majority but a statistical minority, those who take a stance that is way out of proportion.
The point I was trying to make is that taking those extremists and not even showing a number of how many visited the grave, which to be concerning would have to be in the thousands, is cherry-picky and uses a niche minority to represent one side as being bad, or at least, that is the vibe I am getting from it.