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LWDT 8: Hitting the Marx

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Under which leaders (if any) was the Soviet Union socialist?

Lenin (1918-1924)
411
34%
Stalin (1924-1953)
223
19%
Khrushchev (1953-1964)
149
12%
Brezhnev (1964-1982)
125
10%
Gorbachev (1985-1991)
126
10%
Never
167
14%
 
Total votes : 1201

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Torrocca
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:48 am

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NOTICE 1: Anything depicted IC on this nation does NOT reflect my IRL views or values, and is not endorsed by me.
NOTICE 2: Most RP and every OOC post by me prior to 2023 are no longer endorsed nor tolerated by me. I've since put on my adult pants!
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Evil Dictators Happyland
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Founded: Aug 03, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Evil Dictators Happyland » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:54 am


I love the smell of irony in the morning.

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Dumb Ideologies
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Posts: 46019
Founded: Sep 30, 2007
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Dumb Ideologies » Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:56 am



They're being bad losers, while the gloat gang are being bad winners. Both are falling short of being their best selves and not casting themselves in a great light.
Are these "human rights" in the room with us right now?
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Freedom is when people agree with you, and the more people you can force to act like they agree the freer society is
You are the trolley problem's conductor. You could stop the train in time but you do not. Nobody knows you're part of the equation. You satisfy your bloodlust and get away with it every time

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North German Realm
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Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby North German Realm » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:01 am

Dumb Ideologies wrote:


They're being bad losers, while the gloat gang are being bad winners. Both are falling short of being their best selves and not casting themselves in a great light.

The most hilarious point about this is that this isn't a win for the Far-Left either. It's specifically a win for the center left, which is slowly but steadily gaining the upper ground while the two Fars punch each others' lights out in the streets.
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Evil Dictators Happyland
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Founded: Aug 03, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Evil Dictators Happyland » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:05 am

Dumb Ideologies wrote:


They're being bad losers, while the gloat gang are being bad winners. Both are falling short of being their best selves and not casting themselves in a great light.

I lost any sympathy I had for fascists a while ago. I'm not going to pretend that I feel sorry for them when I don't.
Sure, some of them are stupid and misled, but this deplatform doesn't hurt them, it hurts the ringleaders, the people organizing the movement in the first place. And it's not like they were going to listen to reason in the first place. I've met enough fascists on NSG to know that they never do.

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Evil Dictators Happyland
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Founded: Aug 03, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Evil Dictators Happyland » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:08 am

North German Realm wrote:
Dumb Ideologies wrote:
They're being bad losers, while the gloat gang are being bad winners. Both are falling short of being their best selves and not casting themselves in a great light.

The most hilarious point about this is that this isn't a win for the Far-Left either. It's specifically a win for the center left, which is slowly but steadily gaining the upper ground while the two Fars punch each others' lights out in the streets.

Fine by me. If the tankies go down, they stop giving a bad name to the rest of us. No big loss there, especially if their fall hurts the fascists even more.

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Dumb Ideologies
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Posts: 46019
Founded: Sep 30, 2007
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Dumb Ideologies » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:09 am

Evil Dictators Happyland wrote:
Dumb Ideologies wrote:
They're being bad losers, while the gloat gang are being bad winners. Both are falling short of being their best selves and not casting themselves in a great light.

I lost any sympathy I had for fascists a while ago. I'm not going to pretend that I feel sorry for them when I don't.
Sure, some of them are stupid and misled, but this deplatform doesn't hurt them, it hurts the ringleaders, the people organizing the movement in the first place. And it's not like they were going to listen to reason in the first place. I've met enough fascists on NSG to know that they never do.


Different experiences here, can't entirely relate. Of the fash gang, only the Hitlerists have struck me as notably more unreasonable in conversation than your average dweller of the "political Internet".
Last edited by Dumb Ideologies on Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
Are these "human rights" in the room with us right now?
★彡 Professional pessimist. Reactionary socialist and gamer liberationist. Coffee addict. Fun at parties 彡★
Freedom is when people agree with you, and the more people you can force to act like they agree the freer society is
You are the trolley problem's conductor. You could stop the train in time but you do not. Nobody knows you're part of the equation. You satisfy your bloodlust and get away with it every time

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Evil Dictators Happyland
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Posts: 3518
Founded: Aug 03, 2016
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Evil Dictators Happyland » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:15 am

Dumb Ideologies wrote:
Evil Dictators Happyland wrote:I lost any sympathy I had for fascists a while ago. I'm not going to pretend that I feel sorry for them when I don't.
Sure, some of them are stupid and misled, but this deplatform doesn't hurt them, it hurts the ringleaders, the people organizing the movement in the first place. And it's not like they were going to listen to reason in the first place. I've met enough fascists on NSG to know that they never do.


Different experiences here, can't entirely relate. Of the fash gang, only the Hitlerists have struck me as notably more unreasonable in conversation than your average dweller of the "political Internet".

Eh, the ones I'm talking about aren't exactly raving lunatics. They just refuse to accept evidence that disagrees with their narrative, so trying to debate with them is pointless. Which I guess is a trait of all Internet warriors, but fascists tend to take it to an entirely different level even if they're not out-and-out Nazis.
Last edited by Evil Dictators Happyland on Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Dumb Ideologies
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Posts: 46019
Founded: Sep 30, 2007
Mother Knows Best State

Postby Dumb Ideologies » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:26 am

Evil Dictators Happyland wrote:
Dumb Ideologies wrote:
Different experiences here, can't entirely relate. Of the fash gang, only the Hitlerists have struck me as notably more unreasonable in conversation than your average dweller of the "political Internet".

Eh, the ones I'm talking about aren't exactly raving lunatics. They just refuse to accept evidence that disagrees with their narrative, so trying to debate with them is pointless.


Very few people do accept contrary evidence or change their mind except on those issues they have very little emotional investment in. Those we disagree with us most are of course the most unreasonable for not doing so, despite frequent contact with our surely watertight arguments :p

I've moved on a few fairly important things but that's mostly because I'm flakier than a testing lab for anti-dandruff shampoo.
Are these "human rights" in the room with us right now?
★彡 Professional pessimist. Reactionary socialist and gamer liberationist. Coffee addict. Fun at parties 彡★
Freedom is when people agree with you, and the more people you can force to act like they agree the freer society is
You are the trolley problem's conductor. You could stop the train in time but you do not. Nobody knows you're part of the equation. You satisfy your bloodlust and get away with it every time

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Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27805
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:28 am

North German Realm wrote:
Dumb Ideologies wrote:
They're being bad losers, while the gloat gang are being bad winners. Both are falling short of being their best selves and not casting themselves in a great light.

The most hilarious point about this is that this isn't a win for the Far-Left either. It's specifically a win for the center left, which is slowly but steadily gaining the upper ground while the two Fars punch each others' lights out in the streets.


It's not a win for the Far-Left, but we've been getting fucked over whenever it comes to speaking publicly since basically forever now, so we might as well relish in the Far-Right getting a taste of its own medicine.
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They call me Torra, but you can call me... anytime (☞⌐■_■)☞
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
NOTICE 1: Anything depicted IC on this nation does NOT reflect my IRL views or values, and is not endorsed by me.
NOTICE 2: Most RP and every OOC post by me prior to 2023 are no longer endorsed nor tolerated by me. I've since put on my adult pants!
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North German Realm
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Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby North German Realm » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:36 am

Torrocca wrote:
North German Realm wrote:The most hilarious point about this is that this isn't a win for the Far-Left either. It's specifically a win for the center left, which is slowly but steadily gaining the upper ground while the two Fars punch each others' lights out in the streets.


It's not a win for the Far-Left, but we've been getting fucked over whenever it comes to speaking publicly since basically forever now, so we might as well relish in the Far-Right getting a taste of its own medicine.

Oh, make no mistake. It's absolutely soothing for the soul to see people be sane enough to deplatform them when the government isn't sane enough to do it for them.
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North German Confederation
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Norddeutscher Bund
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Die Morgenpost: "We will reconsider our relationship with Poland" Reichskanzler Lagenmauer says after Polish president protested North German ultimatum that made them restore reproductive freedom. | European Society votes not to persecute Hungary for atrocities committed against Serbs, "Giving a rogue state leave to commit genocide as it sees fit." North German delegate bemoans. | Negotiations still underway in Rome, delegates arguing over the extent of indemnities Turkey might be made to pay, lawful status of Turkish collaborators during occupation of Azerbaijan, Cyprus, Syria.

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Asherahan
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Posts: 2694
Founded: Dec 08, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby Asherahan » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:36 am

Question from someone outside of the known.

Who are these people?
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Torrocca
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Posts: 27805
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:44 am

North German Realm wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
It's not a win for the Far-Left, but we've been getting fucked over whenever it comes to speaking publicly since basically forever now, so we might as well relish in the Far-Right getting a taste of its own medicine.

Oh, make no mistake. It's absolutely soothing for the soul to see people be sane enough to deplatform them when the government isn't sane enough to do it for them.


Hell yeah it is.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
They call me Torra, but you can call me... anytime (☞⌐■_■)☞
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
NOTICE 1: Anything depicted IC on this nation does NOT reflect my IRL views or values, and is not endorsed by me.
NOTICE 2: Most RP and every OOC post by me prior to 2023 are no longer endorsed nor tolerated by me. I've since put on my adult pants!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Proctopeo
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Posts: 12370
Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:09 am


hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay

North German Realm wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
It's not a win for the Far-Left, but we've been getting fucked over whenever it comes to speaking publicly since basically forever now, so we might as well relish in the Far-Right getting a taste of its own medicine.

Oh, make no mistake. It's absolutely soothing for the soul to see people be sane enough to deplatform them when the government isn't sane enough to do it for them.

Torrocca wrote:
North German Realm wrote:Oh, make no mistake. It's absolutely soothing for the soul to see people be sane enough to deplatform them when the government isn't sane enough to do it for them.


Hell yeah it is.


government censorship being praised, even by an ancom, now my worries are dispelled, the lwdt is operating as normal I see
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North German Realm
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Ex-Nation

Postby North German Realm » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:32 am

Proctopeo wrote:

hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay

North German Realm wrote:Oh, make no mistake. It's absolutely soothing for the soul to see people be sane enough to deplatform them when the government isn't sane enough to do it for them.

Torrocca wrote:
Hell yeah it is.


government censorship being praised, even by an ancom, now my worries are dispelled, the lwdt is operating as normal I see

I haven't claimed to be "an" for more than 2 years. I have never claimed to be a "com". I support censorship of opinions I don't like. I've made a point of pointing it out almost every time an argument about censorship pops up.
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North German Confederation
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Norddeutscher Bund
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5 Nov, 2020
Die Morgenpost: "We will reconsider our relationship with Poland" Reichskanzler Lagenmauer says after Polish president protested North German ultimatum that made them restore reproductive freedom. | European Society votes not to persecute Hungary for atrocities committed against Serbs, "Giving a rogue state leave to commit genocide as it sees fit." North German delegate bemoans. | Negotiations still underway in Rome, delegates arguing over the extent of indemnities Turkey might be made to pay, lawful status of Turkish collaborators during occupation of Azerbaijan, Cyprus, Syria.

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Proctopeo
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Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:34 am

North German Realm wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay




government censorship being praised, even by an ancom, now my worries are dispelled, the lwdt is operating as normal I see

I haven't claimed to be "an" for more than 2 years. I have never claimed to be a "com". I support censorship of opinions I don't like. I've made a point of pointing it out almost every time an argument about censorship pops up.

That was more in reference to Torra than you, fyi, hence why I quoted both
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North German Realm
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Ex-Nation

Postby North German Realm » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:35 am

Proctopeo wrote:
North German Realm wrote:I haven't claimed to be "an" for more than 2 years. I have never claimed to be a "com". I support censorship of opinions I don't like. I've made a point of pointing it out almost every time an argument about censorship pops up.

That was more in reference to Torra than you, fyi, hence why I quoted both

I realize you were mostly throwing your regularly scheduled jab at Torra, I responded because you quoted me too.
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North German Confederation
NationStates Flag Bracket II - 6th place!

Norddeutscher Bund
Homepage || Overview | Sovereign | Chancellor | Military | Legislature || The World
5 Nov, 2020
Die Morgenpost: "We will reconsider our relationship with Poland" Reichskanzler Lagenmauer says after Polish president protested North German ultimatum that made them restore reproductive freedom. | European Society votes not to persecute Hungary for atrocities committed against Serbs, "Giving a rogue state leave to commit genocide as it sees fit." North German delegate bemoans. | Negotiations still underway in Rome, delegates arguing over the extent of indemnities Turkey might be made to pay, lawful status of Turkish collaborators during occupation of Azerbaijan, Cyprus, Syria.

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Proctopeo
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Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:37 am

North German Realm wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:That was more in reference to Torra than you, fyi, hence why I quoted both

I realize you were mostly throwing your regularly scheduled jab at Torra,

:roll:

I responded because you quoted me too.

Because it went with the other part of that section of the post.
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Evil Dictators Happyland
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Evil Dictators Happyland » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:54 am

Proctopeo wrote:

hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay

If they're going to say that corporate censorship (and censorship in general) is good, then it's quite cathartic to see them get censored regardless of whether or not censorship would be a good thing in most other contexts.
'Sides, since when would the right shed any tears over communists being censored?

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Proctopeo
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Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:59 am

Evil Dictators Happyland wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay

If they're going to say that corporate censorship (and censorship in general) is good, then it's quite cathartic to see them get censored regardless of whether or not censorship would be a good thing in most other contexts.

If it's catharsis it's presented more as legitimate support, which is still bad.

'Sides, since when would the right shed any tears over communists being censored?

I wouldn't "shed tears" (not literally, anyway) but I'd definitely not agree with the move.
Let the commies self-censor, it's just as effective without any responsibility on the part of the website.
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West Leas Oros 2
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Ex-Nation

Postby West Leas Oros 2 » Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:12 pm

Kowani wrote:
West Leas Oros 2 wrote:IT'S ALIVE!! But, seriously folks, I'm back. What's happening?

Oh, you’re back!

That I am. This was definitely a mistake.
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Stylan
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Ex-Nation

Postby Stylan » Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:17 pm

Proctopeo wrote:

hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay

North German Realm wrote:Oh, make no mistake. It's absolutely soothing for the soul to see people be sane enough to deplatform them when the government isn't sane enough to do it for them.

Torrocca wrote:
Hell yeah it is.


government censorship being praised, even by an ancom, now my worries are dispelled, the lwdt is operating as normal I see


By capitalist logic corporate censorship is fine. Plus I have zero problem censoring fascists, far-rightists, etc except I would use the government as opposed to corporations.

Government censorship isn't bad lol
Last edited by Stylan on Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Proctopeo
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Founded: Sep 26, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Proctopeo » Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:40 pm

Stylan wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay




government censorship being praised, even by an ancom, now my worries are dispelled, the lwdt is operating as normal I see


By capitalist logic corporate censorship is fine. Plus I have zero problem censoring fascists, far-rightists, etc except I would use the government as opposed to corporations.

Government censorship isn't bad lol

Yeah, but you're an ML. That changes a lot, so this is entirely in line with your ideology.
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Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27805
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:23 pm

Proctopeo wrote:

hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay

North German Realm wrote:Oh, make no mistake. It's absolutely soothing for the soul to see people be sane enough to deplatform them when the government isn't sane enough to do it for them.

Torrocca wrote:
Hell yeah it is.


government censorship being praised, even by an ancom, now my worries are dispelled, the lwdt is operating as normal I see


I see you're bringing out your usual uncritical jabs. Perhaps you'd fancy yourself to learn the difference between thinking corporate censorship is good and laughing at the far-right getting a taste of its own medicine? Or how denying somebody a platform isn't censorship?

Seeing as how you're probably not gonna bother thinking about it critically, though, I'm just gonna leave this as my one and only reply to you to save the headache you intend to create.
Last edited by Torrocca on Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
They call me Torra, but you can call me... anytime (☞⌐■_■)☞
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
NOTICE 1: Anything depicted IC on this nation does NOT reflect my IRL views or values, and is not endorsed by me.
NOTICE 2: Most RP and every OOC post by me prior to 2023 are no longer endorsed nor tolerated by me. I've since put on my adult pants!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

User avatar
Torrocca
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27805
Founded: Dec 01, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby Torrocca » Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:29 pm

North German Realm wrote:
Proctopeo wrote:hrrmm
corporate censorship... good? lwdt are you okay




government censorship being praised, even by an ancom, now my worries are dispelled, the lwdt is operating as normal I see

I haven't claimed to be "an" for more than 2 years. I have never claimed to be a "com". I support censorship of opinions I don't like. I've made a point of pointing it out almost every time an argument about censorship pops up.


Also, you can still be an Anarchist and realize that the rough equivalent to denying somebody the ability to use your home to preach some hateful bullshit is hardly censorship. I guess right-wing """Libertarians""" only value freedom of association when it benefits their ideology, though.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
They call me Torra, but you can call me... anytime (☞⌐■_■)☞
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
NOTICE 1: Anything depicted IC on this nation does NOT reflect my IRL views or values, and is not endorsed by me.
NOTICE 2: Most RP and every OOC post by me prior to 2023 are no longer endorsed nor tolerated by me. I've since put on my adult pants!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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