And even if we do blame Lincoln, where's the wrong? The Civil War led directly to the emancipation of millions.
Advertisement
by The Empire of Pretantia » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:37 am
by Fasma » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:39 am
by Pacomia » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:39 am
by Vivolkha » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:40 am
by Chan Island » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:41 am
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.
by Risastorstein » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:42 am
by The Empire of Pretantia » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:42 am
by East Ustya » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:44 am
by The Alma Mater » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:45 am
Neko-koku wrote:However Hitler was at least good to ethnic Germans.
by Lancaster of Wessex » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:45 am
East Ustya wrote:
Those are hardly trustworthy sources now are they?
They neglect the fact there was a serious drought that year for one, and the stories of torture and esecutions are clearly fabricated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GM_I2qIAARA
Just like in that whole ''Mao the unknown story'' book.
by Page » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:45 am
East Ustya wrote:Page wrote:Hitler is worse because the deaths of millions caused under his regime was particularly intentional and malicious. Not only did Hitler deliberately have millions of Jews and Slavs murdered, it was nazi aggression that set off World War 2, particularly the Eastern Front, the most horrific conflict in human history.
The Soviets carried out many inexcusable atrocities during WW2 (as well as before and after), but they suffered as a nation more than any other in human history. Many of Stalin's crimes, both those against German civilians and the purges in the USSR, occurred under the unimaginably awful conditions of the Eastern Front. The brutality of the nazis does not excuse Soviet war crimes, but it created the conditions in which these war crimes could be rationalized as justifiable or necessary. Humans subjected to brutality become brutal. Elie Weisel wrote about a man in a nazi concentration camp who savagely beat his own father for a piece of bread. People in Leningrad under siege murdered and cannibalized their neighbors because they were starving. Brutal conditions make brutal people.
And as for the deaths attributed to both Stalin and Mao, it must be acknowledged many were not the result of murderous intent. The famines that occurred cannot be deemed natural, but they were to some extent the result of poor planning and incompetence rather than malice. Mao having farmers forge steel in their own backyard rather than growing food, that's appallingly incompetent but not consciously homicidal.
And nobody even bothers to ask WHY Mao did that.
I know, but nobody cares.
by East Ustya » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:46 am
Lancaster of Wessex wrote:East Ustya wrote:Those are hardly trustworthy sources now are they?
They neglect the fact there was a serious drought that year for one, and the stories of torture and esecutions are clearly fabricated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GM_I2qIAARA
Just like in that whole ''Mao the unknown story'' book.
Since when is the New York Times not a reliable source, because you disagree with it?
by LiberNovusAmericae » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:47 am
East Ustya wrote:
Those are hardly trustworthy sources now are they?
They neglect the fact there was a serious drought that year for one, and the stories of torture and esecutions are clearly fabricated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GM_I2qIAARA
Just like in that whole ''Mao the unknown story'' book.
by LiberNovusAmericae » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:48 am
by Page » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:48 am
Risastorstein wrote:Can we add Leopold II in the list of Humanity's Greatest Assholes™?
by Chan Island » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:48 am
Conserative Morality wrote:"It's not time yet" is a tactic used by reactionaries in every era. "It's not time for democracy, it's not time for capitalism, it's not time for emancipation." Of course it's not time. It's never time, not on its own. You make it time. If you're under fire in the no-man's land of WW1, you start digging a foxhole even if the ideal time would be when you *aren't* being bombarded, because once you wait for it to be 'time', other situations will need your attention, assuming you survive that long. If the fields aren't furrowed, plow them. If the iron is not hot, make it so. If society is not ready, change it.
by East Ustya » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:48 am
LiberNovusAmericae wrote:East Ustya wrote:Those are hardly trustworthy sources now are they?
They neglect the fact there was a serious drought that year for one, and the stories of torture and esecutions are clearly fabricated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GM_I2qIAARA
Just like in that whole ''Mao the unknown story'' book.
As for the torture and executions during the cultural revolution, I see no evidence those were fabricated.
by Novus America » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:50 am
by Stalliongrad and Far-Eastern Territories » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:50 am
by LiberNovusAmericae » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:51 am
by Ayissor » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:51 am
Diopolis wrote:Ayissor wrote:I'd say 100 is a conservative estimate considering 200 million people lived in the USSR at that time, and that's not all the Slaves in Europe.
So yeah, it would probably be that high if not higher.
I'd say half the slavs in eastern europe being declared able to the teutonized doesn't sound unlikely at all- more like the bare minimum. And we forget that a lot of the ethnicities out there got declared aryan, like the latvians, most of the ugro-finnic groups, and even some of the slavs(like croats).
by East Ustya » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:52 am
Novus America wrote:
Also he and his cronies openly stated it:
“Casualties have indeed appeared among workers, but it is not enough to stop us in our tracks. This is the price we have to pay, it's nothing to be afraid of. Who knows how many people have been sacrificed on the battlefields and in the prisons [for the revolutionary cause]? Now we have a few cases of illness and death: it's nothing!”
Chen Yi, Mao’s Foreign Minister
“When there is not enough to eat people starve to death. It is better to let half of the people die so that the other half can eat their fill.”
Mao himself.
Mao’s complete sociopathic disregard for human life cannot be overstated.
Deaths meant nothing to him.
by Lancaster of Wessex » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:55 am
East Ustya wrote:Novus America wrote:
Also he and his cronies openly stated it:
“Casualties have indeed appeared among workers, but it is not enough to stop us in our tracks. This is the price we have to pay, it's nothing to be afraid of. Who knows how many people have been sacrificed on the battlefields and in the prisons [for the revolutionary cause]? Now we have a few cases of illness and death: it's nothing!”
Chen Yi, Mao’s Foreign Minister
“When there is not enough to eat people starve to death. It is better to let half of the people die so that the other half can eat their fill.”
Mao himself.
Mao’s complete sociopathic disregard for human life cannot be overstated.
Deaths meant nothing to him.
Where did you get that nonsense from?
FOX news?
by Novus America » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:55 am
East Ustya wrote:Novus America wrote:
Also he and his cronies openly stated it:
“Casualties have indeed appeared among workers, but it is not enough to stop us in our tracks. This is the price we have to pay, it's nothing to be afraid of. Who knows how many people have been sacrificed on the battlefields and in the prisons [for the revolutionary cause]? Now we have a few cases of illness and death: it's nothing!”
Chen Yi, Mao’s Foreign Minister
“When there is not enough to eat people starve to death. It is better to let half of the people die so that the other half can eat their fill.”
Mao himself.
Mao’s complete sociopathic disregard for human life cannot be overstated.
Deaths meant nothing to him.
Where did you get that nonsense from?
FOX news?
by East Ustya » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:57 am
Lancaster of Wessex wrote:
And this is where the far left is as bad as the far right: history disproves their narratives, so they call it lies and "fake news." It's a pity people can't accept that their heroes were shitty human beings who committed atrocities.
Advertisement
Users browsing this forum: No registered users
Advertisement