"Und Doch" Trend

[Nouveau Quebecois]

Lately, I've been seeing nations pop up with the infamous Iron Division of the Freikorps motto, "Und Doch". The Iron Division, otherwise known as the Iron Brigade, was a Latvian Freikorps Unit formed by Major Josef Bischoff. The unit comprised of ethnic-German and Baltic volunteers to resist the Bolshevik's Eastward advance to reclaim lost territories. The official mission assigned to this force was to prevent any Red Army advance into East Prussia, but its real mission was to help the Baltic Germans re-establish their own state or dominance in Latvia. Eventually tensions within the ranks blew, and the Iron Brigade ended up fighting Bolsheviks, Estonians, and Latvians on scatter occasions. On several occasions the Allies pressured Germany to recall the Iron Division, but no retreat was made until a decisive Latvian victory in battle (supported by the Allies), forced the Iron Division into a scatter retreat. While retreating from the Baltic, discipline amongst the Iron Division broke down and many fighters 'ran wild through the country side marauding in complete disorder'. 'They drove the Latvians 'like rabbits across the fields'. They burned houses, destroyed bridges and telephone poles. They threw bodies into wells, followed by hand grenades. Eventually, the unit disintegrated, and many stayed in Latvia and ended up in the Latvian Army.

Axis History Forums says it's difficult to translate, as literally it just means 'And Yet', or 'Nevertheless', and is meant to convey is that, despite all hardships, the Iron Division will stand the test of time. Technically it doesn't carry National Socialist ideology, and the moderators seem to be letting it slide.

I've also been seeing that people have been making their own play-on-words with the trend. Moderator Farnhamia has a menacing "Und DEAT" imposed on it's flag, and yours truly has chosen a more clerical approach.

If I had to guess how long this trend will last for, I'm placing my money on a week at best.

Anyways, if anyone has any thoughts on why this trend has reoccurred or further opinions on the phrase, go ahead and "Und Discuss"

Original Freikorps Flag:


Scomagia's take on the issue:


Farnhamia's more intimidating stance:

[New haven america]

Lately, I've been seeing nations pop up with the infamous Iron Division of the Freikorps motto, "Und Doch". Axis History Forums says it's difficult to translate, as literally it just means 'And Yet', or 'Nevertheless', and is meant to convey is that, despite all hardships, the Iron Division will stand the test of time. Technically it doesn't carry National Socialist ideology, and the moderators seem to be letting it slide.

I've also been seeing that people have been making their own play-on-words with the trend. Moderator Farnhamia has a menacing "Und DEAT" imposed on his flag, and your's truly has chosen a more clerical approach.

Anyways, if anyone has any thoughts on why this trend has reoccurred or further opinions on the phrase, go ahead and "Und Discuss"

A. It doesn't matter if they're joking about fascist ideologies, they're still trying to normalize fascist ideologies.
B. Farn is a women, or a 1000+ year old interdimensional entity. Depends on their mood.
C. What's your opinion OP?

[Nouveau Quebecois]

Lately, I've been seeing nations pop up with the infamous Iron Division of the Freikorps motto, "Und Doch". Axis History Forums says it's difficult to translate, as literally it just means 'And Yet', or 'Nevertheless', and is meant to convey is that, despite all hardships, the Iron Division will stand the test of time. Technically it doesn't carry National Socialist ideology, and the moderators seem to be letting it slide.

I've also been seeing that people have been making their own play-on-words with the trend. Moderator Farnhamia has a menacing "Und DEAT" imposed on his flag, and your's truly has chosen a more clerical approach.

Anyways, if anyone has any thoughts on why this trend has reoccurred or further opinions on the phrase, go ahead and "Und Discuss"

A. It doesn't matter if they're joking about fascist ideologies, they're still trying to normalize fascist ideologies.
B. Farn is a women, or a 1000+ year old interdimensional entity. Depends on their mood.
C. What's your opinion OP?

See, that's the thing, the Iron Division had nothing to do with fascism. The Fascists didn't even exist then. As for my opinion, I think so long as the Mods seem okay with it, 'tis fine. Especially when it's taken as a joke.

[Scomagia]

Eh, I'm just taking the piss out of it, myself. Otherwise it's no worse than any of the other goofy flag trends over the years.

[Nouveau Quebecois]

Eh, I'm just taking the piss out of it, myself. Otherwise it's no worse than any of the other goofy flag trends over the years.

I have to say, "Und Dude" is one of my favourites.

[New haven america]

A. It doesn't matter if they're joking about fascist ideologies, they're still trying to normalize fascist ideologies.
B. Farn is a women, or a 1000+ year old interdimensional entity. Depends on their mood.
C. What's your opinion OP?

See, that's the thing, the Iron Division had nothing to do with fascism. The Fascists didn't even exist then. As for my opinion, I think so long as the Mods seem okay with it, 'tis fine. Especially when it's taken as a joke.

If you have to say "Technically it doesn't..." then chances are that it does in fact carry the meaning of said ideology.

[Scomagia]

Eh, I'm just taking the piss out of it, myself. Otherwise it's no worse than any of the other goofy flag trends over the years.

I have to say, "Und Dude" is one of my favourites.

Thank you. The painting is actually called Und Doch, which is why I picked it. I saw the trend, Googled Und Doch, found the meaning, and then found the painting.

[Nouveau Quebecois]

See, that's the thing, the Iron Division had nothing to do with fascism. The Fascists didn't even exist then. As for my opinion, I think so long as the Mods seem okay with it, 'tis fine. Especially when it's taken as a joke.

If you have to say "Technically it doesn't..." then chances are that it does in fact carry the meaning of said ideology.

...

I don't think so mate. If they carried any ideology, it was anti-Bolshevism.

[Scomagia]

See, that's the thing, the Iron Division had nothing to do with fascism. The Fascists didn't even exist then. As for my opinion, I think so long as the Mods seem okay with it, 'tis fine. Especially when it's taken as a joke.

If you have to say "Technically it doesn't..." then chances are that it does in fact carry the meaning of said ideology.

Not necessarily. I doubt everyone with the flag is a Nazi or Fascist.

[Catsfern]

Trends like this honestly rally interest me, this is the only site I know of that something like this could happen on. As for my opinion, if they start with coordinated efforts to raid regions or spam forms then we have a problem, until them its really harmless.

[Nouveau Quebecois]

Trends like this honestly rally interest me, this is the only site I know of that something like this could happen on. As for my opinion, if they start with coordinated efforts to raid regions or spam forms then we have a problem, until them its really harmless.

I thought it was insignificant but I'm not gonna lie, seeing a Mod follow the trend is what actually grabbed my attention.

[Nouveau Quebecois]

The most I can see coming out of this though is if all the "Und Doch-ers" rallied behind some sort of NationStates Area 51 Raid and the whole site is just flooded with "Und Doch" flags

[Catsfern]

Id almost enjoy seeing that

[Scomagia]

All Und Doch flags? Nah.

All mocking Und Doch flags? Yes.

[Nouveau Quebecois]

All Und Doch flags? Nah.

All mocking Und Doch flags? Yes.

"Und Dude" is far superior to "Und Dog" imo

[Scomagia]

All Und Doch flags? Nah.

All mocking Und Doch flags? Yes.

"Und Dude" is far superior to "Und Dog" imo

Yes, yes it is.

[Dumb Ideologies]

It's a good solid seasonal meme but it's hardly up to the Ayn Rand sex kitten one from way back. Shout out to my fellow geriatrics with that one.

[Nouveau Quebecois]

It's a good solid seasonal meme but it's hardly up to the Ayn Rand sex kitten one from way back. Shout out to my fellow geriatrics with that one.

I would have to argue that "Und Doch" is a meme of far superior standard. Nations like Scomogagia or whatever have made marvellous use of the "Doch" family of puns and I think that's fantastic.

[Kowani]

It's a good solid seasonal meme but it's hardly up to the Ayn Rand sex kitten one from way back. Shout out to my fellow geriatrics with that one.

…Only on NSG.

[New haven america]

It's a good solid seasonal meme but it's hardly up to the Ayn Rand sex kitten one from way back. Shout out to my fellow geriatrics with that one.

…Only on NSG.

It was her Eastern European charm that got to them.

[Scomagia]

…Only on NSG.

It was her Eastern European charm that got to them.

I know I'd take a run at her. Meow.

[Scomagia]

It's a good solid seasonal meme but it's hardly up to the Ayn Rand sex kitten one from way back. Shout out to my fellow geriatrics with that one.

I would have to argue that "Und Doch" is a meme of far superior standard. Nations like Scomogagia or whatever have made marvellous use of the "Doch" family of puns and I think that's fantastic.

It's Scomagia. Scomogagia is a disease that leads you to becoming me.

[The Brytish Isles]

Congratulations, the meme has spread. Now we must spread it further.

[Catsfern]

Congratulations, the meme has spread. Now we must spread it further.

you mean spread it fuhrer

[Nouveau Quebecois]

Congratulations, the meme has spread. Now we must spread it further.

you mean spread it fuhrer

and now the meme is "Und Dead", thanks, I hope you're proud