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Two Senators want Antifa labled domestic terrorists

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United States of Devonta
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Postby United States of Devonta » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:28 pm

Nova Cyberia wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
I like how that WaPo link opens up with a video that has a thumbnail of a dude with a shirt that praises Pinochet getting knocked around by a sign.

That's totally a peaceful dude right there!

Anndddd.... all the other people who got attacked who weren't wearing Pinochet shirts?

And besides, you endorsed a terrorist who tried to kill children. You have no moral superiority.


Odds are they had like views.

Still the action is wrong and not okay.

But we should be addressing acts of terrorism from the right, as it kills way more people. Antifa is just a distraction so the right doesn't have to do anything about the groups that support them.
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Cedoria
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Postby Cedoria » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:28 pm

'See kids, these days you don't even have to kill anyone to get labelled a terror group! Just show up to fight people who've killed a bunch more, then you'll be fine!'
Yeah no. I'll take these Senators 'anti-terrorism' shtick seriously when they go after the far more dangerous groups Antifa is combatting. They are backed by Congressional and institutional support, not to mention more or less outright being OKeyd by the current POTUS. Antifa basically has none of that, and isn't even an organisation besides.

Plus, friendly daily reminder that anybody who thinks Antifa and Fa are equivalent is an idiot. Thanks.
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Nova Cyberia
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Postby Nova Cyberia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:29 pm

United States of Devonta wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:Anndddd.... all the other people who got attacked who weren't wearing Pinochet shirts?

And besides, you endorsed a terrorist who tried to kill children. You have no moral superiority.


Odds are they had like views.

Still the action is wrong and not okay.

But we should be addressing acts of terrorism from the right, as it kills way more people. Antifa is just a distraction so the right doesn't have to do anything about the groups that support them.

I'm sorry, but your attempted appeal to other problems is still fallacious.
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Cedoria
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Postby Cedoria » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:29 pm

Pacomia wrote:Yeah, Antifa is a violent extremist organisation with a known history of violence and disturbance. I support this, and I’m a liberal.

Antifa is not an organisation. It has no membership lists, funding, or cells or any real structure of any kind.

The mere fact that you make this mistake disqualifies you from reasonable commentary on the subject. You don't know the first thing about it, and it shows.
In real life I am a libertarian socialist/democratic socialist
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Likes: Freedom of speech, Freedom of Expression, Direct Democracy, Worker Owned Cooperatives, Secularism, Anti-Theism, Freedom of civil disobediance, Libertarian Socialism, Social equity for minorities.

Dislikes: Neo-Conservatism, Neo-Liberalism, Stalinism, Capitalism, American Exceptionalism, Most world leaders, Religious bigotry, Despots of virtually any kind, Imperialism, Putinism, Economic Inequality, Identity Politics, Fascism and assorted far-right movements.



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Torrocca
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Postby Torrocca » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:29 pm

United States of Devonta wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:Anndddd.... all the other people who got attacked who weren't wearing Pinochet shirts?

And besides, you endorsed a terrorist who tried to kill children. You have no moral superiority.


Odds are they had like views.

Still the action is wrong and not okay.

But we should be addressing acts of terrorism from the right, as it kills way more people. Antifa is just a distraction so the right doesn't have to do anything about the groups that support them.


The vast majority of terrorism comes from the right-wing, after all.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:30 pm

Torrocca wrote:
Bozopolis wrote:I feel like it needs to be said that Antifa isn't like, a singular organization. No one group is really able to say it represents the whole of antifa. It's one of those things where it's just a political view. One of those "all it takes to join is to consider yourself a member" kinda deals. Just want to make sure you guys keep this information in mind.


No, no, clearly AntiFA is a well-armed and extremely dangerous terrorist organization that's totally the most organized thing to ever organize ever and has sleeper cells all across America!!1! Pray to your bible wrapped in an American flag every night otherwise an AntiFA terrorist organizer might pop out from your closet and terrorize you with their organized terrorism!

Antifa super soldiers have murdered millions of innocent properties!
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United States of Devonta
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Postby United States of Devonta » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:30 pm

Nova Cyberia wrote:
United States of Devonta wrote:
Odds are they had like views.

Still the action is wrong and not okay.

But we should be addressing acts of terrorism from the right, as it kills way more people. Antifa is just a distraction so the right doesn't have to do anything about the groups that support them.

I'm sorry, but your attempted appeal to other problems is still fallacious.


Yeet.

It still stands as true. Other groups deserve to be declared such if Antifa has met the bar.
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Nova Cyberia
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Postby Nova Cyberia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:30 pm

Cedoria wrote:'See kids, these days you don't even have to kill anyone to get labelled a terror group! Just show up to fight people who've killed a bunch more, then you'll be fine!'
Yeah no. I'll take these Senators 'anti-terrorism' shtick seriously when they go after the far more dangerous groups Antifa is combatting. They are backed by Congressional and institutional support, not to mention more or less outright being OKeyd by the current POTUS. Antifa basically has none of that, and isn't even an organisation besides.

Plus, friendly daily reminder that anybody who thinks Antifa and Fa are equivalent is an idiot. Thanks.

What groups does Antifa combat again? Because beating up conservatives and liberals who wave the American flag doesn't mean you're combating fascism.

Your far-left street milita thugs are scum, and should be treated as such.
Yes, yes, I get it. I'm racist and fascist because I disagree with you. Can we skip that part? I've heard it a million times before and I guarantee it won't be any different when you do it
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Torrocca
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Postby Torrocca » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:31 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
No, no, clearly AntiFA is a well-armed and extremely dangerous terrorist organization that's totally the most organized thing to ever organize ever and has sleeper cells all across America!!1! Pray to your bible wrapped in an American flag every night otherwise an AntiFA terrorist organizer might pop out from your closet and terrorize you with their organized terrorism!

Antifa super soldiers have murdered millions of innocent properties!


Tipping over trash cans is the exact same thing as deliberately ramming a vehicle into a crowd of people in the name of your political ideology!!1! I am very smart!
Libertarian Democratic Socialist. RAINBOW! Revolutionary Catalonia and Revolutionary Rojava Forever! ^_^
I am Her Majesty, Torra I, of the House Anarkittismo, NS's self-anointed Anarcho-Monarchist Queen. Now known as God-Empress Torra.
"Fascism is not debated, it is destroyed." - Buenaventura Durruti
"When the people are being hit with a stick, they are not happier if the stick is called “the stick of the people”. The State is an oppression that must be abolished."
I go by Torra and feminine pronouns! They/Them/Their are perfectly acceptable alternatives as well :3
Suggestions welcome!

Capital - Karl Marx and Frederich Engels
Wage Labor and Capital - Karl Marx
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Mutual Aid - Peter Kropotkin
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Nova Cyberia
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Postby Nova Cyberia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:31 pm

United States of Devonta wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:I'm sorry, but your attempted appeal to other problems is still fallacious.


Yeet.

It still stands as true. Other groups deserve to be declared such if Antifa has met the bar.

Okay? I really could give less of a fuck if you wanna declare the Aryan Brotherhood as terrorists. Be my guest. They deserve it.
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Cappuccina
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Postby Cappuccina » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:32 pm

Torrocca wrote:
Cappuccina wrote:Most Antifa members think anyone to their right is fascist, so their understanding is lacking just as much.


I'm sure you have some verifiable proof like, say, a study or a poll that backs up this claim of yours. Amirite?

It's pretty obvious, like saying most fascists are racist.
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Scomagia
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Postby Scomagia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:32 pm

Much as I detest Antifa, this is poorly worded.

A better idea is to label specific Antifa organisations as terroristic or hate groups, such as Rose City Antifa which has, as of this point, assaulted numerous people and had a member who attempted to murder police at a school.
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Torrocca
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Postby Torrocca » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:32 pm

Cappuccina wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
I'm sure you have some verifiable proof like, say, a study or a poll that backs up this claim of yours. Amirite?

It's pretty obvious, like saying most fascists are racist.


Ah, so you don't actually have verifiable proof backing up that claim. Shame.
Libertarian Democratic Socialist. RAINBOW! Revolutionary Catalonia and Revolutionary Rojava Forever! ^_^
I am Her Majesty, Torra I, of the House Anarkittismo, NS's self-anointed Anarcho-Monarchist Queen. Now known as God-Empress Torra.
"Fascism is not debated, it is destroyed." - Buenaventura Durruti
"When the people are being hit with a stick, they are not happier if the stick is called “the stick of the people”. The State is an oppression that must be abolished."
I go by Torra and feminine pronouns! They/Them/Their are perfectly acceptable alternatives as well :3
Suggestions welcome!

Capital - Karl Marx and Frederich Engels
Wage Labor and Capital - Karl Marx
The Conquest of Bread - Peter Kropotkin
Mutual Aid - Peter Kropotkin
Statism and Anarchy - Mikhail Bakunin

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Cedoria
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Postby Cedoria » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:33 pm

Sudorenstan wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Nothing to see here, just the GOP trying to ban dissent against Trump.

I don't think violent crime and no respect for law enforcement is any way to protest the current administration. They have a history of violence and racism and need to be calmed down.

Should law enforcement always be respected just because? With the current history of police antics in America, I'd be far more inclined to protest this suspicious 'respect' we keep hearing about. Law Enforcement have hard jobs, I know. They also have standards they should meet on those jobs, jobs that they volunteered to do. Just 'respecting' someone goes both ways, and let's not pretend American police are infallible either individually or institutionally.
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Likes: Freedom of speech, Freedom of Expression, Direct Democracy, Worker Owned Cooperatives, Secularism, Anti-Theism, Freedom of civil disobediance, Libertarian Socialism, Social equity for minorities.

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United States of Devonta
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Postby United States of Devonta » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:33 pm

Nova Cyberia wrote:
Cedoria wrote:'See kids, these days you don't even have to kill anyone to get labelled a terror group! Just show up to fight people who've killed a bunch more, then you'll be fine!'
Yeah no. I'll take these Senators 'anti-terrorism' shtick seriously when they go after the far more dangerous groups Antifa is combatting. They are backed by Congressional and institutional support, not to mention more or less outright being OKeyd by the current POTUS. Antifa basically has none of that, and isn't even an organisation besides.

Plus, friendly daily reminder that anybody who thinks Antifa and Fa are equivalent is an idiot. Thanks.

What groups does Antifa combat again? Because beating up conservatives and liberals who wave the American flag doesn't mean you're combating fascism.

Your far-left street milita thugs are scum, and should be treated as such.


Have you condemned fascist this hard on NS before, jw?

Like groups that actually have a body count?
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LiberNovusAmericae
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Postby LiberNovusAmericae » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:33 pm

Torrocca wrote:
United States of Devonta wrote:
Odds are they had like views.

Still the action is wrong and not okay.

But we should be addressing acts of terrorism from the right, as it kills way more people. Antifa is just a distraction so the right doesn't have to do anything about the groups that support them.


The vast majority of terrorism comes from the right-wing, after all.

Probably because the benefactor of left wing terrorism collapsed relatively recently in history.
Last edited by LiberNovusAmericae on Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:33 pm

Torrocca wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Antifa super soldiers have murdered millions of innocent properties!


Tipping over trash cans is the exact same thing as deliberately ramming a vehicle into a crowd of people in the name of your political ideology!!1! I am very smart!

Worse!
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Camarder
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Postby Camarder » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:34 pm

Well, Louisiana is a hotbed of Ku Klux Klan activity, so I expected nothing better from them.

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Cedoria
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Postby Cedoria » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:34 pm

Scomagia wrote:Much as I detest Antifa, this is poorly worded.

A better idea is to label specific Antifa organisations as terroristic or hate groups, such as Rose City Antifa which has, as of this point, assaulted numerous people and had a member who attempted to murder police at a school.

Once again, there are NO Antifa organisations. Antifa is NOT an organisation, it's an umbrella label under which people choose to put themselves. There's no group that sits down and organises where, when and how they do stuff, it's just people who show up whenever they get a bunch of proud-boys or Jew-hating Klansmen in the area and they want to tell them to fuck off.

How can you label a non-organisation a terrorist organisation? How do you enforce that law? You can't.
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Likes: Freedom of speech, Freedom of Expression, Direct Democracy, Worker Owned Cooperatives, Secularism, Anti-Theism, Freedom of civil disobediance, Libertarian Socialism, Social equity for minorities.

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Nova Cyberia
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Postby Nova Cyberia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:35 pm

United States of Devonta wrote:
Nova Cyberia wrote:What groups does Antifa combat again? Because beating up conservatives and liberals who wave the American flag doesn't mean you're combating fascism.

Your far-left street milita thugs are scum, and should be treated as such.


Have you condemned fascist this hard on NS before, jw?

Like groups that actually have a body count?

Yeah, actually. I have.

This pathetic dance that occurs whenever anybody condemns Antifa groups is hilariously predictable.

"Oh, you think Antifa's bad? Well, Nazis exist so you have to condemn them first before saying anything about our Antifa gud bois."
Yes, yes, I get it. I'm racist and fascist because I disagree with you. Can we skip that part? I've heard it a million times before and I guarantee it won't be any different when you do it
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Torrocca
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Postby Torrocca » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:35 pm

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

Probably because the benefactor of left wing terrorism collapsed relatively recently.


I'm pretty sure thirty years isn't "recently", if you're talking about the USSR.

And I'm also pretty sure they weren't benefactors to any non-ML leftist movements.

Ifreann wrote:
Torrocca wrote:
Tipping over trash cans is the exact same thing as deliberately ramming a vehicle into a crowd of people in the name of your political ideology!!1! I am very smart!

Worse!


We've solved Fascism by labeling the trashcan tippers as terrorists! Bake 'em away, toys!
Libertarian Democratic Socialist. RAINBOW! Revolutionary Catalonia and Revolutionary Rojava Forever! ^_^
I am Her Majesty, Torra I, of the House Anarkittismo, NS's self-anointed Anarcho-Monarchist Queen. Now known as God-Empress Torra.
"Fascism is not debated, it is destroyed." - Buenaventura Durruti
"When the people are being hit with a stick, they are not happier if the stick is called “the stick of the people”. The State is an oppression that must be abolished."
I go by Torra and feminine pronouns! They/Them/Their are perfectly acceptable alternatives as well :3
Suggestions welcome!

Capital - Karl Marx and Frederich Engels
Wage Labor and Capital - Karl Marx
The Conquest of Bread - Peter Kropotkin
Mutual Aid - Peter Kropotkin
Statism and Anarchy - Mikhail Bakunin

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Nova Cyberia
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Ex-Nation

Postby Nova Cyberia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:35 pm

Cedoria wrote:
Scomagia wrote:Much as I detest Antifa, this is poorly worded.

A better idea is to label specific Antifa organisations as terroristic or hate groups, such as Rose City Antifa which has, as of this point, assaulted numerous people and had a member who attempted to murder police at a school.

Once again, there are NO Antifa organisations. Antifa is NOT an organisation, it's an umbrella label under which people choose to put themselves. There's no group that sits down and organises where, when and how they do stuff, it's just people who show up whenever they get a bunch of proud-boys or Jew-hating Klansmen in the area and they want to tell them to fuck off.

How can you label a non-organisation a terrorist organisation? How do you enforce that law? You can't.

Actually, Antifa organizations do indeed exist.
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United States of Devonta
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Postby United States of Devonta » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:37 pm

LiberNovusAmericae wrote:

Probably because the benefactor of left wing terrorism collapsed relatively recently in history.


Not really. Most of the Right's extremism is driven by fear. Even before 1991 it was high.
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Scomagia
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Postby Scomagia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:38 pm

Cedoria wrote:
Scomagia wrote:Much as I detest Antifa, this is poorly worded.

A better idea is to label specific Antifa organisations as terroristic or hate groups, such as Rose City Antifa which has, as of this point, assaulted numerous people and had a member who attempted to murder police at a school.

Once again, there are NO Antifa organisations. Antifa is NOT an organisation, it's an umbrella label under which people choose to put themselves. There's no group that sits down and organises where, when and how they do stuff, it's just people who show up whenever they get a bunch of proud-boys or Jew-hating Klansmen in the area and they want to tell them to fuck off.

How can you label a non-organisation a terrorist organisation? How do you enforce that law? You can't.

You're lying. There are specific organized groups of Antifa. Antifa ad a whole has no official organization.

And you enforce it exactly like I said. Condemn those organizations which are known to engage in criminal activity.
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Pacomia
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Postby Pacomia » Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:38 pm

Can we all at least agree that the Antifa is a violent group which has done more harm than good, and should not be exempt from assault or anti-violence laws?
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