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Two Senators want Antifa labled domestic terrorists

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Wallenburg
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Postby Wallenburg » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:44 pm

Kowani wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
You're better than this, stop.

Racist, perhaps. Fascist, nah. Sympathizer? Perhaps.

If you want to make a distinction between someone who truly believes in fascism and someone who simply furthers fascism because it's profitable and easy, go ahead. Both kinds of people are equally dangerous and condemnable.
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Great Algerstonia
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Postby Great Algerstonia » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:45 pm

Wallenburg wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
You're better than this, stop.

Crowder has propagated the Bell Curve and the whole "western civilization" dogwhistle. He's massively bigoted against pretty much every minority imaginable. I am not sure what you find objectionable about my claim.

That isn’t fascism, that’s racism. Not all facsists are racists and not all racists are fascists.
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Rojava Free State
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Postby Rojava Free State » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:45 pm

Pacomia wrote:You can be both a leftist and an open-minded critical thinker. It just so happens that I am both.


I myself am a leftist but I'm anti authoritarian and think people have a right to disagree with me without being subjected to violence and hate. People seem to think leftist equals dictator and right wing equals freedom (or vica versa) but the political compass is more like a square than a straight line, with a line between left and right intersected by a line between authoritarian and liberterian. I'm slightly left but extremely authortian
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Postby Highever » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:46 pm

Kowani wrote:
Strahcoin wrote:PragerU Testimonials:
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Postby Diopolis » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:47 pm

Rojava Free State wrote:
Pacomia wrote:You can be both a leftist and an open-minded critical thinker. It just so happens that I am both.


I myself am a leftist but I'm anti authoritarian and think people have a right to disagree with me without being subjected to violence and hate. People seem to think leftist equals dictator and right wing equals freedom (or vica versa) but the political compass is more like a square than a straight line, with a line between left and right intersected by a line between authoritarian and liberterian. I'm slightly left but extremely authortian

Really to graph political beliefs accurately you'd need an x,y, and z axis.
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United States of Devonta
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Postby United States of Devonta » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:47 pm

Rojava Free State wrote:
Pacomia wrote:You can be both a leftist and an open-minded critical thinker. It just so happens that I am both.


I myself am a leftist but I'm anti authoritarian and think people have a right to disagree with me without being subjected to violence and hate. People seem to think leftist equals dictator and right wing equals freedom (or vica versa) but the political compass is more like a square than a straight line, with a line between left and right intersected by a line between authoritarian and liberterian. I'm slightly left but extremely authortian


I assume its a typo, but your first and last sentences highly contradict each other.
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Postby United Pishon Edenic Union » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:48 pm

Union of Sovereign States and Republics wrote:https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/two-senators-want-antifa-activists-to-be-labeled-domestic-terrorists-heres-what-that-means/ar-AAECtvK?li=BBnbcA1&ocid=spartanntp

Two Republican senators have introduced a nonbinding resolution that would label antifascists — known as antifa — as “domestic terrorists,” doubling down against radical activists who have drawn criticism from conservatives and President Trump.

“Antifa are terrorists, violent masked bullies who ‘fight fascism’ with actual fascism, protected by Liberal privilege,” Sen. Bill Cassidy (R-La.) said in a statement. “Bullies get their way until someone says no. Elected officials must have courage, not cowardice, to prevent terror.”


Hina Shamsi, director of the national security project at the American Civil Liberties Union, told The Washington Post that she opposes labeling groups as domestic terrorists. “It is dangerous and overly broad to use labels that are disconnected [from] actual individual conduct,” she said. “And as we’ve seen how ‘terrorism’ has been used already in this country, any such scheme raises significant due process, equal protection and First Amendment constitutional concerns.”


Designating a group as a domestic terrorist organization expands law enforcement’s ability to investigate it. The label also means that police can not only investigate a specific suspect, but also look into groups that person affiliates with, Neal Katyal, a Georgetown University law professor and former national security adviser, told NPR.

Similar concerns may be the reason the federal government does not make public an official list of domestic terrorist groups, Jerome Bjelopera, a specialist in organized crime and terrorism, wrote in a Congressional Research Service report. The government does include domestic and international terrorists on its terrorist watch list, Bjelopera wrote.


So, as the article says, two republican senators want Antifa declared a terrorist organization.

Personally, I couldn't be more happy about this. Finally taking action against these left-wing versions of the white supremacists is long overdue. While I'm just as anti-supremacist as the next guy, Antifa's not much better, given their blatant lack of respect for the police force, veterans, and anyone who isn't on the left.

Thoughts, NSG?




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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:48 pm

Wallenburg wrote:
Kowani wrote:Racist, perhaps. Fascist, nah. Sympathizer? Perhaps.

If you want to make a distinction between someone who truly believes in fascism and someone who simply furthers fascism because it's profitable and easy, go ahead. Both kinds of people are equally dangerous and condemnable.

Crowder is a dumb racist idiot. But he’s not a fascist. Is he a pawn in the fascists quest for power? Possibly
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Postby Rojava Free State » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:49 pm

United States of Devonta wrote:
Rojava Free State wrote:
I myself am a leftist but I'm anti authoritarian and think people have a right to disagree with me without being subjected to violence and hate. People seem to think leftist equals dictator and right wing equals freedom (or vica versa) but the political compass is more like a square than a straight line, with a line between left and right intersected by a line between authoritarian and liberterian. I'm slightly left but extremely authortian


I assume its a typo, but your first and last sentences highly contradict each other.


DOH! I meant anti authoritarian ugh
Last edited by Rojava Free State on Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
political compass:

Economic Left/Right: -0.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.38
pro: marijuana, gun rights, private property, and sexy brown women

anti: fascism, communism, islamism, sexism, pan africanism, La raza, Warren Police Department (and most of the other police departments of metro Detroit except for Auburn Hills. They're aight), gun control, trump, obama, bush, clinton, reagan, carter, chipotle and snotty in crowd teens. Ugh I can't deal with them
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Hatterleigh
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Postby Hatterleigh » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:49 pm

Jack Thomas Lang wrote:Antifa aren't terrorists, and labeling them as such sets a dangerous precedent. They can be violent criminals, and if members of Antifa commit vandalism and violent crimes they should be prosecuted and dealt with by the law. Calling them all terrorists is probably a step too far.

It really isn't. All the time they say "Make racists afraid again" and they aren't exactly looking to convert people peacefully to their cause. Fits the definition of terrorism. That being said, antifa isn't exactly a single organization, and terrorism is actually a pretty vague term
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Wallenburg
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Postby Wallenburg » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:51 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Wallenburg wrote:If you want to make a distinction between someone who truly believes in fascism and someone who simply furthers fascism because it's profitable and easy, go ahead. Both kinds of people are equally dangerous and condemnable.

Crowder is a dumb racist idiot. But he’s not a fascist. Is he a pawn in the fascists quest for power? Possibly

Almost certainly, in my opinion. He platforms Stefan Molyneaux ffs.
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Hatterleigh
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Postby Hatterleigh » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:51 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Wallenburg wrote:If you want to make a distinction between someone who truly believes in fascism and someone who simply furthers fascism because it's profitable and easy, go ahead. Both kinds of people are equally dangerous and condemnable.

Crowder is a dumb racist idiot. But he’s not a fascist. Is he a pawn in the fascists quest for power? Possibly

Fascists hate crowder. He's controlled opposition. Fascists are big gatekeepers
Last edited by Hatterleigh on Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Strahcoin » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:52 pm

Wallenburg wrote:
Strahcoin wrote:Since when did PragerU host actual fascists? Dennis Prager, founder of PragerU, is an Orthodox Jew. He strongly opposes fascism. In this video, Prager condemns Nazism.

Yes, they host fascists. For example, Steven Crowder. Also, being an Orthodox Jew and being a fascist are far from mutually exclusive. In fact, the more orthodox and zionist Jews tend to be more fascist.
And while fascists did murder other socialists, that doesn't mean fascists aren't socialists. Socialists believe in a government-controlled economy and overthrowing the bourgeoisie. Fascists believe in a government-controlled economy and overthrowing those from stronger, wealthier nations.

Socialists believe in dismantling the socioeconomic hierarchies that oppress the workers and various other persecuted groups. Fascists believe in reinforcing hierarchies to benefit an ever-narrower corner of their society, such that the weakest and most vulnerable elements of society are considered worthy of death.
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Trump literally speaks like a child, doesn't know how key elements of his government work, can't pay attention for as much as 10 seconds, and whines about the media when they show everyone a fraction of how stupid he is. He has failed his way through his businesses, and he's failing his way through the presidency.
It's more than just the name. The actual ideology of fascism matches more with that of the far-left than it does to that of the far-right. Overthrowing the oppressors, willingly surrendering the person to the state, assaulting anyone who doesn't conform to the beliefs, etc.

Fascism is literally about installing oppressors, not overthrowing them. Far-leftism across the fucking board believes in the total dissolution of the state, not "willingly surrendering the person to the state". The facts of political speech show that the left has had its speech suppressed far more than the right.
Granted, Nazis may hold national identity crucial. However, their reasoning for this is to overthrow the stronger, wealthier nations (similar to how Marxism involves overthrowing the bourgeoisie).

Marxism also involves overthrowing the concept of a state at all. You don't build a totalitarian state and empire-build to do that.
Conservatives value national identity to reduce racial/sexual discrimination, while Nazis use it to further discrimination.

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Nazi: "If you're not a native-born like me, you are different, and I cannot connect with you. I don't care if you're a law-abiding citizen of the same nation as me."
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I have never encountered a conservative that actually believes that. If they existed, Trump's comments about Democratic congresswomen would have gotten him convicted in the Senate by now.

1. Calling Steven Crowder a fascist is like calling the Black Hole "white". Nothing could be farther from the truth.
2. Then why did Hitler and the Nazis violate the Treaty of Versailles and attack Britain and France?
3. And that's why nobody could debate a leftist...
4. Trump is not failing. He's thriving. Look at the unemployment numbers. Look at the wall being built at the border. Frankly, the politicians of the Democrat Party seem to "whine" about Trump and conservatives significantly more. And as for Trump unable to focus for a long time, neither can the American people. Trump connects with us, and he doesn't pretend to be intellectually better than us.
5. Does that mean laissez-faire capitalism and right-libertarianism are left-wing ideologies?
6. Well, who's going to make sure the "bourgeoisie" don't rise and "seize the means of production" from the laborers?
7. I've never heard of a Nazi who wishes to reduce discrimination.
8. Uh, hello. Also, freedom of speech - we may not agree with it, but we must accept it. (Besides, what was the quote? I don't think it was that bad.)
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Rojava Free State
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Postby Rojava Free State » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:52 pm

Hatterleigh wrote:
Jack Thomas Lang wrote:Antifa aren't terrorists, and labeling them as such sets a dangerous precedent. They can be violent criminals, and if members of Antifa commit vandalism and violent crimes they should be prosecuted and dealt with by the law. Calling them all terrorists is probably a step too far.

It really isn't. All the time they say "Make racists afraid again" and they aren't exactly looking to convert people peacefully to their cause. Fits the definition of terrorism. That being said, antifa isn't exactly a single organization, and terrorism is actually a pretty vague term


Antifa is technically a terror group but operates more like a teenage criminal street gang, with baseball bats, knives and rocks and bottles and a tendency to loot and vandalize stores
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Hatterleigh
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Postby Hatterleigh » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:53 pm

Rojava Free State wrote:
Hatterleigh wrote:It really isn't. All the time they say "Make racists afraid again" and they aren't exactly looking to convert people peacefully to their cause. Fits the definition of terrorism. That being said, antifa isn't exactly a single organization, and terrorism is actually a pretty vague term


Antifa is technically a terror group but operates more like a teenage criminal street gang, with baseball bats, knives and rocks and bottles and a tendency to loot and vandalize stores

Exactly. They're a bunch of Live Action Roleplayers. They don't shut their mouths about all the groups they want to kill and silence but they haven't actually killed anyone in the past 30 years
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Postby Thermodolia » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:55 pm

Wallenburg wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Crowder is a dumb racist idiot. But he’s not a fascist. Is he a pawn in the fascists quest for power? Possibly

Almost certainly, in my opinion. He platforms Stefan Molyneaux ffs.

I wouldn’t call Stefan Molyneaux a fascist either. Not all WNs are fascist
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Postby Hatterleigh » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:55 pm

Rojava Free State wrote:
United States of Devonta wrote:
I assume its a typo, but your first and last sentences highly contradict each other.


DOH! I meant anti authoritarian ugh

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Postby Strahcoin » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:56 pm

Hatterleigh wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Crowder is a dumb racist idiot. But he’s not a fascist. Is he a pawn in the fascists quest for power? Possibly

Fascists hate crowder. He's controlled opposition. Fascists are big gatekeepers

Also, Crowder supports the freedom of speech, while Fascists don't. Crowder opposes the use of violence against those who disagree with them, as stated here.
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:56 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Wallenburg wrote:Almost certainly, in my opinion. He platforms Stefan Molyneaux ffs.

I wouldn’t call Stefan Molyneaux a fascist either. Not all WNs are fascist


This^

Molyneaux is literally an unironic AnCap. He might be a white nationalist but he's not a fascist of any sort.

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The Greater Ohio Valley
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Postby The Greater Ohio Valley » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:57 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Wallenburg wrote:Almost certainly, in my opinion. He platforms Stefan Molyneaux ffs.

I wouldn’t call Stefan Molyneaux a fascist either. Not all WNs are fascist

He’s pretty fascism adjacent though, to be somewhat fair.
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Rojava Free State
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Postby Rojava Free State » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:57 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:I wouldn’t call Stefan Molyneaux a fascist either. Not all WNs are fascist


This^

Molyneaux is literally an unironic AnCap. He might be a white nationalist but he's not a fascist of any sort.


How can someone be an anarchist and a white nationalist? If there's no government, how could they prevent race mixing or being taken over by another ethnic group, things they always are on guard for
political compass:

Economic Left/Right: -0.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.38
pro: marijuana, gun rights, private property, and sexy brown women

anti: fascism, communism, islamism, sexism, pan africanism, La raza, Warren Police Department (and most of the other police departments of metro Detroit except for Auburn Hills. They're aight), gun control, trump, obama, bush, clinton, reagan, carter, chipotle and snotty in crowd teens. Ugh I can't deal with them
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Washington Resistance Army
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:58 pm

Rojava Free State wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
This^

Molyneaux is literally an unironic AnCap. He might be a white nationalist but he's not a fascist of any sort.


How can someone be an anarchist and a white nationalist? If there's no government, how could they prevent race mixing or being taken over by another ethnic group, things they always are on guard for


There's a whole ideology for those sorts.

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Postby The Liberated Territories » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:58 pm

I don't like Antifa or their actions, but calling them terrorists is a bit extreme.
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Wallenburg
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Postby Wallenburg » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:58 pm

Thermodolia wrote:
Wallenburg wrote:Almost certainly, in my opinion. He platforms Stefan Molyneaux ffs.

I wouldn’t call Stefan Molyneaux a fascist either. Not all WNs are fascist

Where is the difference between a white nationalist and a fascist?
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Hatterleigh
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Postby Hatterleigh » Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:58 pm

Rojava Free State wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
This^

Molyneaux is literally an unironic AnCap. He might be a white nationalist but he's not a fascist of any sort.


How can someone be an anarchist and a white nationalist? If there's no government, how could they prevent race mixing or being taken over by another ethnic group, things they always are on guard for

Idk bro, maybe the KKK or something of the like... Maybe they don't care and are just care about race as a way to excuse the wealth gaps
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