Canadian Politics

[Nilokeras]

Why do we keep having PR referenda to give to the voters and they just flat out reject it, like the point has become moot.

It's not that they don't want PR, they don't want the types of PR being proposed. Most of the time, it's MMP that ends up being proposed, and PEI's opponents wanted a straight PR with multi-member constituencies. Or PR types that have never existed such as URP(Urban-rural Proportional), or even Chilean Binomialism converted to work in a PR setting.

There's also the usual demographic issues with referenda to contend with too - turnout tends to be low (41% in BC compared to 61% in the 2017 election) and there was a pretty stark demographic divide between young people (who supported reform much more strongly) and older people (who supported keeping first past the post). Young people tend to vote less often in elections, let alone optional referenda, and therefore you can get disproportionate results.

[Nilokeras]

Why do we keep having PR referenda to give to the voters and they just flat out reject it, like the point has become moot.

It's likely because referenda are a great way to punt spicy political issues to the electorate to solve rather than risk having to enact it on their own. Plus you have the inherent paradox that the parties who form governments in a first-past-the-post system (and therefore the ones that can actually carry out electoral reform) have the most to lose in enacting reform. Hence why the Liberals very quietly took their own electoral reform promises out behind the shed and shot it in the head after dragging it through committee for a while. The NDP too only agreed to it in BC because it was a condition to forming a confidence-and-supply agreement with the Greens, who in contrast 100% do stand to benefit from reform.

[Shrillland]

Why do we keep having PR referenda to give to the voters and they just flat out reject it, like the point has become moot.

It's likely because referenda are a great way to punt spicy political issues to the electorate to solve rather than risk having to enact it on their own. Plus you have the inherent paradox that the parties who form governments in a first-past-the-post system (and therefore the ones that can actually carry out electoral reform) have the most to lose in enacting reform. Hence why the Liberals very quietly took their own electoral reform promises out behind the shed and shot it in the head after dragging it through committee for a while.

Something I have never forgiven Trudeau for myself.

[Major-Tom]

Didn't BC vote for it years and years ago but it just never got enacted?

No, they voted against it 61-39 in a postal plebiscite in 2018. PEI voted on it last year and it was rejected 52-48.

I guess the one I was thinking of was way old.

[Nilokeras]

It's likely because referenda are a great way to punt spicy political issues to the electorate to solve rather than risk having to enact it on their own. Plus you have the inherent paradox that the parties who form governments in a first-past-the-post system (and therefore the ones that can actually carry out electoral reform) have the most to lose in enacting reform. Hence why the Liberals very quietly took their own electoral reform promises out behind the shed and shot it in the head after dragging it through committee for a while.

Something I have never forgiven Trudeau for myself.

I almost voted for the Liberals because of it back in 2015. It was only because I thought my riding was a safe Tory seat that I voted for the NDP - and in hindsight I'm glad I did.

[Nilokeras]

Well here we go, BC premier John Horgan has called a snap election for October 24:

Afterer weeks of speculation, B.C. NDP leader John Horgan has made official the worst kept secret in the province: British Columbians are heading to the polls.

Horgan announced Monday he had called an election for Oct. 24 after meeting with Lt.-Gov. Janet Austin and asking her to dissolve the legislature.

"I've struggled mightily with this decision and it did not come easily to me," said Horgan, acknowledging the controversy of calling an early election during a global pandemic.

But he said that with COVID-19 expected to be a fact of life for the next year, an election made sense now.

"We can either delay that decision and create uncertain and instability over the 12 months…. or we can do what I believe is always the right thing, and ask British Columbians what they think."

The announcement comes after weeks of speculation that Horgan would call an election just over three years into his mandate, and it comes after six cabinet ministers announced their retirements in the past seven days.

We'll have to see if it pays out - the next few days and weeks will be critical in seeing if the opposition's inevitable line that this is a naked power grab (which it is) will cross the broader wonk-public information barrier and actually impact his pretty strong polling. We'll also have to see if his 'unprecedented times call for unprecedented action' line during his press release translates into a more expansive election platform than the previously announced and relatively conservative recovery plan.

[Shrillland]

Well here we go, BC premier John Horgan has called a snap election for October 24:

Afterer weeks of speculation, B.C. NDP leader John Horgan has made official the worst kept secret in the province: British Columbians are heading to the polls.

Horgan announced Monday he had called an election for Oct. 24 after meeting with Lt.-Gov. Janet Austin and asking her to dissolve the legislature.

"I've struggled mightily with this decision and it did not come easily to me," said Horgan, acknowledging the controversy of calling an early election during a global pandemic.

But he said that with COVID-19 expected to be a fact of life for the next year, an election made sense now.

"We can either delay that decision and create uncertain and instability over the 12 months…. or we can do what I believe is always the right thing, and ask British Columbians what they think."

The announcement comes after weeks of speculation that Horgan would call an election just over three years into his mandate, and it comes after six cabinet ministers announced their retirements in the past seven days.

We'll have to see if it pays out - the next few days and weeks will be critical in seeing if the opposition's inevitable line that this is a naked power grab (which it is) will cross the broader wonk-public information barrier and actually impact his pretty strong polling. We'll also have to see if his 'unprecedented times call for unprecedented action' line during his press release translates into a more expansive election platform than the previously announced and relatively conservative recovery plan.

As to the former, I doubt it since that's not what happened in New Brunswick.

[Nilokeras]

Well here we go, BC premier John Horgan has called a snap election for October 24:



We'll have to see if it pays out - the next few days and weeks will be critical in seeing if the opposition's inevitable line that this is a naked power grab (which it is) will cross the broader wonk-public information barrier and actually impact his pretty strong polling. We'll also have to see if his 'unprecedented times call for unprecedented action' line during his press release translates into a more expansive election platform than the previously announced and relatively conservative recovery plan.

As to the former, I doubt it since that's not what happened in New Brunswick.

I doubt it too. Between the American election reaching its endgame around that time and the relatively stable competence of the NDP government I suspect he won't be hurt too much. The more interesting thing will be whether or not his pretty impressive polling figures (48% NDP, 30% Liberals and 14% Greens) actually translates to gaining more seats.

[Dresderstan]

As to the former, I doubt it since that's not what happened in New Brunswick.

I doubt it too. Between the American election reaching its endgame around that time and the relatively stable competence of the NDP government I suspect he won't be hurt too much. The more interesting thing will be whether or not his pretty impressive polling figures (48% NDP, 30% Liberals and 14% Greens) actually translates to gaining more seats.

Well with a gap that large I fail to see how he couldn't win a majority if the opposition is struggling that much, the only way I could see it is if he the people see it as a naked power grab and with the Covid cases rising again the B.C. they may vote against him, but that's one month away, for now I see an NDP majority. Also I wonder if this could mean no snap federal election in the meantime until after the new year?

[Shrillland]

I doubt it too. Between the American election reaching its endgame around that time and the relatively stable competence of the NDP government I suspect he won't be hurt too much. The more interesting thing will be whether or not his pretty impressive polling figures (48% NDP, 30% Liberals and 14% Greens) actually translates to gaining more seats.

Well with a gap that large I fail to see how he couldn't win a majority if the opposition is struggling that much, the only way I could see it is if he the people see it as a naked power grab and with the Covid cases rising again the B.C. they may vote against him, but that's one month away, for now I see an NDP majority. Also I wonder if this could mean no snap federal election in the meantime until after the new year?

It means one earlier than I expected rather than later. I thought it would be sometime in the summer, but with BC voting now instead of next May, I think we'll see a no confidence vote sometime in March at the very latest with an early May election.

[Shrillland]

On the federal level, the government is now pledging $1 billion to give to cities to buy up hotels or motels that are closing due to covid in order to provide housing for the homeless or to build mobile homes for the same: https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/liberals-pledge-1-billion-for-cities-to-buy-motels-hotels-for-rapid-housing-program/ar-BB19grzP?li=AAggXBV

[Nilokeras]

Well with a gap that large I fail to see how he couldn't win a majority if the opposition is struggling that much, the only way I could see it is if he the people see it as a naked power grab and with the Covid cases rising again the B.C. they may vote against him, but that's one month away, for now I see an NDP majority. Also I wonder if this could mean no snap federal election in the meantime until after the new year?

It really is Horgan's election to lose. There are a couple of other minor scandals in the works, like the ongoing kerfuffle about Nathan Cullen's nomination in Stikine and whether or not the party will enforce its equity rules: namely that an Indigenous woman, Annita McPhee, is running and that should lead the party to select her over Cullen. I doubt any of them will break into broader public consciousness though.

[Shrillland]

Now Climate Strike Canada is demanding O'Toole stop using the slogan "Take Back Canada" for the Conservatives claiming they've been using it for over a year: https://www.cbc.ca/kidsnews/post/climate-strikers-say-take-back-canada-slogan-is-theirs-not-erin-otooles

[Anatoliyanskiy]

Now Climate Strike Canada is demanding O'Toole stop using the slogan "Take Back Canada" for the Conservatives claiming they've been using it for over a year: https://www.cbc.ca/kidsnews/post/climate-strikers-say-take-back-canada-slogan-is-theirs-not-erin-otooles

does that matter? no. It does not. Though keep in mind that this bears a suspicious similarity to some far-right groups in Europe. But I digress.

On the matter of the British Columbia election, I really think that the NDP will probably win a majority, given their decent response to the pandemic, and also that the Liberal Party doesn't have the charismatic Christy Clarke as party leader. (Wilkinson doesn't really have much going for him.)

I also really hope that the 2019-2023 period doesn't get as crazy as the 2011-2015 one, though the Liberal Party's already lost two members since the October election, but at least no one's started a new party midway through the session and had like 10 people cross the floor to it (I'm looking at you, Strength in Democracy and Quebec Parliamentary Group).

[Shrillland]

Well, it looks like Singh's going to vote for the Throne Speech after Trudeau's moving a bill through the House guaranteeing $500 monthly unemployment benefits instead of $400: https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/other/ndp-edges-toward-supporting-liberal-minority-after-changes-to-covid-19-benefits/ar-BB19n8Q6?li=AAggXBV

[The Hindustani State]

Why does Canada’s PM support Khalistan in India?

[WayNeacTia]

Now Climate Strike Canada is demanding O'Toole stop using the slogan "Take Back Canada" for the Conservatives claiming they've been using it for over a year: https://www.cbc.ca/kidsnews/post/climate-strikers-say-take-back-canada-slogan-is-theirs-not-erin-otooles

does that matter? no. It does not. Though keep in mind that this bears a suspicious similarity to some far-right groups in Europe. But I digress.

On the matter of the British Columbia election, I really think that the NDP will probably win a majority, given their decent response to the pandemic, and also that the Liberal Party doesn't have the charismatic Christy Clarke as party leader. (Wilkinson doesn't really have much going for him.)

I also really hope that the 2019-2023 period doesn't get as crazy as the 2011-2015 one, though the Liberal Party's already lost two members since the October election, but at least no one's started a new party midway through the session and had like 10 people cross the floor to it (I'm looking at you, Strength in Democracy and Quebec Parliamentary Group).

The NDP aren't going to win a majority my friend, and don't care how far Horgan tries to distance himself from Notley. The NDP had four years in Alberta and they spent us into a hole we will never get out of. The rest of Canada was watching that.

[Shrillland]

does that matter? no. It does not. Though keep in mind that this bears a suspicious similarity to some far-right groups in Europe. But I digress.

On the matter of the British Columbia election, I really think that the NDP will probably win a majority, given their decent response to the pandemic, and also that the Liberal Party doesn't have the charismatic Christy Clarke as party leader. (Wilkinson doesn't really have much going for him.)

I also really hope that the 2019-2023 period doesn't get as crazy as the 2011-2015 one, though the Liberal Party's already lost two members since the October election, but at least no one's started a new party midway through the session and had like 10 people cross the floor to it (I'm looking at you, Strength in Democracy and Quebec Parliamentary Group).

The NDP aren't going to win a majority my friend, and don't care how far Horgan tries to distance himself from Notley. The NDP had four years in Alberta and they spent us into a hole we will never get out of. The rest of Canada was watching that.

Yes, but they're only paying attention now to the Covid response, and the polls show an NDP Majority on that basis.

[Luziyca]

The NDP and the Liberals have agreed on a deal, which will avoid the election.

Honestly, good. Don't want my provincial election to be yeeted to April 2021.

[Nilokeras]

The NDP aren't going to win a majority my friend, and don't care how far Horgan tries to distance himself from Notley. The NDP had four years in Alberta and they spent us into a hole we will never get out of. The rest of Canada was watching that.

I think you're pretty drastically overestimating how much the rest of Canada cares about Alberta politics. Certainly in BC in any case, where the NDP have had a pretty healthy lead since at least March 2019. Plus Notley is remembered in BC moreso for her quixotic campaign against BC wine following that pipeline dispute than anything else she did.

[Luziyca]

Here's a twofer.

Firstly, the writ has been dropped for Saskatchewan's provincial elections. God willing the Sask Party get booted out.

Secondly, the Liberals have declared a confidence vote on new COVID-19 benefits. If that fails, we get a federal election. Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.

[Shrillland]

Here's a twofer.

Firstly, the writ has been dropped for Saskatchewan's provincial elections. God willing the Sask Party get booted out.

Secondly, the Liberals have declared a confidence vote on new COVID-19 benefits. If that fails, we get a federal election. Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.

I saw Singh said that he was ready to fight one, but I think Trudeau's managed to mollify the NDP with the Covid concessions for the time being.

Meanwhile, the government's also pushing to make Orange Shirt Day(Tomorrow for those outside Canada, a day for commemorating those First Nations peoples who suffered in the residential schools) a national holiday of remembrance.

[Luziyca]

Here's a twofer.

Firstly, the writ has been dropped for Saskatchewan's provincial elections. God willing the Sask Party get booted out.

Secondly, the Liberals have declared a confidence vote on new COVID-19 benefits. If that fails, we get a federal election. Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.

I saw Singh said that he was ready to fight one, but I think Trudeau's managed to mollify the NDP with the Covid concessions for the time being.

Yeah, I think he did, per my previous post from the 25th of September.

Meanwhile, the government's also pushing to make Orange Shirt Day(Tomorrow for those outside Canada, a day for commemorating those First Nations peoples who suffered in the residential schools) a national holiday of remembrance.

Interesting. Dunno if it's going to be a stat holiday, or if it's like National Indigenous Peoples Day, where it exists, but doesn't really affect anything.

[Shrillland]

I saw Singh said that he was ready to fight one, but I think Trudeau's managed to mollify the NDP with the Covid concessions for the time being.

Yeah, I think he did, per my previous post from the 25th of September.

Meanwhile, the government's also pushing to make Orange Shirt Day(Tomorrow for those outside Canada, a day for commemorating those First Nations peoples who suffered in the residential schools) a national holiday of remembrance.

Interesting. Dunno if it's going to be a stat holiday, or if it's like National Indigenous Peoples Day, where it exists, but doesn't really affect anything.

Well, the story says it'll be a stat holiday right in its first line. Supposedly they tried this last year, but the Senate did what they do best: Nothing whatsoever before the election negated it.

[Shrillland]

In other news, the Globe and Mail has shown that a wholly-owned by the CPP subsidiary in Colorado has been giving political donations to the Republicans next door: https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-environmental-group-says-cpp-breaking-its-rules-with-third-party/?fbclid=IwAR1yWP5M894fFU2lBxufLp1KNpRNxmxvK0dFHJ7R9lbf3teq2oGl8j0omYI