woman shot in the stomach, charged with death of fetus

[Nova Cyberia]

Or not, seeing as the shooter did nothing wrong.

The idea that one can only defend oneself against a highly pregnant woman by shooting her still does seem a bit iffy.

Well, she was shooting at him. What's he supposed to do? Let himself die? His life was being threatened. He had every right to shoot her.

[Neanderthaland]

The idea that one can only defend oneself against a highly pregnant woman by shooting her still does seem a bit iffy.

Well, she was shooting at him. What's he supposed to do? Let himself die? His life was being threatened. He had every right to shoot her.

Err... no she didn't. And he's a she.

[The Alma Mater]

The idea that one can only defend oneself against a highly pregnant woman by shooting her still does seem a bit iffy.

Well, she was shooting at him. What's he supposed to do? Let himself die? His life was being threatened. He had every right to shoot her.

1.The shooter was a girl.
2. Only the shooter pulled a gun

To be fair, the mom was in a car when she was shot. So perhaps she was threatening to use the car as a weapon.

[Te Netherlands]

So in the perfect storm of Gun violence, the Pro-Life debate and American religious extremism a woman from Alabama who was shot in the stomach while pregnant has been charged with manslaughter of the unborn fetus within. The Woman who shot her has been released.

Alabama is one of 38 states with fetal homicide laws that recognize a fetus as a potential victim and recently the Alabama governor, signed a bill banning abortion in almost every circumstance. Alabama is also a “stand-your-ground” state, which means people are allowed to use physical force to defend themselves if their reason is considered “justifiable”.

“The investigation showed that the only true victim in this was the unborn baby,’’ said Lt Danny Reid of Pleasant Grove police following the shooting, reported AL.com in December. “It was the mother of the child who initiated and continued the fight which resulted in the death of her own unborn baby.”

The case has raised alarm among pro-choice groups who say it is shocking evidence of how the state’s restrictive abortion laws are now being used against pregnant women.

So there you have it expectant provocateurs NSG a woman indicted for manslaughter for losing a pregnancy after being shot in the story is just the latest bizarre story that American serves up to baffle and astound us less ballistic nations. Do you think she should be charged because she provoked the shooting? Should the shooter have any responsibility? Do Fetuses have rights? Is Alabama still in Kansas anymore?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... 1561672289

So if I understand it correctly: The religious woman who is pro-life and pregnant was shot in her stomach by a other woman, but the pro-life activist gets in trouble because of the dead of her unborn child and the other woman has been released? What in the actual heck is this world going?

[Tekania]

So in the perfect storm of Gun violence, the Pro-Life debate and American religious extremism a woman from Alabama who was shot in the stomach while pregnant has been charged with manslaughter of the unborn fetus within. The Woman who shot her has been released.

Alabama is one of 38 states with fetal homicide laws that recognize a fetus as a potential victim and recently the Alabama governor, signed a bill banning abortion in almost every circumstance. Alabama is also a “stand-your-ground” state, which means people are allowed to use physical force to defend themselves if their reason is considered “justifiable”.

“The investigation showed that the only true victim in this was the unborn baby,’’ said Lt Danny Reid of Pleasant Grove police following the shooting, reported AL.com in December. “It was the mother of the child who initiated and continued the fight which resulted in the death of her own unborn baby.”

The case has raised alarm among pro-choice groups who say it is shocking evidence of how the state’s restrictive abortion laws are now being used against pregnant women.

So there you have it expectant provocateurs NSG a woman indicted for manslaughter for losing a pregnancy after being shot in the story is just the latest bizarre story that American serves up to baffle and astound us less ballistic nations. Do you think she should be charged because she provoked the shooting? Should the shooter have any responsibility? Do Fetuses have rights? Is Alabama still in Kansas anymore?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... 1561672289

So if I understand it correctly: The religious woman who is pro-life and pregnant was shot in her stomach by a other woman, but the pro-life activist gets in trouble because of the dead of her unborn child and the other woman has been released? What in the actual heck is this world going?

There is nothing in any of the articles as to the pregnant woman's nor the shooter's stance on the abortion.

[Te Netherlands]

So if I understand it correctly: The religious woman who is pro-life and pregnant was shot in her stomach by a other woman, but the pro-life activist gets in trouble because of the dead of her unborn child and the other woman has been released? What in the actual heck is this world going?

There is nothing in any of the articles as to the pregnant woman's nor the shooter's stance on the abortion.

It was a reaction to the OP, not the article

[Tekania]

There is nothing in any of the articles as to the pregnant woman's nor the shooter's stance on the abortion.

It was a reaction to the OP, not the article

Nope, the OP doesn't say that either. Try again.

[Te Netherlands]

It was a reaction to the OP, not the article

Nope, the OP doesn't say that either. Try again.

"So in the perfect storm of Gun violence, the Pro-Life debate and American religious extremism a woman from Alabama who was shot in the stomach while pregnant has been charged with manslaughter of the unborn fetus within. The Woman who shot her has been released."

[Vassenor]

Nope, the OP doesn't say that either. Try again.

"So in the perfect storm of Gun violence, the Pro-Life debate and American religious extremism a woman from Alabama who was shot in the stomach while pregnant has been charged with manslaughter of the unborn fetus within. The Woman who shot her has been released."

Nothing about that says that the pregnant woman was necessarily pro-life.

[Tekania]

Nope, the OP doesn't say that either. Try again.

"So in the perfect storm of Gun violence, the Pro-Life debate and American religious extremism a woman from Alabama who was shot in the stomach while pregnant has been charged with manslaughter of the unborn fetus within. The Woman who shot her has been released."

That sentence says absolutely nothing about what the pregnant woman's nor the shooter's position on abortion is.

[Greed and Death]

A woman being charged for someone else causing the death of her foetus is a very concerning, but not surprising, development. She should not have been charged.

Alabama are taking some very worrying steps in the regulation of pregnant women.

The prosecutor's argument is she attacked another woman forcing that woman to shoot her to defend her own life.

If for instance I attacked you and you felt your life was in danger and you shot at me but you miss and hit a third party then I could be charged with a crime.

[Grinning Dragon]

Nope, the OP doesn't say that either. Try again.

"So in the perfect storm of Gun violence, the Pro-Life debate and American religious extremism a woman from Alabama who was shot in the stomach while pregnant has been charged with manslaughter of the unborn fetus within. The Woman who shot her has been released."

Considering there is no such thing as "gun violence" other than a made up political phrase, self defense wouldn't apply to this anyways, the situation also isn't about abortion, it is a self defense situation in which one person was charged with a death. The pregnant woman put herself into that situation when there were other options such as walking away, instead she decided to push it.

[Vassenor]

A woman being charged for someone else causing the death of her foetus is a very concerning, but not surprising, development. She should not have been charged.

Alabama are taking some very worrying steps in the regulation of pregnant women.

The prosecutor's argument is she attacked another woman forcing that woman to shoot her to defend her own life.

If for instance I attacked you and you felt your life was in danger and you shot at me but you miss and hit a third party then I could be charged with a crime.

And what evidence of this attack has been presented?

Reminder that the shooter in this case has gone on record as saying that charging the mother is ridiculous.

[The Black Forrest]

A woman being charged for someone else causing the death of her foetus is a very concerning, but not surprising, development. She should not have been charged.

Alabama are taking some very worrying steps in the regulation of pregnant women.

The prosecutor's argument is she attacked another woman forcing that woman to shoot her to defend her own life.

If for instance I attacked you and you felt your life was in danger and you shot at me but you miss and hit a third party then I could be charged with a crime.

There lies the question. Alabama declared the fetus as sacrosanct. The shooter killed it and was not charged.

[Iwassoclose]

huh interesting case study

if the fetus is an individual then the shooter should be charged because its like shooting a bystander in a case of self defense

[Vassenor]

Then again maybe this is the precedent people use to start carrying out abortions again. Claim it was self defence against the fetus.

[Grinning Dragon]

Then again maybe this is the precedent people use to start carrying out abortions again. Claim it was self defence against the fetus.

/sigh.

[The Black Forrest]

Then again maybe this is the precedent people use to start carrying out abortions again. Claim it was self defence against the fetus.

Toxemia is not something to use a joke. Even then you don't have to have an abortion to handle it.....

[Tekania]

huh interesting case study

if the fetus is an individual then the shooter should be charged because its like shooting a bystander in a case of self defense

It goes to what greed and death stated. If someone accidentally shoots someone else when they have a right to self-defense the party engaging in the activity which resulted in the person needing self-defense could be charged as the culpable party.

Also, the shooter did have charges brought to the grand jury. The grand jury gave a no bill on the charges for the shooter.

[Scomagia]

Or not, seeing as the shooter did nothing wrong.

The idea that one can only defend oneself against a highly pregnant woman by shooting her still does seem a bit iffy.

A pregnant woman who brought her crew with her.

And if you don't think pregnant women are just as dangerous as anyone else, you've got a lot to learn.

[Iwassoclose]

huh interesting case study

if the fetus is an individual then the shooter should be charged because its like shooting a bystander in a case of self defense

It goes to what greed and death stated. If someone accidentally shoots someone else when they have a right to self-defense the party engaging in the activity which resulted in the person needing self-defense could be charged as the culpable party.

Also, the shooter did have charges brought to the grand jury. The grand jury gave a no bill on the charges for the shooter.

grand juries are a joke

[Tekania]

It goes to what greed and death stated. If someone accidentally shoots someone else when they have a right to self-defense the party engaging in the activity which resulted in the person needing self-defense could be charged as the culpable party.

Also, the shooter did have charges brought to the grand jury. The grand jury gave a no bill on the charges for the shooter.

grand juries are a joke

If someone has a legal right to self-defense, there is no intent on the part of shooting an innocent bystander when they are shooting their assailant. If anyone bears criminal culpability in the shooting it would be the assailant. Without intent there is no crime. So the real joke here is your desire for criminal culpability without demonstrated intent. You don't seem to really understand the idea well being the innocent bystander claim you make. The culpability in the shooting of an innocent bystander follows along the doctrine of transfer of intent. This can be summed up with the arrow analogy. If you shoot an arrow at a person with the intent to kill them and it kills another person the intent in that killing the person you intended to kill then the intent transfers to the one you shot even though you did not specifically intent to kill the one the arrow hit. This means if the killing was a case of criminal intent then the killing of the one shot with the arrow is criminal intent, however this also means because of this legal doctrine that if there was no criminal intent in killing the first person then also there is no criminal intent in killing the innocent bystander. If the the shot was the result of a legal case of self-defense, then there is no legal intent as to a crime in the case of the fetus for the shooter.

You want this treated as if it was an innocent bystander.... fine.... It was.

[The Alma Mater]

The idea that one can only defend oneself against a highly pregnant woman by shooting her still does seem a bit iffy.

A pregnant woman who brought her crew with her.

And if you don't think pregnant women are just as dangerous as anyone else, you've got a lot to learn.

I have actually never felt so threatened that I believed firing a gun was the only possible solution.

[Gravlen]

No prosecution will take place.

Bessemer, Ala. (AP) -- An Alabama district attorney said Wednesday she is dropping the manslaughter charge against a woman who lost her fetus when she was shot during a fight.

Marshae Jones was arrested last week after a grand jury concluded she intentionally caused the death of her fetus by initiating a fight, knowing she was pregna

Jefferson County Bessemer Cutoff District Attorney Lynneice O. Washington said Wednesday that she would not pursue the case.

"After reviewing the facts of this case and the applicable state law, I have determined that it is not in the best interest of justice to pursue prosecution of Ms. Jones," Washington said, flanked by her chief assistant and local church leaders. "There are no winners, only losers, in this sad ordeal."

The prosecutor did not take questions or explain the process that led to grand jurors returning the indictment to begin with.

Alabama DA Won’t Prosecute Woman Who Was Shot, Lost Pregnancy

I don't think they could have proved that she intentionally caused the death of her own child, so this is the right call on every level.

[Tokora]

The logic between being pro-life yet thinking the solution to everything is best described in a string of words that can't be said without being banned. I'm pro-life and I support gun control, and that fact that I'm apparently the only person in the whole country to think that way is honestly moronic. God is dead on the right and now only greed and violence are praised, with this being the end result of both where the influence of the arms industry demands that someone has to die.