NATION

PASSWORD

Border Patrol Is Detaining Migrants in ‘a Human Dog Pound’

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21995
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:43 am

Telconi wrote:
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:48 hours, usually.

A large facility with a fence around it used for storing large amounts of people? A camp can be, and usually is, a facility. And are they immigration facilities now? You know that that means that they are not there to hold people suspected of a crime, right? If they are immigration facilities then this whole thing is legally even more out of whack.


Literally zero trials ever have been concluded in 48 hours.

Well they hold immigrants, so yes, they are immigration facilities. More specifically they're detention centers for people pending deportation hearings.

Just like my university is an immigration university because it has immigrants in it.

Some people in there are refugees, which are legally differentiated from immgrants. And, of course, they have not been tried yet, so it's hard to call these people anything.

Reading comprehension: it usually takes a maximum of 48 hours before a suspect is first brought before a judge. Nowhere did I (or you) state that it was about finishing a trial completely. But at least people in jail get a judge to hear their case preliminary to decide whether they are rightly in that jail.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.
Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled
Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:46 am

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:
Telconi wrote:
Literally zero trials ever have been concluded in 48 hours.

Well they hold immigrants, so yes, they are immigration facilities. More specifically they're detention centers for people pending deportation hearings.

Just like my university is an immigration university because it has immigrants in it.

Some people in there are refugees, which are legally differentiated from immgrants. And, of course, they have not been tried yet, so it's hard to call these people anything.

Reading comprehension: it usually takes a maximum of 48 hours before a suspect is first brought before a judge. Nowhere did I (or you) state that it was about finishing a trial completely. But at least people in jail get a judge to hear their case preliminary to decide whether they are rightly in that jail.


The number of thirty days was given as total detention time, so yes, on average the process is completed in thirty days for these people. People in normal jails are usually there for thirty days. A person in a typical jail seeing a judge within 48 hours and then being returned to his jail is irrelevant. Alas, reading comprehension.

Refugees are a subgroup of immigrants. All refugees are immigrants.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21995
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:50 am

Telconi wrote:
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:Just like my university is an immigration university because it has immigrants in it.

Some people in there are refugees, which are legally differentiated from immgrants. And, of course, they have not been tried yet, so it's hard to call these people anything.

Reading comprehension: it usually takes a maximum of 48 hours before a suspect is first brought before a judge. Nowhere did I (or you) state that it was about finishing a trial completely. But at least people in jail get a judge to hear their case preliminary to decide whether they are rightly in that jail.


The number of thirty days was given as total detention time, so yes, on average the process is completed in thirty days for these people. People in normal jails are usually there for thirty days. A person in a typical jail seeing a judge within 48 hours and then being returned to his jail is irrelevant. Alas, reading comprehension.

Refugees are a subgroup of immigrants. All refugees are immigrants.

It's not irrelevant, because sometimes a judge decides to let someone out on bail, or decides that there are no crimes to hold a person for. That is an important step in the judicial system. Not all people are sent back to jail, which is why that step is so crucial.

Refugees are not immigrants, now you're just being wrong.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.
Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled
Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:52 am

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:
Telconi wrote:
The number of thirty days was given as total detention time, so yes, on average the process is completed in thirty days for these people. People in normal jails are usually there for thirty days. A person in a typical jail seeing a judge within 48 hours and then being returned to his jail is irrelevant. Alas, reading comprehension.

Refugees are a subgroup of immigrants. All refugees are immigrants.

It's not irrelevant, because sometimes a judge decides to let someone out on bail, or decides that there are no crimes to hold a person for. That is an important step in the judicial system. Not all people are sent back to jail, which is why that step is so crucial.

Refugees are not immigrants, now you're just being wrong.


But not a differentiating trait, by your own criteria.

They're not? Then why are they here?
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21995
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:57 am

Telconi wrote:
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:It's not irrelevant, because sometimes a judge decides to let someone out on bail, or decides that there are no crimes to hold a person for. That is an important step in the judicial system. Not all people are sent back to jail, which is why that step is so crucial.

Refugees are not immigrants, now you're just being wrong.


But not a differentiating trait, by your own criteria.

They're not? Then why are they here?

They are refugees. Immigrants seek to live in a country for a longer time. Refugees are there temporarily until their home is safe again. Sometimes refugees become immigrants, but they are seperate categories.

Getting to see a judge before going into overcrowded prisons with no soap and tooth paste and being separated from your kids sounds hugely important to me.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.
Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled
Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 38385
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Novus America » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:02 pm

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:
Telconi wrote:
But not a differentiating trait, by your own criteria.

They're not? Then why are they here?

They are refugees. Immigrants seek to live in a country for a longer time. Refugees are there temporarily until their home is safe again. Sometimes refugees become immigrants, but they are seperate categories.

Getting to see a judge before going into overcrowded prisons with no soap and tooth paste and being separated from your kids sounds hugely important to me.


All of these asylum seekers are looking for permanent residency though.
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. I support what is good for the country, which means I cannot support either party.

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21995
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:03 pm

Novus America wrote:
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:They are refugees. Immigrants seek to live in a country for a longer time. Refugees are there temporarily until their home is safe again. Sometimes refugees become immigrants, but they are seperate categories.

Getting to see a judge before going into overcrowded prisons with no soap and tooth paste and being separated from your kids sounds hugely important to me.


All of these asylum seekers are looking for permanent residency though.

You got a source for that? They'll be looking for indefinite residency, sure. Mind, there is a difference between residency and citizenship too.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.
Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled
Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

User avatar
Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 38385
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Novus America » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:07 pm

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:
Novus America wrote:
All of these asylum seekers are looking for permanent residency though.

You got a source for that? They'll be looking for indefinite residency, sure. Mind, there is a difference between residency and citizenship too.


Five years permanent residency qualifies you for citizenship.

Do you really think they are leaving only because, gang violence or whatever the are claiming?
And not also to live in the US? They are asylum seekers AND perspective immigrants.

If the were all offered US citizenship under the requirement they renounce their existing citizenship how many would turn down the US citizenship?
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. I support what is good for the country, which means I cannot support either party.

User avatar
Telconi
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34903
Founded: Oct 08, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Telconi » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:09 pm

Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States wrote:
Telconi wrote:
But not a differentiating trait, by your own criteria.

They're not? Then why are they here?

They are refugees. Immigrants seek to live in a country for a longer time. Refugees are there temporarily until their home is safe again. Sometimes refugees become immigrants, but they are seperate categories.

Getting to see a judge before going into overcrowded prisons with no soap and tooth paste and being separated from your kids sounds hugely important to me.


Spaghetti night sounds hugely important to me. Doesn't mean places without it are concentration camps.
-2.25 LEFT
-3.23 LIBERTARIAN

PRO:
-Weapons Rights
-Gender Equality
-LGBTQ Rights
-Racial Equality
-Religious Freedom
-Freedom of Speech
-Freedom of Association
-Life
-Limited Government
-Non Interventionism
-Labor Unions
-Environmental Protections
ANTI:
-Racism
-Sexism
-Bigotry In All Forms
-Government Overreach
-Government Surveillance
-Freedom For Security Social Transactions
-Unnecessary Taxes
-Excessively Specific Government Programs
-Foreign Entanglements
-Religious Extremism
-Fascists Masquerading as "Social Justice Warriors"

"The Constitution is NOT an instrument for the government to restrain the people,it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government-- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." ~ Patrick Henry

User avatar
Vassenor
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 68113
Founded: Nov 11, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:29 am

Jenny / Sailor Astraea
WOMAN

MtF trans and proud - She / Her / etc.
100% Asbestos Free

Team Mystic
#iamEUropean

"Have you ever had a moment online, when the need to prove someone wrong has outweighed your own self-preservation instincts?"

User avatar
Israeli Commonwealth
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 195
Founded: Apr 08, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Israeli Commonwealth » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:33 am


How the hell does that mean anything?? No it isn't about race. But the majority of people trying to come across illegally are Hispanic, Black, Latino, or anything in between. Your argument is retarded.
Hello there. How are you? Are you having a nice day?
If you are talking to me then you won't be...
Hardline American Republican,
I hate transgender people,
I am Jewish,
I believe in free speech,
I hate socialists,
I strongly dislike muslims,
I am pro Israel/Zionist,
I am pro gun,
I am pro agriculture,
I am pro trump,
I am somewhat pro IRA (as in I am Irish and pro independence. Not the leftist IRA though),
and I will personally attack anyone that hates the United States of America.
Welcome to the real world :)

Political Compass- Economic Left/Right: 5.88, Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 3.03
Role-play country- https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=1195858

User avatar
Geneviev
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 16432
Founded: Mar 03, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Geneviev » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:35 am


Of course it's about race.
"Above all, keep loving one another earnestly, since love covers a multitude of sins." 1 Peter 4:8

User avatar
Vassenor
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 68113
Founded: Nov 11, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Vassenor » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:36 am

Israeli Commonwealth wrote:

How the hell does that mean anything?? No it isn't about race. But the majority of people trying to come across illegally are Hispanic, Black, Latino, or anything in between. Your argument is retarded.


So why turn away a decorated veteran who is trying to enter legally?
Jenny / Sailor Astraea
WOMAN

MtF trans and proud - She / Her / etc.
100% Asbestos Free

Team Mystic
#iamEUropean

"Have you ever had a moment online, when the need to prove someone wrong has outweighed your own self-preservation instincts?"

User avatar
Ohioan Territory
Diplomat
 
Posts: 780
Founded: Dec 22, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Ohioan Territory » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:43 am

Israeli Commonwealth wrote:

How the hell does that mean anything?? No it isn't about race. But the majority of people trying to come across illegally are Hispanic, Black, Latino, or anything in between. Your argument is retarded.

Dark-skinned Latin veteran of the American military has a scheduled citizenship hearing in the United States and is denied entry. Why wasn't he allowed in, then?
Justice for East Palestine.

User avatar
The Emerald Legion
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10698
Founded: Mar 18, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby The Emerald Legion » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:46 am

Vassenor wrote:
Israeli Commonwealth wrote:How the hell does that mean anything?? No it isn't about race. But the majority of people trying to come across illegally are Hispanic, Black, Latino, or anything in between. Your argument is retarded.


So why turn away a decorated veteran who is trying to enter legally?


Because he was legally deported in 2008.
"23.The unwise man is awake all night, and ponders everything over; when morning comes he is weary in mind, and all is a burden as ever." - Havamal

User avatar
Ohioan Territory
Diplomat
 
Posts: 780
Founded: Dec 22, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Ohioan Territory » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:49 am

The Emerald Legion wrote:
Vassenor wrote:
So why turn away a decorated veteran who is trying to enter legally?


Because he was legally deported in 2008.

And he had a scheduled citizenship hearing within the U.S. in 2019. Your point?
Justice for East Palestine.

User avatar
Kowani
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44957
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:50 am

Israeli Commonwealth wrote:

How the hell does that mean anything?? No it isn't about race. But the majority of people trying to come across illegally are Hispanic, Black, Latino, or anything in between. Your argument is retarded.

579,00 Illegal immigrants from white countries. Outrage? None.
American History and Historiography; Political and Labour History, Urbanism, Political Parties, Congressional Procedure, Elections.

Servant of The Democracy since 1896.


Historian, of sorts.

Effortposts can be found here!

User avatar
The Emerald Legion
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10698
Founded: Mar 18, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby The Emerald Legion » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:54 am

Ohioan Territory wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:
Because he was legally deported in 2008.

And he had a scheduled citizenship hearing within the U.S. in 2019. Your point?


He's been out of the country for literally three presidencies. One of whom was Obama. Chances are, Trump didn't reach back into the past to deport him over a decade ago to satisfy racists in 2019.
"23.The unwise man is awake all night, and ponders everything over; when morning comes he is weary in mind, and all is a burden as ever." - Havamal

User avatar
The Emerald Legion
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10698
Founded: Mar 18, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby The Emerald Legion » Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:57 am

Kowani wrote:
Israeli Commonwealth wrote:How the hell does that mean anything?? No it isn't about race. But the majority of people trying to come across illegally are Hispanic, Black, Latino, or anything in between. Your argument is retarded.

579,00 Illegal immigrants from white countries. Outrage? None.


> Outrage over 5% of illegal immigrants not being pointed out in particular. Meanwhile Mexico and Central Americans make up 67% of illegal immigration.
"23.The unwise man is awake all night, and ponders everything over; when morning comes he is weary in mind, and all is a burden as ever." - Havamal

User avatar
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:00 am

The Emerald Legion wrote:
Vassenor wrote:
So why turn away a decorated veteran who is trying to enter legally?


Because he was legally deported in 2008.

Why would you turn away a veteran who attempted to enter legally?

That guy did his duty. He is a hero.

User avatar
Kowani
Post Czar
 
Posts: 44957
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:01 am

The Emerald Legion wrote:
Kowani wrote:579,00 Illegal immigrants from white countries. Outrage? None.


> Outrage over 5% of illegal immigrants not being pointed out in particular. Meanwhile Mexico and Central Americans make up 67% of illegal immigration.

Not what I’m talking about, and I think you know that.
American History and Historiography; Political and Labour History, Urbanism, Political Parties, Congressional Procedure, Elections.

Servant of The Democracy since 1896.


Historian, of sorts.

Effortposts can be found here!

User avatar
The Emerald Legion
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10698
Founded: Mar 18, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby The Emerald Legion » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:02 am

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:
Because he was legally deported in 2008.

Why would you turn away a veteran who attempted to enter legally?

That guy did his duty. He is a hero.


And then he broke the law by ignoring a court order and was deported for it.
"23.The unwise man is awake all night, and ponders everything over; when morning comes he is weary in mind, and all is a burden as ever." - Havamal

User avatar
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp
Post Czar
 
Posts: 34994
Founded: Dec 18, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp » Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:04 am

The Emerald Legion wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:Why would you turn away a veteran who attempted to enter legally?

That guy did his duty. He is a hero.


And then he broke the law by ignoring a court order and was deported for it.

Why would you do that?

Arrest him, give him a fair trial, if found guilty, put him in jail.

Don't deport someone who have blood for America.

User avatar
The Emerald Legion
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 10698
Founded: Mar 18, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby The Emerald Legion » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:19 pm

The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:
The Emerald Legion wrote:
And then he broke the law by ignoring a court order and was deported for it.

Why would you do that?

Arrest him, give him a fair trial, if found guilty, put him in jail.

Don't deport someone who have blood for America.


Correction. He wasn't being arrested. It was his original court date to become a citizen. He ignored it and went to go visit his mother in Belize to get 'Herbal Diabetes Cures.' and then was surprised when he came back to find himself not a citizen.

As an aside, am I the only one weirded out by the whole ICE bae thing?
Last edited by The Emerald Legion on Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"23.The unwise man is awake all night, and ponders everything over; when morning comes he is weary in mind, and all is a burden as ever." - Havamal

User avatar
Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21995
Founded: Feb 20, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:28 pm

The Emerald Legion wrote:
The Derpy Democratic Republic Of Herp wrote:Why would you do that?

Arrest him, give him a fair trial, if found guilty, put him in jail.

Don't deport someone who have blood for America.


Correction. He wasn't being arrested. It was his original court date to become a citizen. He ignored it and went to go visit his mother in Belize to get 'Herbal Diabetes Cures.' and then was surprised when he came back to find himself not a citizen.

As an aside, am I the only one weirded out by the whole ICE bae thing?

That’s insane. If his lawyers represent him, and he has a good case, there is no need to have him present. That’s ambushing his citizenship.
The name's James. James Usari. Well, my name is not actually James Usari, so don't bother actually looking it up, but it'll do for now.
Lack of a real name means compensation through a real face. My debt is settled
Part-time Kebab tycoon in Glasgow.

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Ancientania, Cerespasia, Cerula, Cyptopir, Kostane, Philjia, The Kharkivan Cossacks, The Republic of Western Sol

Advertisement

Remove ads