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Was German Reunification a Mistake?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Was German reunification, as it happened, a mistake?

Yes, Germany should never have been reunified
30
17%
Sort of, because it was done wrong and/or too quickly
43
25%
No
100
58%
 
Total votes : 173

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Mojave Confederation
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Posts: 63
Founded: Jun 01, 2019
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Mojave Confederation » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:38 pm

Eglaecia wrote:
Mojave Confederation wrote:So does unified France! and let's not mention unified Great Britain.

France, up until the satanic revolution, was valuable to the world. The UK unifying was illegitimate but in the long run has also been beneficial.

Let us not downplay how UK playing cartel just because it cannot pay its tea is the single biggest reason Communist China exist today, or the part where it aggressively expand to literally everything that move, then arbitrarily make nonsense border as it leave, just like how the allies divide Germany willy-nilly. It's not just Sykes-Picot or India-Pakistan, even Nigeria for example is a mess.
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North German Realm
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Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby North German Realm » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:40 pm

Mojave Confederation wrote:
Eglaecia wrote:France, up until the satanic revolution, was valuable to the world. The UK unifying was illegitimate but in the long run has also been beneficial.

Let us not downplay how UK playing cartel just because it cannot pay its tea is the single biggest reason Communist China exist today, or the part where it aggressively expand to literally everything that move, then arbitrarily make nonsense border as it leave, just like how the allies divide Germany willy-nilly. It's not just Sykes-Picot or India-Pakistan, even Nigeria for example is a mess.

TFW you literally colonize 24% of the world's land area and 23% of its total population, massacre millions of natives and other non-Anglos, dismantle societal structures having existed there for hundreds of years and put arbitrary borders that make no fucking sense, resulting in the eternal anguish and territorial disputes in everywhere you've colonized and/or touched because of muh free trade.
Last edited by North German Realm on Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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North Germany
Norddeutschland

After numerous political struggles and periods of diplomatic tension, the uneasy peace between South and North Germany has broken down. The Second Brothers' War has begun!
Overview || Kaiser | Chancellor | Legislature | Military || News: 23 July, 1908

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The Blaatschapen
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Anarchy

Postby The Blaatschapen » Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:54 am

North German Realm wrote:
Mojave Confederation wrote:Let us not downplay how UK playing cartel just because it cannot pay its tea is the single biggest reason Communist China exist today, or the part where it aggressively expand to literally everything that move, then arbitrarily make nonsense border as it leave, just like how the allies divide Germany willy-nilly. It's not just Sykes-Picot or India-Pakistan, even Nigeria for example is a mess.

TFW you literally colonize 24% of the world's land area and 23% of its total population, massacre millions of natives and other non-Anglos, dismantle societal structures having existed there for hundreds of years and put arbitrary borders that make no fucking sense, resulting in the eternal anguish and territorial disputes in everywhere you've colonized and/or touched because of muh free trade.


Anglos being in favour of free trade? :rofl:

Did not stop them from waging war against the Dutch republic for trading.
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North German Realm
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Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby North German Realm » Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:55 am

The Blaatschapen wrote:
North German Realm wrote:TFW you literally colonize 24% of the world's land area and 23% of its total population, massacre millions of natives and other non-Anglos, dismantle societal structures having existed there for hundreds of years and put arbitrary borders that make no fucking sense, resulting in the eternal anguish and territorial disputes in everywhere you've colonized and/or touched because of muh free trade.


Anglos being in favour of free trade? :rofl:

Did not stop them from waging war against the Dutch republic for trading.

I'm serious. Pretty much everything the British Empire did from an "Foreign Policy" perspective during the Splendid Isolation was to ensure -and promote- free trade. Which is ironic, because it was kinda the cause for multiple recessions in Continental Europe.
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North Germany
Norddeutschland

After numerous political struggles and periods of diplomatic tension, the uneasy peace between South and North Germany has broken down. The Second Brothers' War has begun!
Overview || Kaiser | Chancellor | Legislature | Military || News: 23 July, 1908

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Page
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9486
Founded: Jan 12, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Page » Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:27 am

Eglaecia wrote:
Mojave Confederation wrote:So does unified France! and let's not mention unified Great Britain.

France, up until the satanic revolution, was valuable to the world. The UK unifying was illegitimate but in the long run has also been beneficial.


If Satan is on the side of overthrowing monarchs, secularization of society, and the metric system, I'm on Team Satan!
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Eglaecia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Eglaecia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:27 am

Page wrote:
Eglaecia wrote:France, up until the satanic revolution, was valuable to the world. The UK unifying was illegitimate but in the long run has also been beneficial.


If Satan is on the side of overthrowing monarchs, secularization of society, and the metric system, I'm on Team Satan!

Except from the metric system, yes that is what side Satan is on.
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Petrolheadia
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New York Times Democracy

Postby Petrolheadia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:39 am

Eglaecia wrote:
Page wrote:
If Satan is on the side of overthrowing monarchs, secularization of society, and the metric system, I'm on Team Satan!

Except from the metric system, yes that is what side Satan is on.

His side then.
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North German Realm
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Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby North German Realm » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:42 am

Page wrote:
Eglaecia wrote:France, up until the satanic revolution, was valuable to the world. The UK unifying was illegitimate but in the long run has also been beneficial.


If Satan is on the side of overthrowing monarchs, secularization of society, and the metric system, I'm on Team Satan!

It's less about overthrowing monarchs and more about representation and constitutionalism. Never forget that the Revolution took the wrong turn specifically because the King was too much of an oaf to know when he was beaten and tried to go against the Parliament he himself had given assent to.
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North Germany
Norddeutschland

After numerous political struggles and periods of diplomatic tension, the uneasy peace between South and North Germany has broken down. The Second Brothers' War has begun!
Overview || Kaiser | Chancellor | Legislature | Military || News: 23 July, 1908

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Farnhamia
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Founded: Jun 20, 2006
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Farnhamia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:30 am

Overthrowing monarchy with the aid of Satan? Colonizing 24% of the world, where 23% of the world's population lives, with a handful of guys in red coats?

Get back to talking about the actual topic, which, in case you don't remember, is the late 20th century reunification of Germany. Don't make me unleash the Flying Monkeys.
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Arcturus Novus
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Founded: Dec 03, 2011
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Arcturus Novus » Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:47 am

Honestly? We should probably go back farther than just the 1990s. The unification of Germany in the 1860s-70s was the real problem.
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North German Realm
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Democratic Socialists

Postby North German Realm » Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:03 am

Arcturus Novus wrote:Honestly? We should probably go back farther than just the 1990s. The unification of Germany in the 1860s-70s was the real problem.

Blame it -like most other things that've happened in Europe the last few centuries- on Napoleon.
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North Germany
Norddeutschland

After numerous political struggles and periods of diplomatic tension, the uneasy peace between South and North Germany has broken down. The Second Brothers' War has begun!
Overview || Kaiser | Chancellor | Legislature | Military || News: 23 July, 1908

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Thermodolia
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:34 am

Yes. Germany never should have reunited. In fact the GDR should have been relegated to polish territory/puppet state
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The South Falls
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby The South Falls » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:40 am

Thermodolia wrote:Yes. Germany never should have reunited. In fact the GDR should have been relegated to polish territory/puppet state

Puppet state of poland? I could see reducing the GDR's size, but I wouldn't like for it to become a Russian puppet.
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Thermodolia
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Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:48 am

Mojave Confederation wrote:
Eglaecia wrote:What are you talking about? The unified Germany was the cause of so much damage to Europe. Keeping it divided was the best option for the long-term stability of Europe and the world.

So does unified France! and let's not mention unified Great Britain.

Outside of the 1st French empire a unified France hasn’t been that military of a danger
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Thermodolia
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Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:50 am

Kvatchdom wrote:
Eglaecia wrote:France, up until the satanic revolution, was valuable to the world. The UK unifying was illegitimate but in the long run has also been beneficial.

What do you mean "satanic revolution"?

They mean the French Revolution. One of the best things to happen btw
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North German Realm
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Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby North German Realm » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:50 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Mojave Confederation wrote:So does unified France! and let's not mention unified Great Britain.

Outside of the 1st French empire a unified France hasn’t been that military of a danger

Uuuuuuuuuuh
Absolutist France was literally responsible for nearly every single major war in Europe ever since Louis XIV. The Restoration's agitations was the cause for the Rhine Crisis (which nearly started a major European War), the second republic was responsible for the Springtime of Nations, and the second Empire was responsible for every single crisis that Bismarck wasn't (i.e. the two wars Prussia fought in).
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North Germany
Norddeutschland

After numerous political struggles and periods of diplomatic tension, the uneasy peace between South and North Germany has broken down. The Second Brothers' War has begun!
Overview || Kaiser | Chancellor | Legislature | Military || News: 23 July, 1908

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The New California Republic
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Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:53 am

Thermodolia wrote:Yes. Germany never should have reunited. In fact the GDR should have been relegated to polish territory/puppet state

Do you mean post-1945 or post-1990? :unsure:
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Thermodolia
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Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:53 am

The South Falls wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Yes. Germany never should have reunited. In fact the GDR should have been relegated to polish territory/puppet state

Puppet state of poland? I could see reducing the GDR's size, but I wouldn't like for it to become a Russian puppet.

When did Poland become Russia?
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Thermodolia
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Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:54 am

North German Realm wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Outside of the 1st French empire a unified France hasn’t been that military of a danger

Uuuuuuuuuuh
Absolutist France was literally responsible for nearly every single major war in Europe ever since Louis XIV. The Restoration's agitations was the cause for the Rhine Crisis (which nearly started a major European War), the second republic was responsible for the Springtime of Nations, and the second Empire was responsible for every single crisis that Bismarck wasn't (i.e. the two wars Prussia fought in).

Eh no biggie
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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 50787
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:54 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Yes. Germany never should have reunited. In fact the GDR should have been relegated to polish territory/puppet state

Do you mean post-1945 or post-1990? :unsure:

Post-1990

The Rhineland should have been given to France post 1945 and the Netherlands and Denmark should have also been extended in 45
Last edited by Thermodolia on Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
Male, centrist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, loves dogs particularly German Shepherds, give me any good Irish or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
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The New California Republic
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Posts: 15121
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:57 am

Thermodolia wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Do you mean post-1945 or post-1990? :unsure:

Post-1990

The Rhineland should have been given to France post 1945 and the Netherlands and Denmark should have also been extended in 45

But what about the East German voters that wanted reunification?
Last edited by Friedrich Nietzsche on Thu Jan 03, 1889 13:05 pm, edited 999 times in total.

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Nilrahrarfan
Diplomat
 
Posts: 502
Founded: Sep 02, 2016
Corporate Police State

Postby Nilrahrarfan » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:59 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Yes. Germany never should have reunited. In fact the GDR should have been relegated to polish territory/puppet state

Do you mean post-1945 or post-1990? :unsure:

I wish neither, and if anything, Poland should become a part of Germany. I'd LOVE to see the German-Polish union.
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North German Realm
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Posts: 1514
Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Democratic Socialists

Postby North German Realm » Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:02 am

Thermodolia wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Do you mean post-1945 or post-1990? :unsure:

Post-1990

The Rhineland should have been given to France post 1945 and the Netherlands and Denmark should have also been extended in 45

Edgy.
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North Germany
Norddeutschland

After numerous political struggles and periods of diplomatic tension, the uneasy peace between South and North Germany has broken down. The Second Brothers' War has begun!
Overview || Kaiser | Chancellor | Legislature | Military || News: 23 July, 1908

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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 50787
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:03 am

North German Realm wrote:
Definitely Not Trumptonium wrote:
Ukraine and Belarus were independent states before German reunification, what you're proposing is annexing internationally recognised sovereign nations to give a favour to Germany.
Except not. West and East Germany reunified in 1989-90 (3 October 1990). Ukraine and Belarus existed only as part of the Soviet Union, without any authority as a sovereign state outside of it (like the modern Republics of the Russian Federation). They became sovereign nations in August 1991, and their statehood internationally recognized -at some points- later into 1992-3. At the point the 4+2 negotiations were going on, Ukraine and Belarus existed only as members of the Soviet Union, and under jurisdiction thereof. Their "internationally recognized statehood" was like that of the Republic of Dagestan. None at all. Whether or not Pomerania and (EDITED: Lower) Silesia should have been returned to Germany isn't my point, it's that Kresy should have been returned to Poland first, before any form of negotiation over German unification could start (as Germany still had claims on lands held by Poland, which it did not rescind until after the agreement).

This is the exact reason why I think Germany should have been forcibly broken up post 45
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>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 50787
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:04 am

The New California Republic wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Post-1990

The Rhineland should have been given to France post 1945 and the Netherlands and Denmark should have also been extended in 45

But what about the East German voters that wanted reunification?

If they don’t like polish rule they can move elsewhere
Male, centrist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, loves dogs particularly German Shepherds, give me any good Irish or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

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