MAGAThread XVI: Raising the Barr

[Valrifell]

Invading the Middle East is what destabilized it. Leaving it is what the US should have done 19 years ago.

Also this. Our attempts to play kingmaker in the ME made this mess.

It's not so much us as Iran and the Sauds.

[Nakena]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

Quite intrigueing isn't it?

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

That happens if when a Leviathan is being created and then a few generations later people no longer know to ride it. It becomes then the willing beast for those who understand best to ride it and its nature.

Unfortunatly that have been the Neocons until recently.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

You won't care, but the Republicans see that permanently alienating the Kurds by letting another mustachioed dictator slaughter them after promising to help them is going to tear off America's ass in the future.

This is actually the second time America has done this against the Kurds for the record. The first time lead to gassings.

[Bear Stearns]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

The US imports most of it's oil from Canada, Venezuela, Mexico, and Saudi Arabia. Three of which aren't in the Middle East and one of which has been extremely stable and not in need of liberating.

Which makes sense, if you think about it. Transportation is expensive as fuck and pipelines are super convenient, so nearby nations will naturally make up the majority of imports, it's also easier to trade in nations that aren't being bombed to smithereens. This is not even factoring in the fact that, since the turn of the millennia, the US has grown increasingly independent with oil as we increase domestic production.

EDIT TO ADD: also the Kurds are most likely going to be victims of horrendous atrocities because the Turks detest them with a violent passion. Letting war crimes happen is *checks notes* bad.

The war in Iraq wasn't about importing oil to the US, it was about ensuring Iraq didn't mess with commodities prices and that the oil kept flowing to Japan and Europe. It was still an unjustifiable war for oil. Every single US intervention in Middle East has been a long-term failure. It is time to go home.

[Valrifell]

You won't care, but the Republicans see that permanently alienating the Kurds by letting another mustachioed dictator slaughter them after promising to help them is going to tear off America's ass in the future.

This is actually the second time America has done this against the Kurds for the record. The first time lead to gassings.

Letting a group of peoples fall to genocide is perfectly acceptable because... uh... they're the wrong nation.

[Duhon]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

this is literally to keep isis (not destroyed, world issue) and the turks (not attacking unless us troops leave) out
this is literally not the time that spiel works

[Bear Stearns]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

You want the nice shit about being the biggest economic power in the world then you have to accept the bad shit about enforcing that position. At one point during the British Empire about 50% of UK taxation was going towards the navy to defend British interests.

I don't want empire, because imperialism is expensive and immoral.

[Telconi]

Also this. Our attempts to play kingmaker in the ME made this mess.

It's not so much us as Iran and the Sauds.

It's not us playing kingmaker, it's the products of us playing kingmaker that done it!

[Bear Stearns]

This is actually the second time America has done this against the Kurds for the record. The first time lead to gassings.

Letting a group of peoples fall to genocide is perfectly acceptable because... uh... they're the wrong nation.

Why is it America's job to do something about it? Let Europe fight this one. Let's see how much they enjoy a decade-long occupation in a Middle Eastern shithole.

[Valrifell]

You want the nice shit about being the biggest economic power in the world then you have to accept the bad shit about enforcing that position. At one point during the British Empire about 50% of UK taxation was going towards the navy to defend British interests.

I don't want empire, because imperialism is expensive and immoral.

You work in finance (or want to, I don't quite recall which), either way you're currently LARPing as a failed investment bank. Morality hasn't really been applicable to you lot.

[Valrifell]

Letting a group of peoples fall to genocide is perfectly acceptable because... uh... they're the wrong nation.

Why is it America's job to do something about it? Let Europe fight this one. Let's see how much they enjoy a decade-long occupation in a Middle Eastern shithole.

Because we're the most armed to do it? Like, we were literally already there. It took a concerted effort to open the Kurds up to potential genocide, this isn't the path of least resistance.

[Bear Stearns]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

You won't care, but the Republicans see that permanently alienating the Kurds by letting another mustachioed dictator slaughter them after promising to help them is going to tear off America's ass in the future.

Alienating a Middle Eastern tribe is worth keeping America out of that part of the world.

What do you actually want? A US invasion of Turkey? Permanent occupation of Kurdistan? Are you going to fight in these wars?

[Duhon]

well ah if people ahhh unironically ahhhhhh use ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

MANDATE OF MANDATE OF MANDATE OF HEAVENNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

i ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh guess AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

We Qing Dynasty now.

qin tel qin
no wait shi huangdi was a legalist
wait i need to shout into the void a little more
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Bear Stearns]

I don't want empire, because imperialism is expensive and immoral.

You work in finance (or want to, I don't quite recall which), either way you're currently LARPing as a failed investment bank. Morality hasn't really been applicable to you lot.

Weirdest ad hominen I've seen in awhile. I can't criticize imperialism and wars built on rather faulty premises because of my job/username...?

[Valrifell]

You won't care, but the Republicans see that permanently alienating the Kurds by letting another mustachioed dictator slaughter them after promising to help them is going to tear off America's ass in the future.

Alienating a Middle Eastern tribe is worth keeping America out of that part of the world.

What do you actually want? A US invasion of Turkey? Permanent occupation of Kurdistan? Are you going to fight in these wars?

Turkey would back down if pressure was applied to get them to do so, none has been attempted.

[Bear Stearns]

Why is it America's job to do something about it? Let Europe fight this one. Let's see how much they enjoy a decade-long occupation in a Middle Eastern shithole.

Because we're the most armed to do it? Like, we were literally already there. It took a concerted effort to open the Kurds up to potential genocide, this isn't the path of least resistance.

Maybe America shouldn't be so armed.

[Valrifell]

You work in finance (or want to, I don't quite recall which), either way you're currently LARPing as a failed investment bank. Morality hasn't really been applicable to you lot.

Weirdest ad hominen I've seen in awhile. I can't criticize imperialism and wars built on rather faulty premises because of my job/username...?

It's a joke, see, that people in finance don't have morals.

[Cannot think of a name]

Alienating a Middle Eastern tribe is worth keeping America out of that part of the world.

What do you actually want? A US invasion of Turkey? Permanent occupation of Kurdistan? Are you going to fight in these wars?

Turkey would back down if pressure was applied to get them to do so, none has been attempted.

Well, a strongly worded tweet.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Because we're the most armed to do it? Like, we were literally already there. It took a concerted effort to open the Kurds up to potential genocide, this isn't the path of least resistance.

Maybe America shouldn't be so armed.

Maybe some people like me don't want to live under Sino-Russian hegemony... though granted maybe you do.

[Bear Stearns]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

Quite intrigueing isn't it?

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

That happens if when a Leviathan is being created and then a few generations later people no longer know to ride it. It becomes then the willing beast for those who understand best to ride it and its nature.

Unfortunatly that have been the Neocons until recently.

Sudden liberals are warhawks now.

[Cannot think of a name]

Lol the one time there's bipartisanship in Congress is one the rare occasion when Trump goes against the military industrial complex.

We need to pull out of the Middle East entirely. Tired of my country being dragged into these dark age desert religious wars for oil.

You want the nice shit about being the biggest economic power in the world then you have to accept the bad shit about enforcing that position. At one point during the British Empire about 50% of UK taxation was going towards the navy to defend British interests.

Man, you guys really hated sunsets.

[Duhon]

You won't care, but the Republicans see that permanently alienating the Kurds by letting another mustachioed dictator slaughter them after promising to help them is going to tear off America's ass in the future.

Alienating a Middle Eastern tribe is worth keeping America out of that part of the world.

What do you actually want? A US invasion of Turkey? Permanent occupation of Kurdistan? Are you going to fight in these wars?

alienating a mideastern tribe was what led to 9/11
as much as pulling back on us overseas military commitments would be right in my book
exposing the kurds to genocide is simply not it

[Telconi]

You work in finance (or want to, I don't quite recall which), either way you're currently LARPing as a failed investment bank. Morality hasn't really been applicable to you lot.

Weirdest ad hominen I've seen in awhile. I can't criticize imperialism and wars built on rather faulty premises because of my job/username...?

"I may want to create and perpetuate rediculous, decades long conflict amongst people in a socially backwards economically depressed part of the world. But at least I don't work at a bank, you monster!"

[Valrifell]

Quite intrigueing isn't it?



That happens if when a Leviathan is being created and then a few generations later people no longer know to ride it. It becomes then the willing beast for those who understand best to ride it and its nature.

Unfortunatly that have been the Neocons until recently.

Sudden liberals are warhawks now.

Yeah, I'd like to avoid seeing the Kurds indiscriminately killed and displaced by Turkish soldiers, which would happen, so I guess I'm the bad guy :/

[Nakena]

You won't care, but the Republicans see that permanently alienating the Kurds by letting another mustachioed dictator slaughter them after promising to help them is going to tear off America's ass in the future.

This is actually the second time America has done this against the Kurds for the record. The first time lead to gassings.

That happens when an Empire's policy changes every 4-8 years randomly and unpredictably based on the outcome of popularity contests. :^)

You work in finance (or want to, I don't quite recall which), either way you're currently LARPing as a failed investment bank. Morality hasn't really been applicable to you lot.

Weirdest ad hominen I've seen in awhile. I can't criticize imperialism and wars built on rather faulty premises because of my job/username...?

Cheapest and laziest one too.