Absolutely American Terror Territory

[Novus America]

Most modern background checks include a social media review.

It's standard procedure. I am certain Israel does this already to some extend for example.

It is standard procedure. So I do not see why this is that big a deal.

[Trumpisslavia]

Illegal aliens from Mexico won't be affected by this. They get in anyways. And theres nothing Miller can do but to compensate for getting subjected to this cuckoldery.

This exercise in caprice is aimed not just at the concept of legal immigration (and you thought this admin just hates "illegals"!) but at the legal presence of foreigners Stephen Miller dislikes, including but not limited to Mexicans.

And we give the benefit of the doubt to Donald fucking Trump and Stephen fucking Miller because...?

They do the background checks for all immigrants? Damn they must be busy boys.
We have again been doing background checks on immigrants more than 200 years.
They are done by members of the civil service anyways.

And many private and public jobs require similar as well.
This is not that surprising or revolutionary of an idea.

Most modern background checks include a social media review.

Hire people who think like Miller (or maybe Trump), Novus. Then you won't have to worry about Miller reenacting the genesis of the Thousand-Armed Thousand-Headed Avalokiteshvara, you know?

Anyway, the sheer number of people affected, the sheer amount of info to be looked upon, and the sheer malevolence of the Trump administration -- all militate against this being used other than as an exercise in caprice.

[Liriena]

It will never stop being absurdly funny and sad watching freedom-loving right-wingers cheer for the invasion of privacy of "undesirables".

[Nakena]

If it appears you are doing that that is something they could flag is evidence of you being deceptive.

Nobody is claiming it is a silver bullet solution.
But a social media check is a component (just one component) of most modern background checks.
Want a Secret or Top Secret Clearance? Social Media check.
Many jobs? Social Media check.
Lawsuit? Other sides lawyers will demand a Social Media check.

It is common practice. And you find a lot of good stuff.
The classic in law is they claim they are so hurt they cannot do anything yet they post a picture of themselves sky diving (true story) or son similar.
You would be amazed the good stuff you can find.

If something is too clean and too good to be true it always raises a yellow flag. Or just shows that the profile isnt used that much. However this can only be dertermined by properly trained and specialized personal, and can provide at best a part of a greater picture. So theres the question what is looked for?

I don’t think you understand NSA’s role. NSA has nothing to do with Baltimore, it is federal agency and is targeted to international issues. The city of Baltimore has its own cyber security team, if any federal agency were to help Them it would be the FBI

I believe Baltimore has probably bigger problems. But getting a strong shield wont help when the insides are beginning to rot away.

That said we disagree about the potential ability to build such a system. I would not dream to suggest it would be infallible, but it will prevent a few from getting in.

It isn't impossible. It just depends on the details and how consequently and to what extend of depth a defensive system is set up, and what the number of detection failures is considered acceptable given the circumstances.

[Nakena]

It will never stop being absurdly funny and sad watching freedom-loving right-wingers cheer for the invasion of privacy of "undesirables".

Thats why they produce half-assed solutions that provide more harm than good.

This exercise in caprice is aimed not just at the concept of legal immigration (and you thought this admin just hates "illegals"!) but at the legal presence of foreigners Stephen Miller dislikes, including but not limited to Mexicans.

North Korea has a somewhat more stringent policy regarding incompetent minions.

[Trumpisslavia]

The practical solution would be setting up decoy profiles just for show to noisy employers or other interested parties and authorities.

If it appears you are doing that that is something they could flag is evidence of you being deceptive.

Nobody is claiming it is a silver bullet solution.
But a social media check is a component (just one component) of most modern background checks.
Want a Secret or Top Secret Clearance? Social Media check.
Many jobs? Social Media check.
Lawsuit? Other sides lawyers will demand a Social Media check.

It is common practice. And you find a lot of good stuff.
The classic in law is they claim they are so hurt they cannot do anything yet they post a picture of themselves sky diving (true story) or son similar.
You would be amazed the good stuff you can find.

Your assumption is that to be a foreigner is to be quote-unquote undesirable, which to be fair seems to be the prevailing assumption when it comes to immigrants in much of the hellscape that is the world at present. Not even immigrants anymore, just fucking foreigners -- they all have Ebola or airborne rabies or bits and pieces of the Borg or something.

Putting aside the the fact that this is a product of the most xenophobic administration in American history, the thing is that a pool of applicants to any one job opening or any one security clearance is far, far smaller than the pool of visa applicants to your United States.

[Novus America]

Illegal aliens from Mexico won't be affected by this. They get in anyways. And theres nothing Miller can do but to compensate for getting subjected to this cuckoldery.

This exercise in caprice is aimed not just at the concept of legal immigration (and you thought this admin just hates "illegals"!) but at the legal presence of foreigners Stephen Miller dislikes, including but not limited to Mexicans.

They do the background checks for all immigrants? Damn they must be busy boys.
We have again been doing background checks on immigrants more than 200 years.
They are done by members of the civil service anyways.

And many private and public jobs require similar as well.
This is not that surprising or revolutionary of an idea.

Most modern background checks include a social media review.

Hire people who think like Miller (or maybe Trump), Novus. Then you won't have to worry about Miller reenacting the genesis of the Thousand-Armed Thousand-Headed Avalokiteshvara, you know?

Anyway, the sheer number of people affected, the sheer amount of info to be looked upon, and the sheer malevolence of the Trump administration -- all militate against this being used other than as an exercise in caprice.

Again Social Media checks are already done for federal government security clearances, many private jobs and most court cases.
Why is this so strange? This is common stuff.

And so I guess we should no longer have security clearance background checks because you do not like the current administration? Again we already do this for tons of people including a lot of federal employees (anyone getting a Secret or higher clearance).

And Trump does not hire the civil service.

[Trumpisslavia]

It will never stop being absurdly funny and sad watching freedom-loving right-wingers cheer for the invasion of privacy of "undesirables".

Thats why they produce half-assed solutions that provide more harm than good.

The harm is the point.

[Novus America]

If it appears you are doing that that is something they could flag is evidence of you being deceptive.

Nobody is claiming it is a silver bullet solution.
But a social media check is a component (just one component) of most modern background checks.
Want a Secret or Top Secret Clearance? Social Media check.
Many jobs? Social Media check.
Lawsuit? Other sides lawyers will demand a Social Media check.

It is common practice. And you find a lot of good stuff.
The classic in law is they claim they are so hurt they cannot do anything yet they post a picture of themselves sky diving (true story) or son similar.
You would be amazed the good stuff you can find.

Your assumption is that to be a foreigner is to be quote-unquote undesirable, which to be fair seems to be the prevailing assumption when it comes to immigrants in much of the hellscape that is the world at present. Not even immigrants anymore, just fucking foreigners -- they all have Ebola or airborne rabies or bits and pieces of the Borg or something.

Putting aside the the fact that this is a product of the most xenophobic administration in American history, the thing is that a pool of applicants to any one job opening or any one security clearance is far, far smaller than the pool of visa applicants to your United States.

No. Are you saying we assume all applicants for security clearances and jobs are undesirable?

And millions of checks are already conducted each year.
And we already are supposed to do a legal background check on each Immigrant.
Are you saying we should stop doing background checks altogether?

[Nakena]

Thats why they produce half-assed solutions that provide more harm than good.

The harm is the point.

Because they are idiots. And because they do not even know what they want or what they are there for on this world.

My disgust and disdain keeps increasing.

[Novus America]

If it appears you are doing that that is something they could flag is evidence of you being deceptive.

Nobody is claiming it is a silver bullet solution.
But a social media check is a component (just one component) of most modern background checks.
Want a Secret or Top Secret Clearance? Social Media check.
Many jobs? Social Media check.
Lawsuit? Other sides lawyers will demand a Social Media check.

It is common practice. And you find a lot of good stuff.
The classic in law is they claim they are so hurt they cannot do anything yet they post a picture of themselves sky diving (true story) or son similar.
You would be amazed the good stuff you can find.

If something is too clean and too good to be true it always raises a yellow flag. Or just shows that the profile isnt used that much. However this can only be dertermined by properly trained and specialized personal, and can provide at best a part of a greater picture. So theres the question what is looked for?

I don’t think you understand NSA’s role. NSA has nothing to do with Baltimore, it is federal agency and is targeted to international issues. The city of Baltimore has its own cyber security team, if any federal agency were to help Them it would be the FBI

I believe Baltimore has probably bigger problems. But getting a strong shield wont help when the insides are beginning to rot away.

That said we disagree about the potential ability to build such a system. I would not dream to suggest it would be infallible, but it will prevent a few from getting in.

It isn't impossible. It just depends on the details and how consequently and to what extend of depth a defensive system is set up, and what the number of detection failures is considered acceptable given the circumstances.

Of course. A background check is only a good as the investigator.
But no good investigator would neglect at least a quick social media review.

[Trumpisslavia]

Your assumption is that to be a foreigner is to be quote-unquote undesirable, which to be fair seems to be the prevailing assumption when it comes to immigrants in much of the hellscape that is the world at present. Not even immigrants anymore, just fucking foreigners -- they all have Ebola or airborne rabies or bits and pieces of the Borg or something.

Putting aside the the fact that this is a product of the most xenophobic administration in American history, the thing is that a pool of applicants to any one job opening or any one security clearance is far, far smaller than the pool of visa applicants to your United States.

No. Are you saying we assume all applicants for security clearances and jobs are undesirable?

And millions of checks are already conducted each year.
And we already are supposed to do a legal background check on each Immigrant.
Are you saying we should stop doing background checks altogether?

No, make the process something that people can easily fulfill and won't be so prone to sudden onsets of Miller-induced xenophobia. You know, user-friendly.

[Novus America]

It will never stop being absurdly funny and sad watching freedom-loving right-wingers cheer for the invasion of privacy of "undesirables".

Funny. So we consider all applicants for security clearances undesirable then?
I have undergone a background check for a security clearance.
They checked my social media.

I also did background checks for a law firm. Guess what, I always checked social media (amongst other things of course).

[Novus America]

No. Are you saying we assume all applicants for security clearances and jobs are undesirable?

And millions of checks are already conducted each year.
And we already are supposed to do a legal background check on each Immigrant.
Are you saying we should stop doing background checks altogether?

No, make the process something that people can easily fulfill and won't be so prone to sudden onsets of Miller-induced xenophobia. You know, user-friendly.

What is so hard about giving them the social media and emails you remember?
I had a security clearance interview and had to do it.
It is not hard.

[Rezmaeristan]

All we're doing is vetting each and everyone who tries to enter the USA. What's so bad about that? If you don't like it, don't immigrate.

[Nakena]

All we're doing is vetting each and everyone who tries to enter the USA. What's so bad about that? If you don't like it, don't immigrate.

Afaik it is about student and work Visas and not immigrants.

[Scomagia]

No, make the process something that people can easily fulfill and won't be so prone to sudden onsets of Miller-induced xenophobia. You know, user-friendly.

What is so hard about giving them the social media and emails you remember?
I had a security clearance interview and had to do it.
It is not hard.

The operating assumption seems to be that this is really a conspiracy to make sure you always have reason to deport any immigrants at any time. It's super paranoid and lacking in evidence. No one has put forward any information to substantiate this fantasy of strict enforcement and no discretion with regards to forgotten accounts.

[Novus America]

What is so hard about giving them the social media and emails you remember?
I had a security clearance interview and had to do it.
It is not hard.

The operating assumption seems to be that this is really a conspiracy to make sure you always have reason to deport any immigrants at any time. It's super paranoid and lacking in evidence. No one has put forward any information to substantiate this fantasy of strict enforcement and no discretion with regards to forgotten accounts.

And even if it was the case it would be a stupid way to do it.
If you do not remember it, it is not easy for them to find.

Anyways people commonly make a few errors or omissions by mistake on their background check forms.

When I did one I made a few errors. When the interviewer asks you about it they are not playing “gotcha” and tossing your application instantly.
They just want a reasonable explanation.

I am pretty sure many immigrants already make innocent errors or omissions and yet we do not throw out their applications over every little thing.

Given
A) We already do background checks on immigrants, and do not play “gotcha” although we already have plenty of ways to do that.
B) This is standard procedure on other background checks.
I do not see what the big deal is beyond “Orange man bad, everything he does is bad” stuff.

[Duhon]

All we're doing is vetting each and everyone who tries to enter the USA. What's so bad about that? If you don't like it, don't immigrate.

Because it's ridiculously impractical (though I have no doubt Miller will try and match it, zeal for zeal), so the only way this pans out in practice is... a legal way to say NO to every visa applicant without screeching about COOTIES! or having to undergo due process. Under this system, you can say this uppity foreigner missed a spot so DEPORT, or this uppity naturalized citizen named Trevor Noah or John Oliver or Seb Gorka or someone else missed another spot so DEPORT --

-- as I've said, this is an exercise in caprice, under the most determinedly xenophobic administration in American history.

[Duhon]

What is so hard about giving them the social media and emails you remember?
I had a security clearance interview and had to do it.
It is not hard.

The operating assumption seems to be that this is really a conspiracy to make sure you always have reason to deport any immigrants at any time. It's super paranoid and lacking in evidence. No one has put forward any information to substantiate this fantasy of strict enforcement and no discretion with regards to forgotten accounts.

Given what this administration represents, it's less paranoia and more standard operating procedure. But I guess we'll see how this wide-scale blanket NO pans out, since this is not yet fully implemented.

[Novus America]

All we're doing is vetting each and everyone who tries to enter the USA. What's so bad about that? If you don't like it, don't immigrate.

Because it's ridiculously impractical (though I have no doubt Miller will try and match it, zeal for zeal), so the only way this pans out in practice is... a legal way to say NO to every visa applicant without screeching about COOTIES! or having to undergo due process. Under this system, you can say this uppity foreigner missed a spot so DEPORT, or this uppity naturalized citizen named Trevor Noah or John Oliver or Seb Gorka or someone else missed another spot so DEPORT --

-- as I've said, this is an exercise in caprice, under the most determinedly xenophobic administration in American history.

Your understanding of American history is quite lacking.
We have had far more xenophobic ones.

And it is not “impractical”.
You are only expected to answer to the best of your knowledge.
If playing “gotcha” was the goal, there would be better ways to do it anyways.

[Novus America]

The operating assumption seems to be that this is really a conspiracy to make sure you always have reason to deport any immigrants at any time. It's super paranoid and lacking in evidence. No one has put forward any information to substantiate this fantasy of strict enforcement and no discretion with regards to forgotten accounts.

Given what this administration represents, it's less paranoia and more standard operating procedure. But I guess we'll see how this wide-scale blanket NO pans out, since this is not yet fully implemented.

If playing “gotcha” was the goal, they could already do it without this.
I guarantee you immigrants already make innocent errors and omissions and do not automatically get a no because of it.
So yes to think this would suddenly result in a dramatic change is pretty paranoid, and not based on the existing evidence.

[Duhon]

Given what this administration represents, it's less paranoia and more standard operating procedure. But I guess we'll see how this wide-scale blanket NO pans out, since this is not yet fully implemented.

If playing “gotcha” was the goal, they could already do it without this.
I guarantee you immigrants already make innocent errors and omissions and do not automatically get a no because of it.
So yes to think this would suddenly result in a dramatic change is pretty paranoid, and not based on the existing evidence.

Only one way to see if I'm seeing way too much malevolence out of this:

Anyone volunteer for a US visa?

[Novus America]

If playing “gotcha” was the goal, they could already do it without this.
I guarantee you immigrants already make innocent errors and omissions and do not automatically get a no because of it.
So yes to think this would suddenly result in a dramatic change is pretty paranoid, and not based on the existing evidence.

Only one way to see if I'm seeing way too much malevolence out of this:

Anyone volunteer for a US visa?

Well that would be interesting.
I have done plenty of background checks (and that included) social media but never the immigration one.
Then you could see if it is some twisted rigged gotcha game, or just like any other background check. But I still bet on the latter given legal immigration numbers have not dropped.

[Longweather]

I'm confused at people talking about how hard this would be. It seems like it's not all social media ever (the article mentions a list which would unlikely require NS accounts). Also, how many email accounts and phone numbers do people generally have? Seems like most won't have a problem supplying them.

This is just another step as well toward widespread surveillance of all americans. It's a foot in the door. Once they can do it with visa applicants, then they'll do it with anyone applying for government jobs, then anyone who deals with law enforcement in any way, then anyone living in certain cities, and eventually everyone. They can monitor everything you view or do online, and eventually not only would it be an embarrassing invasion of privacy, they can also punish you for it.

Hard dictatorship is just around the bend

Have you heard of the Office of Personnel Management's e-QIP system? The US government already requires things like phone numbers and other information that I can barely remember from filling it out.

Because it's ridiculously impractical (though I have no doubt Miller will try and match it, zeal for zeal), so the only way this pans out in practice is... a legal way to say NO to every visa applicant without screeching about COOTIES! or having to undergo due process. Under this system, you can say this uppity foreigner missed a spot so DEPORT, or this uppity naturalized citizen named Trevor Noah or John Oliver or Seb Gorka or someone else missed another spot so DEPORT --

-- as I've said, this is an exercise in caprice, under the most determinedly xenophobic administration in American history.

Your understanding of American history is quite lacking.
We have had far more xenophobic ones.

And it is not “impractical”.
You are only expected to answer to the best of your knowledge.
If playing “gotcha” was the goal, there would be better ways to do it anyways.

Honestly, it's annoying that people are sleeping on Calvin Coolidge and the Immigration Act of 1924. Trump's administration has yet to even sign anything as anti-immigrant as the Asian Exclusion Act and National Origins Act.