Death Penalty as spare parts source.

[Elwher]

An idea that has gone around many times, but the recent article in USA Today https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2019/05/02/organ-donation-physician-assisted-suicide-death-disability-column/3628448002/?fbclid=IwAR1URN5YblvFmrs5NiGwPb-XtDKJku6j1IimqOCXJaN7c-fwDnXQsVpHPGg brings it to my mind again.

One of the arguments that is used against the death penalty is that it is strictly revenge and serves no useful purpose to society. What if any and all useful organs were harvested from the subject to go into general circulation? That way, a man who killed one or more people could wind up saving one or more lives by his death. This, to me, is the closest we will ever get to restorative justice in cases of murder; not paying back but paying forward.

[LiberNovusAmericae]

This reminds me of what the government of China does, and that is enough for me to oppose it.

[Wunderstrafanstalt]

Why don't the govt instead mandate everyone to donate their organs after they die, if we're going with that approach?

[Chernoslavia]

This reminds me of what the government of China does, and that is enough for me to oppose it.

Wait, China's still harvesting organs from Falun Gong practitioners?

[Neutraligon]

An idea that has gone around many times, but the recent article in USA Today https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2019/05/02/organ-donation-physician-assisted-suicide-death-disability-column/3628448002/?fbclid=IwAR1URN5YblvFmrs5NiGwPb-XtDKJku6j1IimqOCXJaN7c-fwDnXQsVpHPGg brings it to my mind again.

One of the arguments that is used against the death penalty is that it is strictly revenge and serves no useful purpose to society. What if any and all useful organs were harvested from the subject to go into general circulation? That way, a man who killed one or more people could wind up saving one or more lives by his death. This, to me, is the closest we will ever get to restorative justice in cases of murder; not paying back but paying forward.

No, for the same reason it is very difficult to do any sort of testing on prisoners.

[Nakena]

An idea that has gone around many times, but the recent article in USA Today https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2019/05/02/organ-donation-physician-assisted-suicide-death-disability-column/3628448002/?fbclid=IwAR1URN5YblvFmrs5NiGwPb-XtDKJku6j1IimqOCXJaN7c-fwDnXQsVpHPGg brings it to my mind again.

One of the arguments that is used against the death penalty is that it is strictly revenge and serves no useful purpose to society. What if any and all useful organs were harvested from the subject to go into general circulation? That way, a man who killed one or more people could wind up saving one or more lives by his death. This, to me, is the closest we will ever get to restorative justice in cases of murder; not paying back but paying forward.

The PRC is doing that already in concentration camps. The prisoners are harvested for their organs and other usable parts.

Thats some next level stuff.

[Autonomous Cleaner Bot Cleaners]

An idea that has gone around many times, but the recent article in USA Today https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2019/05/02/organ-donation-physician-assisted-suicide-death-disability-column/3628448002/?fbclid=IwAR1URN5YblvFmrs5NiGwPb-XtDKJku6j1IimqOCXJaN7c-fwDnXQsVpHPGg brings it to my mind again.

One of the arguments that is used against the death penalty is that it is strictly revenge and serves no useful purpose to society. What if any and all useful organs were harvested from the subject to go into general circulation? That way, a man who killed one or more people could wind up saving one or more lives by his death. This, to me, is the closest we will ever get to restorative justice in cases of murder; not paying back but paying forward.

Just resolve the matter of reassembling the wrongly convicted and I guess I have to be on board.

(Our current inability to institute restorative justice in those cases where the state fucks up and executes the wrong person is the argument against the death penalty far above and beyond more important, in my opinion, than "revenge" and "no useful purpose to society." If we're going to be looking for a "restorative justice" angle on capital punishment, we probably need to start there.)

[Washington Resistance Army]

Why don't the govt instead mandate everyone to donate their organs after they die, if we're going with that approach?

We really should tbh

[Nakena]

Why don't the govt instead mandate everyone to donate their organs after they die, if we're going with that approach?

We really should tbh

A couple of countries have already instituted that policy if I a not mistaken.

[LiberNovusAmericae]

This reminds me of what the government of China does, and that is enough for me to oppose it.

Wait, China's still harvesting organs from Falun Gong practitioners?

I don't know for sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if they're still doing it.

[Kowani]

Why don't the govt instead mandate everyone to donate their organs after they die, if we're going with that approach?

Indeed. What does a corpse care of liberty?

[Gormwood]

Why don't the govt instead mandate everyone to donate their organs after they die, if we're going with that approach?

Indeed. What does a corpse care of liberty?

People will throw a fit over it just like they do vaccination.

[Kowani]

Indeed. What does a corpse care of liberty?

People will throw a fit over it just like they do vaccination.

I am aware. I just find it ridiculous.

[Heloin]

I'm going to skip over the ethical dilemma first and look at how this would actually work. Only 25 inmates were executed in the US in 2018, two of them were electrocuted so there organs are useless. For the other 23 the most useful and needed organs for donation the heart, liver, and kidneys are destroyed by the process of lethal injection, then only about half of them would be suitable for organ donation cutting down the population of executed inmates able to donate organs to about 12, being hopeful.

That and hospitals probably won't take the organs seeing that it's a massive violation of the Hippocratic Oath.

[Liriena]

I'm opposed to the death penalty, so... no, this ain't it.

This reminds me of what the government of China does, and that is enough for me to oppose it.

Wait, China's still harvesting organs from Falun Gong practitioners?

So I've heard.

[Elwher]

I'm going to skip over the ethical dilemma first and look at how this would actually work. Only 25 inmates were executed in the US in 2018, two of them were electrocuted so there organs are useless. For the other 23 the most useful and needed organs for donation the heart, liver, and kidneys are destroyed by the process of lethal injection, then only about half of them would be suitable for organ donation cutting down the population of executed inmates able to donate organs to about 12, being hopeful.

That and hospitals probably won't take the organs seeing that it's a massive violation of the Hippocratic Oath.

Obviously, the method of executions would have to change to something that did not damage the organs. Firing squad or guillotine comes to mind. As to the problem of acceptance, as long as the donor is dead before the surgical team starts work, then do no harm is not violated.

[Elwher]

Why don't the govt instead mandate everyone to donate their organs after they die, if we're going with that approach?

The difference is that a convicted murderer owes a debt to society that other people do not.

[Cappuccina]

Yeah... let's like not do that.

I support the death penalty for some crimes and such, but all this will do is encourage use of the penalty to feed into the medical industry. They'd just start tossing people on death role.

[Risottia]

An idea that has gone around many times, but the recent article in USA Today https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2019/05/02/organ-donation-physician-assisted-suicide-death-disability-column/3628448002/?fbclid=IwAR1URN5YblvFmrs5NiGwPb-XtDKJku6j1IimqOCXJaN7c-fwDnXQsVpHPGg brings it to my mind again.

One of the arguments that is used against the death penalty is that it is strictly revenge and serves no useful purpose to society. What if any and all useful organs were harvested from the subject to go into general circulation? That way, a man who killed one or more people could wind up saving one or more lives by his death. This, to me, is the closest we will ever get to restorative justice in cases of murder; not paying back but paying forward.

No, for the same reason it is very difficult to do any sort of testing on prisoners.

Doktor Mengele disagreed, you know.

Hell, it's 2019 and we're still enjoying the sight of people willing to treat other people as material resources. I want to vomit.

[The Free Joy State]

An idea that has gone around many times, but the recent article in USA Today https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2019/05/02/organ-donation-physician-assisted-suicide-death-disability-column/3628448002/?fbclid=IwAR1URN5YblvFmrs5NiGwPb-XtDKJku6j1IimqOCXJaN7c-fwDnXQsVpHPGg brings it to my mind again.

One of the arguments that is used against the death penalty is that it is strictly revenge and serves no useful purpose to society. What if any and all useful organs were harvested from the subject to go into general circulation? That way, a man who killed one or more people could wind up saving one or more lives by his death. This, to me, is the closest we will ever get to restorative justice in cases of murder; not paying back but paying forward.

Firstly, wrongful conviction is a thing. Approximately 4.1% of those sentenced to die are innocent.

Second, practically, the drugs used will render the organs unusable, as Heloin pointed out.

I'm going to skip over the ethical dilemma first and look at how this would actually work. Only 25 inmates were executed in the US in 2018, two of them were electrocuted so there organs are useless. For the other 23 the most useful and needed organs for donation the heart, liver, and kidneys are destroyed by the process of lethal injection, then only about half of them would be suitable for organ donation cutting down the population of executed inmates able to donate organs to about 12, being hopeful.

That and hospitals probably won't take the organs seeing that it's a massive violation of the Hippocratic Oath.

Obviously, the method of executions would have to change to something that did not damage the organs. Firing squad or guillotine comes to mind. As to the problem of acceptance, as long as the donor is dead before the surgical team starts work, then do no harm is not violated.

That your answer to the obvious problem of harm to the organs is to switch to a crueller method of execution is more morally problematic (and how to you hope to kill someone by firing squad without turning the organs into unsusble Swiss cheese is beyond me)

Finally, the UN states that someone cannot be subject to cruel or unusual punishment. Even if they have committed a crime. Being forced to have their organs removed -- with no opt-out, no chance to refuse -- would be unethical, and a violation of basic human rights (which even those convicted of crimes have). As the UN said about the forced removal of organs of religious minorities:

"the right to the truth about gross human rights violations and serious violations of human rights law is an inalienable and autonomous right, linked to the duty and obligation of the State to protect and guarantee human rights, to conduct effective investigations and to guarantee effective remedy and reparations. This right is closely linked with other rights and has both an individual and a societal dimension and should be considered as a non-derogable right and not be subject to limitations.”

[Risottia]

Yeah... let's like not do that.

I support the death penalty for some crimes and such, but all this will do is encourage use of the penalty to feed into the medical industry. They'd just start tossing people on death role.

Nah, it's not like the private corporations running the US prison system would ever dare to exploit the system and endorse whatever policy increases the number of convictions as long as they can get a profit from that. If it were so, the US would have, dunno, the greatest prison population of the world while having just one-fifth the total population of PRC. And that can't be the case, because home of the free, you know.

[Saiwania]

It really should be considered.

I must admit that I want to try a bar of soap derived from human fat, for science. If there is no risk for prions, certain bones from people can perhaps be used for gelatin. Dead bodies may well be more lucrative for products than we think, if we can get past wanting to bury them. I can understand the need for burning a corpse after a certain point, but not wasting perfectly good land with coffins and graves.

[Washington Resistance Army]

I must admit that I want to try a bar of soap derived from human fat, for science.

What in the fucking fuck?

[Costa Fierro]

This reminds me of what the government of China does, and that is enough for me to oppose it.

Wait, China's still harvesting organs from Falun Gong practitioners?

Not anymore I don't think.

Also wouldn't the current methods of capital punishment make organ harvesting redundant?

I must admit that I want to try a bar of soap derived from human fat, for science.

What in the fucking fuck?

Saiwania wants to live out his Nazi fantasies. In other words, water is wet.

[Saiwania]

What in the fucking fuck?

If soap is just fat, it isn't so objectionable. Now I don't know first hand, if its good for cleaning purposes or not. If it has a good or bad scent as opposed to the ways soap is usually made. But I do believe that dead bodies can be recycled much more efficiently if the sentimentality is removed. We should see the dead, as a resource or business opportunity. It is wasteful to keep using coffins and its generally a waste of time and resources to hold funerals. The dead are gone, so they definitely aren't going to hear or care about what well wishers do, but many products can be made that people will arguably benefit more from.