Right-Wing Discussion Thread XVI: Making Things Right Again

[United Muscovite Nations]

It's debateable. I don't think there's a lot of evidence besides the absurdity of the situation itself that the Holodomor was deliberate. I've posted a lot on the evidence for it being the consequence of government incompetence.

Even if it was not deliberate, (many believe it was) it was at least a complete lack of caring.
Stalin has zero regard for human life regardless.

Yes, I think Stalin was genocidal and murderous, I just think there are better examples than the Holodomor.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Except for when he does.

When?

When he said he never changed his mind. When he said he wanted Isaac to be sacrificed. Whenever he says he's benevolent.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

When?

When he said he never changed his mind. When he said he wanted Isaac to be sacrificed.

How a test a change of mind?

[Jolthig]

There'd be a lot of coincidences stacking up at once for it to be solely unintentional.
At the very least, there was a deliberate choice made for the famine to affect specific regions when the soviets confiscated all the grain in western Ukraine.

That was simply a consequence of the disastrous policies for collectivization. The grain had to be collected by the state so it could be distributed. There wasn't a market where grain was sold, the state distributed it, and that required requisitioning it. Many of the records show that the Soviet reaction to the failure to meet the grain quota was panic and disbelief (even cancelling requisitions of grain and emergency distribution of leftover grain), which wouldn't be a logical reaction if they had planned for that.

That's how I look at the situation as well. Same with China's Great Leap Forward.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Whenever he says he's benevolent.

Haqq (Truth)

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

When he said he never changed his mind. When he said he wanted Isaac to be sacrificed.

How a test a change of mind?

His test with the Isaac sacrifice isn't an example of him changing his mind, it's an example of him lying. If you want examples of him changing his mind, just look to Numbers.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

How a test a change of mind?

His test with the Isaac sacrifice isn't an example of him changing his mind, it's an example of him lying.

Since when was a test of faith a lie?

If you want examples of him changing his mind, just look to Numbers.

I don't believe in Numbers.

[Novus America]

^This. There are better ways to measure industrialization than the amount of military equipment a country can put out.

Realistically, the best economic situation for the common man was the US in the late fifties/early sixties, not under a soviet block country.

Exactly.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

\Since when was a test of faith a lie?

When it contains deception. There's no way you can spin saying "I want this guy to be sacrificed" when you don't really want him sacrificed, as not deceptive.

[Jolthig]

Realistically, the best economic situation for the common man was the US in the late fifties/early sixties, not under a soviet block country.

Exactly.

Mmhmm.

[Diopolis]

Realistically, the best economic situation for the common man was the US in the late fifties/early sixties, not under a soviet block country.

Exactly.

Of course, the country that best maintained that situation was heavily interventionist France, not mercantilist Japan or free market USA.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

\Since when was a test of faith a lie?

When it contains deception. There's no way you can spin saying "I want this guy to be sacrificed" when you don't really want him sacrificed, as not deceptive.

Well you can, because Allah SWT just did. It was in His plan all along that IsHaaq AS (Issac) wasn't gonna die like that. It also was a sign of precedent that blood sacrifice doesn't please Allah SWT (this is more referring to animals but, you know, same process.

[Novus America]

Exactly.

Of course, the country that best maintained that situation was heavily interventionist France, not mercantilist Japan or free market USA.

Well the USA in the late 50s early 60s still had state intervention, although a moderate level of it.

[Diopolis]

Of course, the country that best maintained that situation was heavily interventionist France, not mercantilist Japan or free market USA.

Well the USA in the late 50s early 60s still had state intervention, although a moderate level of it.

Less than today's France, though.

[Novus America]

Well the USA in the late 50s early 60s still had state intervention, although a moderate level of it.

Less than today's France, though.

But it was more successful than today’s France too.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

When it contains deception. There's no way you can spin saying "I want this guy to be sacrificed" when you don't really want him sacrificed, as not deceptive.

Well you can, because Allah SWT just did. It was in His plan all along that IsHaaq AS (Issac) wasn't gonna die like that. It also was a sign of precedent that blood sacrifice doesn't please Allah SWT (this is more referring to animals but, you know, same process.

He said he wanted Isaac sacrificed. That was a lie.

[Jolthig]

Less than today's France, though.

But it was more successful than today’s France too.

It was pretty much after Nixon where everything just started go into a downward spiral especially among the middle class.

[Hanafuridake]

Personally I would be more depressed if Christianity turned out to be true than atheism. A lot of people I love would suffer in eternal torment because they weren't believers

You wouldn't be mourning over their punishment though. You wouldn't really care about them actually.

No, I'm fairly certain that I would care quite a lot about my friends and family even after death.

Why would you want to change? You're in Jannah and can get any you ask for.

Does that include homosexual desires?

Yes, this is true.

Then this conception of the universe is quite dull compared to the materialist viewpoint. Nietzsche and Marx's materialisms, while being flawed, are infinitely more preferable to me. That doesn't make them true, but it does punch a hole in the argument that people like Kowani are hopeless souls doomed to a meaningless existence.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Well you can, because Allah SWT just did. It was in His plan all along that IsHaaq AS (Issac) wasn't gonna die like that. It also was a sign of precedent that blood sacrifice doesn't please Allah SWT (this is more referring to animals but, you know, same process.

He said he wanted Isaac sacrificed. That was a lie.

It was a test of faith, not a lie.

No, I'm fairly certain that I would care quite a lot about my friends and family even after death.

Islamically you wouldn't.

Does that include homosexual desires?

I doubt it but idk for certain.

Then this conception of the universe is quite dull compared to the materialist viewpoint. Nietzsche and Marx's materialisms, while being flawed, are infinitely more preferable to me. That doesn't make them true, but it does punch a hole in the argument that people like Kowani are hopeless souls doomed to a meaningless existence.

What the problem with everything being created to serve Allah SWT?

[Bienenhalde]

Personally I would be more depressed if Christianity turned out to be true than atheism. A lot of people I love would suffer in eternal torment because they weren't believers, I would be trapped in a one-sided afterlife for all eternity with no room for change, and perhaps most strikingly to the imagination argument, this elaborate cosmos with one hundred billion galaxies and other wondrous phenomenon only exists because God wants people to make a simple decision.

I think maybe your understanding of Christianity is far too simplistic, but then again, I suppose that many Christians have far too simplistic an understanding of Christianity as well.

[Bienenhalde]

Then this conception of the universe is quite dull compared to the materialist viewpoint. Nietzsche and Marx's materialisms, while being flawed, are infinitely more preferable to me. That doesn't make them true, but it does punch a hole in the argument that people like Kowani are hopeless souls doomed to a meaningless existence.

It seems terribly depressing to imagine a universe where life has no meaning and nothing but matter exists.

[Kowani]

Then this conception of the universe is quite dull compared to the materialist viewpoint. Nietzsche and Marx's materialisms, while being flawed, are infinitely more preferable to me. That doesn't make them true, but it does punch a hole in the argument that people like Kowani are hopeless souls doomed to a meaningless existence.

It seems terribly depressing to imagine a universe where life has no meaning and nothing but matter exists.

God, I hate this idea. Life does have meaning-it is the meaning you make for yourself, the life you live. Just because there is no greater purpose to everything, no cosmic deity guiding everything does not make things meaningless. They are inherently valuable to you, and, if you aren’t mean or antisocial, the people you choose to surround yourself with.

[Hanafuridake]

Does anyone see me as left-wing, in curiosity? A friend of mine seems to think that I'm just a leftist in denial, I didn't have a clue why. So I wondered what others' perception was.

Then this conception of the universe is quite dull compared to the materialist viewpoint. Nietzsche and Marx's materialisms, while being flawed, are infinitely more preferable to me. That doesn't make them true, but it does punch a hole in the argument that people like Kowani are hopeless souls doomed to a meaningless existence.

It seems terribly depressing to imagine a universe where life has no meaning and nothing but matter exists.

Lots of matter is living, and in both Nietzsche & Marx's worldview, matter is in a constant state of change and self-transformation.

[The Xenopolis Confederation]

Does anyone see me as left-wing, in curiosity? A friend of mine seems to think that I'm just a leftist in denial, I didn't have a clue why. So I wondered what others' perception was.

It seems terribly depressing to imagine a universe where life has no meaning and nothing but matter exists.

Lots of matter is living, and in both Nietzsche & Marx's worldview, matter is in a constant state of change and self-transformation.

From what I can see, your politics are neither left-wing nor right-wing. They are unique.

[Greater Cesnica]

Does anyone see me as left-wing, in curiosity? A friend of mine seems to think that I'm just a leftist in denial, I didn't have a clue why. So I wondered what others' perception was.



Lots of matter is living, and in both Nietzsche & Marx's worldview, matter is in a constant state of change and self-transformation.

From what I can see, your politics are neither left-wing nor right-wing. They are unique.

Like a buffet