Right-Wing Discussion Thread XVI: Making Things Right Again

[Northern Davincia]

I disagree.

Whether or not you disagree doesn't change the fact that you, a mortal human being, only have limited knowledge of reality and the universe. God has infinite knowledge and so His judgement overrides yours.

Should I pull up a list of every lie in the Qu’ran? Or the Bible, which one would you prefer?

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

I disagree.

Whether or not you disagree doesn't change the fact that you, a mortal human being, only have limited knowledge of reality and the universe. God has infinite knowledge and so His judgement overrides yours.

Should I pull up a list of every lie in the Qu’ran? Or the Bible, which one would you prefer?

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.

^This

[Northern Davincia]

Whether or not you disagree doesn't change the fact that you, a mortal human being, only have limited knowledge of reality and the universe. God has infinite knowledge and so His judgement overrides yours.

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.

^This

As much as I intensely disagree with Islam on theological matters, I admire your lot in their piety.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

^This

As much as I intensely disagree with Islam on theological matters, I admire your lot in their piety.

[Bear Stearns]

What are RWDT's vices?

I'm a big fan of rye whiskey and stout beer. Canadian Club and Guinness are my brands.

Also a big fan of old school chewing tobacco. Not modern day pouches or "long cut", but honest to God treated tobacco leaves. Red Man is probably the best brand for it.

[Conserative Morality]

I disagree.

Whether or not you disagree doesn't change the fact that you, a mortal human being, only have limited knowledge of reality and the universe. God has infinite knowledge and so His judgement overrides yours.

Should I pull up a list of every lie in the Qu’ran? Or the Bible, which one would you prefer?

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.

“But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.”

21"'I will go and be a deceiving spirit in the mouths of all his prophets,' he said.

"'You will succeed in enticing him,' said the LORD. 'Go and do it.' 22"

So now the LORD has put a deceiving spirit in the mouths of these prophets of yours. The LORD has decreed disaster for you."

9"'And if the prophet is enticed to utter a prophecy, I the LORD have enticed that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand against him and destroy him from among my people Israel."

[Jolthig]

Ooh I'm going to join the debate if Kowani challenges the Quran.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Ooh I'm going to join the debate if Kowani challenges the Quran.

Same. Not here tho for obvs reasons.

[Greater Adamsia]

What are RWDT's vices?

I'm a big fan of rye whiskey and stout beer. Canadian Club and Guinness are my brands.

Also a big fan of old school chewing tobacco. Not modern day pouches or "long cut", but honest to God treated tobacco leaves. Red Man is probably the best brand for it.

I'm a glutton, overly fond of fine food and (soft, due to the teetotaling thing I've got going on) drink. My caloric intake is Herculean, and I'm genuinely surprised that I'm merely slightly pudgy in the gut and not horrifically obese. High metabolism, perhaps?

[Bear Stearns]

What are RWDT's vices?

I'm a big fan of rye whiskey and stout beer. Canadian Club and Guinness are my brands.

Also a big fan of old school chewing tobacco. Not modern day pouches or "long cut", but honest to God treated tobacco leaves. Red Man is probably the best brand for it.

I'm a glutton, overly fond of fine food and (soft, due to the teetotaling thing I've got going on) drink. My caloric intake is Herculean, and I'm genuinely surprised that I'm merely slightly pudgy in the gut and not horrifically obese. High metabolism, perhaps?

Omg I absolutely love the whole concept of your nation. Anglo-Saxon Calvinism ftw!

[The Supreme Magnificent High Swaglord]

I'm a glutton, overly fond of fine food and (soft, due to the teetotaling thing I've got going on) drink. My caloric intake is Herculean, and I'm genuinely surprised that I'm merely slightly pudgy in the gut and not horrifically obese. High metabolism, perhaps?

Omg I absolutely love the whole concept of your nation. Anglo-Saxon Calvinism ftw!

My intent was a sort of "Puritan technocracy" of sorts; a contradictory mess but only by the standards of our timeline's 21st century.

[Diopolis]

What are RWDT's vices?

I'm a big fan of rye whiskey and stout beer. Canadian Club and Guinness are my brands.

Also a big fan of old school chewing tobacco. Not modern day pouches or "long cut", but honest to God treated tobacco leaves. Red Man is probably the best brand for it.

I'm fond of rye whiskey, and brandy, and bocks and schwartzbiers(like any good Texan, my preference is for shiner). I also like pipe tobacco and the occasional cigar.

[Bear Stearns]

Omg I absolutely love the whole concept of your nation. Anglo-Saxon Calvinism ftw!

My intent was a sort of "Puritan technocracy" of sorts; a contradictory mess but only by the standards of our timeline's 21st century.

It sounds like a place I would like to live in. KJV, thank-you notes, and a flinty work ethic sound like a paradise.

[Bear Stearns]

What are RWDT's vices?

I'm a big fan of rye whiskey and stout beer. Canadian Club and Guinness are my brands.

Also a big fan of old school chewing tobacco. Not modern day pouches or "long cut", but honest to God treated tobacco leaves. Red Man is probably the best brand for it.

I'm fond of rye whiskey, and brandy, and bocks and schwartzbiers(like any good Texan, my preference is for shiner). I also like pipe tobacco and the occasional cigar.

My father went to college in Texas and picked up a taste for Shiner. It is quite good!

[Diopolis]

I'm fond of rye whiskey, and brandy, and bocks and schwartzbiers(like any good Texan, my preference is for shiner). I also like pipe tobacco and the occasional cigar.

My father went to college in Texas and picked up a taste for Shiner. It is quite good!

Honestly it's probably the best mass market beer here in the US. Quite telling that you can still drink it at 40-45 degrees instead of the "will shatter your teeth upon contact" temperatures best suited for bud.

[Kowani]

Should I pull up a list of every lie in the Qu’ran? Or the Bible, which one would you prefer?

Mostly the Holy Qur'an, but there aren't any lies in it. If you show the Bible the Chrsitians will refute said lies.

Sure, let’s go with the Qu’ran. It’s not like this post’ll be fuckin’ giant…

-Everyone comes from 2 people.
-And thy Lord inspired the bee, saying: Choose thou habitations in the hills and in the trees and in that which they thatch;
16:69 Then eat of all fruits, and follow the ways of thy Lord, made smooth (for thee).
-And He it is Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. They float, each in an orbit
-Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water ? Will they not then believe ?
-The entire “moon splitting” bull.
-And all things We have created by pairs, that haply ye may reflect.
-For indeed there are rocks from out which rivers gush, and indeed there are rocks which split asunder so that water floweth from them. And indeed there are rocks which fall down for the fear of Allah.
-And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah ?
-Homosexuality is unnatural.

Can’t keep his story straight.

-How many Angels spoke to Mary?
-Which came first, Heaven or Earth?
-Is Allah Merciful?
-Who was the first Muslim?
-But the devil whispered to him, saying: O Adam! Shall I show thee the tree of immortality and power that wasteth not away ? "The tree of immortality and power"
In Genesis (3:22-24), Adam and Eve are driven out of the Garden of Eden before eating from the "Tree of Life" and thereby becoming immortal. But here they eat from "the tree of immortality and power" -- yet they don't become immortal or powerful, they become ashamed of their nakedness. Why?
20:121 Then they twain ate thereof, so that their shame became apparent unto them, and they began to hide by heaping on themselves some of the leaves of the Garden.

A question. If I steal something, should I get a life sentence?

No, you should get your hand cut off. But you're not Muslim so that doesn't apply.

Yes, that punishment makes sense. Deterring crime? Nah. Crippling punishment? Heck yeah.

Considering he guides us into an eternity of nothingness and literal slavery

No religion that teaches an afterlife says this.

No? Tell me, can one go against Allah’s will in heaven?

I’m gonna ignore the semantics for a moment, and point out that you are not his slave. You are his servant, which is not the same thing.

It is in Al-Islam. "عَبْد/'Abd" translates to either "slave" or "servant",so it doesn't really matter which one I use, it conveys the same meaning.

And yet in English, they are not the same.

Of those cases which I spoke? He is the architect of them.

Not necessarily. The last thing you said, about the mother dying during childbirth, isn't necessarily because Allah SWT actively ended her life.

Interesting, that:
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children.

[The Supreme Magnificent High Swaglord]

My intent was a sort of "Puritan technocracy" of sorts; a contradictory mess but only by the standards of our timeline's 21st century.

It sounds like a place I would like to live in. KJV, thank-you notes, and a flinty work ethic sound like a paradise.

The closest modern RL analogue would be Singapore, perhaps. The political/ruling class and the expert/intelligentsia class have considerable overlap, the government is committed to maintaining peace and public order (and does this by laws that seem somewhat draconian to outsiders), the standard of living is among the highest in the world thanks to advanced technology (bordering on early Post-Modern Tech) and the culture is equal parts inclusive (we don't care who you are) yet conservative and communitarian (provided that you conform and assimilate to our values, and do your duties as a citizen of the Republic to the utmost of your ability). Also, they're currently engaged in a proxy war over Quebec against the Empire of Japan and their Canadian puppet regime. The current ruler is His Excellency Justin T. Vaiksnoras, by Divine Providence and the Popular Will, President of the Republic of Adamsia.

[Kowani]

I disagree.

Whether or not you disagree doesn't change the fact that you, a mortal human being, only have limited knowledge of reality and the universe. God has infinite knowledge and so His judgement overrides yours.

It is interesting, that whenever one invokes divine knowledge or judgement, it is always to support their own point.

Should I pull up a list of every lie in the Qu’ran? Or the Bible, which one would you prefer?

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.[/quote]
Of course not, if you move the goalposts so that everything is a metaphor.

[Northern Davincia]

Whether or not you disagree doesn't change the fact that you, a mortal human being, only have limited knowledge of reality and the universe. God has infinite knowledge and so His judgement overrides yours.

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.

“But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.”

21"'I will go and be a deceiving spirit in the mouths of all his prophets,' he said.

"'You will succeed in enticing him,' said the LORD. 'Go and do it.' 22"

So now the LORD has put a deceiving spirit in the mouths of these prophets of yours. The LORD has decreed disaster for you."

9"'And if the prophet is enticed to utter a prophecy, I the LORD have enticed that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand against him and destroy him from among my people Israel."

The first example is pretty clear when you understand nuance, in that eating of the tree is the act in which death entered the world. Hyperbole, metaphors, and the like are not lies.
As for the second example, it is similar to when God hardens the hearts of men. Micaiah was the true prophet acting on God's behalf, whereas the other prophets serving King Ahab were false. God was fully honest in stating that attacking Syria would end badly.
Context is important.

Whether or not you disagree doesn't change the fact that you, a mortal human being, only have limited knowledge of reality and the universe. God has infinite knowledge and so His judgement overrides yours.

It is interesting, that whenever one invokes divine knowledge or judgement, it is always to support their own point.

Should I pull up a list of every lie in the Qu’ran? Or the Bible, which one would you prefer?

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.

Of course not, if you move the goalposts so that everything is a metaphor.

1. To criticize God on the nature of reality is to speak from ignorance, as we do not have infinite knowledge.
2. Some things are metaphors, and some aren't. The context will allow us to determine which is which.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Mostly the Holy Qur'an, but there aren't any lies in it. If you show the Bible the Chrsitians will refute said lies.

Sure, let’s go with the Qu’ran. It’s not like this post’ll be fuckin’ giant…

-Everyone comes from 2 people.
-And thy Lord inspired the bee, saying: Choose thou habitations in the hills and in the trees and in that which they thatch;
16:69 Then eat of all fruits, and follow the ways of thy Lord, made smooth (for thee).
-And He it is Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. They float, each in an orbit
-Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water ? Will they not then believe ?
-The entire “moon splitting” bull.
-And all things We have created by pairs, that haply ye may reflect.
-For indeed there are rocks from out which rivers gush, and indeed there are rocks which split asunder so that water floweth from them. And indeed there are rocks which fall down for the fear of Allah.
-And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah ?
-Homosexuality is unnatural.

Can’t keep his story straight.

-How many Angels spoke to Mary?
-Which came first, Heaven or Earth?
-Is Allah Merciful?
-Who was the first Muslim?
-But the devil whispered to him, saying: O Adam! Shall I show thee the tree of immortality and power that wasteth not away ? "The tree of immortality and power"
In Genesis (3:22-24), Adam and Eve are driven out of the Garden of Eden before eating from the "Tree of Life" and thereby becoming immortal. But here they eat from "the tree of immortality and power" -- yet they don't become immortal or powerful, they become ashamed of their nakedness. Why?
20:121 Then they twain ate thereof, so that their shame became apparent unto them, and they began to hide by heaping on themselves some of the leaves of the Garden.

No, you should get your hand cut off. But you're not Muslim so that doesn't apply.

Yes, that punishment makes sense. Deterring crime? Nah. Crippling punishment? Heck yeah.

No religion that teaches an afterlife says this.

No? Tell me, can one go against Allah’s will in heaven?

It is in Al-Islam. "عَبْد/'Abd" translates to either "slave" or "servant",so it doesn't really matter which one I use, it conveys the same meaning.

And yet in English, they are not the same.

Not necessarily. The last thing you said, about the mother dying during childbirth, isn't necessarily because Allah SWT actively ended her life.

Interesting, that:
Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children.

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=462608&p=35903349#p35903349

[Kowani]

Should I pull up a list of every lie in the Qu’ran? Or the Bible, which one would you prefer?

You will not find a single lie uttered by God.

Of course not, if you move the goalposts so that everything is a metaphor.

1. To criticize God on the nature of reality is to speak from ignorance, as we do not have infinite knowledge. [/quote] To point out that God seems to have gotten basic facets of reality wrong is not.

2. Some things are metaphors, and some aren't. The context will allow us to determine which is which.

Read-Whatever makes God look bad is metaphor.

[El-Amin Caliphate]

Of course not, if you move the goalposts so that everything is a metaphor.

1. To criticize God on the nature of reality is to speak from ignorance, as we do not have infinite knowledge.

To point out that God seems to have gotten basic facets of reality wrong is not.

2. Some things are metaphors, and some aren't. The context will allow us to determine which is which.

Read-Whatever makes God look bad is metaphor.[/quote]
Again, 2000 years of Biblical scholarship know more than you.

[The Supreme Magnificent High Swaglord]

1. To criticize God on the nature of reality is to speak from ignorance, as we do not have infinite knowledge.

To point out that God seems to have gotten basic facets of reality wrong is not.

2. Some things are metaphors, and some aren't. The context will allow us to determine which is which.

Read-Whatever makes God look bad is metaphor.

Again, 2000 years of Biblical scholarship know more than you.[/quote]

I think that you may have messed up the formatting, m8.

EDIT: Somewhere, somehow, something has gone wrong.

[Kowani]

Again, 2000 years of Biblical scholarship know more than you.

An erroneous idea does not cease to be erroneous just because it is older.

[Kowani]

Again, 2000 years of Biblical scholarship know more than you.

I think that you may have messed up the formatting, m8.

EDIT: Somewhere, somehow, something has gone wrong.

FIxed!