NATION

PASSWORD

Right-Wing Discussion Thread XVI: Making Things Right Again

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

Do you consider nationalism and patriotism synoymous?

Yes- I am a nationalist and a patriot
115
26%
No- I am a nationalist and a patriot
52
12%
No- I am a nationalist, not a patriot
43
10%
No- I am a patriot, not a nationalist
147
33%
Yes- I am neither a nationalist nor a patriot
18
4%
No- I am neither a nationalist nor a patriot
68
15%
 
Total votes : 443

User avatar
Bienenhalde
Senator
 
Posts: 3606
Founded: Mar 11, 2017
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Bienenhalde » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:55 pm

Hanafuridake wrote:
Joohan wrote:
^this

We've no intention of sharing the stage. Thou shalt have not gods before me.


Wait, so you're criticizing liberalism for being allegedly intolerant of Christianity but saying that Christianity should be intolerant of everyone else.

That makes... not a lot of sense.


Well, even if one does not believe in tolerance, one can still claim that liberals are liars and hypocrites for claiming tolerance as a core value while not being tolerant in actual practice.
Bienenhalde (mostly) represents my real political views.
https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=75.6&d=68.6&g=38.8&s=45.2
OOC:
[*]Age: 24 [*]Pennsylvania Dutch [*]ELCA Lutheran [*]Male [*]Bisexual - leaning towards gay [*]Independent [*]Sinophile-Japanophile [*]Monarchist [*]Has Asperger's

User avatar
North German Realm
Minister
 
Posts: 2289
Founded: Jan 27, 2019
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby North German Realm » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:02 pm

Hanafuridake wrote:
Joohan wrote:
^this

We've no intention of sharing the stage. Thou shalt have not gods before me.


Wait, so you're criticizing liberalism for being allegedly intolerant of Christianity but saying that Christianity should be intolerant of everyone else.

That makes... not a lot of sense.

He's criticizing Liberalism specifically because it doesn't allow him to show his intolerance in public as much as he could have before liberalism. You'll notice this is a trend.
------------------
------------------
------------------
------------------
------------------
------------------
North Germany
Norddeutschland

Poisonous gas, constant artillery barrages, machines that can mow through trenches without a halt! Will this cursed War ever end?
Overview | Kaiser | Chancellor | Legislature | Military
15 October 1910
Norddeutsche Morgenpost: Revolution in Portugal! Portuguese King flees to Berlin! Angola, Portuguese India, and Macau occupied by North Germany! Dutch, South African forces occupy neighboring Portuguese colonies accordingly. | France humiliated in Dhaka by British and Native Indian forces! | Terrorist Bombing destroys Los Angeles Times offices! | British-American Fishery dispute resolved in The Hague, Netherlands!

User avatar
Hanafuridake
Minister
 
Posts: 3095
Founded: Sep 09, 2018
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Hanafuridake » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:31 pm

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:So where's the forcing religion aspect?


Joohan wrote:We've no intention of sharing the stage.

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:Joohan made many posts regarding this topic, namely the fact that he doesn't support forcing Christianity on people.


He has said that he doesn't support “Christian death squads,” not that he doesn't support a Christian state.

Joohan wrote:In a way actually, that was exactly what Jesus intended. Purge through converting the non-believers onto his path. Neither he, nor I, ever suggested CHRISTIAN DEATH SQUADS, but the laws of Heaven and the duities implied far outstrip any concept of NAP or bs natural rights purported by liberals and their ilk ( Temple, whip, merchants, etc. ). Christianity has never had an official Jurisprudence - the thought was always to have a Christian populace form a state, which would naturally accommodate our faith.
Time traveling Heian princess trapped in the 21st century

User avatar
El-Amin Caliphate
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15283
Founded: Apr 05, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby El-Amin Caliphate » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:33 pm

Hanafuridake wrote:
El-Amin Caliphate wrote:So where's the forcing religion aspect?


Joohan wrote:We've no intention of sharing the stage.

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:Joohan made many posts regarding this topic, namely the fact that he doesn't support forcing Christianity on people.


He has said that he doesn't support “Christian death squads,” not that he doesn't support a Christian state.

Joohan wrote:In a way actually, that was exactly what Jesus intended. Purge through converting the non-believers onto his path. Neither he, nor I, ever suggested CHRISTIAN DEATH SQUADS, but the laws of Heaven and the duities implied far outstrip any concept of NAP or bs natural rights purported by liberals and their ilk ( Temple, whip, merchants, etc. ). Christianity has never had an official Jurisprudence - the thought was always to have a Christian populace form a state, which would naturally accommodate our faith.

Preaching Christianity still =/= forcing Christianity
Kubumba Tribe's sister nation. NOT A PUPPET! >w< In fact, this one came 1st.
Proud Full Member of the Council of Islamic Cooperation!^u^
I'm a (Pan) Islamist ;)
CLICK THIS
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people

Democracy and Freedom Index
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)

User avatar
Hanafuridake
Minister
 
Posts: 3095
Founded: Sep 09, 2018
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Hanafuridake » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:40 pm

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:
Hanafuridake wrote:



He has said that he doesn't support “Christian death squads,” not that he doesn't support a Christian state.


Preaching Christianity still =/= forcing Christianity


A Christian state which does not share a platform with other religions is forcing Christianity on the public.
Time traveling Heian princess trapped in the 21st century

User avatar
El-Amin Caliphate
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15283
Founded: Apr 05, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby El-Amin Caliphate » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:42 pm

Hanafuridake wrote:
El-Amin Caliphate wrote:Preaching Christianity still =/= forcing Christianity


A Christian state which does not share a platform with other religions is forcing Christianity on the public.

When said Christian state starts forcing people to be Christian you'll be right. Until then, a Christian state appreciating and promoting Christian life is not forcing Christianity on anyone.
Last edited by El-Amin Caliphate on Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kubumba Tribe's sister nation. NOT A PUPPET! >w< In fact, this one came 1st.
Proud Full Member of the Council of Islamic Cooperation!^u^
I'm a (Pan) Islamist ;)
CLICK THIS
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people

Democracy and Freedom Index
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)

User avatar
Joohan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1913
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Joohan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:28 am

North German Realm wrote:
Hanafuridake wrote:
Wait, so you're criticizing liberalism for being allegedly intolerant of Christianity but saying that Christianity should be intolerant of everyone else.

That makes... not a lot of sense.

He's criticizing Liberalism specifically because it doesn't allow him to show his intolerance in public as much as he could have before liberalism. You'll notice this is a trend.


Ive a lot of criticisms for liberalism - but yeah this is what I am currently on about. Liberalism's core concept of tolerance and moral subjectivity has led naturally to the current state of societal norms.

Topical quote given the above poll, " Tolerance is the virtue of the man without conviction " - G.K. Chesterton. Tolerance is not a virtue, nor should it be treated as such. Or, perhaps a more famous quote from Archbishop Charles Chaput,

" Tolerance is not a Christian virtue. Charity, justice, mercy, prudence, honesty; these are Christian virtues. "

User avatar
Kowani
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13914
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:30 am

Joohan wrote:
North German Realm wrote:He's criticizing Liberalism specifically because it doesn't allow him to show his intolerance in public as much as he could have before liberalism. You'll notice this is a trend.


Ive a lot of criticisms for liberalism - but yeah this is what I am currently on about. Liberalism's core concept of tolerance and moral subjectivity has led naturally to the current state of societal norms.

Topical quote given the above poll, " Tolerance is the virtue of the man without conviction " - G.K. Chesterton. Tolerance is not a virtue, nor should it be treated as such. Or, perhaps a more famous quote from Archbishop Charles Chaput,

" Tolerance is not a Christian virtue. Charity, justice, mercy, prudence, honesty; these are Christian virtues. "

Tolerance is what allows you to hold your religious beliefs in the first place.
Narcissistic (Hedonistic) Nihilist. Yes, I am edgy. I know.
Atheist and still proud of it.
Post-Capitalist, Post-Nationalist.
Rights are functionally just privileges society has deemed important.
Prydania wrote:
As a Canadian? I find Americans and their deep, deep distrust of the government to be fundamentally, critically, laughably flawed. I find some aspects of your country completely absurd. The distrust of anything remotely resembling authority is one. The gun problem that stems from that is another.

Seangoli wrote:You are spouting nonsensical drivel with no coherent thought, little logic, and at the end of it all just angry opining at the clouds based on a truly astonishly low level of knowledge or understanding of the subject matter.

0% Capitalism

User avatar
Joohan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1913
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Joohan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:33 am

Hanafuridake wrote:
El-Amin Caliphate wrote:So where's the forcing religion aspect?


Joohan wrote:We've no intention of sharing the stage.

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:Joohan made many posts regarding this topic, namely the fact that he doesn't support forcing Christianity on people.


He has said that he doesn't support “Christian death squads,” not that he doesn't support a Christian state.

Joohan wrote:In a way actually, that was exactly what Jesus intended. Purge through converting the non-believers onto his path. Neither he, nor I, ever suggested CHRISTIAN DEATH SQUADS, but the laws of Heaven and the duities implied far outstrip any concept of NAP or bs natural rights purported by liberals and their ilk ( Temple, whip, merchants, etc. ). Christianity has never had an official Jurisprudence - the thought was always to have a Christian populace form a state, which would naturally accommodate our faith.


Christianity has no jurisprudence - thus a Christian state could not exist.

I am for a state which promotes and supports Christianity - but no such state has been laid out by either the Church or the Bible. We can only look here or there for examples.

Such an ideal state would not force people to convert, but it would never humor the idea of agnosticism, Hinduism, or what have you. You may practice your faith as you wish - but the state is geared to accommodate Christianity. It's not a fair game - and it's not supposed to be.

Do what you will - but we are really suggesting you do this.

User avatar
Joohan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1913
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Joohan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:37 am

Kowani wrote:
Joohan wrote:
Ive a lot of criticisms for liberalism - but yeah this is what I am currently on about. Liberalism's core concept of tolerance and moral subjectivity has led naturally to the current state of societal norms.

Topical quote given the above poll, " Tolerance is the virtue of the man without conviction " - G.K. Chesterton. Tolerance is not a virtue, nor should it be treated as such. Or, perhaps a more famous quote from Archbishop Charles Chaput,

" Tolerance is not a Christian virtue. Charity, justice, mercy, prudence, honesty; these are Christian virtues. "

Tolerance is what allows you to hold your religious beliefs in the first place.


No it's not, and it never has been. Christians have held onto their beliefs while being thrown to the lions in Rome, beheaded in Japan, butchered in Scandinavia, burned in China, lynched in Mexico, guillotined in France, and all other manner of persecution across the world.

Our faith does not need tolerance in order to persevere.
Last edited by Joohan on Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Kowani
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13914
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:43 am

Joohan wrote:
Kowani wrote:Tolerance is what allows you to hold your religious beliefs in the first place.


No it's not, and it never has been. Christians have held onto their beliefs while being thrown to the lions in Rome, beheaded in Japan, butchered in Scandinavia, burned in China, lynched in Mexico, guillotined in France, and all other manner of persecution across the world.

Our faithI does not need tolerance in order to persevere.

I would like to point out that it’s much easier to track people’s faith now than it was back than. And than China and Japan really weren’t the greatest examples you could have given. But now? Oh, no. Tolerance is what allows the religion to survive, and not just from governmental or societal persecution.
Narcissistic (Hedonistic) Nihilist. Yes, I am edgy. I know.
Atheist and still proud of it.
Post-Capitalist, Post-Nationalist.
Rights are functionally just privileges society has deemed important.
Prydania wrote:
As a Canadian? I find Americans and their deep, deep distrust of the government to be fundamentally, critically, laughably flawed. I find some aspects of your country completely absurd. The distrust of anything remotely resembling authority is one. The gun problem that stems from that is another.

Seangoli wrote:You are spouting nonsensical drivel with no coherent thought, little logic, and at the end of it all just angry opining at the clouds based on a truly astonishly low level of knowledge or understanding of the subject matter.

0% Capitalism

User avatar
El-Amin Caliphate
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15283
Founded: Apr 05, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby El-Amin Caliphate » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:45 am

Kowani wrote:
Joohan wrote:
No it's not, and it never has been. Christians have held onto their beliefs while being thrown to the lions in Rome, beheaded in Japan, butchered in Scandinavia, burned in China, lynched in Mexico, guillotined in France, and all other manner of persecution across the world.

Our faithI does not need tolerance in order to persevere.

I would like to point out that it’s much easier to track people’s faith now than it was back than. And than China and Japan really weren’t the greatest examples you could have given. But now? Oh, no. Tolerance is what allows the religion to survive, and not just from governmental or societal persecution.

Over 2 billion people adhere to Christianity. It's doing more than surviving.
Kubumba Tribe's sister nation. NOT A PUPPET! >w< In fact, this one came 1st.
Proud Full Member of the Council of Islamic Cooperation!^u^
I'm a (Pan) Islamist ;)
CLICK THIS
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people

Democracy and Freedom Index
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)

User avatar
Joohan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1913
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Joohan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:47 am

Kowani wrote:
Joohan wrote:
No it's not, and it never has been. Christians have held onto their beliefs while being thrown to the lions in Rome, beheaded in Japan, butchered in Scandinavia, burned in China, lynched in Mexico, guillotined in France, and all other manner of persecution across the world.

Our faithI does not need tolerance in order to persevere.

I would like to point out that it’s much easier to track people’s faith now than it was back than. And than China and Japan really weren’t the greatest examples you could have given. But now? Oh, no. Tolerance is what allows the religion to survive, and not just from governmental or societal persecution.


China was infamous for it's persecution of Christian missionaries throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, and Japan straight up banned missionaries for entering into the country ( not before executing a number of the missionaries and their converts ). They were pretty intolerant of Christians.

could you explain why you think it is that our faith is reliant upon tolerance to survive?
Last edited by Joohan on Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Kowani
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13914
Founded: Apr 01, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kowani » Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:56 am

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:
Kowani wrote:I would like to point out that it’s much easier to track people’s faith now than it was back than. And than China and Japan really weren’t the greatest examples you could have given. But now? Oh, no. Tolerance is what allows the religion to survive, and not just from governmental or societal persecution.

Over 2 billion people adhere to Christianity. It's doing more than surviving.

Cultural inertia, poverty, lack of education-in all the places where these things are on the decline, so too is Christianity.

Joohan wrote:
Kowani wrote:I would like to point out that it’s much easier to track people’s faith now than it was back than. And than China and Japan really weren’t the greatest examples you could have given. But now? Oh, no. Tolerance is what allows the religion to survive, and not just from governmental or societal persecution.


China was infamous for it's persecution of Christian missionaries throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, and Japan straight up banned missionaries for entering into the country ( not before executing a number of the missionaries and their converts ). They were pretty intolerant of Christians.
Actually, I meant the whole “we will persevere!” thing. ‘Cause that? Nah. Oh, sure, a handful of people. But that’s not so much anyone’s personal spiritual conviction as it was material limits.
[/quote]
And I could you explain why you think it is that our faith is reliant upon tolerance to survive?[/quote]
Let’s begin with the obvious problem of different sects within the religion. The thousands of them that there are. To have these sects coexist in peace would be tolerant, and thus, they must war. If one sect actually wins, it gets to impose its laws on everyone. But that’s a very good recipe for a very angry populace, especially with religious laws, which are a bit prudish, and good at inciting rebellion. The whole “misogyny/homophobia thing” is terrible PR. The prohibition of birth control is fundamentally unworkable, so that’s not good for you either.
Narcissistic (Hedonistic) Nihilist. Yes, I am edgy. I know.
Atheist and still proud of it.
Post-Capitalist, Post-Nationalist.
Rights are functionally just privileges society has deemed important.
Prydania wrote:
As a Canadian? I find Americans and their deep, deep distrust of the government to be fundamentally, critically, laughably flawed. I find some aspects of your country completely absurd. The distrust of anything remotely resembling authority is one. The gun problem that stems from that is another.

Seangoli wrote:You are spouting nonsensical drivel with no coherent thought, little logic, and at the end of it all just angry opining at the clouds based on a truly astonishly low level of knowledge or understanding of the subject matter.

0% Capitalism

User avatar
Joohan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1913
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Joohan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:13 am

Kowani wrote:Cultural inertia, poverty, lack of education-in all the places where these things are on the decline, so too is Christianity.


Poverty and lack of education are on the decline practically everywhere - Christianity is only noticeably declining in the west.

Joohan wrote:
China was infamous for it's persecution of Christian missionaries throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, and Japan straight up banned missionaries for entering into the country ( not before executing a number of the missionaries and their converts ). They were pretty intolerant of Christians.
Actually, I meant the whole “we will persevere!” thing. ‘Cause that? Nah. Oh, sure, a handful of people. But that’s not so much anyone’s personal spiritual conviction as it was material limits.

And I could you explain why you think it is that our faith is reliant upon tolerance to survive?[/quote]
Let’s begin with the obvious problem of different sects within the religion. The thousands of them that there are. To have these sects coexist in peace would be tolerant, and thus, they must war. If one sect actually wins, it gets to impose its laws on everyone. But that’s a very good recipe for a very angry populace, especially with religious laws, which are a bit prudish, and good at inciting rebellion. The whole “misogyny/homophobia thing” is terrible PR. The prohibition of birth control is fundamentally unworkable, so that’s not good for you either.[/quote][/quote]

Again, this does nothing to prove your earlier assertion that, " Tolerance is what allows you to hold your religious beliefs in the first place. " Again, not at all. As history has shown over the last 2000 years, we can be actively hunted down by either the state or zealous mobs - we will persevere regardless of if we are tolerated or not.

Tolerance is not something which should be done away with - it is a useful tool to maintain civility between groups which disagree with one another. However, a state which uphold Christianity should not forsake morality in order to appear tolerant. Within the church, the various sects should show a great degree of civility between one another. Our whole, kill the apostate phase, kind of ended back in the 17th century. Heated debate and theological argumentation sure - but your local Lutheran church and Catholic Chapel aren't going to be turning into FOB's.

Again, tolerance is a tool, not a virtue or foundation of governance.

All the blue law stuff you mentioned can be sorted out through a few decades of social engineering. A concerted propaganda campaign by both private and public entities can turn the public opinion with time.
Last edited by Joohan on Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
The Xenopolis Confederation
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7453
Founded: Aug 11, 2017
Anarchy

Postby The Xenopolis Confederation » Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:31 am

Joohan wrote:
North German Realm wrote:He's criticizing Liberalism specifically because it doesn't allow him to show his intolerance in public as much as he could have before liberalism. You'll notice this is a trend.


Ive a lot of criticisms for liberalism - but yeah this is what I am currently on about. Liberalism's core concept of tolerance and moral subjectivity has led naturally to the current state of societal norms.

Topical quote given the above poll, " Tolerance is the virtue of the man without conviction " - G.K. Chesterton. Tolerance is not a virtue, nor should it be treated as such. Or, perhaps a more famous quote from Archbishop Charles Chaput,

" Tolerance is not a Christian virtue. Charity, justice, mercy, prudence, honesty; these are Christian virtues. "

Are you saying that someone who believes "live and let live” has no convictions?

Also, you do not want to force non believers to convert, yes? Why is that?
Pro: Liberty, Liberalism, Capitalism, Secularism, Equal opportunity, Direct Democracy, Windows Chauvinism, Psychedelic Rock, LGBT+ Rights, Live and let live tbh.
Against: Authoritarianism, Traditionalism, Non-Market-Socialism, Laissez-Faire Capitalism, Autocracy, (A)Theocracy, Macs, "The ends justify the means," Collectivism in all its forms.
Economic: 0.5
Social: -8
I'm an 18 year old Australian who tries to think about things but fails, as we all do. I'll regret this in 2 years tops.

I think I have gender dysphoria so I'd prefer you use she/her pronouns on me. If not, he/him'll do.

User avatar
Joohan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1913
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Joohan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:39 am

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:
Joohan wrote:
Ive a lot of criticisms for liberalism - but yeah this is what I am currently on about. Liberalism's core concept of tolerance and moral subjectivity has led naturally to the current state of societal norms.

Topical quote given the above poll, " Tolerance is the virtue of the man without conviction " - G.K. Chesterton. Tolerance is not a virtue, nor should it be treated as such. Or, perhaps a more famous quote from Archbishop Charles Chaput,

" Tolerance is not a Christian virtue. Charity, justice, mercy, prudence, honesty; these are Christian virtues. "

Are you saying that someone who believes "live and let live” has no convictions?

Also, you do not want to force non believers to convert, yes? Why is that?


Apathy isn't a conviction.

A forced convert, isn't really a convert. They haven't accepted Christ or the Spirit; without faith in the trinity, baptism and conversation are just empty and meaningless rituals - completely antithetical to what the point of being a missionary to begin with. We aren't looking to boost numbers on a paper, we are looking to save souls.

User avatar
The Xenopolis Confederation
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7453
Founded: Aug 11, 2017
Anarchy

Postby The Xenopolis Confederation » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:13 am

Joohan wrote:
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Are you saying that someone who believes "live and let live” has no convictions?

Also, you do not want to force non believers to convert, yes? Why is that?


Apathy isn't a conviction.

A forced convert, isn't really a convert. They haven't accepted Christ or the Spirit; without faith in the trinity, baptism and conversation are just empty and meaningless rituals - completely antithetical to what the point of being a missionary to begin with. We aren't looking to boost numbers on a paper, we are looking to save souls.

Who said anything about apathy?

Would you "save souls" by force if you could?
Pro: Liberty, Liberalism, Capitalism, Secularism, Equal opportunity, Direct Democracy, Windows Chauvinism, Psychedelic Rock, LGBT+ Rights, Live and let live tbh.
Against: Authoritarianism, Traditionalism, Non-Market-Socialism, Laissez-Faire Capitalism, Autocracy, (A)Theocracy, Macs, "The ends justify the means," Collectivism in all its forms.
Economic: 0.5
Social: -8
I'm an 18 year old Australian who tries to think about things but fails, as we all do. I'll regret this in 2 years tops.

I think I have gender dysphoria so I'd prefer you use she/her pronouns on me. If not, he/him'll do.

User avatar
Hanafuridake
Minister
 
Posts: 3095
Founded: Sep 09, 2018
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Hanafuridake » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:17 am

Joohan wrote:Japan straight up banned missionaries for entering into the country ( not before executing a number of the missionaries and their converts ). They were pretty intolerant of Christians.


After the missionaries made themselves unwelcome through violating social mores, selling Japanese in the slave trade, burning down temples and shrines, and convincing daimyo to donate feudal land to the Church. Nobunaga paid little attention to the Christians and most of his ire was directed to Buddhist temples and sects which opposed him. Hideyoshi at first simply banned daimyo from handing land away or from forcing farmers of his fief to convert until moving onto harsher measures.

Really, for all of the talk by Christian missionaries about how they face persecution in other countries, they have been their own worst enemies more often than not.
Time traveling Heian princess trapped in the 21st century

User avatar
Napkizemlja
Diplomat
 
Posts: 571
Founded: Apr 13, 2019
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Napkizemlja » Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:14 am

How about them Yankees.
Orthodox Christian and aspiring MD. Communitarian. Anti-usury. Ralph Fiennes is Serbian. English, Scottish, Welsh and Manx.

User avatar
The Supreme Magnificent High Swaglord
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6166
Founded: Jul 22, 2016
Father Knows Best State

Postby The Supreme Magnificent High Swaglord » Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:17 am

Napkizemlja wrote:How about them Yankees.


What do you mean? The sports team? The slang term for an American? The slang term for a Northerner? The slang term for a New Englander? The guy who made the song Despacito?
< THE HIGH SWAGLORD | 8VALUES | POLITISCALES >
My NS stats are not indicative of my OOC views. NS stats are meant to be rather silly. My OOC political and ideological inspirations are as such:
The Republic, by Plato | Leviathan, by Thomas Hobbes | The Confucian civil service system of imperial China | The "Golden Liberty" elective
monarchy system of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth | The corporatist/technocratic philosophy of Henri de Saint-Simon | The communitarian
ideological framework of the Singaporean People's Action Party | "New Deal"-style societal regimentation | Kantian/Mohist/Stoic philosophy

User avatar
El-Amin Caliphate
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15283
Founded: Apr 05, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby El-Amin Caliphate » Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:11 am

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:
Joohan wrote:
Apathy isn't a conviction.

A forced convert, isn't really a convert. They haven't accepted Christ or the Spirit; without faith in the trinity, baptism and conversation are just empty and meaningless rituals - completely antithetical to what the point of being a missionary to begin with. We aren't looking to boost numbers on a paper, we are looking to save souls.

Who said anything about apathy?

Would you "save souls" by force if you could?

You can't save souls by force.
Kubumba Tribe's sister nation. NOT A PUPPET! >w< In fact, this one came 1st.
Proud Full Member of the Council of Islamic Cooperation!^u^
I'm a (Pan) Islamist ;)
CLICK THIS
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people

Democracy and Freedom Index
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)

User avatar
Joohan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1913
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Joohan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:27 am

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:
Joohan wrote:
Apathy isn't a conviction.

A forced convert, isn't really a convert. They haven't accepted Christ or the Spirit; without faith in the trinity, baptism and conversation are just empty and meaningless rituals - completely antithetical to what the point of being a missionary to begin with. We aren't looking to boost numbers on a paper, we are looking to save souls.

Who said anything about apathy?

Would you "save souls" by force if you could?


You did in the first question.

And you can't save a soul by force. No one can force the holy spirit in, you have to let it in.

User avatar
Communist Zombie Horde
Diplomat
 
Posts: 944
Founded: Jan 04, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Communist Zombie Horde » Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:29 am

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Who said anything about apathy?

Would you "save souls" by force if you could?

You can't save souls by force.

False. Communists can be saved by means other than execution.
NS Parliament: Arnold Delbert; National People's Party

This nation is not entirely representative of my views. I've had some fun with the stats and I want to keep them that way.

User avatar
El-Amin Caliphate
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15283
Founded: Apr 05, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby El-Amin Caliphate » Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:33 am

Communist Zombie Horde wrote:
El-Amin Caliphate wrote:You can't save souls by force.

False. Communists can be saved by means other than execution.

Not by force tho. Otherwise they're just putting on a show for you to save their skin. And literally no one was talking about execution, why even bring that up?
Kubumba Tribe's sister nation. NOT A PUPPET! >w< In fact, this one came 1st.
Proud Full Member of the Council of Islamic Cooperation!^u^
I'm a (Pan) Islamist ;)
CLICK THIS
https://americanvision.org/948/theonomy-vs-theocracy/ wrote:God’s law cannot govern a nation where God’s law does not rule in the hearts of the people

Democracy and Freedom Index
Plaetopia wrote:Partly Free / Hybrid regime (score 4-6) El-Amin Caliphate (5.33)

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Arkhane, Black Moon Sodality, First American Empire, Galloism, Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Grand Proudhonia, Jean-Paul Sartre, LiberNovusAmericae, Neko-koku, Ors Might, Purgatio, Serconas, Tuthina

Advertisement

Remove ads