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Right-Wing Discussion Thread XVI: Making Things Right Again

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Do you consider nationalism and patriotism synoymous?

Yes- I am a nationalist and a patriot
115
26%
No- I am a nationalist and a patriot
52
12%
No- I am a nationalist, not a patriot
43
10%
No- I am a patriot, not a nationalist
147
33%
Yes- I am neither a nationalist nor a patriot
18
4%
No- I am neither a nationalist nor a patriot
68
15%
 
Total votes : 443

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Duhon
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Founded: Nov 21, 2018
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Duhon » Fri May 17, 2019 9:24 pm

Totally Not OEP wrote:
Duhon wrote:So... secession later. Neither Lincoln nor the south would've brooked compromise with regards to slavery. There would still be civil war, or at best a random disturbance by southern stragglers that would never really amount to anything, but would solidify northern opinion in favor of abolition if not complete racial egalitarianism.


Probably not; once it was shown that Southern fears about a Republican President were unfounded, Secession would become unlikely.


Which would've meant the Republicans abjuring their campaign promises, which I think is even more unlikely.

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Novus America
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Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Novus America » Fri May 17, 2019 9:52 pm

Totally Not OEP wrote:
Duhon wrote:So... secession later. Neither Lincoln nor the south would've brooked compromise with regards to slavery. There would still be civil war, or at best a random disturbance by southern stragglers that would never really amount to anything, but would solidify northern opinion in favor of abolition if not complete racial egalitarianism.


Probably not; once it was shown that Southern fears about a Republican President were unfounded, Secession would become unlikely.


So you acknowledge the South was wrong and unreasonable.
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Totally Not OEP
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Totally Not OEP » Fri May 17, 2019 10:28 pm

Duhon wrote:
Totally Not OEP wrote:
Probably not; once it was shown that Southern fears about a Republican President were unfounded, Secession would become unlikely.


Which would've meant the Republicans abjuring their campaign promises, which I think is even more unlikely.


The Republicans had promised to roll back Kansas-Nebraska in a sense, nothing more. The Free Soilers were content to even concede the Southwest, given there was no real interest on the part of Northern Farmers to settle it.
I'm definitely not OEP. I definitely don't advocate for annexing Mexico and establishing a National Syndicalist state.

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Totally Not OEP
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Totally Not OEP » Fri May 17, 2019 10:29 pm

Novus America wrote:
Totally Not OEP wrote:
Probably not; once it was shown that Southern fears about a Republican President were unfounded, Secession would become unlikely.


So you acknowledge the South was wrong and unreasonable.


No.
I'm definitely not OEP. I definitely don't advocate for annexing Mexico and establishing a National Syndicalist state.

True it was bad, but could've been worse
I'm ridin' a Hellcat, not a hearse
Took over at home, then jumped off the curb
Now all of my shows, they word 4 word
Broke so long, thought I was cursed

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Epicurustan
Secretary
 
Posts: 33
Founded: May 17, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Epicurustan » Sat May 18, 2019 2:19 am

Jack Thomas Lang wrote:What is your most valued book (collection)?

For me, it's my collection of "Great Ages of Man", each book provides an easy-to-read overview of different times and places, with chapters on culture, politics, religion, art, etc and pictures. I have books on the Reformation, Enlightenment, Ancient China, Imperial Rome, Byzantium, Classical Greece, Early Japan, Ancient Egypt, Historic India, Ancient America, Early Islam, Medieval Europe, 17th century Europe and the Age of Exploration. They're no longer published, which is a travesty.

My collection of ancient philosophy books. Pretty much all books related to religion are precious to me.

My favorite so far is Meditations by Marcus Aurelius, Epicurus' letters and the Dao Ching.
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Hanafuridake
Senator
 
Posts: 3730
Founded: Sep 09, 2018
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Hanafuridake » Sat May 18, 2019 2:27 am

Jack Thomas Lang wrote:What is your most valued book (collection)?

For me, it's my collection of "Great Ages of Man", each book provides an easy-to-read overview of different times and places, with chapters on culture, politics, religion, art, etc and pictures. I have books on the Reformation, Enlightenment, Ancient China, Imperial Rome, Byzantium, Classical Greece, Early Japan, Ancient Egypt, Historic India, Ancient America, Early Islam, Medieval Europe, 17th century Europe and the Age of Exploration. They're no longer published, which is a travesty.


There's a couple that I own, but my favorite would be a collection of Kukai's works & commentaries.
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Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76675
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Conserative Morality » Sat May 18, 2019 2:35 am

Duhon wrote:Well, speaking of the South and its barbaric "Cause", here's a question: could anything have prevented the split of the Union and descent into Civil War, during the 1860s and afterwards?

We could have rounded up and shot every slaver in the South.
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Hanafuridake
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Founded: Sep 09, 2018
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Hanafuridake » Sat May 18, 2019 2:40 am

Totally Not OEP wrote:Events of late are increasingly making me reconsider whether to readopt Southern Nationalism or not.


Posts like this convince me that maybe CM has a point, at least in regard to the failure to take punitive measures so that secessionist ideas would never have arisen in the South again.
Last edited by Hanafuridake on Sat May 18, 2019 2:45 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Epicurustan
Secretary
 
Posts: 33
Founded: May 17, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Epicurustan » Sat May 18, 2019 2:42 am

>implying political ideologies will reduce the suffering caused by a shortage of joy created by a deficiency of desires fullfilled

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The Xenopolis Confederation
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7788
Founded: Aug 11, 2017
Anarchy

Postby The Xenopolis Confederation » Sat May 18, 2019 2:43 am

Totally Not OEP wrote:Events of late are increasingly making me reconsider whether to readopt Southern Nationalism or not.

What did he mean by this?
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Duhon
Senator
 
Posts: 4072
Founded: Nov 21, 2018
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Duhon » Sat May 18, 2019 2:49 am

Hanafuridake wrote:
Totally Not OEP wrote:Events of late are increasingly making me reconsider whether to readopt Southern Nationalism or not.


Posts like this convince me that maybe CM has a point, at least in regard to the failure to take punitive measures so that secessionist ideas would never have arisen in the South again.


While I'm not gonna go so far to recommend the death of every slaver in the South, Reconstruction should've lasted a lot longer, and the Grant admin far more decisive, in stamping out unrest. Representative democracy in the South shouldn't have returned so soon, with a majority of people in favor of keeping blacks in utter subjection for as long as possible, slavery or no.

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Duhon
Senator
 
Posts: 4072
Founded: Nov 21, 2018
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Duhon » Sat May 18, 2019 2:49 am

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:
Totally Not OEP wrote:Events of late are increasingly making me reconsider whether to readopt Southern Nationalism or not.

What did he mean by this?


Lost Cause, yo.

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Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76675
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Conserative Morality » Sat May 18, 2019 3:11 am

Duhon wrote:
While I'm not gonna go so far to recommend the death of every slaver in the South,

Don't worry, I am mostly joking in advocating the death of every slaver in the prewar South.

Mostly.
Reconstruction should've lasted a lot longer, and the Grant admin far more decisive, in stamping out unrest. Representative democracy in the South shouldn't have returned so soon, with a majority of people in favor of keeping blacks in utter subjection for as long as possible, slavery or no.

I would argue, tbh, that the Grant administration was decisive - but that it was ham-stringed by moderate and 'liberal' republicans and Democrats in Congress.
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Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
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Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Conserative Morality » Sat May 18, 2019 3:20 am

Also gib Dominican Republic pls

It's free real estate

1.5 mil payment for national debts is nothing, basically free
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Asherahan
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Posts: 1968
Founded: Dec 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Asherahan » Sat May 18, 2019 3:22 am

Conserative Morality wrote:Also gib Dominican Republic pls

It's free real estate

1.5 mil payment for national debts is nothing, basically free

Isorrowproductions trucking to the Dominican Republic?
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The Xenopolis Confederation
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Anarchy

Postby The Xenopolis Confederation » Sat May 18, 2019 3:23 am

Conserative Morality wrote:Also gib Dominican Republic pls

It's free real estate

1.5 mil payment for national debts is nothing, basically free

Why do you want Dominican Republic?
Pro: Liberty, Liberalism, Capitalism, Secularism, Equal opportunity, Direct Democracy, Windows Chauvinism, Psychedelic Rock, LGBT+ Rights, Live and let live tbh.
Against: Authoritarianism, Traditionalism, Non-Market-Socialism, Laissez-Faire Capitalism, Autocracy, (A)Theocracy, Macs, "The ends justify the means," Collectivism in all its forms.
Economic: 0.5
Social: -8
I'm an 18 year old Australian who tries to think about things but fails, as we all do. I'll regret this in 2 years tops.

I think I have gender dysphoria so I'd prefer you use she/her pronouns on me. If not, he/him'll do.

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Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
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Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Conserative Morality » Sat May 18, 2019 3:28 am

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Why do you want Dominican Republic?

M A N I F E S T D E S T I N Y

Also, as several of its supporters mused upon when it was being considered, having a black majority state without an entrenched white aristocracy would have contributed to much needed balance in Congress and also acted as a kind of 'safety valve' for black populations in the South who otherwise would have had little other choice but to stay and knuckle under the still-extant Southern aristocracy.
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Asherahan
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Asherahan » Sat May 18, 2019 3:33 am

Serious question why didn't the US annex Cuba and the Caribbean islands in the 1890s and 1900s?
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The Xenopolis Confederation
Powerbroker
 
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Founded: Aug 11, 2017
Anarchy

Postby The Xenopolis Confederation » Sat May 18, 2019 3:33 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Why do you want Dominican Republic?

M A N I F E S T D E S T I N Y

Also, as several of its supporters mused upon when it was being considered, having a black majority state without an entrenched white aristocracy would have contributed to much needed balance in Congress and also acted as a kind of 'safety valve' for black populations in the South who otherwise would have had little other choice but to stay and knuckle under the still-extant Southern aristocracy.

N O

Also, what makes you think Dominican Republic would be able to vote when Guam and Peurto Rico can't?
Pro: Liberty, Liberalism, Capitalism, Secularism, Equal opportunity, Direct Democracy, Windows Chauvinism, Psychedelic Rock, LGBT+ Rights, Live and let live tbh.
Against: Authoritarianism, Traditionalism, Non-Market-Socialism, Laissez-Faire Capitalism, Autocracy, (A)Theocracy, Macs, "The ends justify the means," Collectivism in all its forms.
Economic: 0.5
Social: -8
I'm an 18 year old Australian who tries to think about things but fails, as we all do. I'll regret this in 2 years tops.

I think I have gender dysphoria so I'd prefer you use she/her pronouns on me. If not, he/him'll do.

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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 52921
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Sat May 18, 2019 3:55 am

Asherahan wrote:Serious question why didn't the US annex Cuba and the Caribbean islands in the 1890s and 1900s?

Because Spanish. Literally. There where a group of people who didn’t want Spanish people in the US in any majority
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Asherahan
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Asherahan » Sat May 18, 2019 3:56 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Asherahan wrote:Serious question why didn't the US annex Cuba and the Caribbean islands in the 1890s and 1900s?

Because Spanish. Literally. There where a group of people who didn’t want Spanish people in the US in any majority

But almost free clay, resources and manpower!
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Thermodolia
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Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Sat May 18, 2019 3:58 am

Conserative Morality wrote:
Duhon wrote:Well, speaking of the South and its barbaric "Cause", here's a question: could anything have prevented the split of the Union and descent into Civil War, during the 1860s and afterwards?

We could have rounded up and shot every slaver in the South.

Sherman for the south!!
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

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Thermodolia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 52921
Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Sat May 18, 2019 4:00 am

Asherahan wrote:
Thermodolia wrote:Because Spanish. Literally. There where a group of people who didn’t want Spanish people in the US in any majority

But almost free clay, resources and manpower!

Nobody ever said racists where smart
Last edited by Thermodolia on Sat May 18, 2019 4:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Male, Titoist cultural nationalist, lives somewhere in the Deep South, give me any good Irish, Canadian, or Scottish whiskey and I will be your friend for life. I'm GAY!
I'm agent #69 in the Gaystapo!
>The Sons of Adam: I'd crown myself monarch... cuz why not?
>>Dumb Ideologies: Why not turn yourself into a penguin and build an igloo at the centre of the Earth?
>Xovland: I keep getting ads for printer ink. Sometimes, when you get that feeling down there, you have to look at some steamy printer pictures.
Click for Da Funies
Click Here for RP Info Embassy Program
Ambassadors to the WA:
Ambassador to the GA Jon Æthr
Ambassador to the SC Eve Šanœ

RIP Dya

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Asherahan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1968
Founded: Dec 08, 2015
Democratic Socialists

Postby Asherahan » Sat May 18, 2019 4:01 am

Thermodolia wrote:
Asherahan wrote:But almost free clay, resources and manpower!

Nobody ever said racists where smart

Truer words have never been said.
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Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
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Left-Leaning College State

Postby Conserative Morality » Sat May 18, 2019 4:12 am

The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:N O

Also, what makes you think Dominican Republic would be able to vote when Guam and Peurto Rico can't?

Because statehood was literally written into the contract offered.

THE MYTH OF CONSENT OF THE GOVERNED

Dominican Republic: "I consent!"

Grant Adminsitration: "I consent!"

Racists: "I DON'T"
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