2019-2020 US Election Megathread II: Tim Ryan's Empire

[Thuzbekistan]

I wonder if Greens will make gains in the US, like they have in recent European elections.

Hopefully fucking never.

Aight then

[The Andromeda Archipelago]

I wonder if Greens will make gains in the US, like they have in recent European elections.

Hopefully fucking never.

In New Mexico, GREEN used to mean Getting Republicans Elected Every November. Now, most environmentally conscious voters vote Democrat.

[Duhon]

Mandatory voting.

No actually proportional representation would be the big game changer.

Commies, you get reps! Nazis, you get reps! All the mad little parties get reps! Woohoo!

[Jack Thomas Lang]

Commies, you get reps! Nazis, you get reps! All the mad little parties get reps! Woohoo!

If this is your criticism for proportional representative, please try again.

[Galloism]

No actually proportional representation would be the big game changer.

Commies, you get reps! Nazis, you get reps! All the mad little parties get reps! Woohoo!

Governments throughout history have been concerned about the common man getting a voice in government.

Even the founding fathers were scared of that, hence the landowning requirements.

It's time to let go of our fear.

[Mettaton-EX]

No actually proportional representation would be the big game changer.

Commies, you get reps! Nazis, you get reps! All the mad little parties get reps! Woohoo!

are you under the impression that the current system is preventing nazis from gaining representation

[Nakena]

No actually proportional representation would be the big game changer.

Commies, you get reps! Nazis, you get reps! All the mad little parties get reps! Woohoo!

Yes and most prop-rep democracies work out with it too. Also at least it prevent the mads flocking to the big tents and stay in their smoll ones, containing them inside their lolboxes.

[Telconi]

Commies, you get reps! Nazis, you get reps! All the mad little parties get reps! Woohoo!

are you under the impression that the current system is preventing nazis from gaining representation

I would say it's more likely the lack of Nazi voters...

[Ngelmish]

You dont speak for all leftists....

I'm reiterating the very basis of our ideology: The people.

Dictators are traitors to leftism.

Aaaaand yet, leftist policies have pushed reforms that "the people" have disagreed with throughout history. The morality of individual leftists has contradicted what the people wanted, or been out of step with reforms that the majority of the left has carried out. I believe that you have had some personal experience with falling into the latter camp.

"The people" is hardly an ideology in itself -- they're too divided. It's a debating point.

[Telconi]

I'm reiterating the very basis of our ideology: The people.

Dictators are traitors to leftism.

Aaaaand yet, leftist policies have pushed reforms that "the people" have disagreed with throughout history. The morality of individual leftists has contradicted what the people wanted, or been out of step with reforms that the majority of the left has carried out. I believe that you have had some personal experience with falling into the latter camp.

"The people" is hardly an ideology in itself -- they're too divided. It's a debating point.

It all works if you just de-personify the people who disagree with you.

[Ngelmish]

Aaaaand yet, leftist policies have pushed reforms that "the people" have disagreed with throughout history. The morality of individual leftists has contradicted what the people wanted, or been out of step with reforms that the majority of the left has carried out. I believe that you have had some personal experience with falling into the latter camp.

"The people" is hardly an ideology in itself -- they're too divided. It's a debating point.

It all works if you just de-personify the people who disagree with you.

Well, since you want criminal sentences for people who disagree with your axiom that "arms are good" (read, people who might apply some limitations at some times to Telconi's right to have some guns) and their subsequent cultural marginalization, it's not as though you're above "de-personifying" folks when it comes to ludicrously criminalizing things.

Or isn't that the point of criminalization

[Pasong Tirad]

Commies, you get reps! Nazis, you get reps! All the mad little parties get reps! Woohoo!

are you under the impression that the current system is preventing nazis from gaining representation

Boy oh boy is he gonna be surprised when he finds out about Steve King.

[San Lumen]

I wonder if Greens will make gains in the US, like they have in recent European elections.

Hopefully fucking never.

What do you have against the greens?

[Washington Resistance Army]

Hopefully fucking never.

What do you have against the greens?

Have you ever heard of Jill Stein lol

[San Lumen]

Those who want election reform why do they always push for proportional representation?

What's wrong with IRV or MMP?

In IRV no vote is wasted

In MMP it satisfies both sides. Those who want districts get what they want and those who want proportional representation get the reform they desire. Its a win win.

[Telconi]

It all works if you just de-personify the people who disagree with you.

Well, since you want criminal sentences for people who disagree with your axiom that "arms are good" (read, people who might apply some limitations at some times to Telconi's right to have some guns) and their subsequent cultural marginalization, it's not as though you're above "de-personifying" folks when it comes to ludicrously criminalizing things.

Or isn't that the point of criminalization

Oh how awful that human rights abusers should be punished for human rights abuses. I suppose we as a society are mean old de-personifying ugly heads when we put rapists in prison too?

[Shrillland]

Those who want election reform why do they always push for proportional representation?

What's wrong with IRV or MMP?

In IRV no vote is wasted

In MMP it satisfies both sides. Those who want districts get what they want and those who want proportional representation get the reform they desire. Its a win win.

It'll take time. IRV's now finally got a foothold in America, and people will start looking at Maine and think it's a good idea for their states, particularly states with strong third parties of their own like Vermont, California, New Mexico, etc.

[Telconi]

Those who want election reform why do they always push for proportional representation?

What's wrong with IRV or MMP?

In IRV no vote is wasted

In MMP it satisfies both sides. Those who want districts get what they want and those who want proportional representation get the reform they desire. Its a win win.

These systems still favor an overall split between two large parties.

[Shrillland]

Those who want election reform why do they always push for proportional representation?

What's wrong with IRV or MMP?

In IRV no vote is wasted

In MMP it satisfies both sides. Those who want districts get what they want and those who want proportional representation get the reform they desire. Its a win win.

These systems still favor an overall split between two large parties.

Oh, absolutely. On the other hand, ours is such a large and diverse country with such large and diverse states that straight up PR can lead a lot of voters left out. You'd experience that first-hand if Cali's seats become straight up PR and Republicans end up with a lot less seats than they could with MMP.

[Telconi]

These systems still favor an overall split between two large parties.

Oh, absolutely. On the other hand, ours is such a large and diverse country with such large and diverse states that straight up PR can lead a lot of voters left out. You'd experience that first-hand if Cali's seats become straight up PR and Republicans end up with a lot less seats than they could with MMP.

I fail to see how this is a bad thing.

[Shrillland]

Oh, absolutely. On the other hand, ours is such a large and diverse country with such large and diverse states that straight up PR can lead a lot of voters left out. You'd experience that first-hand if Cali's seats become straight up PR and Republicans end up with a lot less seats than they could with MMP.

I fail to see how this is a bad thing.

My point is that different regions have different needs, your state is like that as is mine. MMP ensures that the voters of those regions still have their unique needs addressed while still ensuring voters from smaller parties have a seat at the table through the lists.

[Telconi]

I fail to see how this is a bad thing.

My point is that different regions have different needs, your state is like that as is mine. MMP ensures that the voters of those regions still have their unique needs addressed while still ensuring voters from smaller parties have a seat at the table through the lists.

How do they get their needs addressed through MMP in a way that they don't through the FPTP we have now?

[Shrillland]

My point is that different regions have different needs, your state is like that as is mine. MMP ensures that the voters of those regions still have their unique needs addressed while still ensuring voters from smaller parties have a seat at the table through the lists.

How do they get their needs addressed through MMP in a way that they don't through the FPTP we have now?

I didn't say they didn't get them addressed with the current system, plenty of them are addressed. We send our representatives to Washington to represent us(at least ostensibly), but we need a fairer system for the nation as a whole to ensure more voices from other parties besides the large ones get heard and represented.

[Telconi]

How do they get their needs addressed through MMP in a way that they don't through the FPTP we have now?

I didn't say they didn't get them addressed with the current system, plenty of them are addressed. We send our representatives to Washington to represent us(at least ostensibly), but we need a fairer system for the nation as a whole to ensure more voices from other parties besides the large ones get heard and represented.

But we don't get them addressed now...

[Galloism]

I didn't say they didn't get them addressed with the current system, plenty of them are addressed. We send our representatives to Washington to represent us(at least ostensibly), but we need a fairer system for the nation as a whole to ensure more voices from other parties besides the large ones get heard and represented.

But we don't get them addressed now...

Mostly because the system was set up to disenfranchise most people. It’s only over time we’ve started to change that, and we got a long way to go.

https://www.netflix.com/title/80996949

Number 5.