Conservative Speaker Attacked at UMKC

[Torrocca]

I'm sure it would've merely been coincidental if there was an uptick in violence against trans people in Missouri following Knowles' speech had he spoken unhindered. :3



Like I said, I'm not saying to ignore hateful ideologies. I'm saying direct action works better to combat them.

Is it though? It just seems like an excuse to take the easier and more immediately satisfying route.

Yes, actually. If you prevent hate from building foundations via organization and whatnot, it quite literally does a lot to prevent the rise of hate.

[Kowani]

Too bad that precedent already exists in law.

Hm?

Mind you, in the US, this is not the case, unless it advocates a clear and present danger.

[Torrocca]

I'm sure it would've merely been coincidental if there was an uptick in violence against trans people in Missouri following Knowles' speech had he spoken unhindered. :3



Like I said, I'm not saying to ignore hateful ideologies. I'm saying direct action works better to combat them.

Well, he wasn't calling for violence, so...

It doesn't fucking matter if he was or wasn't directly calling for violence if his words still help to normalize hate.

[Loben]

Is it though? It just seems like an excuse to take the easier and more immediately satisfying route.

Yes, actually. If you prevent hate from building foundations via organization and whatnot, it quite literally does a lot to prevent the rise of hate.

Worked wonders in the 30s for Germany.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpattia]

One of the hallmarks of being oppressed is using mob tactics to stifle the speech of others.

Can't you tell how oppressed Torra is?

It's totally just a coinky-dink that targeted violence against trans people is on the rise, amirite?

And it's totally harmless that leaving hateful (Intentional or unintentional) opinions unchallenged and allowing them to fester without any social consequence whatsoever is the best recipe for perpetuating their dominance in public discourse, righto?

[Ors Might]

Is it though? It just seems like an excuse to take the easier and more immediately satisfying route.

Yes, actually. If you prevent hate from building foundations via organization and whatnot, it quite literally does a lot to prevent the rise of hate.

Not seeing how it prevents any hate. In fact, it just seems like it’ll increase the amount of concentrated hatred and instead prevents people from actually having to elaborate on why the ideology is bad.

A world where people can’t coherently outline why Nazism is bad without resorting to glorified sloagans is a world in danger.

[Torrocca]

Yes, actually. If you prevent hate from building foundations via organization and whatnot, it quite literally does a lot to prevent the rise of hate.

Not seeing how it prevents any hate. In fact, it just seems like it’ll increase the amount of concentrated hatred and instead prevents people from actually having to elaborate on why the ideology is bad.

A world where people can’t coherently outline why Nazism is bad without resorting to glorified sloagans is a world in danger.

Except the hate can't be concentrated if it's being denied avenues to grow and spread. Sure, maybe one individual will privately hold hateful ideas, but that's far less impactful than an entire group organizing and coordinating their hatred.

It's totally just a coinky-dink that targeted violence against trans people is on the rise, amirite?

And it's totally harmless that leaving hateful (Intentional or unintentional) opinions unchallenged and allowing them to fester without any social consequence whatsoever is the best recipe for perpetuating their dominance in public discourse, righto?

Absolutely.

[Telconi]

Well, he wasn't calling for violence, so...

It doesn't fucking matter if he was or wasn't directly calling for violence if his words still help to normalize hate.

Yeah, "all of my suffering is because people are different than me" is a shit belief system.

[Kowani]

Yes, actually. If you prevent hate from building foundations via organization and whatnot, it quite literally does a lot to prevent the rise of hate.

Not seeing how it prevents any hate. In fact, it just seems like it’ll increase the amount of concentrated hatred and instead prevents people from actually having to elaborate on why the ideology is bad.

A world where people can’t coherently outline why Nazism is bad without resorting to glorified sloagans is a world in danger.

A world where people need to have why Nazism is bad explained to them is worse.

[Scomagia]

"Everyone, help! I'm being attacked by a word! Somebody, help!"

Your words maybe could incite someone somewhere to do something to someone someday! I better use actual violence to shut you up! /s

[Loben]

"Everyone, help! I'm being attacked by a word! Somebody, help!"

Your words maybe could incite someone somewhere to do something to someone someday! I better use actual violence to shut you up! /s

Remember stocks and stones?

What a time to be alive.

[Torrocca]

"Everyone, help! I'm being attacked by a word! Somebody, help!"

Your words maybe could incite someone somewhere to do something to someone someday! I better use actual violence to shut you up! /s

Like I said, it's literally totally just a funny little coincidence that deliberate, targeted violence against the trans community has been on the rise, amirite or amirite?

[Scomagia]

He would've literally died from the lavender oil!

Let's, uh, let's just sweep under the rug the frequent amounts of violence already committed against trans people.

Yes, violence against trans people is bad. It's also bad to take action against someone because of their speech.

The most reasonable position. I like you.

[Torrocca]

He would've literally died from the lavender oil!

Let's, uh, let's just sweep under the rug the frequent amounts of violence already committed against trans people.

Yes, violence against trans people is bad. It's also bad to take action against someone because of their speech.

Sometimes lesser evils are necessary in the grand scheme of things. I'd rather take lavender oil than the continued upward trend in people murdering trans people for being trans.

[Scomagia]

Your words maybe could incite someone somewhere to do something to someone someday! I better use actual violence to shut you up! /s

Like I said, it's literally totally just a funny little coincidence that deliberate, targeted violence against the trans community has been on the rise, amirite or amirite?

Now connect it to Knowle's speech or sit down.

[Scomagia]

Yes, violence against trans people is bad. It's also bad to take action against someone because of their speech.

Sometimes lesser evils are necessary in the grand scheme of things. I'd rather take lavender oil than the continued upward trend in people murdering trans people for being trans.

Yes, because acts of violence don't set a precedent for greater acts of violence.

[Loben]

Like I said, it's literally totally just a funny little coincidence that deliberate, targeted violence against the trans community has been on the rise, amirite or amirite?

Now connect it to Knowle's speech or sit down.

Brain antenna.

[Ors Might]

Not seeing how it prevents any hate. In fact, it just seems like it’ll increase the amount of concentrated hatred and instead prevents people from actually having to elaborate on why the ideology is bad.

A world where people can’t coherently outline why Nazism is bad without resorting to glorified sloagans is a world in danger.

Except the hate can't be concentrated if it's being denied avenues to grow and spread. Sure, maybe one individual will privately hold hateful ideas, but that's far less impactful than an entire group organizing and coordinating their hatred.

And it's totally harmless that leaving hateful (Intentional or unintentional) opinions unchallenged and allowing them to fester without any social consequence whatsoever is the best recipe for perpetuating their dominance in public discourse, righto?

Absolutely.

You might have a point if we existed at any point in time than the one we have right now. The internet is an open platform in the extreme. Now more than ever, the ability to analyze your opponent’s ideology and pick apart its flaws is vital.

Not seeing how it prevents any hate. In fact, it just seems like it’ll increase the amount of concentrated hatred and instead prevents people from actually having to elaborate on why the ideology is bad.

A world where people can’t coherently outline why Nazism is bad without resorting to glorified sloagans is a world in danger.

A world where people need to have why Nazism is bad explained to them is worse.

Not really. Both worlds overlap and are equally in danger from Nazism.

[Torrocca]

Like I said, it's literally totally just a funny little coincidence that deliberate, targeted violence against the trans community has been on the rise, amirite or amirite?

Now connect it to Knowle's speech or sit down.

SImple: Knowles' speech, had it been unchecked, would've helped to normalize hatred, which in turn would've begotten more violence.

Like I said, it literally doesn't fucking matter if he was or wasn't directly advocating for violence if at the end of the day his words end up normalizing the idea that it's okay to hate and discriminate against an entire part of society.

[Scomagia]

Your words maybe could incite someone somewhere to do something to someone someday! I better use actual violence to shut you up! /s

Remember stocks and stones?

What a time to be alive.

Stocks and stones sounds pretty kinky.

[Torrocca]

Except the hate can't be concentrated if it's being denied avenues to grow and spread. Sure, maybe one individual will privately hold hateful ideas, but that's far less impactful than an entire group organizing and coordinating their hatred.



Absolutely.

You might have a point if we existed at any point in time than the one we have right now. The internet is an open platform in the extreme. Now more than ever, the ability to analyze your opponent’s ideology and pick apart its flaws is vital.

A world where people need to have why Nazism is bad explained to them is worse.

Not really. Both worlds overlap and are equally in danger from Nazism.

Actually, shutting down hate groups and whatnot still works even on the internet.

[Loben]

Remember stocks and stones?

What a time to be alive.

Stocks and stones sounds pretty kinky.

Only if you’re into snuff

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpattia]

He would've literally died from the lavender oil!

Let's, uh, let's just sweep under the rug the frequent amounts of violence already committed against trans people.

Yes, violence against trans people is bad. It's also bad to take action against someone because of their speech.

If said speech helps perpetuate anti-transgender pogroms against innocent people who just seek to live a life of peace without being forced to hide who they are, then it should definitely not be above consequences or the law. There is a reason why Germany is so harsh against any expression of radical opinions, right or left, because they know that allowing said opinions to fester freely is what got em Weimar, several attempted military coups by anti-democratic extremists, and then a complete nightmare.

But yeah, we must not disrupt the free marketplace of ideas under any circumstances, even against aiding and abetting perpetuation of murders based on your XYZ, righto?

[Ors Might]

You might have a point if we existed at any point in time than the one we have right now. The internet is an open platform in the extreme. Now more than ever, the ability to analyze your opponent’s ideology and pick apart its flaws is vital.


Not really. Both worlds overlap and are equally in danger from Nazism.

Actually, shutting down hate groups and whatnot still works even on the internet.

I would not celebrate. Reddit is hardly a majority or even a plurality of internet traffic.

Besides, hatred need not be overt in order to spread and do damage.

[Scomagia]

Now connect it to Knowle's speech or sit down.

SImple: Knowles' speech, had it been unchecked, would've helped to normalize hatred, which in turn would've begotten more violence.

Like I said, it literally doesn't fucking matter if he was or wasn't directly advocating for violence if at the end of the day his words end up normalizing the idea that it's okay to hate and discriminate against an entire part of society.

Blah blah blah, words are more violent than violence and normalize violence more than violence does.

*yawn*

How tedious.