TDT 4: What the $#@! is a "womxn", anyways?

[Auzkhia]

They often don't have the highest self-esteem, they project their exact version of dysphoria, they can't deal with their pain in a healthy way.

That's a serious problem...wouldn't teaching someone to use positive terms about themselves be more...productive? That's what I learned from counseling anyway.

Yeah, while anecdotal evidence, it's apparent once you get acquainted with them. I too have dealt with self-loathing, I recognize that disgust coming from the inside of them. Soaking the mind in misery leads to bad things, also speaking from therapy.

They often don't have the highest self-esteem, they project their exact version of dysphoria, they can't deal with their pain in a healthy way.

Indeed; self-confidence and open-mindedness tend to be inversely correlated.

Indeed, it looks like insecurities, and I know that feeling all to well. They say that misery loves company.

[Grenartia]

I have a question about trans people that I'm sure you guys can answer properly. How do I refute people who state the "41% suicide rate after transition" statistic?" Please note that I am not supporting that statement, and that I fully believe that transition is the best treatment of gender dysphoria.

Being hated and denied equal rights by society at large, and without a close-knit support group (racial minorities, for instance, still have their families and usually churches or other faith groups, and other forms of community), tends to breed a sense of hopelessness which fosters suicidal ideation. Besides, if memory serves, that 41% statistic is for pre-transition individuals, and the number drops significantly (I don't remember to what number exactly) during and after transition (but still not to the same level as cis people, admittedly, though the factors I explained arguably perfectly account for it).

Yes, they're not ashamed of calling themselves that, ime.

I mean, calling yourself “scum” or “trash” probably doesn’t indicate a healthy amount of self-esteem.

Which would explain why they go around bullying other trans people like they do.

[Saciu]

I mean, calling yourself “scum” or “trash” probably doesn’t indicate a healthy amount of self-esteem.

They often don't have the highest self-esteem, they project their exact version of dysphoria, they can't deal with their pain in a healthy way.

I too love strawmen.

[Cappuccina]

They often don't have the highest self-esteem, they project their exact version of dysphoria, they can't deal with their pain in a healthy way.

Indeed; self-confidence and open-mindedness tend to be inversely correlated.

Not really.

[Dumb Ideologies]

Yes, the reason that trans spaces online are so toxic probably has a lot to do with low self-esteem. A lot of trans people are denied recognition and find themselves socially isolated when they're growing up. That sort of upbringing is well-known to be linked to the development of low self-confidence, unhealthy communication styles and an inability to deal with conflict productively.

No, that tendency is not only reserved to those who disagree with you on a certain activist point. You probably just don't recognise that the people on your side in argument are also being total fannies.

One of the greatest frustrations is seeing some of the most persistently vicious and nasty people screaming that they're being "attacked" when they're justly criticised for their behaviour, that any criticism of them is "gaslighting", and hurling snarls left right and centre while the people on their side of the argument nod along like this is normal person behaviour.

[Auzkhia]

If one thinks transgender spaces online are "toxic" and "cliquey"

It's because we do have the bridge up. A lot of trans people are working with pain and trauma to varying degrees, but that's understandable.

Like I rather eat a bowl of thumbtacks than to engage in a Q&A session with a terf or any other two-bit transphobe with some "concerns" and to argue about whether people like me are real and valid, laboring over nuanced responses to each "concern". And it's kinda why so many remotely vocal trans people with any size of platform gets called an activist. Any trans person with an opinion is a trans activist.

Even within the trans community, it's ask four people and get five opinions. So, are we this united front? No, but maybe it could be, with the right organization , but that's another intracommunity debate, it seems.

[Dumb Ideologies]

If one thinks transgender spaces online are "toxic" and "cliquey"

It's because we do have the bridge up. A lot of trans people are working with pain and trauma to varying degrees, but that's understandable.

Like I rather eat a bowl of thumbtacks than to engage in a Q&A session with a terf or any other two-bit transphobe with some "concerns" and to argue about whether people like me are real and valid, laboring over nuanced responses to each "concern". And it's kinda why so many remotely vocal trans people with any size of platform gets called an activist. Any trans person with an opinion is a trans activist.

Even within the trans community, it's ask four people and get five opinions. So, are we this united front? No, but maybe it could be, with the right organization , but that's another intracommunity debate, it seems.

Not wanting to talk to people who aren't trans and have a track record of baiting and trying to bully trans people for "ownage points" is one thing.

But many, probably a majority, also prefer to slap a label on well-meaning people with differing opinions to theirs within the community and try to isolate and smear them, try to mark them as unacceptable and ignore them, rather than engage with them in honest discussion. That's another thing.

Someone disagrees, call them truscum or a trender and then either enjoy them being diverted off the topic to defend themselves or use their lack of a denial as evidence and try to start a-cancelling. We can't be a united front because different groups have fundamentally different ideas about what gender even is, and so the aim of having a "united front" would inevitably involve trying to socially enforce a particular "party line", which would in turn cause more splits and angst. The aim is surely not a "united front" but a "big tent" (and no-one fucking dare uwu at that), what we need to do is learn how to handle diversity of opinion better so that we become a functional community capable of disagreeing on things like adults without instantly screaming bloody murder and letting loose the hounds of war.

[Luminesa]

If one thinks transgender spaces online are "toxic" and "cliquey"

It's because we do have the bridge up. A lot of trans people are working with pain and trauma to varying degrees, but that's understandable.

Like I rather eat a bowl of thumbtacks than to engage in a Q&A session with a terf or any other two-bit transphobe with some "concerns" and to argue about whether people like me are real and valid, laboring over nuanced responses to each "concern". And it's kinda why so many remotely vocal trans people with any size of platform gets called an activist. Any trans person with an opinion is a trans activist.

Even within the trans community, it's ask four people and get five opinions. So, are we this united front? No, but maybe it could be, with the right organization , but that's another intracommunity debate, it seems.

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

[Necroghastia]

If one thinks transgender spaces online are "toxic" and "cliquey"

It's because we do have the bridge up. A lot of trans people are working with pain and trauma to varying degrees, but that's understandable.

Like I rather eat a bowl of thumbtacks than to engage in a Q&A session with a terf or any other two-bit transphobe with some "concerns" and to argue about whether people like me are real and valid, laboring over nuanced responses to each "concern". And it's kinda why so many remotely vocal trans people with any size of platform gets called an activist. Any trans person with an opinion is a trans activist.

Even within the trans community, it's ask four people and get five opinions. So, are we this united front? No, but maybe it could be, with the right organization , but that's another intracommunity debate, it seems.

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

Or, y'know, C) you value your mental well-being enough to not want to engage with someone who is bigoted against you.

[Mettaton-EX]

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

Or, y'know, C) you value your mental well-being enough to not want to engage with someone who is bigoted against you.

d) you've had the same exact argument dozens of times and you're Tired

[Auzkhia]

If one thinks transgender spaces online are "toxic" and "cliquey"

It's because we do have the bridge up. A lot of trans people are working with pain and trauma to varying degrees, but that's understandable.

Like I rather eat a bowl of thumbtacks than to engage in a Q&A session with a terf or any other two-bit transphobe with some "concerns" and to argue about whether people like me are real and valid, laboring over nuanced responses to each "concern". And it's kinda why so many remotely vocal trans people with any size of platform gets called an activist. Any trans person with an opinion is a trans activist.

Even within the trans community, it's ask four people and get five opinions. So, are we this united front? No, but maybe it could be, with the right organization , but that's another intracommunity debate, it seems.

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

Trans people get a lot of bad faith actors their way that don't actually give one solitary shit of the complexity of gender and all its study. Nobody is entitled to debate. Plus, with debating transphobes, I am debating my own existence, even if it is not about myself per se, trans people are asked to prove themselves all the time, so excuse us for wanting to gender paps out of our wigs for one little second of peace.

Being trans or nonbinary isn't just some viewpoint, it's simply who I am.

[Luminesa]

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

Or, y'know, C) you value your mental well-being enough to not want to engage with someone who is bigoted against you.

I’ve had someone call me the AntiChrist for real. A very big, very mean street preacher, too. You have to laugh when people say things like that, and then just hold your head up. And I’m not a particularly strong person, nor do I have the highest esteem all the time.

[Luminesa]

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

Trans people get a lot of bad faith actors their way that don't actually give one solitary shit of the complexity of gender and all its study. Nobody is entitled to debate. Plus, with debating transphobes, I am debating my own existence, even if it is not about myself per se, trans people are asked to prove themselves all the time, so excuse us for wanting to gender paps out of our wigs for one little second of peace.

Being trans or nonbinary isn't just some viewpoint, it's simply who I am.

Well in the case of debating whether or not you exist...I guess I can’t help with that. You do exist and you are someone, and someone special and good. And you were made to do good things and to love other people. I can’t say much beyond that.

[Necroghastia]

Or, y'know, C) you value your mental well-being enough to not want to engage with someone who is bigoted against you.

I’ve had someone call me the AntiChrist for real. A very big, very mean street preacher, too. You have to laugh when people say things like that, and then just hold your head up. And I’m not a particularly strong person, nor do I have the highest esteem all the time.

So you didn't have a conversation with him about how you aren't the Antichrist?

[Luminesa]

I’ve had someone call me the AntiChrist for real. A very big, very mean street preacher, too. You have to laugh when people say things like that, and then just hold your head up. And I’m not a particularly strong person, nor do I have the highest esteem all the time.

So you didn't have a conversation with him about how you aren't the Antichrist?

It was part of a conversation about Catholicism where he didn’t really wanna listen, and he was already convinced I was the AntiChrist for being Catholic. These were like...fire-and-brimstone kinda of people from some little church in backwoods Mississippi. The people around him were still interested in talking, however, so I kept talking. I kept talking to him as well, and he stood and listened. I made an impression on at least two of them. I admittedly like to hear myself talk and am an extrovert, but I do enjoy conversing with others about what I believe as well, even if I know they won’t always agree. You don’t have to convince people even, to enjoy a conversation.

[Grenartia]

If one thinks transgender spaces online are "toxic" and "cliquey"

It's because we do have the bridge up. A lot of trans people are working with pain and trauma to varying degrees, but that's understandable.

Like I rather eat a bowl of thumbtacks than to engage in a Q&A session with a terf or any other two-bit transphobe with some "concerns" and to argue about whether people like me are real and valid, laboring over nuanced responses to each "concern". And it's kinda why so many remotely vocal trans people with any size of platform gets called an activist. Any trans person with an opinion is a trans activist.

Even within the trans community, it's ask four people and get five opinions. So, are we this united front? No, but maybe it could be, with the right organization , but that's another intracommunity debate, it seems.

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

You obviously have never been on the receiving end of concern trolling and harrassment from transphobes and TERFs. They aren't interested in, nor will they be "won over" by rational debate. They are unreachable, and trying to reach them only ends in pain and suffering. We know this from repeated personal experience. Its like debating Nazis. You're not going to change their minds, no matter how well-reasoned and backed up by facts your argument is.

Or, y'know, C) you value your mental well-being enough to not want to engage with someone who is bigoted against you.

I’ve had someone call me the AntiChrist for real. A very big, very mean street preacher, too. You have to laugh when people say things like that, and then just hold your head up. And I’m not a particularly strong person, nor do I have the highest esteem all the time.

That's not remotely comparable.

We can't just "laugh off" our very real marginalization, no more than your Catholic ancestors in the US could "laugh it off" 100 years ago, when the KKK was actively promoting hatred and oppression of Catholics, when discrimination against Catholics was socially acceptable, etc.

People who are truly marginalized are, according to society at large, "acceptable targets". Anything done to us is "ok", even the most heinous of crimes (see: the Trans Panic 'Defense', and the entire reason for the existence of Transgender Day of Rememberance) and anything we do in response, no matter how reasonable or trivial, is "unacceptable", or otherwise used to justify doing heinous things to us in the first place.

Getting called a ridiculous name by some jackass with a megaphone (yes, I know that particular group eschews megaphones, but still) and a "ur goin to hell" sign is nowhere near the same level as having TERFs and transphobes incite hatred and violence against you.

So you didn't have a conversation with him about how you aren't the Antichrist?

It was part of a conversation about Catholicism where he didn’t really wanna listen, and he was already convinced I was the AntiChrist for being Catholic. These were like...fire-and-brimstone kinda of people from some little church in backwoods Mississippi. The people around him were still interested in talking, however, so I kept talking. I kept talking to him as well, and he stood and listened. I made an impression on at least two of them. I admittedly like to hear myself talk and am an extrovert, but I do enjoy conversing with others about what I believe as well, even if I know they won’t always agree. You don’t have to convince people even, to enjoy a conversation.

Those same jackasses come to my campus, too, and they might pretend to be civil and willing to be "won over" by you, but when it comes to LGBT+ people, they have no interest in extending that same courtesy to us. I know, I've been yelled at by them directly.

[Auzkhia]

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

You obviously have never been on the receiving end of concern trolling and harrassment from transphobes and TERFs. They aren't interested in, nor will they be "won over" by rational debate. They are unreachable, and trying to reach them only ends in pain and suffering. We know this from repeated personal experience. Its like debating Nazis. You're not going to change their minds, no matter how well-reasoned and backed up by facts your argument is.

Exactly, they don't care, most of them just want to waste your time by flooding your mentions.

They already have their mind made up, most terfs on twitter either have me blockchained because I'm part of the "trans cult" or they haven't found me yet.

[Luminesa]

If you’d rather eat a bowl of tacks than explain your views to someone else, either A.) you don’t have a whole lot of security regarding your views, or B.) you don’t value the person you’re talking to enough to help them understand your position. Neither of those things are good indicators. Having pain and trauma is understandable, but it doesn’t excuse toxic behavior, and if you’re not willing to put the drawbridge down, nobody is going to ever try to understand or even converse on the matter. And the result is a lack of unity and a lot of in-fighting.

You obviously have never been on the receiving end of concern trolling and harrassment from transphobes and TERFs. They aren't interested in, nor will they be "won over" by rational debate. They are unreachable, and trying to reach them only ends in pain and suffering. We know this from repeated personal experience. Its like debating Nazis. You're not going to change their minds, no matter how well-reasoned and backed up by facts your argument is.

I’ve had someone call me the AntiChrist for real. A very big, very mean street preacher, too. You have to laugh when people say things like that, and then just hold your head up. And I’m not a particularly strong person, nor do I have the highest esteem all the time.

That's not remotely comparable.

We can't just "laugh off" our very real marginalization, no more than your Catholic ancestors in the US could "laugh it off" 100 years ago, when the KKK was actively promoting hatred and oppression of Catholics, when discrimination against Catholics was socially acceptable, etc.

People who are truly marginalized are, according to society at large, "acceptable targets". Anything done to us is "ok", even the most heinous of crimes (see: the Trans Panic 'Defense', and the entire reason for the existence of Transgender Day of Rememberance) and anything we do in response, no matter how reasonable or trivial, is "unacceptable", or otherwise used to justify doing heinous things to us in the first place.

Getting called a ridiculous name by some jackass with a megaphone (yes, I know that particular group eschews megaphones, but still) and a "ur goin to hell" sign is nowhere near the same level as having TERFs and transphobes incite hatred and violence against you.

It was part of a conversation about Catholicism where he didn’t really wanna listen, and he was already convinced I was the AntiChrist for being Catholic. These were like...fire-and-brimstone kinda of people from some little church in backwoods Mississippi. The people around him were still interested in talking, however, so I kept talking. I kept talking to him as well, and he stood and listened. I made an impression on at least two of them. I admittedly like to hear myself talk and am an extrovert, but I do enjoy conversing with others about what I believe as well, even if I know they won’t always agree. You don’t have to convince people even, to enjoy a conversation.

Those same jackasses come to my campus, too, and they might pretend to be civil and willing to be "won over" by you, but when it comes to LGBT+ people, they have no interest in extending that same courtesy to us. I know, I've been yelled at by them directly.

I didn’t say it was the same thing, it was just an experience of mine that I felt like sharing, maybe to try and sympathize. I don’t wish for LGBT people to suffer violence. I don’t like to see people hating themselves either, or fearing somehow that they don’t exist. No, I’ve never been physically attacked for being Catholic (thank God, I dunno what I would do in the face of physical violence), but I am quite aware that other people do get physically attacked for being whoever they are. I only said that you have to try and just keep your head up. The more you do it, the more it becomes a habit. I dunno if it’s the most helpful advice for raising self-esteem or for making a person feel better about themselves, but it’s kinda all I have.

[Grenartia]

You obviously have never been on the receiving end of concern trolling and harrassment from transphobes and TERFs. They aren't interested in, nor will they be "won over" by rational debate. They are unreachable, and trying to reach them only ends in pain and suffering. We know this from repeated personal experience. Its like debating Nazis. You're not going to change their minds, no matter how well-reasoned and backed up by facts your argument is.



That's not remotely comparable.

We can't just "laugh off" our very real marginalization, no more than your Catholic ancestors in the US could "laugh it off" 100 years ago, when the KKK was actively promoting hatred and oppression of Catholics, when discrimination against Catholics was socially acceptable, etc.

People who are truly marginalized are, according to society at large, "acceptable targets". Anything done to us is "ok", even the most heinous of crimes (see: the Trans Panic 'Defense', and the entire reason for the existence of Transgender Day of Rememberance) and anything we do in response, no matter how reasonable or trivial, is "unacceptable", or otherwise used to justify doing heinous things to us in the first place.

Getting called a ridiculous name by some jackass with a megaphone (yes, I know that particular group eschews megaphones, but still) and a "ur goin to hell" sign is nowhere near the same level as having TERFs and transphobes incite hatred and violence against you.



Those same jackasses come to my campus, too, and they might pretend to be civil and willing to be "won over" by you, but when it comes to LGBT+ people, they have no interest in extending that same courtesy to us. I know, I've been yelled at by them directly.

I didn’t say it was the same thing, it was just an experience of mine that I felt like sharing, maybe to try and sympathize.

Fair enough, I appreciate the sentiment and that you didn't intend for any unreasonable comparisons to be made.

I don’t wish for LGBT people to suffer violence. I don’t like to see people hating themselves either, or fearing somehow that they don’t exist. No, I’ve never been physically attacked for being Catholic (thank God, I dunno what I would do in the face of physical violence), but I am quite aware that other people do get physically attacked for being whoever they are. I only said that you have to try and just keep your head up. The more you do it, the more it becomes a habit. I dunno if it’s the most helpful advice for raising self-esteem or for making a person feel better about themselves, but it’s kinda all I have.

Its kind of hard for a lot of us to keep our heads up under the present political and social circumstances. Personally, I'm just trying to do my best to make things better for my siblings, in even the smallest way. I realize I might come across as aggressive and dismissive at times, especially to people and viewpoints I often disagree with, but I'm just trying to make sure as many people as possible feel welcome using this space (and that motivates my disagreement with said people and viewpoints). With transmeds in particular, I would rather deal with the fallout of shutting one of them down so hard that they never come back, than allowing them to spread attitudes that discourage 10 other trans people from feeling welcomed here in the first place.

Although, in a bit of happy news, this happened:

A waitress who was fired after refusing to serve transphobic customers at a Wisconsin restaurant on Saturday said she has no regrets about putting “morals over money.”

During her shift at Fat Joe’s Bar and Grill in the town of Fond du Lac, Brittany Spencer overheard a couple making insulting comments about a transgender customer sitting at the bar. As she served the customers, they turned to her to ask what she thought about the trans patron.

"They were asking me if I thought it was disgusting and wrong and why we would let someone like that into the establishment," Spencer told NBC 26, NBC News’ Green Bay affiliate. "To which I answered, ‘No, I do not agree with that,’ and walked away."

Spencer said she asked her manager if another employee could serve the table, because she was uncomfortable, but her manager said no.

“She essentially told me to suck it up or go home," Spencer told NBC 26. "To which I said, ‘OK, I will leave.’"

That night, Spencer took to Facebook to share what happened, stating that she was sent home for refusing to serve the customers. The following day, she was alerted by the restaurant’s management that she’d been fired from her waitressing position.

“I WAS FIRED FROM MY JOB BECAUSE I REFUSED TO WAIT ON A TABLE WHO WERE MAKING TRANSPHOBIC REMARKS ABOUT GUESTS AT ANOTHER TABLE,” Spencer wrote on her Facebook page Sunday. “But I’ll always choose my morals over money. See ya.”

Fat Joe’s has since disabled its Facebook page following an inundation of negative reviews. The establishment did not respond to NBC News’ request for comment, but Tad Wallender, one of the co-owners of Fat Joe’s, told NBC 26 that the restaurant serves all customers and that Spencer was fired for “refusing to do the duty we hired her for.”

"We are going to serve anyone in here as long as it's a safe environment," Wallender said. "I've been in the service industry for a good 15 years, and I've heard hundreds of conversations I didn't agree with, but it's a matter of fact of brushing it off and having to tough it out through your task.”

Spencer said she has received a bounty of supportive Facebook messages thanking her for standing up against transphobia. She has also filed a complaint with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC), a federal agency that enforces civil rights laws against workplace discrimination.

While she is in the process of looking for a new job, she said the incident at Fat Joe’s is “bigger than” what happened to her.

"Ignoring hate and ignoring people talking like that is not being neutral," Spencer said. "That's allowing hate to happen in your establishment, and I didn't think that was appropriate so I left. Turning a blind eye to hate is just as bad as saying the hateful things in my opinion."

Apparently, a bunch of people reached out to her on social media, asking how they could give her money to make up for her lost wages, but instead, she asked for people to donate to a homeless shelter that serves LGBT+ youth, putting the icing on the cake for superb allyship.

[Hediacrana]

Although, in a bit of happy news, this happened:

A waitress who was fired after refusing to serve transphobic customers at a Wisconsin restaurant on Saturday said she has no regrets about putting “morals over money.”

During her shift at Fat Joe’s Bar and Grill in the town of Fond du Lac, Brittany Spencer overheard a couple making insulting comments about a transgender customer sitting at the bar. As she served the customers, they turned to her to ask what she thought about the trans patron.

"They were asking me if I thought it was disgusting and wrong and why we would let someone like that into the establishment," Spencer told NBC 26, NBC News’ Green Bay affiliate. "To which I answered, ‘No, I do not agree with that,’ and walked away."

Spencer said she asked her manager if another employee could serve the table, because she was uncomfortable, but her manager said no.

“She essentially told me to suck it up or go home," Spencer told NBC 26. "To which I said, ‘OK, I will leave.’"

That night, Spencer took to Facebook to share what happened, stating that she was sent home for refusing to serve the customers. The following day, she was alerted by the restaurant’s management that she’d been fired from her waitressing position.

“I WAS FIRED FROM MY JOB BECAUSE I REFUSED TO WAIT ON A TABLE WHO WERE MAKING TRANSPHOBIC REMARKS ABOUT GUESTS AT ANOTHER TABLE,” Spencer wrote on her Facebook page Sunday. “But I’ll always choose my morals over money. See ya.”

Fat Joe’s has since disabled its Facebook page following an inundation of negative reviews. The establishment did not respond to NBC News’ request for comment, but Tad Wallender, one of the co-owners of Fat Joe’s, told NBC 26 that the restaurant serves all customers and that Spencer was fired for “refusing to do the duty we hired her for.”

"We are going to serve anyone in here as long as it's a safe environment," Wallender said. "I've been in the service industry for a good 15 years, and I've heard hundreds of conversations I didn't agree with, but it's a matter of fact of brushing it off and having to tough it out through your task.”

Spencer said she has received a bounty of supportive Facebook messages thanking her for standing up against transphobia. She has also filed a complaint with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC), a federal agency that enforces civil rights laws against workplace discrimination.

While she is in the process of looking for a new job, she said the incident at Fat Joe’s is “bigger than” what happened to her.

"Ignoring hate and ignoring people talking like that is not being neutral," Spencer said. "That's allowing hate to happen in your establishment, and I didn't think that was appropriate so I left. Turning a blind eye to hate is just as bad as saying the hateful things in my opinion."

Apparently, a bunch of people reached out to her on social media, asking how they could give her money to make up for her lost wages, but instead, she asked for people to donate to a homeless shelter that serves LGBT+ youth, putting the icing on the cake for superb allyship.

Awesome solidarity! Nice story to start the day with.

[Auzkhia]

Although, in a bit of happy news, this happened:



Apparently, a bunch of people reached out to her on social media, asking how they could give her money to make up for her lost wages, but instead, she asked for people to donate to a homeless shelter that serves LGBT+ youth, putting the icing on the cake for superb allyship.

Awesome solidarity! Nice story to start the day with.

I love this story, it's good to see someone taking a stand for trans people, and this more cookie worthy than using my pronouns.

[Grenartia]

Awesome solidarity! Nice story to start the day with.

I love this story, it's good to see someone taking a stand for trans people, and this more cookie worthy than using my pronouns.

Like, I see a lot of people condemning allies who just call themselves that without really doing anything (and especially when they hid from criticism by claiming they're allies), but I think its important to highlight what good allyship is, so that other allies have a good example to look up to.

[Grenartia]

In other news, I already have great ideas for the next title ("Morals Over Money") and the next poll (either a poll about the latest Contrapoints controversy, or one about Brittany Spencer). What do yall think?

[Auzkhia]

In other news, I already have great ideas for the next title ("Morals Over Money") and the next poll (either a poll about the latest Contrapoints controversy, or one about Brittany Spencer). What do yall think?

Or Always deciding to not have the Venus symbols on its menstrual products. But that's something we can talk about for now. Though I rather have the poll be about Brittany Spencer (nice name!) than to be about ContraPoints because my twitter TL was full of the "contraversey" in the past week and got kinda sick of it. Though her next video explains some things, supposedly.

[Hediacrana]

In other news, I already have great ideas for the next title ("Morals Over Money") and the next poll (either a poll about the latest Contrapoints controversy, or one about Brittany Spencer). What do yall think?

Or Always deciding to not have the Venus symbols on its menstrual products. But that's something we can talk about for now. Though I rather have the poll be about Brittany Spencer (nice name!) than to be about ContraPoints because my twitter TL was full of the "contraversey" in the past week and got kinda sick of it. Though her next video explains some things, supposedly.

I'm also a little done with the Contrapoints controversy for the moment. It will probably keep flaring up anyhow, so I think it might be nice to throw in a less tired topic in the poll instead.