TDT 4: What the $#@! is a "womxn", anyways?

[Saciu]

I think it's been quite a while since I last posted properly here, and my opinions have probably changed on a lot of things since then, but I have some exciting (but late) news: I am finally on hormones! (Today is my 21st day on E). When should I first expect to see changes?

[The Blaatschapen]

I think it's been quite a while since I last posted properly here, and my opinions have probably changed on a lot of things since then, but I have some exciting (but late) news: I am finally on hormones! (Today is my 21st day on E). When should I first expect to see changes?

You are on E?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tsOvpj4mSo

[Auzkhia]

I think it's been quite a while since I last posted properly here, and my opinions have probably changed on a lot of things since then, but I have some exciting (but late) news: I am finally on hormones! (Today is my 21st day on E). When should I first expect to see changes?

Congratulations!

One of the first things I had were the euphoria of being on HRT and nipple sensitivity as the breast budding formed. Most effects take a like a month or two to see.

[Saciu]

I think it's been quite a while since I last posted properly here, and my opinions have probably changed on a lot of things since then, but I have some exciting (but late) news: I am finally on hormones! (Today is my 21st day on E). When should I first expect to see changes?

Congratulations!

One of the first things I had were the euphoria of being on HRT and nipple sensitivity as the breast budding formed. Most effects take a like a month or two to see.

How long did it take for the sensitivity to commence?

[The New California Republic]

I think it's been quite a while since I last posted properly here, and my opinions have probably changed on a lot of things since then, but I have some exciting (but late) news: I am finally on hormones! (Today is my 21st day on E). When should I first expect to see changes?

You are on E?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tsOvpj4mSo

...I actually clicked that link fully expecting it to be a video of the 90s club scene.

[Auzkhia]

Congratulations!

One of the first things I had were the euphoria of being on HRT and nipple sensitivity as the breast budding formed. Most effects take a like a month or two to see.

How long did it take for the sensitivity to commence?

A few days to a week, at least for me, it happened quickly.

[Hanafuridake]

I think it's been quite a while since I last posted properly here, and my opinions have probably changed on a lot of things since then, but I have some exciting (but late) news: I am finally on hormones! (Today is my 21st day on E). When should I first expect to see changes?

Congratulations!

It'd probably be better to ask your doctor that, since there tends to be a ton of different factors that go into changes and it's never the same for everyone.

[Vassenor]

OK, that's the appointment over with.

Doctor was happy to formally diagnose and recommend for hormone therapy subject to the usual second opinion and stuff.

...now I just need to have the talk with everyone about going full time at home and stuff.

>MFW

[Bienenhalde]

Alright, so recently I’ve been having a debate with folks over an article I read about Shahid Buttar, where he describes himself as “a cisgender heterosexual man who also identifies as queer due to his gender expression being fluid”

Personally, I feel like he’s co-opting the label and it’s kind of offensive to me - we don’t say a cishet tomboy is queer, because they’re cishet. It bothers me because it feels like it undermines the thing that trans people have been working towards, that your expression of yourself doesn’t define your gender or your sexuality, and kind of feels like it invalidates trans people who don’t fully conform to their gender’s stereotypes.

Anyone else have thoughts I might be missing?

you are not "queer" or LGBT because you're a slightly feminine man, full stop.

Forcing people in to rigid gender roles does not seem particularly useful, and I find toxic ideas of masculinity particuarly off-putting. That said, I think cishet people appropriating the label "queer" is probably more harmful than helpful.

[Cekoviu]

you are not "queer" or LGBT because you're a slightly feminine man, full stop.

Forcing people in to rigid gender roles does not seem particularly useful, and I find toxic ideas of masculinity particuarly off-putting. That said, I think cishet people appropriating the label "queer" is probably more harmful than helpful.

i'm not saying anyone has to be forced into rigid gender roles, i'm just saying that not adhering to them does not make one queer

[Novus America]

Forcing people in to rigid gender roles does not seem particularly useful, and I find toxic ideas of masculinity particuarly off-putting. That said, I think cishet people appropriating the label "queer" is probably more harmful than helpful.

i'm not saying anyone has to be forced into rigid gender roles, i'm just saying that not adhering to them does not make one queer

The thing is being “queer” is now trendy and in amongst certain groups.
So people are going to coop the label to be cool.

Easy now, if you are a woman just say you are bi. If you are guy occasionally where a piece of feline clothing and claim to be non binary. Etc.

Celebs now do that and others will follow. The irony of mainstreaming LGBT rights movement is you get more acceptance which is good, but without some sort of gatekeeping attention seeking celebs and woke rainbow capitalists will completely hijack you movement and turn it into nothing more than another marketing trend.

Well probably too late now to stop it.

[Saciu]

Congratulations!

One of the first things I had were the euphoria of being on HRT and nipple sensitivity as the breast budding formed. Most effects take a like a month or two to see.

How long did it take for the sensitivity to commence?

In case anyone's wondering, I finally started getting chest sensitivity today.

[West Leas Oros 2]

Total idiot question here, but who or what is GC? I feel like I’m dumb here.

[Necroghastia]

Total idiot question here, but who or what is GC? I feel like I’m dumb here.

Referring to r/GenderCritical, a TERF subreddit that got banned.

[West Leas Oros 2]

Total idiot question here, but who or what is GC? I feel like I’m dumb here.

Referring to r/GenderCritical, a TERF subreddit that got banned.

Cool. I’m not generally a fan of reddit politics, but this I can get behind.

[Vassenor]

...and internet Dys baiting ended up eroding pretty much all of the positivity wave I've had since Thursday.

Great.

[Cekoviu]

...and internet Dys baiting ended up eroding pretty much all of the positivity wave I've had since Thursday.

Great.

what is dys baiting

[Wink Wonk We Like Stonks]

...and internet Dys baiting ended up eroding pretty much all of the positivity wave I've had since Thursday.

Great.

what is dys baiting

probably means dysphoria baiting
people saying/doing things for the sole purpose of making others feel dysphoric

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

I stumbled upon this: https://youtu.be/2txYhkmhVts a few days ago while researching for the helpline and thought some of you could find it useful. It’s about voice training for MtF transgender women.

[Hediacrana]

Thought some of you would like to know about this new children's album celebrating children who are trans/nb/gnc. I certainly wish I had had access to media that related to my experience when I was younger!

[Cekoviu]

Thought some of you would like to know about this new children's album celebrating children who are trans/nb/gnc. I certainly wish I had had access to media that related to my experience when I was younger!

not sure how i feel about this. i think younger kids might see this and think "oh, those ppl are getting praise and support for being trans so it must be a cool trend!" that's how u end up getting detransitioners, which hurts both the kids and trans people whose cause is delegitimized by non-trans people transitioning and then detransitioning. i havent listened to the album so it probably depends on exactly how they approached it, but it'd definitely require a lot of finesse

oh, also, pet peeve: it's very very annoying when ppl group in "gender non-conforming" with trans/non-binary, as that's a COMPLETELY different things and it lends credence to the idea of, to use a cliché, trans women just being men in dresses and the other way around. ppl need to stop doing it

[Hediacrana]

Thought some of you would like to know about this new children's album celebrating children who are trans/nb/gnc. I certainly wish I had had access to media that related to my experience when I was younger!

not sure how i feel about this. i think younger kids might see this and think "oh, those ppl are getting praise and support for being trans so it must be a cool trend!" that's how u end up getting detransitioners, which hurts both the kids and trans people whose cause is delegitimized by non-trans people transitioning and then detransitioning. i havent listened to the album so it probably depends on exactly how they approached it, but it'd definitely require a lot of finesse

oh, also, pet peeve: it's very very annoying when ppl group in "gender non-conforming" with trans/non-binary, as that's a COMPLETELY different things and it lends credence to the idea of, to use a cliché, trans women just being men in dresses and the other way around.

Discussing things in combination does not indicate an absence of distinctions within that combination. No sensible person takes the LGBTQ abbreviation to mean that lesbian, gay, bi and trans people are identical, or understands the BIPOC abbreviation to signal that there are no meaningful distinctions between 'Indigenous', 'Black', or 'People of Colour'.

In this case, my inclusion of gnc merely reflects the reality that there are gnc children who come to identify as trans at a later point in life (not all, of course, but some - including myself!), and that these children face bullying and societal stigma in similar ways.

If parents of trans/nb/gnc children finally gain access to much-needed resources that speak to the specific experience of their children (Julián Is a Mermaid being another good example), to me this is a good thing. It serves a practical, real need that parents and their children face.

ppl need to stop doing it

If people need to stop doing anything, they need to stop regurgitating that stale 'children are learning trans is trendy'-meme. It entirely ignores the reality that by and large, gender-expansive children are bullied rather than affirmed.

Surely we shouldn't abstain from telling a child who is bullied that they are wonderful, just as they are, just because it might make other children want to get bullied?

[Vassenor]

Thought some of you would like to know about this new children's album celebrating children who are trans/nb/gnc. I certainly wish I had had access to media that related to my experience when I was younger!

not sure how i feel about this. i think younger kids might see this and think "oh, those ppl are getting praise and support for being trans so it must be a cool trend!" that's how u end up getting detransitioners, which hurts both the kids and trans people whose cause is delegitimized by non-trans people transitioning and then detransitioning. i havent listened to the album so it probably depends on exactly how they approached it, but it'd definitely require a lot of finesse

So how often do those things actually happen? Since nine times out of ten detransitioning is the result of abuse rather than desistance.

[Novus America]

what is dys baiting

probably means dysphoria baiting
people saying/doing things for the sole purpose of making others feel dysphoric

But in that case it might be best to avoid the more toxic parts of the internet. Not to victim blame, it is still wrong to cyber bully but you still should take reasonable precautions to avoid them, if simply ignoring them is not sufficient.

[Luminesa]

not sure how i feel about this. i think younger kids might see this and think "oh, those ppl are getting praise and support for being trans so it must be a cool trend!" that's how u end up getting detransitioners, which hurts both the kids and trans people whose cause is delegitimized by non-trans people transitioning and then detransitioning. i havent listened to the album so it probably depends on exactly how they approached it, but it'd definitely require a lot of finesse

oh, also, pet peeve: it's very very annoying when ppl group in "gender non-conforming" with trans/non-binary, as that's a COMPLETELY different things and it lends credence to the idea of, to use a cliché, trans women just being men in dresses and the other way around.

Discussing things in combination does not indicate an absence of distinctions within that combination. No sensible person takes the LGBTQ abbreviation to mean that lesbian, gay, bi and trans people are identical, or understands the BIPOC abbreviation to signal that there are no meaningful distinctions between 'Indigenous', 'Black', or 'People of Colour'.

In this case, my inclusion of gnc merely reflects the reality that there are gnc children who come to identify as trans at a later point in life (not all, of course, but some - including myself!), and that these children face bullying and societal stigma in similar ways.

If parents of trans/nb/gnc children finally gain access to much-needed resources that speak to the specific experience of their children (Julián Is a Mermaid being another good example), to me this is a good thing. It serves a practical, real need that parents and their children face.

ppl need to stop doing it

If people need to stop doing anything, they need to stop regurgitating that stale 'children are learning trans is trendy'-meme. It entirely ignores the reality that by and large, gender-expansive children are bullied rather than affirmed.

Surely we shouldn't abstain from telling a child who is bullied that they are wonderful, just as they are, just because it might make other children want to get bullied?

I don't think Ceko is suggesting that 'trans is trendy' is a thing all children are learning. I think what she's suggesting is that young children-as they often do-will hear or see a thing and become interested in it because it seems cool or fun, if it is presented in a way that is super cool and fun, while they are not told how difficult or painful some parts of that 'cool' thing are. Children see Superman on TV, many wanna be Superman. They don't necessarily know that Superman lost his whole biological family and ended-up a stranger on a strange planet, oftentimes misunderstood and characterized as a goody-goody, rather than as the genuinely compassionate character he was meant to be. They just like the super-powers and the cool costume.

I also don't think we can necessarily separate a musical album meant to reach an audience from the aims of any album in a market-driven society, in which creating trends is the aim and the end goal (perhaps with the exception of indie albums or odd concept albums which don't really have a specific audience). Popular magazines and influencers on social media, TV, and music all push "trends", what is fun and cool to have and be. Even if it's objectively not trendy, hip, or fun to be trans, one can't expect everyone who listens to the album to get that message. Sure, it might not be large numbers of listeners who think "trans is trendy", but the way children's albums and children's entertainment is often presented (hello Disney Channel, the most egregious example) is to push that these kids, their music, and these things they see in popular media are trendy. So naturally, while some children can discern and decipher the larger picture behind music (which is multi-faceted in itself), that can't be expected of every child. Especially not preteens.

I haven't listened to the album myself. Despite the fact that I work in a child-centered environment, I don't tend to care for some children's albums, because I get the feeling at times that children's albums are made due to some feeling that kids cannot, on some level, understand music that is not labeled for "children". It's a weird label that I feel is sometimes meant to both be a barrier for children who can understand more complex music and a hindrance to children who can't. Maybe it's because I rarely listened to children's albums when I was a kid, and because Kid's Bop eventually became quite grating to hear every day in my 4th-grade classroom. If my statement seems contradictory, I guess the thing I'd want to be taken away is that children's emotional intelligence is a spectrum, but there are definitely milestones that are hallmark to normal childhood development, and they should not be ignored. They are why music companies slobber at the mouth trying to make child-stars out of any preteen who can barely sing.