Dumb Ideologies wrote:You're all too forgiving. Do 40 laps around the field, let us pull off all your nails, and then pay us $33bn.
Grand Lolquisitor DI has assumed her title and job.
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by Nanatsu no Tsuki » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:15 am
Dumb Ideologies wrote:You're all too forgiving. Do 40 laps around the field, let us pull off all your nails, and then pay us $33bn.
Slava Ukraini
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Supposedly heartless, & a d*ck.||Is maith an t-earra an tsíocháin.||No TGsRIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria
by Dumb Ideologies » Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:10 am
by The Rich Port » Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:24 am
Geneviev wrote:I want to say to the people in this thread that I'm sorry for the things I said in the past. God doesn't give people the authority to judge others, and I was wrong. I'm really sorry.
Anyway, happy pride month.
by Hediacrana » Thu Jun 13, 2019 5:14 pm
Probably every responsible adult has held views at some point that they're now embarrassed about. Good for you that you're recognizing past mistakes!Geneviev wrote:I want to say to the people in this thread that I'm sorry for the things I said in the past. God doesn't give people the authority to judge others, and I was wrong. I'm really sorry.
Anyway, happy pride month.
by Des-Bal » Thu Jun 13, 2019 6:44 pm
Geneviev wrote:I want to say to the people in this thread that I'm sorry for the things I said in the past. God doesn't give people the authority to judge others, and I was wrong. I'm really sorry.
Anyway, happy pride month.
Cekoviu wrote:DES-BAL: Introverted, blunt, focused, utilitarian. Hard to read; not verbose online or likely in real life. Places little emphasis on interpersonal relationships, particularly with online strangers for whom the investment would outweigh the returns.
Desired perception: Logical, intellectual
Public perception: Neutral-positive - blunt, cold, logical, skilled at debating
Mindset: Logos
by Arcturus Novus » Thu Jun 13, 2019 6:50 pm
Des-Bal wrote:Geneviev wrote:I want to say to the people in this thread that I'm sorry for the things I said in the past. God doesn't give people the authority to judge others, and I was wrong. I'm really sorry.
Anyway, happy pride month.
If you aren't ashamed of your opinions in 7 years you aren't growing as a person.
Nilokeras wrote:there is of course an interesting thread to pull on [...]
Unfortunately we're all forced to participate in whatever baroque humiliation kink the OP has going on instead.
by Nanatsu no Tsuki » Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:50 pm
Slava Ukraini
Also: THERNSY!!
Your story isn't over;֍Help save transgender people's lives֍Help for feral cats
Cat with internet access||Supposedly heartless, & a d*ck.||Is maith an t-earra an tsíocháin.||No TGsRIP: Dyakovo & Ashmoria
by The New California Republic » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:52 am
US diplomats have been finding creative ways to show support for LGBTQ+ Pride month after the White House banned them from flying the rainbow flag.
Before this year embassies had routinely hoisted the flag - but this year they were required to seek approval from the state department, which reportedly refused all requests.
On Tuesday Vice-President Mike Pence said the ban was the "right decision".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-48641960
by Cekoviu » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:32 pm
The New California Republic wrote:US diplomats have been finding creative ways to show support for LGBTQ+ Pride month after the White House banned them from flying the rainbow flag.
Before this year embassies had routinely hoisted the flag - but this year they were required to seek approval from the state department, which reportedly refused all requests.
On Tuesday Vice-President Mike Pence said the ban was the "right decision".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-48641960
by Gormwood » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:34 pm
by Ifreann » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:39 pm
by The Rich Port » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:00 pm
The New California Republic wrote:US diplomats have been finding creative ways to show support for LGBTQ+ Pride month after the White House banned them from flying the rainbow flag.
Before this year embassies had routinely hoisted the flag - but this year they were required to seek approval from the state department, which reportedly refused all requests.
On Tuesday Vice-President Mike Pence said the ban was the "right decision".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-48641960
by The New California Republic » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:23 pm
The Rich Port wrote:The New California Republic wrote:
https://time.com/5604611/mike-pence-emb ... ide-flags/
How much you wanna bet it's a fucking stupid reason like "security" when the Pride Flag's been flown for years before now without any issue.
My guess is this decriminalization campaign, while Grunell is legit about it, is being stonewalled and used for propaganda purposes.
Mike Pence especially has some fucking nerve pretending he's any kind of friend to the LGBT. Even TRUMP made fun of him for being a wannabe Inquisitor.
I hope he's having fun sitting around being a useless wart on the ass of America, licking the boots of a man who most likely has dementia.
Mr Pence, an evangelical Christian, opposes gay marriage and has a history of supporting anti-LGBTQ+ legislation.
The ban has been backed by prominent evangelical Trump supporter Franklin Graham, who on Sunday tweeted that the gay pride flag was "offensive to Christians and millions of people of other faiths".
by The Rich Port » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:42 pm
by Torrocca » Fri Jun 14, 2019 9:18 pm
by Iciaros » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:23 pm
Torrocca wrote:You ever just feel like you're wrong/lying to yourself about being trans because of eggish feelings or dysphoria mumbo-jumbo or whatever (news at eleven, Torra doesn't know how their brain works), and it just feels like you're lying presenting yourself a certain way?
Because holy fucking hell that is 100% me_irl right now.
by Khasinkonia » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:29 pm
Torrocca wrote:You ever just feel like you're wrong/lying to yourself about being trans because of eggish feelings or dysphoria mumbo-jumbo or whatever (news at eleven, Torra doesn't know how their brain works), and it just feels like you're lying presenting yourself a certain way?
Because holy fucking hell that is 100% me_irl right now.
by The Rich Port » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:30 pm
Torrocca wrote:You ever just feel like you're wrong/lying to yourself about being trans because of eggish feelings or dysphoria mumbo-jumbo or whatever (news at eleven, Torra doesn't know how their brain works), and it just feels like you're lying presenting yourself a certain way?
Because holy fucking hell that is 100% me_irl right now.
by The Xenopolis Confederation » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:03 pm
Torrocca wrote:You ever just feel like you're wrong/lying to yourself about being trans because of eggish feelings or dysphoria mumbo-jumbo or whatever (news at eleven, Torra doesn't know how their brain works), and it just feels like you're lying presenting yourself a certain way?
Because holy fucking hell that is 100% me_irl right now.
by Grenartia » Sat Jun 15, 2019 12:52 am
by Grenartia » Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:27 am
Hanafuridake wrote:Hediacrana wrote:Fuck the Vatican.The Vatican also calls on doctors to ‘intervene’ on intersex patients, even when parents do not agree.
Intersex groups are against medically unnecessary procedures intended to ‘normalize’ infants at birth. Many of these procedures may impact a person’s quality of life.
Wait, so informed adults having sexual reassignment surgery performed is wrong, but doctors doing the procedure on babies is okay?
Northern Davincia wrote:Necroghastia wrote:
If you find the understanding to be faulty, then why not correct it? What are Hanafuridake and I misunderstanding?
God doesn't make mistakes. Exodus 4:11 and John 9:2-4 indicates that what us humans perceive as flaws are actually reminders to help those with "flaws."
Northern Davincia wrote:Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
Why aren’t LGBT people valid?
Because they don't follow the human standard established by Adam and Eve.Torrocca wrote:
Nope. God doesn't make mistakes, remember? That means God wanted LGBTQ+ people, which means we're all valid.
Not quite. People can be created and fall short of the human standard, but that does not give them free reign in their actions.Necroghastia wrote:
So then... why is the Vatican saying doctors should surgically alter intersex children? If God doesn't make mistakes, then surely he intended for them to be intersex.
Yes, they were intended to be intersex and humans have the responsibility to help them. Surgical "correction" is simply the easiest way to have them conform to the human standard.
Hanafuridake wrote:I don't really care about the homophobic and transphobic nature of the document because it's standard for the Vatican. What makes me angriest the most is that the Vatican thinks that it has the right to instruct doctors to perform cosmetic surgeries on children which could seriously injure them all because some priests are uncomfortable about the physical characteristics a child is born with. This is one of the most seriously bankrupt things they've done in a long time, all the while their supporters make unfounded claims that trans people support sexual reassignment surgery for kids.
Like always, the cries of children mean little to them.
Jack Thomas Lang wrote:Torrocca wrote:It sounds to me like you're questioning God's infallibility when the Bible makes it clear that God doesn't make mistakes. It's obvious God wanted the LGBTQ+ to exist and live life however we want to.
God makes narcissists, that does not mean he wants them to live a life of toxic pride and disregard for others. The argument that God made LGBTQ+ people, therefore they should live however they want doesn't follow.
Torrocca wrote:Northern Davincia wrote:Because race and sex are not abnormalities, they're quite normal. Being born with an extra arm is an abnormality, but removing it is not an act of malice.
Y'know, to be quite frank here, if the infallible Abrahamic God's interpretation of intersex people that God created is that they should be forced to undergo unwanted surgeries at the behest of a human institution and of LGBTQ+ people that God created is that we'll be burning in hell as sinners or whatever, then that God can really go fuck itself right the fuck on away from humanity, and so too can the Vatican.
Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:This question is tangentially related to the ‘intersex children’ line of argument. Bear with me so I can explain my question. I am currently family planning with my husband. If I were to have a child and they were intersex what I’d do would be put them in blockers as soon as convenient, and as soon as they turn around 15-16 years of age, I’d ask about identity, how they feel and then start HRT depending on their determination. Is this a sound way to proceed? What would you do different? Did I miss something? Thoughts?
Northern Davincia wrote:Torrocca wrote:
Y'know, to be quite frank here, if the infallible Abrahamic God's interpretation of intersex people that God created is that they should be forced to undergo unwanted surgeries at the behest of a human institution and of LGBTQ+ people that God created is that we'll be burning in hell as sinners or whatever, then that God can really go fuck itself right the fuck on away from humanity, and so too can the Vatican.
It is your choice to think so, but I am only here to clarify the Vatican's viewpoint.
Northern Davincia wrote:Hanafuridake wrote:
The difference being that a vaccine is used to prevent someone from catching or spreading dangerous diseases. Most intersex organizations aren't opposed to surgery when performed to save a child's life.
And in this instance, surgery would be done for the sake of easing into society, like removing an unneeded extra limb.
Necroghastia wrote:
If as an adult they wish to undergo SRS, that should be their right. I'm not going to try to do a "WELLLL that's DIFFERENT" argument here about vaccines because I'm not the one who is asserting the existence of a benevolent and infallible god.
I'm of the opinion that it should be the parent's right to decide.
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Not being able to marry who you love or be comfortable in your own body is much more than a narrow threat to your happiness.
Considering that vows of poverty are deemed noble in Christianity, earthly happiness is not worth pursuing as a be-all-end-all goal.
Cekoviu wrote:Galloism wrote:I think you went to a nicer school than I did.
I'm thinking of public changing rooms like at a pool. I was homeschooled during middle and high school, so I haven't interacted with school changing rooms.
Regardless, it's not too hard to shield your privates with a towel when you change, and not showering is not extraordinarily atypical (though it won't win you friends).
Northern Davincia wrote:Torrocca wrote:
And it's pretty clear that that viewpoint's morally fucked up and completely wrong according to the interpretation of God being infallible, since there's no justifiable argument neither you nor the Catholic Church can make that reconciles that fact with this shitty idea you're peddling that God created certain humans to be forced to live torturous lives or to be cursed to damnation from their birth.
No one is cursed to damnation
- that's a matter of choice -
and no one is being forced to live a torturous life.
Obviously the Vatican is not Calvinist.
Scripture encourages restraint in one's life, but I can't stop anyone from living incorrectly if they wish to.
Northern Davincia wrote:Torrocca wrote:
And it's pretty clear that that viewpoint's morally fucked up and completely wrong according to the interpretation of God being infallible, since there's no justifiable argument neither you nor the Catholic Church can make that reconciles that fact with this shitty idea you're peddling that God created certain humans to be forced to live torturous lives or to be cursed to damnation from their birth.
No one is cursed to damnation
- that's a matter of choice -
and no one is being forced to live a torturous life.
Obviously the Vatican is not Calvinist.
Scripture encourages restraint in one's life, but I can't stop anyone from living incorrectly if they wish to.
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:
How do you reconcile queer theology with the Bible stating multiple times that homosexuality is immoral?
Hediacrana wrote:Nanatsu no Tsuki wrote:
I guess I’m just trying to cover all my bases hypothetically. Nervous future mom, you know. Which is perhaps me anticipating a lot, I’m not pregnant. But this is a thought that has occupied me a few times. Maybe I’m also seeking to overprotect a hypothetical child. Time will tell here, right?
I can certainly relate - I became a parent last year.The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:How do you reconcile queer theology with the Bible stating multiple times that homosexuality is immoral?
The very issue is that that's a contested interpretation. Ideally, I'd really suggest you just take a look at that book that I linked to in the post you replied to, it's excellent, but in lieu of that, take a look at https://www.queertheology.com/what-do-we-do-with-the-bible/ and the resources listed on that page.
Cekoviu wrote:Necroghastia wrote:
I mean, I'm definitely bitter over having been circumcised, especially since that means if I decide to go for SRS that means there's less... "raw material" to work with.
My position towards it has always been not caring - doesn't matter if your penis was forcibly altered if you're not going to have it!
Auze wrote:Hanafuridake wrote:
I remember when Christian conservatives accused transgender people of pushing invasive surgeries on children, but now the Vatican is wanting doctors to do exactly that.
I mean, conjoined twins and those with similar birth defects are separated and have defects removed all the time. Considering intersex people by and large have characteristics that are closer to and will identify as one sex or the other, how is it any different?
Hediacrana wrote:Some good news: Americans are becoming more supportive of trans rights - even the ones belonging to parts of society that are generally unsupportive.Survey Shows Americans Are Becoming More Supportive of Transgender Rights Amid Federal Rollback of LGBTQ Protections:
More than six in ten Americans say they have become more supportive of transgender rights compared to their stances five years ago, according to a new survey.
The findings from the Public Religion Research Institute, a nonpartisan research organization, show a shift in public perception across political parties. Over three-quarters of Democrats surveyed reported being more supportive of transgender rights now than in 2014. Meanwhile, 64% of independents said they felt this way, and 47% of Republicans did.
Majorities from major religious groups also indicated their perceptions had changed, according to the survey, which contacted over 1,000 people. Nearly 70% of Catholics reported becoming more supportive of transgender rights over the last five years, versus 60% of nonwhite Protestants and 52% of white evangelical Protestants, the findings published Tuesday say.
Robert P. Jones, the CEO of the Public Religion Research Institute, suggested the shift is part of a larger trend of mounting LGBTQ support.
“Increase in support for transgender rights tracks fairly closely with the large increase in support for gay, lesbian and bisexual Americans,” he tells TIME. Jones also says the number of Americans who report having a close friend or family member who is transgender has doubled since 2015, and that “having a close relationship with someone transgender is strongly correlated with holding more supportive views of transgender rights.”
(...)
“Generally, the Trump administration’s policy directions, such as refusing to collect data on transgender Americans and restricting transgender military service, are flying against the wind of support for transgender rights in the country,” he says. “Virtually every demographic group in the country, including Republicans and white evangelical Protestants, report they have become more supportive of transgender rights over the last five years.”
United Muscovite Nations wrote:Blazelander wrote:
actually the statements are true, google them fren.
Some of the articles don't say what you say they say. For example, the one where you claimed that MTF trans people are just gay men trying to seduce straight men didn't say that. It said that MTF people who are homosexual (in the article's terminology, that they are attracted to men) are the ones who aren't autogynephiliacs and actually have brains neurologically shifted female.
HumanSanity wrote:Saint Ignis wrote:
You say that as if a) they haven't always been politicized and b) like being LGBT isn't inherently political, for better or worse. Usually worse.
I agree that being LGBT+ is inherently political.
Cishets always seem to find a way to be at the center of the struggles we have to deal with, so I'm glad some are openly trying to engage discussions about our communities and how to relate to us.
Sure, sometimes they need to butt out. But here they seem to *generally* either a) be trolls who don't give a shit about us, or b) be trying to talk to us like people.
Similarly, while I'm not hetero, I am cis. In my brief forays in this thread I like the vibe and the community, and where I feel it appropriate I try to share in that community. Sometimes I get the read of the conversation and either have no lived experience that contributes or realize it's not a conversation for me, and I stay away. But unless anyone here disagrees and wants to show me my place, I still feel like my contributions are... well somewhat meaningful.
As to why they care, I hate to use an overused line but, I care because I have trans friends. They share their experiences with me and explain why those experiences matter. Explain why kinship with other LGBT+ people and trans people matters. Explain how that affects their worldview. They don't have to do any of that, but they often do, and that makes me care because I have sympathy for people around me.
Anyways, that's why I, as a cis person, give a shit about "trans issues". I'm sure hetero people give a shit about non-hetero issues for similar reasons.
Cekoviu wrote:First American Empire wrote:
It's a lie, and so are almost all the other articles. I'm a trans woman attracted to women and I'm not an "autogynophiliac" or whatever it is. I am also monogamous, have never done drugs, don't drink, have only had one sex partner, who I did not sleep with until we were married for eight months*, have never had an STD, and am one of the most prudish people on NSG despite my religion not actually viewing sex as sinful.
*I would have right after marriage if SRS wasn't an issue.
Autogynephilia is an idiotic concept anyway, because in a survey ~90% of cis women respondents were judged to also have autogynephilia.
E: reference. Under a more rigorous definition, a significant minority of 28% still have autogynephilia.
Geneviev wrote:I want to say to the people in this thread that I'm sorry for the things I said in the past. God doesn't give people the authority to judge others, and I was wrong. I'm really sorry.
Anyway, happy pride month.
Hediacrana wrote:Probably every responsible adult has held views at some point that they're now embarrassed about. Good for you that you're recognizing past mistakes!Geneviev wrote:I want to say to the people in this thread that I'm sorry for the things I said in the past. God doesn't give people the authority to judge others, and I was wrong. I'm really sorry.
Anyway, happy pride month.
Also, personally speaking, I don't think I ever felt hurt by anything you wrote - instead, I felt sad for you because I knew you were trans while holding those views, which I just don't think is a great place to be in at all.
Torrocca wrote:You ever just feel like you're wrong/lying to yourself about being trans because of eggish feelings or dysphoria mumbo-jumbo or whatever (news at eleven, Torra doesn't know how their brain works), and it just feels like you're lying presenting yourself a certain way?
Because holy fucking hell that is 100% me_irl right now.
The Xenopolis Confederation wrote:Torrocca wrote:You ever just feel like you're wrong/lying to yourself about being trans because of eggish feelings or dysphoria mumbo-jumbo or whatever (news at eleven, Torra doesn't know how their brain works), and it just feels like you're lying presenting yourself a certain way?
Because holy fucking hell that is 100% me_irl right now.
Yeah, sometimes. I often feel like I'm not really a trans-woman because I'm not dysphoric enough, or not girly enough. Or I often wonder if this is just a product of me being depressed or lost or something, and trying to find some way to cope. But if that's the case, I've only gotten more depressed after cracking, so if that's the case, it hasn't worked. And yet I strongly suspect that if I walked back on all this, declared myself a cis man and moved on, I would only feel even worse. I'm on Discord if you need to talk about stuff.
by Torrocca » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:30 am
by Novus America » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:50 am
Torrocca wrote:I'm loving all this love and support <3 But, uh, seriously, the Egg of Self-Doubt and Confusion is looking mighty comfortable recently... :V
by The New California Republic » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:52 am
Novus America wrote:Have you spoken to a professional therapist trained in such things? That is almost certainly hot best option.
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