Massive Fire at Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

If you have nothing to add, please take your drivel elsewhere.

Ironic.

So far, you've said exactly nothing of substance in this thread. First you were trying to persuade everybody that grieving for Notre Dame was wrong unless you were a French nationalist and a devout Catholic, and now you're trying to argue that it was arson with no evidence. You're not as clever as you clearly think you are, you're just irritating, and so I humbly ask you to make your point or stop talking.

[Athonuna]

In fact, almost none of the artworks or relics were even inside, and just about all of them are accounted for. Culture and heritage survived by the stratacornea of the skin of their teeth thanks to the heroes of the Paris Fire Brigade.

Indeed. The firefighter brigade are true heroes. They were scrambling in to rescue things and remove them out of the blaze.

Their work to save these artworks are very noble. I can only imagine their bravery to save their nation's greatest works in the midst of a fire.

[The Black Party]

So far, you've said exactly nothing of substance in this thread. First you were trying to persuade everybody that grieving for Notre Dame was wrong unless you were a French nationalist and a devout Catholic,

Simply not true. I'll wave this away.

and now you're trying to argue that it was arson with no evidence.

Also not true.

You're not as clever as you clearly think you are, you're just irritating, and so I humbly ask you to make your point or stop talking.

I have.

How do you "rule out" something "for the time being". If it's "for the time being", it's inconclusive. That's just as good as saying "We're ruling out faulty electrical wiring for the time being". Something that is "ruled out" is definitive. Therefore, it is definitive that the fire was accidental and not caused by arson. We don't know what caused the fires, but we definitively know that both fires in Notre Dame were accidental.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Indeed. The firefighter brigade are true heroes. They were scrambling in to rescue things and remove them out of the blaze.

Their work to save these artworks are very noble. I can only imagine their bravery to save their nation's greatest works in the midst of a fire.

Indeed. That's also why I am awaiting to see if an update on the injured firefighter is released.

[Bombadil]

I was unaware Notre Dame had the Crown of Thorns in their possession.

[Athonuna]

Can someone please explain to this person that the gov't has ruled out arson for the time being and that we don't know what happened until an investigation is carried out. Jesus H. Craig. I guess I'm typing in Sanskrit.

How do you "rule out" something "for the time being". If it's "for the time being", it's inconclusive. That's just as good as saying "We're ruling out faulty electrical wiring for the time being". Something that is "ruled out" is definitive. Therefore, it is definitive that the fire was accidental and not caused by arson. We don't know what caused the fires, but we definitively know that both fires were accidental.

God, leave it alone. It's ruled out for the time being and we'll return to it in an investigation.

[The Black Party]

How do you "rule out" something "for the time being". If it's "for the time being", it's inconclusive. That's just as good as saying "We're ruling out faulty electrical wiring for the time being". Something that is "ruled out" is definitive. Therefore, it is definitive that the fire was accidental and not caused by arson. We don't know what caused the fires, but we definitively know that both fires were accidental.

God, leave it alone. It's ruled out for the time being and we'll return to it in an investigation.

Yes, that's exactly what I am saying; I am agreeing with you.

[Deutschess Kaiserreich]

I guess Judge Claude Frollo found Esmeralda.

[Athonuna]

Their work to save these artworks are very noble. I can only imagine their bravery to save their nation's greatest works in the midst of a fire.

Indeed. That's also why I am awaiting to see if an update on the injured firefighter is released.

I've been covering the story since about 2 hours after it began, when I first learned about it. Hopefully their injuries aren't too severe.

[The Black Party]

I guess Judge Claude Frollo found Esmeralda.

In the process he caused hellfire.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

How do you "rule out" something "for the time being". If it's "for the time being", it's inconclusive. That's just as good as saying "We're ruling out faulty electrical wiring for the time being". Something that is "ruled out" is definitive. Therefore, it is definitive that the fire was accidental and not caused by arson. We don't know what caused the fires, but we definitively know that both fires were accidental.

God, leave it alone. It's ruled out for the time being and we'll return to it in an investigation.

Thank you! It is ruled out for now until an investigation is carried out. I've been saying that now for several posts.

[The Black Party]

Thank you! It is ruled out for now until an investigation is carried out. I've been saying that now for several posts.

Almost like something shouldn't be ruled out until an investigation is carried out but hey, what do I know? That's why they're in politics and I'm not.

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

So far, you've said exactly nothing of substance in this thread. First you were trying to persuade everybody that grieving for Notre Dame was wrong unless you were a French nationalist and a devout Catholic,

Simply not true. I'll wave this away.

and now you're trying to argue that it was arson with no evidence.

Also not true.

You're not as clever as you clearly think you are, you're just irritating, and so I humbly ask you to make your point or stop talking.

I have.

How do you "rule out" something "for the time being". If it's "for the time being", it's inconclusive. That's just as good as saying "We're ruling out faulty electrical wiring for the time being". Something that is "ruled out" is definitive. Therefore, it is definitive that the fire was accidental and not caused by arson. We don't know what caused the fires, but we definitively know that both fires in Notre Dame were accidental.

None of that is evidence of anything. Perhaps they were a bit hasty with their conclusions, but that doesn't mean in and of itself that those conclusions are wrong.
Also, friendly reminder that you said this earlier today:

We care because Notre Dame is an incredibly iconic symbol and is important to so many people. The fact that it burned down along with all of the priceless artifacts in there is a very sad event for so many.

Are you really that sad, personally? Or are you sad for other people? Because I can't take this thread seriously after I saw someone say their on the verge of tears rn, like omy gawdd #PrayForParis #DonateToDame

We just ruin everything we touch.

All of this is says very little other than "you don't have a right to be sad because Notre Dame meant more to some people than it does to you", which is utter bullshit if I've ever seen it.
You're not convincing anyone of anything, but you are being quite annoying, and if anyone here is impressed by it, I encourage them to come forward and say so, because I don't think anyone is.

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

Thank you! It is ruled out for now until an investigation is carried out. I've been saying that now for several posts.

Almost like something shouldn't be ruled out until an investigation is carried out but hey, what do I know? That's why they're in politics and I'm not.

It's almost as though there are people who do this for a living that might be more of an authority than Random Internet Troll #11375. Imagine that...

[Duhon]

Can people just put The Black Party on ignore? He won't stop trying to trigger people otherwise. Thanks.

[The Black Party]

None of that is evidence of anything. Perhaps they were a bit hasty with their conclusions, but that doesn't mean in and of itself that those conclusions are wrong.

It's a good thing I didn't say they were wrong, but I would like to stress that "they" were not at all hasty with their conclusions and that they made the right conclusion. Any speculation otherwise should be avoided and not consulted since the Moderators outlawed it.

Also, friendly reminder that you said this earlier today:

Are you really that sad, personally? Or are you sad for other people? Because I can't take this thread seriously after I saw someone say their on the verge of tears rn, like omy gawdd #PrayForParis #DonateToDame

We just ruin everything we touch.

All of this is says very little other than "you don't have a right to be sad because Notre Dame meant more to some people than it does to you", -snip-

No, it was a question regarding their emotions for the destruction of Notre Dame. You're debunking a statement I never made.

You're not convincing anyone of anything, but you are being quite annoying, and if anyone here is impressed by it, I encourage them to come forward and say so, because I don't think anyone is.

Have I not convinced you that the fires were definitively an accident?

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Indeed. That's also why I am awaiting to see if an update on the injured firefighter is released.

I've been covering the story since about 2 hours after it began, when I first learned about it. Hopefully their injuries aren't too severe.

Same here. I hope they get better soon.

[Duhon]

So how much would a rebuild of the Notre Dame cost? Has anyone got a hold of the figures?

[Farnhamia]

Thank you! It is ruled out for now until an investigation is carried out. I've been saying that now for several posts.

Almost like something shouldn't be ruled out until an investigation is carried out but hey, what do I know? That's why they're in politics and I'm not.

I could have sworn we went over this thing about arson speculation. Do I have to warn you for trolling? It really seems like you're trying very hard to get a rise out of somebody.

[The Black Party]

Almost like something shouldn't be ruled out until an investigation is carried out but hey, what do I know? That's why they're in politics and I'm not.

It's almost as though there are people who do this for a living that might be more of an authority than Random Internet Troll #11375. Imagine that...

That's why I trust everything authority figures say without question, as I'm sure we all do. They're the professionals, let's leave the Paris Police at that.

[Valentine Z]

It will never be the same, however

This is a thought I've had since I heard about it. It's like the Ship of Thesues problem, the one that goes "if you have one thing and over time change out all the components, is that thing still fundamentally the same thing, or is it new and something else?" (I know this analogy is pretty terrible at relating to the Notre Dame fire, but it's what you get shush)

My point is, all of the stuff destroyed in the fire will never come back, all the bricks and wood and materials that got burned will never be a part of Notre Dame again, and even if they do rebuild the cathedral, it'll just be recreations of the parts of Notre Dame that were lost.

So, is it still Notre Dame, or is it just sections of Notre Dame that survived the fire held together by recreations of what didn't survive?

Ah-ha! Someone else has read about the SoT problem as well!

Yeah, I thought the same way. Though if the history has been an indicator of the problem, I say that at this point, we probably don't even have the original Notre Dame? I mean, before this fire, it has been damaged and restored for a few times in the past such as WW1 and WW2, so at this point, can we say the originals more or less don't exist anymore?

----

On another topic, I'm glad that most of the artifacts survived, and that at the very least, it can be rebuilt and salvageable. I still want to visit the Notre Dame during my lifetime. ^^

[Evil Dictators Happyland]

It's almost as though there are people who do this for a living that might be more of an authority than Random Internet Troll #11375. Imagine that...

That's why I trust everything authority figures say without question, as I'm sure we all do. They're the professionals, let's leave the Paris Police at that.

I certainly don't see the problem with doing exactly that with this issue.
And for, like, the eighth time by now, do you have a point to make? If so, make it, don't hide behind thinly-veiled sarcasm. If not, stop posting here. It's really not that difficult.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

For those interested, here: https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/not ... index.html you can take a look at ND before the fire, just to relish in it's beauty.

Also an artist paid tribute to ND with a drawing: https://www.instagram.com/p/BwSS49nlGNq ... e=ig_embed

[The Black Party]

I could have sworn we went over this thing about arson speculation. Do I have to warn you for trolling? It really seems like you're trying very hard to get a rise out of somebody.

Noted and will adhere to:

You'll know when it's official. Speculation [in general]. Don't split hairs with me. Drop it. That goes for everyone else.

[Farnhamia]

This is a thought I've had since I heard about it. It's like the Ship of Thesues problem, the one that goes "if you have one thing and over time change out all the components, is that thing still fundamentally the same thing, or is it new and something else?" (I know this analogy is pretty terrible at relating to the Notre Dame fire, but it's what you get shush)

My point is, all of the stuff destroyed in the fire will never come back, all the bricks and wood and materials that got burned will never be a part of Notre Dame again, and even if they do rebuild the cathedral, it'll just be recreations of the parts of Notre Dame that were lost.

So, is it still Notre Dame, or is it just sections of Notre Dame that survived the fire held together by recreations of what didn't survive?

Ah-ha! Someone else has read about the SoT problem as well!

Yeah, I thought the same way. Though if the history has been an indicator of the problem, I say that at this point, we probably don't even have the original Notre Dame? I mean, before this fire, it has been damaged and restored for a few times in the past such as WW1 and WW2, so at this point, can we say the originals more or less don't exist anymore?

----

On another topic, I'm glad that most of the artifacts survived, and that at the very least, it can be rebuilt and salvageable. I still want to visit the Notre Dame during my lifetime. ^^

Over time, some of the decorations and art were damaged. The fabric of the cathedral was given a restoration between the 1840s and 1860s because it had become very worn because of the passage of time. It suffered no damage in World War 1 and only very minor damage in World War 2.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notre-Dam ... the_church